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America Is One Sorry Ass Country. We Have Become Moral Monsters Under Both Political Parties

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Radicalman Donating Member (170 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-20-06 06:56 PM
Original message
America Is One Sorry Ass Country. We Have Become Moral Monsters Under Both Political Parties
Yesterday, David Johnston reported in the New York Times that nearly 20 cases in which civilian contractors were accused of abusing detainees have been sent to the Justice Department. So far there has not been a single indictment.

In our Torture Nation this is to be expected. The record, as enumerated below, shows that the United States has become one sorry ass country under both political parties. I do not recognize this country anymore. It is not the land I was raised in. When I was a child, during World War Two, one of the major motivations for fighting the fascists was that they tortured and killed the innocents.

Now we have become them. It wounds the human heart. There are no words to adequately describe the shame I feel. A man who stole two elections to get to and maintain control of the white house is now leading this parade of ignominy and savage desecration of the most fundamental principles of morality.

The American Civil Liberties Union (ACLU) released documents of forty-four autopsies held in Afghanistan and Iraq October 25, 2005. Twenty-one of those deaths were listed as homicides. The documents show that detainees died during and after interrogations by Navy SEALs, Military Intelligence, and Other Government Agencies.

"These documents present irrefutable evidence that U.S. operatives tortured detainees to death during interrogation," said Amrit Singh, an attorney with the ACLU. "The public has a right to know who authorized the use of torture techniques and why these deaths have been covered up."

But this is only one example of the Bush regime's authorized torture and killings.

Who knows how many cover ups of similar deaths and torture there have been by the Regime?

In February 2006, the American-based organization Human Rights First, formerly the Lawyers Committee for Human Rights, charged the U.S. government with the deaths of 100 detainees during "the global war on terror."

Indeed, the string of scandals involving the sexual and physical abuse of detainees held by American forces in Afghanistan, Iraq and Guantanamo Bay hasn't stopped. Torture and inhumane treatment are still "widespread" in U.S.-run detention centers in Afghanistan, Iraq, Cuba and elsewhere, despite Bush regime denials," Amnesty International said in May, 2006.

On May 19, 2006, The United Nations Committee On Torture called upon the United States to close all secret prisons, hold accountable senior military and civilian officials who authorized, acquiesced or consented to acts of torture committed by their subordinates, and end its practice of transferring detainees to countries with known torture records.

The committee also criticized the indefinite detention of prisoners at Guantanamo Bay and called for its closure. The committee rejected U.S. claims that the Convention against Torture did not apply to U.S. personnel acting outside of the United States or during wartime.

What was the response of the U.S. Congress? It passed The Military Commissions Act (Senate Bill 3930) and was signed by President (?) George W. Bush on October 17, 2006 In part the act enables President (?) Bush to torture alleged terrorists úsnatched arbitrarily, anywhere in the world, simply on his say-so, SO his designated minions úwill be preserved. In effect the law allows the CIA to torture captives by various methods without being charged with war crimes and felony violations of American law. It grants impunity to senior Bush regime officials against war crimes committed after 9/11. It redefines war crimes such as torture and strips litigants of the ability to cite the Geneva Conventions. Senior Bush officials cannot be prosecuted for war crimes in the United States.

A survey by the Pew Research Center in October of 2005 showed that 15 percent of Americans believe torture is "often" justified, and
31 percent believe it is "sometimes" justified. Add to that another 17 percent who said it is "rarely" justified, and you have two out of three Americans justifying torture under certain circumstances. Only 32 percent said it is "never" justified, while another 5 percent didn't know or refused to answer.

This is a response from people who mostly say that they live in a "Christian Nation." Evidently, the image of Jesus, who was tortured to death, has little impact on the "Christians." Christianity was founded by a victim of torture! It is interesting to note that secularists in the same survey were significantly more opposed to torture than "Christians."

Torture grossly violates the universal commandment given by Jesus, that we should always treat others as we would like to be treated. So whatever you wish that men would do to you, do so to them; for this is the law and the prophets. (Matthew 7:12 RSV)

"Christians" must know that the act of torture perfectly expresses the twisted spirit of Satan, and totally violates the Holy Spirit of God. The desire to inflict pain on others is the most repulsive, repugnant, Satanic desire human beings could possibly have. It is clear that in the Christian tradition, Satan, who hates all people, constantly tries to tempt humans into demeaning, degrading, and hurting each other. It doesn't matter if one thinks of satan in literal terms or as a symbol of what is truly evil. One doesn’t need to believe in either God or satan to understand the power of this ancient analysis.

Torture is indeed Satanic. The American people have made a compact with evil. Not since the days of government sanctioned slavery has the U.S. been inhabited by so many morally perverted and INDIFFERENT citizens. IT IS PERHAPS THE INDIFFERENCE WHICH MAY BE THE MOST PERVERTED ACT OF ALL. The fact that Americans tolerate crimes against humanity by their own leaders is evidence that Americans are moving, en masse, TOWARD religious hypocracy, WITHOUT shame, WITHOUT honor, and WITHOUT decency.

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msongs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-20-06 07:03 PM
Response to Original message
1. if torture was good enough for jesus it oughta be good enough for everyone nt
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Torn_Scorned_Ignored Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 06:29 PM
Response to Reply #1
26. I disagree
Edited on Thu Dec-21-06 06:48 PM by Sees Clearly
Didn't Jesus take on the sins of the world for the sake of salvation?



An Afghan detainee is carried on a stretcher before being interrogated at Camp X-Ray at the U.S. Naval Base in Guantánamo Bay, Cuba, on Feb. 2, 2002.


http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2006/07/26/interrogation/index.html
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bluehighways911 Donating Member (67 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-20-06 07:35 PM
Response to Original message
2. You Have One Major Problem,
And I feel your pain. We all should. And maybe if the media told us the whole story, America would rise up.

But please don't lump the entire Democratic Party as being in favor of this. Or the Republican, for that matter, although they have been far more complicit.

I did see the movie Iraq for Sale. And as sickening as it was, and why isn't this movie on prime time like the 9/11 blame Clinton mess.

I did see Democrats try to get a bill through to, sorry I only saw it once, but either investigate the contractors or try to get them out completly. It was started by Dodd and one other I can't remember.

It never got the votes, either out of comittee or on the floor. And Kerry and Murtha, and Feingold and many others have been fighting the President for the past four years.

Yes, we have some Dems afraid to step up. Some may actually think we are doing the right thing, as bad as it has turned out.

But my advice to all. Don't spend all day bitching. Get up and do something. Let your reps know this is wrong. We may not have the answers, but we know Bush is wrong. And we are spending hundreds of billion that could be used on helping America, just digging a hole that gets worse and worse.\

Here is your chance netroots. They do listen. And we can make them change.

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lonestarnot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-20-06 10:24 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. Post of the month.
K & R
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sendero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-20-06 11:06 PM
Response to Reply #2
6. Welcome to DU...
...and who could disagree with what you are saying?
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Robeson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-20-06 11:10 PM
Response to Reply #2
7. Welcome to DU, bluehighways911...
...welcome aboard! :hi:
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Senator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 02:48 AM
Response to Reply #2
8. The DC Dems Have a Bigger Problem
Because on Jan. 3rd they become fully complicit with the violation of Geneva Article 3.

Whatever has been the case up to that point, on that day they accept the mantle of responsibility. They literally become The Government of the US. As such they become personally, and as a coordinated political party, subject to international and treaty law regarding war crimes and torture.

The are duty-bound to act -- to stop the torture and prosecute the perpetrators. If they fail to do so, they become war criminals themselves. The actions of the regime become irrelevant. The entire Iraq war itself becomes irrelevant. As does any domestic agenda, political concerns about future elections, or claims of any level of ignorance.

They assume the burden. Like it or not.

They need to listen to this reality. They need to change.

Only Impeachment can address this responsibility.

Impeachment IS our positive agenda.

It is our ONLY moral, patriotic option.

--
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Usrename Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 04:59 AM
Response to Reply #8
10. If they do nothing, they are criminals under the law.
The way I understand things, you are absolutly correct.
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RestoreGore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 07:16 AM
Response to Reply #2
12. If we have to tell Congressional Representatives torture is wrong....
Then they are morally bankrupt, and so are those who continue to cover for them just because there is an "R" or a "D" next to their name... that is the mentality that doomed the Republican Party... putting party over country. Torture is the tool of devils, and those being sworn in on January 3 of all parties have a MORAL duty to stand up to it. If they don't, what else can be said but that they are enablers of the torture? Bottomline, if Bush and his thugs do not face impeachment for these crimes, then we will know that the Democrats elected to Congress have only condoned a kindler gentler Fascism, and that should not stand with ANY American who loves their country.
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MsMagnificent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 11:44 AM
Response to Reply #2
14. Good post
& welcome to DU! :hi:
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Catherine Vincent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 02:09 PM
Response to Reply #2
21. Inspiring post! Thank you.
Welcome to DU! :hi:

You should start your DU journal with this post.
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Radicalman Donating Member (170 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 08:13 PM
Response to Reply #2
28. YES, HERE IS YOUR CHANCE NETROOTS...MAKE THEM CHANGE. RIGHT ON!!!
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ranadec Donating Member (15 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-20-06 10:43 PM
Response to Original message
4. The simple truth.....
The real terrorists are our own government sponsored terrorists. The so-called "war on terror" is just the excuse being used to further American corporate interests....exploiting the worlds resources and poor and indigenous people around the world and at home.

The "war on terror" is a win/win process for those pushing it...more violence creates an opposite reaction of violence...with more fear to push...more excuses to do more damage...more profits...more power to make them.

If the "war on terror" was stopped in Afganistan...and here and there...then that might have been it.

But allowing Israel to continue making a mess...and the US following suit....well yea...it might last 100 years or so...if you are dumb enough to want it to that is.

Humans are not a sane species?
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BeFree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-20-06 10:58 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. Humans not sane?
It does seem some humans are less sane than others, eh? Well, there are a whole lot of sane people on DU... a majority. A super majority, even. But you kinda figured that already, right?

I can remember a few insane folks in years past claiming that war was good for bizness. Now they don't say it so much, but the reality is....
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ranadec Donating Member (15 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 07:08 AM
Response to Reply #5
11. Changing the icing on the cake?
What the DU might represent is an attempt at least to slightly change the icing on an ugly fascist cake. The cake might look a little better...but you really don't want to eat any of it.

The really sad part of it is that while the people on the DU might think things will change for the better....the smirk and friends know that's only an illusion. They've make their $$...and have set many things up in order to make more.

"They" might let you think you live in a democracy...as you have thought all along? And as Dr. Phil would say...."hows that working out for you?"

People will say...wow...that's really negative....I would say...no just realistic. You can't change things until you face the truth?
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Alcibiades Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 01:54 PM
Response to Reply #11
20. American "democracy" is working just fine for me
Sure, it could be better. Sometimes, I may not get my way. That's fine, I accept that. They have made their money, but the investigation of war profiteering has yet to begin. I think that what we have seen is an extremist, ideologically driven administration who has gone too far, and driven his party into permanent minority status, just a Herbert Hoover did. If realism means defeatism and doing nothing, then I'm pretty utopian.

At any rate, we are not a democracy. The demos does not rule. We have a mixed constitution, a republican form of government. Given that the demos has revealed itself to be vulnerable to demagoguery, as in the election of 2004, I'm not so sure I'm in favor of direct democracy anyway.

I respectfully submit that what we have here is a fascist regime, but I don't think it's useful to call it that, as our rightist authoritarianism is distinctly different in character from that of Mussolini. Anyway, getting rid of them, and holding them accountable for their actions, would be more than just changing the icing on the fascist cake--it would be a major victory for humanity.
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Radicalman Donating Member (170 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 08:20 PM
Response to Reply #20
29. The American Political System Is a Joke!!

It's a total failure. If the "system" includes the corporate media pimps and whores, along with a President whose sanity is in doubt, and cowardly dems whose only principle is re-election, look what the result is. The burning issue of our time (no pun intended) is global warming......it's going to make life for our grandchildren altogether horribly different than ours. They will hate us for what we have done to them. It isn't even discussed by the politicians and the media, except for Al Gore.
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newyawker99 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 04:41 PM
Response to Reply #4
24. Hi ranadec!!
Welcome to DU!! :toast:
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leftofthedial Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 03:26 AM
Response to Original message
9. judging by the escalating violence
we apparently aren't torturing enough
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RestoreGore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 07:25 AM
Response to Reply #9
13. I don't know if you were joking or not...
Edited on Thu Dec-21-06 07:43 AM by RestoreGore
But it is a really good guess that it is the torture and occupation of their country that has caused this escalation in violence. We are occupying a country that does not want to be occupied, and a people who suffered horror beyond our comprehension. Iraq is now the gate to hell. So what would you do in their shoes? What would your response be today if say, China invaded the U.S. like we did Iraq and subjected our people to the same abuses? Would you be silent, or would you not fight to take your country back?
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Heywood J Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 12:36 PM
Response to Reply #13
18. I took it as a joke.
I don't think there's more than a handful of people here who would seriously agree with that.
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leftofthedial Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 01:23 PM
Response to Reply #13
19. ya think?
maybe another 100,000 troops and more torturing will calm things down.

Don't you think l'il george and his unkas bob and dick know how to win a "war"?



oh, uh, :sarcasm:
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Kolesar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 11:56 AM
Response to Original message
15. The Democrats I funded or voted for are not responsible for this torture
A link to David Johnston would be nice, btw.

Welcome to DU, and Ranadec and bluehighways911, too! :hi:
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Mrspeeker Donating Member (671 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 12:16 PM
Response to Original message
16. I agree
SORRY ASS! just go to a airport, and you will soon realize this is the future of our country check points and security drills, and they are totally free and democratic.

freedom to fascism over night!
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mike_c Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 12:24 PM
Response to Original message
17. on January 3rd dem complicity becomes real responsibility....
We must stop this madness.
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Kurovski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 02:59 PM
Response to Original message
22. K&R(nt)
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dfgrbac Donating Member (378 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 04:27 PM
Response to Original message
23. These attitudes are a result of corporate mass media.
People can be manipulated by the mass media, there is no doubt about it. This is the big reason that the FCC Fairness Doctrine was in place - until the Reagan Administration repealed it. This doctrine required that the media present all issues balanced with opinions from both sides. If not, the other side could ask for equal time - and get it.

When the Fairness Doctrine was repealed, it allowed the likes of Rush Limbaugh and Bill O'Reily to hit the air! And we see the result.

In the coming Democratic Presidential Primary debates, you will hear candidate Mike Gravel telling us how we can overcome this corporate dominance over our country and our lives. We, the people, can enact the National Initiative for Democracy!
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MasonJar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 04:55 PM
Response to Original message
25. Gove them a chance please. I just read a post today saying
that investigations of renditions and other torture would be immediately on the agenda. The Dems weren't even allowed a place to hold meetings and were ostracized by the PUKES.
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KoKo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 06:49 PM
Response to Original message
27. We ARE "Moral Monsters" but we were convinced we were doing
THE RIGHT THING...even though we uprooted and destroyed..civilizations before us!

Perhaps it's OUR GUILT...that still drives us? :shrug:
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ranadec Donating Member (15 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-22-06 09:39 AM
Response to Reply #27
30. Similarities?
Israel's Zionists are almost committing genocide...taking land and resources.

The US is based on genocide and took land and resources. Manifest destiny?

Both seem to be basically driven by religious beliefs...mixed with political ideas...anger, fear, and greed? Both are the "chosen people"?

Interesting how in the US...it's "whiney time"....that time at the end of the year when Americans try to be REALLY NICE...I guess to make up for the rest of the year?

As if this will make what happened to the most recent 2/3s of a million Iraqi victims go away....or maybe that's part of what it's all about? "Out, damned spot! out, I say!...."

Best wishes for this Holiday Season....that's my social conditioning speaking.
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