Why were Karl Rove, George Bush, and the Repubs so wrong...?

[kentuck]

..about the last election? As Dubya said, "Karl has all the numbers". He assured all the Republicans in the House and Senate that they would maintain control. They would lose a few seats in the House but would still hold the majority. Never in their wildest imaginations did they expect to lose the Senate.

After all, Karl was the "brain" behind the operation and if he said they were going to win, they believed it. Dubya went so far as to ask Denny Hastert to stay on as Speaker. So what happened??

No doubt, they are still scratching their heads. They had dotted every "i" and crossed every "t"...what changed the equation? How could they have been so wrong?

The Democrats rejoiced. The voters had chosen them over the Republicans. But, did they really? Or did they simply reject the Republicans and then, the Democrats were the only other option? Is it possible that the voters are still in limbo, waiting for changes and solutions, and the Democrats are only renting the place for a short time?

What was different about the last election as compared to those in the past? My hunch is that the Internet came of age and the Karl Roves of the world did not see it coming. They did not see the Trojan Horse standing at their gate - crammed full of volunteers and ideas for the future. Although the Democrats are more advanced than the Republicans on the workings of the Internet, I think they see it mostly as a "fund-raising" tool. They recall how Dr. Dean raised so much money in 2004. However, it is much more than that. It is a tool to change the world. It is a "democratic" tool - with a small "d".

Those political Parties that cling to their old paradigm are doomed to failue and extinction, in my opinion. They must either adapt to a new reality or they may go the way of the dodo bird. The "new way" is one of social progress. It is one of enlightenment. It is one that brings the world together, rather than making weapons that kill each other. It is one that looks to improve the lives of each individual. The potential is unlimited.

[90-percent]

1. new way?

Plan "B" for them would simply be to censor the internet. Then they don't have to do all this "changing" you suggest.

-85% Jimmy

[kentuck]

2. If they could, they would have already done it...

It's easier said than done.

[pretzel4gore]

6. that's right: it's like organizing the drops/water

in lake erie....one thing for sure - as you say, if they could censor the net, or slow the leftwing, they'd do it, but it appears they csan't w/out tromping on rightwing toes, and, well, the rightwing has been told not to trust the gov and therefore they are suspicious bastards even when it's their own!
:rofl:
(i eagerly await the leaked gop memo saying 'shush, you fools, we're just suspending oneman one vote, the idiot amer ppl will gyly go along but YOU MUST SHUTTUP!')
:rofl:

[whistle]

3. Wrong question.....ask why do so many Americans still believe the lies which

....Rove and the White House have been putting over on the American people to command even the minority of votes which went to republican candidates this past November? Democrats should have come away perhaps 30 more seats in the House and at least 3 to 6 more seats in the Senate. Karl Rove gets far too much credit as a political genius when he is really nothing but a two bit grifter and scam artist with like minded crooks and charlatans working along with him to hood wink Americans of our due process and fair voting counts.

[babylonsister]

4. Have you considered they're lying through their teeth and knew

how badly they'd be trounced, but couldn't bear to admit it? Heck, all the pundits were pretty much calling it for the Dems, at least the House, and the Senate was considered to be a squeaker. They knew but could do nothing about it; their failed policies preceded them, ensuring their loss. Maybe they didn't realize just how fed up Americans are, but even that would be ignorant on their part considering all the polling that was done.

[nuxvomica]

5. They still believed that people still believed them

The election was lost by the summer of 2005 when their credibility numbers went down, thanks to Cindy Sheehan and the disastrous aftermath of Katrina. These folks lived and died by the bullshit they were selling and when a) folks caught on and b) the Bushistas kept lying like folks still believed them, the hole just kept getting deeper. Once the people know the emporer has no clothes, things are pretty bad for the emporer but he can make it even worse if he continues to think they don't know he's naked.

[izzie]

7. Could be they just believed what they said.

I hardly ever believe a thing until the votes are in.

[MathEducation]

8. for one thing...

They didn't make homosexual marriage or abortion an issue.

http://www.libertypost.org/cgi-bin/readart.cgi?ArtNum=165779&Disp=4

...

Even before he made that forecast, Dobson said that Christians should tell the GOP leadership – at that time Newt Gingrich, Dick Armey and Trent Lott – that "the ground is shifting underneath their feet; that they are aware that they have been ignored … and if that lack of commitment to the things in which they believe continues then they will abandon the Republican Party."

[pretzel4gore]

13. the dollar issue....

the ratwing fundies can lie to each other as much as they want, but that don't change the fact the iraq war is lost, and god knows at what cost, the nation is filled with hate (i sure hate, i'd execute rush limbah, bill oreilly, coulter, frum, brite hum, gibson and a host of local mediawhores with my own hands, if given chance!)...and when some confidence man sells snake oil along with truth/salvation etc, and the snake oil stinks to hi heaven? well fukkem. and that's basically what happened. the busheviks can spin the loss anyway they want, but iraq is theirs-they did iraq, and goddam them they are stuck with it! pretending they only 'domestic' terrorist aint gonna wash now, it's obvious they are terrorists and that is all that's left!

[TheCowsCameHome]

9. Maybe the lies and deceit were too hard to cover up.

[napi21]

10. I think they underestimated the voters and how disgusted they are

with the current powers. "Their base" is dwindling, and I don't think they recognized that. They figured the RW fundies were a larger group than they really are, and the silent majority went to the polls, which is unusual in an off election year.

I really doubt they knew they were going to take such a big hit. All you had to do was watch Shrub at that Press Conference the day after the election to see how utterly dejected he was. Even through the attempts at jokes, it was very obvious. He's trying to recover, but I think he's going to be shocked AGAIN when he has to deal with a Dem majority and can no longer get anything he wants! It should be an interesting 2007!

[MathEducation]

12. or maybe...

it was a "sucker punch..." or a ruse...

http://tkdtutor.com/13Sparring/Free-Sparring/SparringStrategy/SparringStrategyIII.htm

Don't underestimate these guys... There's a reason. They know what they're doing...

It appeared that Rove didn't give a shit. I suspect that he's content with the damage he's done. If we are lucky he'll crawl into some hole for the rest of his pitiful life and do no more damage...

[jarab]

11. The Dem braintrust was also soooo wrong on the Senate ..

Almost all had us coming up a few - at least one or two - short of majority.

I think the internet did have a lot to do with the close races, for the first time ever. And, perhaps Rove used his last psychological ammo in guaranteeing victory - absolutely knowing the results could go either way.
Then, again, maybe pollsters are the last hucksters - worthless as our barometers at critical times.

...O...

[Mist]

14. Well, I'm not sure I agree with your premise that the voters changed

from 2000 and 2004. Gore won, and there's ample reason to assume that Kerry won. I think a big difference was that some of the Rethug base, the fundy base, peeled away after Kuo's book and the Ted Haggard scandal. Another possibility: some fence sitters, who say they don't see a huge difference between the parties, got off their asses and voted Democratic. In fact, I wonder at the election results being as close as they were; I think the Rethugs were going to try to swing a number of elections, but the number of Dem votes provided too wide a margin to plausibly steal.

[calimary]

15. I think perhaps it was the Dean factor. I don't think kkkarl took that

particular ingredient seriously. You're correct in pointing out that "they recall how Dr. Dean raised so much money in 2004." But they DIDN'T take that seriously. Why? I think it was because Dean didn't go all the way. So, to their way of thinking, whatever it was he did couldn't have been all that significant. Why? Because it didn't win the election for him. They further saw the hoo-hah over the "Dean Scream" and concluded that this guy's a flake, don't worry about him, don't waste your time on him, he's nothing but a flash in the pan, and look, he can't even get all his own Dems together. 'Cause you can BET they saw the rancor generated against Dean within the DNC and especially the DLC, a lot of which STILL exists.

I think they seriously misunderestimated Dr. Dean. They probably took note of the struggle a LOT of us out there in voterland were forced to go through, even to convince the DNC that Dean should be our chair. THAT wasn't even a slam dunk. We had to push and push and push. And when Dean had such an uphill struggle to push forward with his "50-state strategy" (for which many STILL don't give him credit), I'm sure the bad guys took note of that, too. They laughed and scoffed at Dean all the way to the LOSER'S CIRCLE!!!!

All they understand is winning, which they'll do ANYTHING to accomplish. ANYTHING. Therefore, anything that does NOT win isn't worth their time. Dean didn't win in 2004. Didn't even get to the end of primary season. So to them, he was utterly worthless. So they turned their noses up at him and laughed. To their everlasting humiliation and DEFEAT.

And I, for one, as a longtime Dean-dame, couldn't be more delighted!

:toast: