Kerry getting a primary challenge from the left?

[SaveElmer]

Sen. John Kerry (D-MA) "may have competition for the Democratic Senate nomination in 2008," reports the Gloucester Times. Defense attorney Edward O'Reilly "said yesterday he will formally announce his bid at this weekend's Democratic Party convention in Amherst."

"The former Gloucester city councilor and School Committee chairman said Kerry's vote to authorize force in Iraq in 2002 is one reason why he's running."

I wonder if the same folks who supported Tasini against Hillary will take a look at this guy...


http://politicalinsider.com/2007/05/kerry_may_get_primary_challeng.html

[skipos]

1. Freaking hell. I understand running against Lieberman or some warmonger

but Kerry has changes his tune on Iraq and hopefully learned his lesson. Spend money defeating some New England Repubs please.

[iconocrastic]

111. We could win with a new face in Mass.

People are tired of Kerry. We need to rejuvenate our message. Can you tell me what Kerry's message even is (today)?

[Forkboy]

120. Um...we already HAVE Mass...why fuck with it?

People here aren't tired of Kerry.

[Adelante]

2. I hate this

We have a blue seat and have to fuck with it.

[flyarm]

3. good luck idiot!!...eom

[Mojambo]

4. I support primary challenges

Period.

It's healthy for our democracy to have EVERY representative (D or R) challenged every cycle. We are always whining that our representatives aren't held accountable. Well, consistent primary challenges are one way of doing that.

Having said all that, I still support Senator Kerry and hope he wins the nomination to run for his Senate seat again.

[deadmessengers]

5. Amen!

Couldn't have put it better myself.

[MH1]

6. This was discussed in the Kerry group - thinking this guy won't get on the ballot.

If he does, he'll be no match for Kerry.

:shrug: ... the guy wants to spend his money on a vanity campaign, so be it.

[Tellurian]

123. Vanity campaign? O'Rielly said it's a Grievance Campaign..

[beachmom]

7. Yep. I heard this today. We live in a democracy, and anyone

can attempt to challenge someone for an elected office. And that's a good thing. I hardly think this will keep Kerry up at night though. Thing is, no matter what I am sure Kerry would win the primary. But according to this Mass. blog, it is doubtful, he would get enough delegate votes to make it onto the ballot:

http://point08.blogspot.com/2007/05/watertown-native-challenging-kerry-in.html

O'Reilly described himself to the Herald as "no flash in the pan," but he faces high hurdles to even get on the 2008 ballot. He not only needs 10,000 signatures, but he'll need the vote of 15% of the delegates at the 2008 state convention. The latter is a feat that gubernatorial candidate Chris Gabrieli only barely pulled off last year. O'Reilly would likely have to accomplish that without the support of any institutional Democrat and without the benefit of a pre-convention advertising blitz. It seems doubtful that O'Reilly will make the ballot.

[WildEyedLiberal]

8. I'm sure there'll be a contingent of loonies supporting him

But even pro-war Dem Stephen Lynch's challenger got his ass handed to him in the Mass primary, so there's zero chance that this guy will get more than 10 or 15%. I'm sure Kerry will welcome the debate as a chance to discuss his initiatives to end the war, however.

[primative1]

80. Bingo ...

He gets some free TV time and we move on.

[jcrew2001]

9. Barney!

its barney's time! he'll be healed by then!

[sabbat hunter]

69. how old is bartney frank?

and does he want to go to the senate and challenge his friend john kerry ina primary?

he has been in the house a long time, may not want to go to teh senate.

how did he get hurt anyhow?

[jcrew2001]

74. kerry's the past, barney's the future

he got hurt doing wrist exercises, tore a tendon.

[sabbat hunter]

126. barney is the future?

well considering he is 3 years older than kerry i really wouldnt consider him "the future".

also i cannot see barney frank opposing his friend John kerry for the senatorial nomination.

[Forkboy]

136. Barney would never do that.

Barney is the real deal,both as a person and a Democrat.

[The Magistrate]

10. Oh, This Will Be Rum Fun, Mr. Elmer

Fourth of July and Christmas and Halloween all rolled up in one....

[Tellurian]

94. You called it, Magistrate! :)

[mtnsnake]

11. Well, Kerry's job MIGHT be safe...

as long as he doesn't crack any jokes, shoot any geese, windsurf in front of a TV camera, talk about lesbians, say something stupid and then make like he was just joking, dance like an Egyptian, brag how good a terrorist killer he could be, eat, sleep, walk, or talk!

[karynnj]

55. Actually,

He is far better with jokes than you gice him credit for. He held his own on the Colbert show. I assume that he may be asked about gay and lesbian issues and his answers are fine, though some would like him to be for gay marriage.

As to saying something stupid, he is unlikely to say that Ghandi runs a gas station in St Louis, which offended some people I know, nor is he likely to say that the younger generation is lazy.

As to being a good terrorist hunter, he is considered to have been right by people on all parts of the political spectrum on terrorism.

I doubt he would "dance like an Eqyptian", but George Butler in his book of photos put out in 2004 refers to a large Bundy family party where he first met John Kerry - he said that when a Charleston was played, easily the best dancer was John Kerry. He is an athlete and is suppose to be a graceful skier and skater, so I assume that he would be a good dancer. I bet that Teresa is too.

I also bet he, unlike a certain Senator, would likely agree to debate his primary challaanger.

Maybe Hillary should not talk about "fabulous shoes" or having to "ration chocolate" and she really needs to control those impatient eye rolls she does.

This is actually not really a challange from the left. Unlike Hillary, Kerry has been part of the group leading the effort to get out since 2005. Also, unlike Hillary, he spoke out before the war. Her challanger didn't get far, his will likely get less far.

[laugle]

134. It's nice to see a little humor here!

Kerry's a good man, but a jokester NOT!

[Forkboy]

12. Waste of time,but I enjoy the laugh.

[Tellurian]

13. His approval rating is way low for a Sr Senator..

Men just don't like him, most likely because he chickened out after the election.

[ProSense]

20. His approval rating jumped since the last time you checked

54%, and the young people love him 60%.

Stop salivating at the thought that Kerry will lose his seat.

Start praying that Hillary wins the primary. Kerry did!

[rinsd]

127. Here's the tracking version of that poll for ease of look up.

http://www.surveyusa.com/client/PollTrack.aspx?g=167be8b3-bb54-4fb9-bd74-401e630f31d8

[PresidentObama]

21. Ahm, JR. Senator. Sr. Senator would be Ted Kennedy. n/t

[Forkboy]

26. So he'll win with 75% of the vote instead of 80%

Men just don't like him..

Interesting comment.Can you prove that?

[PresidentObama]

27. He'll win alright. EASILY. n/t

[Forkboy]

29. Some here have been pushing the Kerry is weak in Mass meme.

Some here truly hate the man,and it's funny because I was calling his supporters Kerrybots for half the election,so I was hardly his biggest fan.Now I'm in the position of defending him from bitter Hillary fans who take every opportunity to attack him (these are the "good" Dems,naturally,who have only the Party's interest in heart,I'm sure).

Funny how DU works.

BTW,the "Kerrybot" only applied to a certain section of his supporters.One a certain section of Hillary supporters seem hell bent of copying.

[PresidentObama]

30. It doesn't take being a Kerry fan to know he's a great Senator.

This poster has no real reason to think Kerry is a bad one. They seem to think that Kerry will lose because he lost a Presidential election. I think the MA voters are smart enough to look at his record of accomplishments above all else, and make a judgment about what he's done for the state. NOT whether or not he won a bid for President.

[Forkboy]

36. I'll be voting for him

Which immediately discounts the laughable charge that,"men don't like him.." posited above.

[karynnj]

57. She also said that blacks don't like him in another post

I really don't know how he got 81% of the vote last time he ran for Senate. That was right after the IWR - It's hard to believe that non black non-Republican white women repesent 81% of the MA voting population.

He might beat the 69% that Hillary got after spending record amounts - ending up lower than Schumer in his race a few years earlier and Spitzer this year.

[wyldwolf]

14. KOS and crew were afraid to support Tasini. I doubt they'll support this guy

[w4rma]

15. "Afraid" to? More like smart enough not to. They aren't idiots. (nt)

[Tellurian]

17. O'Reilly stands a very good chance of unseating Kerry..nm

[w4rma]

18. I do realize that Hillary and her people would like to believe that, but it's not true. (nt)

[PresidentObama]

22. Why are you so against Kerry?

It's obviously blurring reality for you. This guy has no chance. I know tons of people from the great state of MA, and all of them say Kerry will be re-elected with ease. Including winning a mild primary fight against O'Reilly.

[Name removed]

45. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[WildEyedLiberal]

82. What blows my mind about it...

...The Hillarybots (in particular the one you are conversing with) got what they wanted. JK isn't running for president (thanks in large part to Hillary's decision to join in the trash-Kerry-a-thon brought to us by Tony Snow and Bush), the idea of which clearly terrified them. But some of them just can't let go of the irrational hatred, even though JK now poses no threat to her soulless juggernaut of a candidacy.

Whatever. I used to live in MA and you're completely correct, but let the screaming bots continue their jihad. I'm sure it keeps Kerry up at night. :crazy:

[politicasista]

83. LOL!

:rofl: True.

[laugle]

135. Every Hillary supporter is not against JK!

IMO, from what I have seen, it seems to be the other way around.

I know nothing about this possible candidate against Kerry, but I do know that the climate in this country is one of disgust with both parties!

Personally, I don't think anyone is safe, and candidates up for re-election should never be complacent.

It's pretty obvious that people are feeling a real need to finally change things in Washington.

My question is; "if not now--when?"

[wyldwolf]

19. same thing. They knew he'd lose and lose bad. They were afraid to support such a loser

[w4rma]

40. Two things. The Kos folks don't mind Hillary as a Senator they just don't want her as President.

In fact they like her as a Senator, in general.

Two, it's a waste of time and resources to support that guy and his go-nowhere campaign. That's not being "afraid", that's being smart with your resources.

[wyldwolf]

65. One thing: They knew they could never defeat Clinton, so they were afraid to try

[karynnj]

58. Afraid??

There was some support on DKos for him, but it was considered a lost cause - because realisticly it was. Also, Kerry has actually reached out to Dkos and the rest of the blogosphere, especially the MA blogs.

They know that Kerry led on Kerry/Feingold and is a leader pushing for a way out. His possible opponent proposes doing what Kerry proposed to do in Iraq. Unlike Hillary, Kerry will likely not be afraid to debate this guy. Kerry is currently working with Gary Hart and Zinni in an organization that Kerry proposed to the others to educate Americans on what issues really impact their national security.

Even though he is not a Presidential candidate, he is clearly one of the leading foreign policy thinkers and Massachusetts knows that. They also know that he is incredibly good at finding solutions when others have failed - whether on insuring that people could continue to get out of area baseball games on cable to the more important accomplishment of brokering a way to have the upcoming Cambodian Tribunal. The elegant solution that balanced Cambodian and international interests that the UN and Cambodia accepted has been accepted for use for the Siera Leone tribunal.

Here's a link to an excellent post on that with an understandable history of Cambodia in the 1960s -1970s, which is will help people counter any idea that the US leaving Vietnam was responsible for Pol Pot.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x905152

[wyldwolf]

64. they were afraid to support him because it was a lost cause

[Tellurian]

16. Kerry's opponent is an attorney..

from the OP Link:

"He also said Kerry mishandled contributions to his presidential campaign - including $2,000 O'Reilly donated. O'Reilly said Kerry should have used money in his account to challenge the results in Ohio, the state whose electoral college votes put George W. Bush ahead. There were allegations of voter fraud in Ohio.

Instead, O'Reilly said, Kerry is using the money left from his presidential bid to help fund his re-election campaign.

"There are a lot of things that have been building up," O'Reilly said of his issues with Massachusetts' junior senator.

O'Reilly has been an attorney for 25 years. He also is a former firefighter, corrections officer at Norfolk State Prison and Gloucester lobsterman. He hails from Watertown, and has degrees from the University of Massachusetts and New England School of Law."

O'Reilly seems very sure of himself...why shouldn't he be, he was a Gloucester fisherman (re:Perfect Storm). Gloucester fishermen are as tough as nails and back each other 100%. Looks like he'll have plenty of statewide support from unions and the locals. Most of all, he seems to have a laundry list of complaints against Kerry and intends to make those issues the centerpiece of his campaign. He'll get big support in Boston, the Irish capital second only to Dublin. Now that it was disclosed during Kerry's Presidential bid, he's not Irish at all.

[PresidentObama]

23. Kerry won't lose because he lost in 2004. He'll win because of his accomplishments for MA.

If this guy is running on the fact he didn't think Kerry used his money properly in the 2004 PRESIDENTIAL election, he'll lose easily. The Mass. voters care about their state, and they know John Kerry has fought for over twenty years to better their state and better the United States. Again I'll repeat this, your hatred for Kerry has blurred reality for you.

Kerry will win with ease. Watch.

[Tellurian]

24. I'm not to blame for Kerry's failures..

and what per chance has Kerry done for the State of Massachusetts?

[PresidentObama]

25. Kerry's failures? Losing the Presidential election? That links to his work for the state of MA how??

Don't pretend he hasn't done anything for his own state. Would he be in the Senate for over twenty years if he did nothing? Absolutely not. You've lost it if you believe that. His voting record and past is easily available to the public. I suggest you get to researching. Put your money where your mouth is that Kerry is this big failure, and hasn't done anything for MA. That or stick to cheerleading Hillary, please.

Heres a quick "big picture" look at his Senate Record from his Senate website. If you want to get down to the nitty gritty, get to researching. Or get back to cheerleading. Your choice. Here you go:

http://kerry.senate.gov/v3/about/record.html

[MH1]

28. They must hate him in MA, donchaknow? That's why

all his appearances are PACKED.

Mass-souls are strange that way, I've heard. They only show up and give multiple standing ovations during a speech to someone they detest and can't wait to vote against.

:sarcasm:

okay

:rofl:

(and I can't even see the post that you are replying to, which makes it even funnier)

[Tellurian]

31. Well, don't hold back..what has he done for his state lately?

His disapproval level is 43% with males in his own state!

http://www.surveyusa.com/client/PollReport.aspx?g=5954b748-8e5e-4c46-b7f6-b91b874c02b7

Packing them in with adoring females only gives him a slightly lower disapproval rating. huzzah!

[PresidentObama]

32. SurveyUSA. LOL. Can you read? 50 percent of males approve of the job he's doing.

And 57% of females according to this poll you just showed.

And you're trying to put the nail in his coffin. Yet Kerry is doing just fine, and will win with ease. Crazy.

[Tellurian]

33. According to his own site, he hasn't done anthing for MA in 5 yrs..

http://kerry.senate.gov/text/about/accomplishments.html

[PresidentObama]

34. Perhaps you should look here...

http://kerry.senate.gov/v3/cfm/headlines.cfm

Also might wanna look for some recent votes and such here:

http://www.opencongress.org/people/show/300060_john_kerry

[Tellurian]

35. I did. How many of his proposals have gotten passed..and where do I look..

to find what he's done for the State of MA in particular?

[Tellurian]

37. I see a problem with the latest.. The Water Resources Development Act of 2007[

H.R.1495 - Water Resources Development Act of 2007
To provide for the conservation and development of water and related resources, to authorize the Secretary of the Army to construct various projects for improvements to rivers and harbors of the United States, and for other purposes.

This Amendment was slipped into the WATER RESOURCES DEVELOPMENT ACT OF 2007: and passed and agreed upon as stated.

S.Amdt.1135 Pass To express the sense of the Senate that Congress must send to the President acceptable legislation to continue funds for Operation Iraqi Freedom and Operation Enduring Freedom by not later than May 28, 2007.

edited to include link:

http://www.opencongress.org/bill/110-h1495/show

Kerry's amendment was defeated here:

"An amendment offered by Senator John Kerry (D-MA), that would direct the Army Corps of Engineers to factor climate change into all future water projects fell short by 9 votes of a 60 vote requirement imposed by opponents of the amendment. According to a release from Senator Kerry, the amendment would direct the Army Corps of Engineers to use the best available climate science, account for potential future impacts of climate change on storms and floods, and account for the costs and benefits associated with the loss and protection of wetlands, floodplains, and other natural systems that can buffer the effects of climate change. The Kerry amendment was supported by numerous national, state, and local conservation and environmental organizations."

But Amd..1135 was passed..

[Inuca]

38. WHat are you talking about???

The Water Resources bill was in no way Kerry's (if it "belongs" to anybody, that would be Boxer). And what has he to do with the amendment you mention???

[Tellurian]

41. Kerry had submitted an Amendment that was defeated..I edited for clarity..

What about the Funding Iraqi Vote...did he vote for passage?

If not, why didn't Kerry announce the amendment was slipped in for the next vote?...

[karynnj]

71. It was not in Kerry's amendment

what about Hillary? She's in the Senate too. It also is meaningless - it is a sense of the Senate resolution - it is completely non-binding.

[karynnj]

70. It was the first Senate fight on global warming

It got 51 votes, it needed 60. Several Democrats voted against it. It will likely be offered again - because it is a very sensible bill that Feingold is sponsoring as well.

It says that on any future water product, climate change must be considered when engineering the project. I guess he could waste his time writing a bill to stop flag burning - which is a hugh threat to the country and is so tough to pass.

Maybe you should consider the Kerry Small Business amendments that were passed. Also consider he got an amendment passed that takes away pensions for congressmen ousted due to things like bribes. Last year Kerry's amendment that was a package to help Gulf state small businesses in the wake of hurricane Katrina was passed decisively. You won't find it listed under Kerry's name. You can look in the Senate record though and see that they called for a vote on Snowe/Kerry, which had been Kerry when fiorst introduced. During the vote, it's name changed to Snowe/Vitter. The reason because tthat was the way to get a huge block of Republican votes. Incidently, I noticed that Hillary was speaking of helping NO people a few days ago. Kerry wrote his bill within 2 weeks of the hurricane.

You must think it was a good idea, Hillary voted for it.

[draft_mario_cuomo]

49. His approval rating is 77% among Democrats and 74% among progressives

He is no Holy Joe (DLC-Ct). He is in no danger of losing in a primary.

[PresidentObama]

51. My thoughts exactly. Pretending he's in danger of a primary loss is nuts. n/t

[Alexander]

141. Shh! The Hillarybots' heads might explode!

Heaven forbid they be robbed of their delusion that Kerry will somehow lose re-election.

[last_texas_dem]

100. 43% disapproval from males isn't all that high...

Most Republicans aren't going to approve of John Kerry, and even deep "blue" Massachusetts has around a 30-35% Repug population. Add on some Independents and a handful of Dems, and factor in that men are more likely to be conservatives or at least not partial to liberals, and Kerry's 43-percent disapproval from males in his state looks pretty normal; perhaps even a bit on the low side.

[draft_mario_cuomo]

48. Kerry's failures?

Kerry is someone who rose from relatively modest means to become a Lt. Gov to Dukakis, a powerful Senator, and a presidential nominee. He did this all on merit, not with any shortcuts...

[tigereye]

67. I thought he was from a well-to do family

not that that is entirely relevant to the issue.

[karynnj]

73. His immediate family was upper middle class

but his mother was a Forbes and also descended from the first Governor of Massachusetts - you know the guy who said "Boston was the shining city on the hill" (the phrase Reagan borrowed).

So, although he had less money than any one in his circle. He had an aunt who paid for his private school tuition. He also was connected to the elite and accepted as one of them. Had he chose to make money rather than public service after he left school, he would have had great jobs handed to him on a silver platter.

One way you could think of it was that Clinton had to go to Boy's state reach over other kids to shake Kennedy's hand. Kerry shook Kennedy's hand when he met him a few times and sailed on his yaught. Kerry's connection was that in his senior year in high school and freshman year in college he dated Jackie Kennedy's step-sister.

Although Kerry worked a few summers unloading boats and had a union card, on his Senate web site he says he had a priviledged upbringing. He is right - he did.

He did however work hard to get all the offices he did.

[blm]

124. Kerry COULD HAVE used his connections but always chose to WORK and ACHIEVE

his goals, not have them handed to him.

You're right about his upbringing - though his mother was a Forbes, his parents lived modestly on a public servant's salary, which would be considered middle class now, but he was fortunate enough to have an aunt to fund his coolege tuition.

[ISUGRADIA]

43. O'Reilly is going to get no official union support

Please, union leaders are not idiots. Have you seen Kerry's AFL-CIO ratings? They are not going to back a primary opponent to a supportive Senator.

[Forkboy]

46. Keep grasping.

While I keep laughing.

[karynnj]

63. Terullian

Will you bet your presence here on that? I will bet mine. Your acceptance or rejection will tell how serious you are.

One of Kerry's Forbes ancestor led an effort that sent a boat load of food to Ireland during the famine. There's a statue in Boston. That should make him and his descendant an honorary Irishman. Kerry incidentally told Russert on Meet the Press that his Kerry ancestors were from Austria.

[Tellurian]

79. Why are you avoiding my question?

Placing bets, giving the 1000th obligatory rendition of Kerry's familial history.

When in fact, no one can tell me specifically, what Kerry has done for the State of Massachusetts in the last 5 yrs?

[karynnj]

88. You brought up the family history

Just this year,

- Kerry got increased funding for the Veterans Centers dealing helping vets deal with re-entry into society and PTSD - this included 7 Massachusetts centers.
- Kerry was the person who created many of the women's and minority small business programs.
- A little less than a year ago, when Massachusetts had severe floods, Kerry quickly converted a Small Business Forum he was having to deal with helping small business in the area file the forms needed in addition to the meeting itself.
- Kerry is a leading environmental expert in the Senate - which benefits the nation and MA
- Kerry is a leading technology expert - which benefits the nation and MA
- Kerry (through his book), has raised awareness and money for the Silent Spring Institute in Cape
Cod
- Kerry has introduced both his kids insurance plan and his innovative plan for catastophic insurance.
- Kerry was the main person who got the troubled Coast Guard program re-bid. (As they were producing a boat that wouldn't make the specs and they were greatly over cost this will save money and get a usable product.)

Kerry is leading as much as anyone else (and far more than most) to getting us out of Iraq which benefits everyone. He also has international respect and has done things like broker the up coming Cambodean tribunal. I do not intend to list all the grants to MA colleges that Kerry, Kennedy, and the MA congressmen have announced. I've watched Kerry in committee on CSPAN and he is impressive.


Here's one that the Senator who heads the SRFC subcommittee that covers the middle east and northeast likely had something to do with.
- Kerry, Kennedy announce Northeastern University's Middle East Studies Program to receive $85,000

Not counting NY pork and flag burning, what exactly has Hillary done. Among other things, Kerry in his first term:
- opened the Contra part of Iran/Contra. Once it was in the open, Reagan couldn't fund the Contra thugs and the drugs the Contras were allowed to bring into the US stopped. Could that have been part of the improvement in the cities in 1990 vs the middle 1980s??
- Did most of the work on BCCI - which likely had more impact on identifying terrorist networks than anything done by any other Senator. A terrorist connected Pakistani bank had bought protection from both sides of the aisle and was doing business in the US. Kerry stood against t alone.
I know you don't like to here this, but those were major accomplishments. In comparison, what has Hillary done?

[Tellurian]

96. What are you so afraid of..why won't you answer a few questions relative to Kerry's record..

On what has he done for the State of MA specifically over the last 5 yrs?

And how many of the Bills Kerry sponsored have gotten passed and could you please list them here?

[karynnj]

130. Didn't see this one Saturday

But here is a link to Kerry's accomplisments . http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=3271641

For comparison, here is what a Hillary supporter posted when asked her five most significant accomplishments.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=3272026&mesg_id=3272140

He has been in the Senate far longer than Seantor Clinton, whose rather thin list of accomplishments in the Senate you posted. The impact of 2 of Kerry's first term efforts were each greater than her entire list.

1) Kerry investigated the illegal funding of the Contras. They were right wing thugs who were quilty of killing nuns and priests in addition to their own people. They were also bringing drugs into this country. If Kerry were not investigating the it would have been a scandal of selling arms to Iran to free the hostage - and the entire covert Central American piece might have gone unnoticed. This was immoral for what we were doing in Central America and because we allowed the importation of cocaine into the US. The investigations of this greating damaged GHWB's popularity. His excuse that he knew nothing about that because he must have been gone to the men's room then was not believable.

2) Kerry investegated BCCI. Closing this bank was a major set back for the OBL empire.

[wisteria]

119. Senator Kerry already has the support of most unions and firefighters along with most of Mass.

Don't get you hopes up, Senator Kerry will continue to be around to out shine Hillary Clinton.

[Alexander]

138. Kerry losing is a bigger pipe dream than Hillary winning the nomination...

But don't let me stop you in your hatefest.

Given your obvious loathing for Senator Kerry, I think it's fair to ask - did you vote for him in 2004?

[Mass]

39. It is still a democracy, so he can announce his run. If he gets 10 000 signatures and 15 % of the

delegates at the Convention, he will be on the ballot. Then we will see what happens.

Still a lot of steps before he is on the ballot. This said, a primary challenge is not necessarily bad, but, whatever the Kerry hater in this thread thinks, it is doubtful that the person has a chance. Kerry's number for April on the Survey USA poll were back to what they are normally in MA and the only rational for the opponent to run is a 5 year old vote and his position on Iraq is the same as Kerry.

[Tellurian]

42. I think we should get something straight right now..

I don't HATE anyone. And I don't hate for other people.

I may not like someone and reflect that inference in my opinion, but I'm not a HATER as you are so quick to label people who do not conform to your opinion. The use of that word may apply to others, but it is far and away not a word that comes close to describing me. So, I would appreciate it if you would keep that in mind when responding to anything I've written.

I don't hate John Kerry. I may not like him and think it's time for him to go, but I do not Hate the man.

[Forkboy]

47. uh huh.

[Cameron27]

62. Come on Forkboy,

I don't doubt what Tellurian says. Let's face it, there really is something close to hate for both Hillary and Bill Clinton from some posters here that her supporters consistantly have to confront.

[Forkboy]

66. I don't argue that there are those who seem to hate Hillary.

But Tellurian acts just they do when it comes to Kerry.Either he is a hater too,or possibly the people he thinks are haters really aren't.

[MH1]

75. For what it's worth, I detest Hillary.

Due to her despicable behavior to Kerry, which taught me that she is absolutely untrustworthy. I also think it will be very, very bad for the Democratic Party if she wins the nomination, because it will energize the republican base and demoralize a good bit of the democratic base.

But I try not to be overbearing about it. I don't jump on every Hillary thread I see just to toss my complaints about her back at her supporters. I do post them occasionally - particularly when someone else brings her up in a non-Hillary thread - but I try to avoid getting in a big flamewar about it - it is simply my observations that I will state occasionally to remind people what some people object to about her. If other people feel that they can trust her despite my experience, or that her positions or just being a woman outweigh the issues that I bring up, then that is fine - everyone is entitled to their own choice based on their values and priorities.

I think some of the Hillary supporters try to trash Kerry at every opportunity they get, and it's really getting old. He isn't running for president in 2008, there's no way any serious primary challenge will be mounted against him for his senate seat, and it's just really silly to keep trying to tear him down.

But then, it shows more about the character of those posters, than about Kerry, so it's fine. The ignore button comes in very handy.

[Tellurian]

77. Now , you're just acting childish...

demonstrating what little respect you have for yourself and others, who express their sincere thoughts into words.

[Forkboy]

78. You're half right about who I don't respect.

[Name removed]

87. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Tellurian]

97. Thanks, seasonedblue..

and of course you are right.

[ProSense]

61. Political posturing it not a strong record

Most Senators will never match Kerry's record. Not one of the current candidates will ever come close. Senator Kerry is responsible for authoring and contributing to some of the most important pieces of legislation passed or pending. Also, given the makeup of Congress, a progressive Democrat is going to have a long uphill battle to get legislation passed.

Senator Kerry continues to fight to get sensible progressive legislation passed rather than offer up watered down ones just to score points. I wish some of those racing to get legislation like the bankruptcy bill passed (score!) would do the country a favor and slow down, stop weakening good bills and supporting bad one.

[beachmom]

72. Of course it's hate. Either of JK or his supporters or both.

I can't imagine wishing for Sen. Clinton to be defeated in a primary. I have no issue with her being senator. You, OTOH, seem to have a big problem with John Kerry even being in the Senate. That shows me that your hatred has blinded you to the fact that you are being disloyal to your party. Disloyal by undercutting our last standard bearer. Disloyal for wanting to squash one of the most progressive members of the Senate. Disloyal for putting your own personal vendettas ahead of protecting the Democratic brand. Make no mistake that when you speak so disdainfully of our LAST NOMINEE, Independents and Republicans notice and think: hey, those Democrats don't even believe in their own nominees, so we sure won't.

You oughta be ashamed of yourself.

[karynnj]

81. So, you play a person ion TV who does?

You spend more energy on knocking Kerry, than you do on supporting Hillary.

[Tellurian]

86. Nope, just asking a simple question, What has Kerry done for the State of MA in the last 5yrs?????

You dance around the question with insults and innuendo...but are devoid of facts..

Oh, and while I'm asking...How many of the myriad of Bills proposed by Kerry in the Senate have passed?

And please list them if you will.

[beachmom]

89. This question WOULD be relevant IF in MA there were NO:

veterans, small business owners, children, voters, women, sick people, Vietnam Vets who got cancer from Agent Orange, Vietnamese Americans, and so son. Apparently, according to Tellurian's definition, NOBODY lives in Mass. except chipmunks, so UNTIL Kerry passes the Rights of Chipmunks Act, he has done JACK SHIT for Mass.

[Tellurian]

90. Wow...nothing but drool! nm

[beachmom]

98. Your question has been asked and answered by multiple people.

The fact is you don't give a shit. You couldn't care less about Massachusetts. Because if you cared, you would want John Kerry re-elected.

But you come into thread after thread after thread shitting all over Kerry and Kerry supporters.

Your disloyal posts say a lot about you, and nothing about Senator Kerry.

Because only someone disloyal would advocate having Kerry kicked out of the Senate.

[Tellurian]

102. Well then can you produce a record of Kerry's accomplishments over the last 5 yrs.. because

This is all I have:

http://kerry.senate.gov/text/about/accomplishments.html

According to his own link..he hasn't accomplished anything in the last 5 yrs. and I can't find a reference anywhere else.

So, if you have info that would help Kerry out relating to his sponsored Bills passing or anything he's done for the State of MA, please post it here.

Thanks-

[ProSense]

103. Do you

read?

[Forkboy]

104. Now we wont get an answer at all.

You're gonna scare them away with facts.

[Forkboy]

106. Well I was wrong..his record is "very thin".

:rofl:

[ProSense]

101. I guess you stumped everyone huh?

05/11/2007 Kerry, Kennedy, Olver announce UMASS Amherst's Polymer Science and Engineering Program to receive $170,508 Kerry, Kennedy, Olver announce UMASS Amherst's Polymer Science and Engineering Program to receive $170,508
04/27/2007 Kerry announces seven Massachusetts Vet Centers to receive additional funding
03/21/2007 Kerry, Kennedy, Delahunt announce Cape Cod National Seashore to receive $2 million for land preservation
07/19/2006 Senate Committee Passes Kerry Amendment on Big Dig Investigation
06/01/2006 SENATORS KERRY, KENNEDY PLEASED TO ANNOUCE FOUR MASSACHUSETTS COMPANIES AWARDED TAX CREDITS TO INCREASE INVESTMENT IN LOW-INCOME COMMUNITIES
08/17/2005 SENATOR KERRY, SENATOR KENNEDY ANNOUNCE GRANT FOR MEDFORD LAW ENFORCEMENT
08/17/2005 SENATORS KERRY AND KENNEDY ANNOUNCE FEDERAL GRANT TO WEST SPRINGFIELD POLICE DEPARTMENT FOR FINGERPRINTING TECHNOLOGY
07/18/2005 Senator John Kerry Announces $8,037,000 Grant Awarded to the Massachusetts Victim Witness Assistance Board
07/12/2005 SENATOR JOHN KERRY AND SENATOR EDWARD KENNEDY ANNOUNCE $13,709 GRANT TO BOLSTER LAW ENFORCEMENT EFFORTS IN WARREN
11/24/04 LAWMAKERS ANNOUNCE NEW FUNDS FOR U MASS DARTMOUTH PROGRAMS THAT BENEFIT SOUTHEASTERN MASSACHUSETTS
11/23/04 KENNEDY, KERRY, DELAHUNT ANNOUNCE $500,000 FOR MARTHA’S VINEYARD HOSPITAL
11/23/04 KERRY, KENNEDY AND FRANK ANNOUNCE FUNDING TO COMPLETE ROUTE 106 REHABILITATION
11/23/04 KERRY, KENNEDY, MCGOVERN AND FRANK ANNOUNCE NEW FUNDING FOR FALL RIVER
11/23/04 LAWMAKERS ANNOUNCE FUNDS FOR NEW BEDFORD
11/23/04 Kennedy, Kerry and Capuano Secure Millions for Important Cambridge
11/23/04 KENNEDY, KERRY & DELAHUNT DELIVER $1 MILLION TO FIGHT CANCER
11/23/04 KERRY, KENNEDY AND LYNCH ANNOUNCE $1.5 MILLION IN FEDERAL FUNDING FOR BROCKTON PRIORITIES:
11/23/04 KENNEDY, KERRY, CAPUANO, LYNCH AND MARKEY ANNOUNCE FEDERAL ASSISTANCE FOR THE GREATER BOSTON AREA
11/23/04 KENNEDY, KERRY, & LYNCH ANNOUNCE $200,000 IN FEDERAL FUNDING TO IMPROVE DRINKING WATER IN BRAINTREE, HOLBROOK AND RANDOLPH
11/22/04 Kerry Gets Unfair Tariffs Lifted:
10/10/03 Senator Kerry and Congressman Tierney Announce Grant to Expand sea sampling of the lobster resource into offshore areas of Massachusetts
10/08/03 Kennedy, Kerry and Capuano Announce $50,000 for YouthBuild
10/08/03 Kennedy, Kerry and Frank Announce $50,000 grant to provide technical assistance to 15 Small Businesses in rural areas of Barnstable, Bristol, Plymouth, and Norfolk counties
10/08/03 Kennedy, Kerry and Lynch Announce Grant to Improve Community Safety in the City of Brockton $225,000 grant to fund Brockton Weed and Seed site
10/07/03 Kennedy, Kerry and Meehan Announce Grant to Improve Community Safety in the City of Lawrence $225,000 grant to fund Lawrence Police Department Weed and Seed site
06/18/02 KERRY WINS EXTENSION OF DISASTER LOAN DEADLINE FOR SMALL BUSINESSES SBA RESPONDS TO LOBBYING BY KERRY ON BEHALF OF STRUGGLING COMPANIES
06/14/02 Disaster Area Declaration Offers Gloucester Community Chance to Recover

You can find a lot more like it at Kerry's Senate site

And he still has one of the greatest Senators ever.

Don't you have some Hillary spinning to do?

[Tellurian]

105. I suppose I did..

thanks for posting something...Prosense..even though his record is very thin..I do appreciate you doing it.

Did you find anything relating to his sponsored Bills that have passed? Could you post those too?

Thanks again-

[ProSense]

109. Did you read the entire post? The link is there. n/t

[wisteria]

116. For someone who knows nothing about the man, you certainly have a lot to say about him,

It is time for him to go? Exactly why? Perhaps it is because he is an honest politician and would actually speak truth to power and not just pretend too.
Tell me, if "Hill" looses are you going to suggest it is time for her to go too?

[knight_of_the_star]

44. Just to point something out SaveElmer

Unlike HRC, Kerry has said he made a mistake in voting for the IWR and has worked to undo that mistake. HRC has yet to admit she made a mistake or take serious efforts to end the conflict by assuming any kind leadership role on the issue. Of course facts are funny that way huh?

[PresidentObama]

52. I would prefer this not become a Hillary vs. Kerry thread.

In any event, I'm very happy with Kerry's position on the Iraq War. And happy he stayed in the Senate to confront the issues of global warming and the Iraq War. And I live in the real world, and know Senator Kerry will win re-election. He's a great Senator, and has done a lot for this country. Because he "lost" a Presidential election isn't going to cost him anything.

[Name removed]

76. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[laugle]

137. Thank you for injecting that and also, we don't

need to beat-up on Tellurian for asking a relevent question, just because he supports Hillary!

[politicasista]

144. Nobody is beating up her for supporting Hillary

She has a right to support who she wants. It the attacks on fellow Democrats just to promote Hillary that people are jumping on her for. Especially after people have posted facts that refute the lies.

[SaveElmer]

131. Two things...

First, what you say about Hillary is both incorrect, and irrelevant.

Second, Hillary has already faced the voters since her IWR vote, and they overwhelmingly voted to send her back to the Senate...

And as Kerry2008 said, this is not a Hillary vs. Kerry thread...I hope Kerry wins

[draft_mario_cuomo]

50. Why do HRC supporters seem to hate Senator Kerry?

Obviously, the fact that Kerry is a progressive is part of it but there seems to be more behind this apparent hostility to Kerry from HRC supporters.

[politicasista]

59. Cause he still is a threat even if he isn't running n/t

[Forkboy]

68. I don't get what he really has to do with this election anyways.

I'm sure he'll have an effect to a certain degree,but it won't be a big one.So why the hostility? :shrug:

I know a few have problems with another poster who defends Kerry a lot,and doesn't seem to like Hillary much,and I think that's a part of it.Very few of them seem to take kindly to disliking the Goddess of Peace*.

* Copyright 2007 Mtnsnake,Inc. :)

[karynnj]

84. Because Kerry has spent his entire career fighting

the foreign policy of the last half century. Senator Kerry, who will be re-elected, will be one of the few people will to demand accountability - from Democrats as well as Republicans.

My guess is that on DU, Kerry and the Kerry supporters were the first people these guys attacked. They now targeted Obama and his supporters and I assume that I either missed the attacks on Edwards or they are coming. I have actually even questioned if they really support Hillary - because of the anger they intentionally stir up. That seriously doesn't seem the way to increase support.

One of them has gone so far as to say that when the Clintons win, we DU Kerry people will be investigated - which is absolutely illogiocal.

[Alexander]

142. "I have actually even questioned if they really support Hillary"

As do I. Anyone can see that the tactics used by Hillary supporters here cause more people to vote against her than for her.

The Hillary fanatics here are either the craziest, most unhelpful group of supporters ever, or they are operatives working for another campaign. Either way, they are doing an excellent job of making sure DUers don't vote for her.

[beachmom]

85. I don't know. I doubt it's true out in the country, but it seems

this is about settling scores with Kerry SUPPORTERS.

Edit: and this is largely a DU phenomenon. Hillary supporters on DailyKos respect and like Kerry very much.

[SaveElmer]

132. Why do Hillary detractors...

Always make shit up?

Point to where I said I hated Senator Kerry!

In fact, I do not support a primary challenge of this type, and would hope Massachusetts voters will reject it if it takes place.

[laugle]

139. It's not hatred for JK. People in general were

profoundly disappointed that Kerry didn't win in 2004, and we have to go through 4 more years of Bushco.

Also, IMO, there was alot of bad blood created, and still continuing today on the Kerry/Hillary threads.

I think there is much more vitriol towards Hillary than Kerry. I know there are many supporters of Hillary at DU, yet the majority of them don't seem to be posting very often, and that's understandable.

Regardless of our difference's, as democrat's, we are on the same team. I hope we can treat each other with respect and improve the dialogue.

[politicasista]

143. Why don't you blame the Democrats that sat on the sidelines

while the candidate was attacked and didn't back him up? Why don't you blame an unfair and unbalanced media that didn't do THEIR job? Or a DNC chair that didn't work hard enough to secure the Dem infrastructure like Dean is doing now?


Yes, go ahead, keep beating up the victim. That only helps the repukes even more.

[Czolgosz]

53. Isn't this how a Democracy is supposed to work?

[PresidentObama]

54. Sure. If the guy makes it on the ballot, he'll have his opportunity.

With that said, Kerry will win with ease!!

[Czolgosz]

56. Of course Kerrill win. I'm disappointed Lieberman survived his challenge from the left, but Kerry

will (and should) win his with ease.

[Tellurian]

91. Yep, I enjoy a good horse race! nm

[wisteria]

60. Well, this guy is not only up against Massachusetts supporters, but those out side of the state

that still support him.He is in for the fight of his life from Senator Kerry and ALL his supporters.

[IA_Seth]

92. Yep.

He'll have money coming from me. He has campaigned for friends in local races, and I owe that to him. I am sure I am not alone.

[Tellurian]

93. He seems to be well prepared..

and according to the OP, his reason for running is not necessarily to win...but to air grievances he has with Kerry. And of course, Kerry supporters know, this isn't a National election, you have to have a residence in MA to vote.

[wisteria]

117. Yeah, and these types are a dine a dozen. Don't get too giddy.

Senator Kerry isn't loosing. This challenger offers nothing but worthless and questionable complaints about Kerry.

[MH1]

95. I think it's hilarious

that this post has almost 100 comments and enough recs to get on the greatest page.

It's not like there's anything important going on in the world or anything. A meaningless challenge to a popular Democratic senator in a deep blue state - a challenger who probably can't even get on the primary ballot - is worth all this time?

Okay, it's not hilarious, it's sad.

That said, I guess I'd better stop commenting too. It's been fun, but really, folks!

[beachmom]

99. Good point, MH. It's technically called the "asshole" phenomenon.

All you need is one asshole, and suddenly there are 100 posts. I'm officially done with this thread.

[Tellurian]

108. Oh, no...don't go..

perhaps you learned something you didn't know. Kerry has a record after all. Somewhat thin, but he does have one..see it wasn't a total waste because you learned something..BRAVA!

[karynnj]

110. She is perfecting aware of much of Senator Kerry's accomplishments

which are not thin. You didn't answer what Hillary did in her first term comparable in importance to just 2 of Kerry's first term accomplishments. ( Stopping the illegal funding of the Contras by bringing it to light by investigating whan no one else would and stopping the the terrorist linked bank BCCI from controlling a bank operating in the US) Those are MASSIVE important efforts.

What did Hillary do - frankly I'm not interested in NY pork.

[Tellurian]

107. Nothing lost..

you got to air your feelings on how you detest Hillary...

It was somewhat therapeutic, doncha think? fifteen hundred forty one page views and counting later..

[JI7]

112. John Kerry should look to Hillary's incredible record and bravery

in standing with Holy Joe against video games as how to be a good Senator.

maybe Hillary can teach him a few ethnic jokes also.

[JI7]

113. i notice some Hillary supporters have more posts bashing others

than they do supporting Hillary. the only "pro Hillary" posts they make are the stupid polls which currently are mostly a reflection of whoever the media whore gives most attention to.

[Alexander]

140. Make that "nearly all" Hillary supporters, and I'd agree.

The very same people saying "Boast about your candidate, but don't bash the others!" are the ones bashing every other candidate out there (including some who aren't running yet) and offering weak, laughable defenses of Senator Clinton ("Goddess of Peace"?...get real). :eyes:

Ironic.

[JI7]

114. if Kerry was more like Lieberman maybe Hillary supporters wouldn't hate him

so much and support him the way they did Joe Lieberman.

[TankLV]

115. Good.

Competition is good.

Good in the Primaries.

The challenger is learning the ropes - maybe he's starting to keep the stable full?

After all, Kerry is human and won't be with us forever.

I sure hope the Dem party has practice runs for ALL positions - and that when the time comes, we have SEASONED candidates to step up and take their place when the time comes.

That's how I choose to look at this...

Keep the blood flowing with new blood...

But keep it flowing...

Gotta keep the cancer that is the repukes at bay PERMANENTLY.

Repukes are like the HIV virus - got to keep battling them once they infect the body politic with new drugs and new blood...

[Forkboy]

121. I totally agree that anyone and everyone should try to run if they desire.

And I'm not against O'Reilly running at all.More power to him.Just pointing to some here that he doesn't stand a chance,even if manages to get on the ballot.

I encourage people of all beliefs to try running.Republican,Democrat,third parties....it's democracy and it's fun to see,and let the chips fall where they may.

[PresidentObama]

125. You're right. Competition is good. And if he makes it on the ballot, he'll get his chance.

Doesn't change the fact Senator Kerry has been a wonderful Senator, and Kerry will win with ease.

[onenote]

129. in theory , primary challenges can be good, but we need the $$ to run against the repubs

My concern is that in some instances primary campaigns end up costing money that could better be spent in general election campaigns against repubs.

[Gman]

118. Some people just can't stand prosperity

and got to find a way to fuck it up.

[wiley]

122. Barney Frank could easily beat Kerry

The first openly gay Senator? That would be nice if if were Barney Frank, but despute my dislike of Kerry we should not waste time or energy on this one. It could get very, very ugly. Kind of like lead pipe versus hard ball politics. If it comes down to that, MA could easily vote for a liberal Republican. So, it's not a good idea. Now if Kennedy resigned, I would vote for Frank in a second, but then again, I don't want either to leave so what would be the point?

[karynnj]

133. Barney Frank couldn't come close

The same poll that had Kerry with the lowest numbers he's had, showed him 20 points ahead of the most prominent people who could oppose him.

[hughee99]

128. I remember there was some MA clean elections law...

that outlined how much a candidate could raise, spend, and get in matching funds. If a candidate runs unopposed, that number is much lower, so this could enable Kerry to raise and spend more money than he otherwise could, not that he really needs to.

I'm not sure what happened to that law or if it's still in effect, but if it is, this would benefit him, since it's not a serious challenge anyway.