Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

Great John Edwards speech!

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion: Presidential (Through Nov 2009) Donate to DU
 
rinsd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-24-07 11:15 AM
Original message
Great John Edwards speech!
Edited on Thu May-24-07 12:06 PM by rinsd
http://www.obamapedia.org/page/2002+John+Edwards+speech+supporting+the+Iraq+War?t=anon

Mr. President, I am here to speak in support of the resolution before us, which I cosponsored. I believe we must vote for this resolution not because we want war, but because the national security of our country requires action. The prospect of using force to protect our security is the most difficult decision a Nation must ever make. We all agree that this is not an easy decision. It carries many risks. If force proves necessary, it will also carry costs, certainly in resources, and perhaps in lives. After careful consideration, I believe that the risks of inaction are far greater than the risks of action.

Saddam Hussein's regime represents a grave threat to America and our allies, including our vital ally, Israel. For more than two decades, Saddam Hussein has sought weapons of mass destruction through every available means. We know that he has chemical and biological weapons. He has already used them against his neighbors and his own people, and is trying to build more. We know that he is doing everything he can to build nuclear weapons, and we know that each day he gets closer to achieving that goal. Iraq has continued to seek nuclear weapons and develop its arsenal in defiance of the collective will of the international community, as expressed through the United Nations Security Council. It is violating the terms of the 1991 cease-fire that ended the Gulf war and as many as 16 Security Council resolutions, including 11 resolutions concerning Iraq's efforts to develop weapons of mass destruction. By ignoring these resolutions, Saddam Hussein is undermining the credibility of the United Nations, openly violating international law, and making a mockery of the very idea of collective action that is so important to the United States and its allies.

We cannot allow Saddam Hussein to get nuclear weapons in violation of his own commitments, our commitments, and the world's commitments. This resolution will send a clear message to Iraq and the world: America is united in its determination to eliminate forever the threat of Iraq's weapons of mass destruction. The United States must do as much as possible to build a new United Nations Security Council coalition against Saddam Hussein. Although the administration was far too slow to start this diplomatic process, squandering valuable time to bring nations to our side, I support its recent efforts to forge a new U.N. Security Council resolution to disarm Iraq. If inspectors go back into Iraq, they should do so with parameters that are air-tight, water-tight, and Saddam-tight. They should be allowed to see what they want when they want, anytime, anywhere, without warning, and without delay. Yet if the Security Council is prevented from supporting this new effort, then the United States must be prepared to act with as many allies as possible to address this threat. We must achieve the central goal of disarming Iraq.

Of course, the best outcome would be a peaceful resolution of this issue. No one here wants war. We all hope that Saddam Hussein meets his obligations to existing Security Council Resolutions and agrees to disarm, but after 11 years of watching Hussein play shell-games with his weapons programs, there is little reason to believe he has any intention to comply with an even tougher resolution. We cannot trust Saddam Hussein, and we would be irresponsible to do so. That is why we must be prepared to use force, if necessary, to disarm Saddam Hussein, and eliminate Iraq's weapons of mass destruction once and for all. Almost no one disagrees with these basic facts: that Saddam Hussein is a tyrant and a menace; that he has weapons of mass destruction and that he is doing everything in his power to get nuclear weapons; that he has supported terrorists; that he is a grave threat to the region, to vital allies like Israel, and to the United States; and that he is thwarting the will of the international community and undermining the United Nations' credibility. Yet some question why Congress should act now to give the President the authority to act against Saddam Hussein's weapons of mass destruction.

I believe we should act now for two reasons: first, bipartisan congressional action on a strong, unambiguous resolution, like the one before us now, will strengthen America's hand as we seek support from the Security Council and seek to enlist the cooperation of our allies. If the administration continues its strong, if belated, diplomacy, backed by the bipartisan resolve of the Congress, I believe the United States will succeed in rallying many allies to our side. Second, strong domestic support and a broad international coalition will make it less likely that force would need to be used. Saddam Hussein has one last chance to adhere to his obligations and disarm, and his past behavior shows that the only chance he will comply is if he is threatened with force. Of course, there is no guarantee that he will comply even if threatened by force, but we must try. Others argue that if even our allies support us, we should not support this resolution because confronting Iraq now would undermine the long-term fight against terrorist groups like al-Qaida. Yet, I believe that this is not an either-or choice. Our national security requires us to do both, and we can.

The resolution before us today is significantly better than the one the president initially submitted. It is not a blank check. It contains several provisions that I and many of my colleagues have long argued were required. First, it gives the administration the authority to use all necessary means to eliminate the threat posed by Saddam Hussein's weapons of mass destruction. Second, it calls on the administration to do as much as possible to forge a new U.N. Security Council mandate, understanding that if new Security Council action proves impossible, the United States must be prepared to act with as many allies as will join us. Third, it requires the administration to report to Congress on its plans to assist with Iraq's transition to democracy after Saddam Hussein is gone. It is in America's national interest to help build an Iraq at peace with itself and its neighbors, because a democratic, tolerant and accountable Iraq will be a peaceful regional partner. Such an Iraq could serve as a model for the entire Arab world. So far, we have not heard nearly enough from the administration about its plans for assisting the Iraqi people as they rebuild their lives and create a new, democratic government. The president has said that the U.S. will help, but he hasn't offered any details about how. As we have learned in Afghanistan, this administration's words are not enough. This resolution will require the administration to move beyond its words and share with Congress, and the world, its concrete plans for how America will support a post-Saddam Iraq.

Finally, in taking this action, Congress must make clear that any actions against Iraq are part of a broader strategy to strengthen American security in the Middle East, and indeed around the world. We must do more to support existing non-proliferation and disarmament programs that can help prevent access to the weapons-grade materials that tyrants like Saddam Hussein want. We must demand America's active and continuous involvement in addressing the crisis between Israel and the Palestinians, and promoting democratization throughout the Arab world. We must commit to developing a national strategy for energy security, one that would reduce our reliance on the Middle East for such critical resources. The decision we must make now is one a nation never seeks. Yet when confronted with a danger as great as Saddam Hussein, it is a decision we must make. America's security requires nothing less
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
edwardsfeingold08 Donating Member (123 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-24-07 11:44 AM
Response to Original message
1. Right now Edwards, Dodd and Kucinich are the only Presidential hopefuls who oppose the blank check
"Conceding to the president on full funding for the Iraq war is a serious mistake. It is time to force an end to this war, and the only way for Congress to do that is to use its funding power. Any compromise that funds the war through the end of the fiscal year isn't a compromise at all, it's a capitulation. As I have said repeatedly, Congress should send the president the same bill he vetoed again and again until he realizes he has no choice but to start bringing our troops home." John Edwards 2007

"Half-measures and equivocations are not going to change our course in Iraq. If we are serious about ending the war, Congress must stand up to this president's failed policy now - with clarity and conviction." Chris Dodd 2007

"Sens. Hillary Rodham Clinton of New York and Barack Obama of Illinois, declined to say how they intended to vote on the measure."
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18841182/


I don't like Edwards role in the run up to the Iraq war as much as anyone. But, at least he's taken a clear position on what he wants done now and what he wants done in the future to end this war. Same with Dodd. Obviously, same with Kucinich. I hope Obama and others follow suit.

This is the most important vote on the war since 2002.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
GreenArrow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-24-07 11:47 AM
Response to Reply #1
3. "This is the most important vote on the war since 2002"
And Edwards doesn't have to make it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
huskerlaw Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-24-07 12:18 PM
Response to Reply #3
11. That's not his fault
Edited on Thu May-24-07 12:20 PM by huskerlaw
It absolutely pisses me off when people use the "well, nice talk, but no action" argument. Just because he CAN'T vote against this "compromise", doesn't mean he WOULDN'T vote against it if he had the opportunity. Frankly, one could use the same argument with Obama...nice that he says he was against the IAWR, but he wasn't exactly in the Senate at that point, was he? But that too is a cop-out. We all know he was vocally against it, whether he could vote on it or not. Same with Edwards now.

There is absolutely nothing to indicate that his current stance is insincere. NOTHING. He is one of the very few politicians (candidates or otherwise) who consistently take a very vocal stand against BushCo and this war.

Until you can prove to me that he is, in fact (not in your opinion, or based on circumstances he has no control over) all talk and no action, you and others who use that argument can STFU.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
GreenArrow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-24-07 12:23 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. I disagree.
Just because he can't vote on it doesn't mean he would vote it either.

There's nothing to indicate his current stance is insincere? How about his previous voting record on foreign policy issues. It's a pity he didn't take his "stand" when he was voting to let the horse out of the barn instead of waiting to offer directives from the porch after the horse is already down the road.

STFU yourself, sucker.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
huskerlaw Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-24-07 12:24 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. How amusing.
I ask for current proof and you use history...really, thank you for making my point for me.

:hi:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
GreenArrow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-24-07 12:28 PM
Response to Reply #13
16. horses...
you can lead 'em to water, but you can't make 'em drink.

If you think IWR and Iraq are merely "history" you really aren't looking very carefully.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
huskerlaw Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-24-07 12:35 PM
Response to Reply #16
17. So you prefer "stay the course" then?
Since apparently people aren't allowed to change their minds when presented with new facts.

Personally, I would rather have a president who admits mistakes and then tries to remedy them. But to each their own, I guess.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rinsd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-24-07 11:52 AM
Response to Reply #1
4. Edwards is free to take whatever position he wants. He doesn't have to actually vote.
I am hoping that Clinton and Obama follow Dodd's lead on this.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
question everything Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-24-07 11:57 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. The measure of maturity is the ability to learn from
one's mistakes and to change one's position. Yes, the other side call this "flip flop" but we know better, right?

Let's face it, most voters did support the war, believing the lies from the White House. And, had our leaders were smart and left after six months, or so, when the regime fell, opening the way for UN troops to take over - preferably from neighboring Arab countries - Bush would still be sitting top with high approval rating.

I suspect that even now, if September will bring "good" news, many will still change their mind. No one likes to be associated with a losing cost.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rinsd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-24-07 12:13 PM
Response to Reply #5
9. To be honest I don't think he has learned.
The wild swing from hawk amongst hawks to anti-Iraq war champion is just too much. I see a political calculation.

I still think he's a decent candidate and certainly will vote for him should he receive the nomination.

But I hate it that Clinton get blasted for not issuing an apology while people eat up some phony I'm the candidate most against the Iraq war crap.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
huskerlaw Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-24-07 12:25 PM
Response to Reply #9
15. Any proof...
that it's insincere or a political calculation? Aside from what you "see," of course.

Didn't think so.

:hi:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rinsd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-24-07 12:37 PM
Response to Reply #15
18. Its an opinion based on an obvious pattern.
He was all about the IWR until he 1st ran for President. Then the base started blasting him and Kerry for IWR and Dean was gaining a following as being against the war. So Kerry and Edwards voted against that $87B appropriations bill that fall.

His 2nd run for President began with his mea culpa for his involvement with IWR as he hoped to position himself as the electable anti-war candidate (with apologies to Kucinich). But then Obama entered the race and suddenly what Edwards had hoped would be a large group in his corner vs. Hillary was up for grabs and frankly more interested in Obama.

Same thing with the DLC. He gives a key address at their 2002 convention and is a co founder of the New Democrats(the DLC's Senate caucus) and now he pretends that he was never part of it.

All that said, if he's the nominee, he certainly has my vote.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
GreenArrow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-24-07 01:41 PM
Response to Reply #15
21. equally,
any proof that he is sincere? Aside from what you see, that is?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
huskerlaw Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-24-07 02:20 PM
Response to Reply #21
27. I assume people aren't lying
until they give me reason to suspect otherwise.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
question everything Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-24-07 01:36 PM
Response to Reply #9
19. I am with you about Clinton
the demand by so many that she dropped to her knees, pound on her chest and ask for forgiveness if obscene and I have posted about it, especially after Gingrich came out with his "mea culpa."

She said that her vote was based on what was known then and that she would not vote for it now. This should be enough. Again, the maturity of people to change their opinions based on new information and change in conditions.

As for political expediency... well this is why we call this politics, right?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rinsd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-24-07 02:06 PM
Response to Reply #19
23. It sure ain't tiddlywinks
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
GreenArrow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-24-07 11:46 AM
Response to Original message
2. more in the same vein
19 September 2002

"Congress Must Be Clear," by Senator John Edwards, September 19, 2002

(Op-ed column from The Washington Post on Thursday, 09/19/02)

(This byliner by John Edwards, U.S. Senator (Democrat-North Carolina), first appeared in The Washington Post September 19 and is in the public domain. No republication restrictions.)
(begin byliner)

Congress Must Be Clear John Edwards

Quick Action Will Ensure that Politics Plays no Part in the Debate About Iraq.

The debate over Iraq is not about politics. It is about national security. It should be clear that our national security requires Congress to send a clear message to Iraq and the world: America is united in its determination to eliminate forever the threat of Iraq's weapons of mass destruction.

Fast congressional action to reinforce our resolve is more imperative, not less, in light of Saddam Hussein's recent overture to allow U.N. inspectors back into Iraq. That is a gambit we have seen before. Congress needs to act now to make clear to our U.N. allies and to Iraq that the United States will not stand for the usual half-measures or delaying tactics.

Drafting an appropriate resolution that a large majority of Congress could support should not be difficult. The outlines of such a resolution are already clear. In fact, the biggest debate right now is over the politics of "timing."

There's no better way to remove politics from the process than to go straight to a debate over substance. Quick, bipartisan congressional action will ensure that politics plays no part in this debate. It will also strengthen America's hand as we pursue support from the Security Council and seek to enlist the cooperation of our allies.

The resolution should be strong and unambiguous. It should not be a blank check for the administration, but neither should it try to micromanage a war from Capitol Hill. It should spell out the broad elements of a process that will preserve the legitimacy of American actions, enhance international consensus and strengthen our global leadership.

Here's what I believe the resolution should say. First and foremost, it should clearly endorse the use of all necessary means to eliminate the threat posed by Saddam Hussein's weapons of mass destruction.

Second, the resolution should call for an effort to rally the international community under a U.N. Security Council mandate. The president's speech last week was an important first step, and his belated diplomatic efforts have already borne fruit. At the same time, we must not tie our own hands by requiring Security Council action. Congress should authorize the United States to act with whatever allies will join us if the Security Council is prevented from supporting action to enforce the more than 16 resolutions against Iraq.

Third, Congress should demand that the administration take real steps to win the peace. The only chance for Iraq to become a democratic, tolerant state -- and a model for the Arab world -- will be through sustained American involvement. We will need to help provide security inside Iraq after Hussein is gone, work with the various Iraqi opposition groups, reassure Iraq's neighbors about its future stability and support the Iraqi people as they rebuild their lives. Congress also should consider authorizing funds now to support such efforts, rather than waiting for events to force us to act with emergency spending.

Congressional pressure to secure our victory is especially necessary because of the administration's performance in Afghanistan, where we have been dangerously slow to help provide security and support democracy. This is wrong today in Afghanistan, and it will be wrong tomorrow in Iraq. In fact, the president's silence about any U.S. commitment to a post-Hussein Iraq was a conspicuous flaw in his speech last week before the United Nations.

Congress must also make clear that any actions against Iraq are part of a broader strategy to strengthen American security in the Middle East. We must do more to support existing nonproliferation and disarmament programs that can help prevent access to the weapons-grade materials that tyrants such as Hussein want. We must demand America's active and continuous involvement in addressing the crisis between Israel and the Palestinians and in promoting democracy throughout the Arab world. We must commit to developing a national strategy for energy security, one that would reduce our reliance on the Middle East for such critical resources.

Iraq is a grave and growing threat. Hussein has proven his willingness to act irrationally and brutally against his neighbors and against his own people.

Iraq's destructive capacity has the potential to throw the entire Middle East into chaos, and it poses a mortal threat to our vital ally, Israel. Thousands of terrorist operatives around the world would pay anything to get their hands on Saddam Hussein's arsenal and would stop at nothing to use it against us. America must act, and Congress must make clear to Hussein that he faces a united nation.

(The writer is a Democratic senator from North Carolina and a member of the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence.)

(end byliner)

http://www.usembassy.it/file2002_09/alia/a2091910.htm
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
CTD Donating Member (732 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-24-07 12:03 PM
Response to Original message
6. Paragraphs are your friend
Arrrggghhh.

That could be the best chunk of prose ever spoken, but there is no way I can read that.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rinsd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-24-07 12:07 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. I chopped it up for ya. I just hope my paragraphs were close to his paragraphs (nt)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Beaverhausen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-24-07 12:12 PM
Response to Original message
8. "Of course, the best outcome would be a peaceful resolution of this issue. No one here wants war."
One more time for the slow learners...the IWR only authorized war as a last resort if Saddam didn't disarm. Don't blame the democrats for Bush not following what the resolution said.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Tejanocrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-24-07 12:17 PM
Response to Original message
10. Thanks for posting that, but it's not as good as Obama's awesome quotes:
"Today we are engaged in a deadly global struggle for those who would intimidate, torture, and murder people for exercising the most basic freedoms. If we are to win this struggle and spread those freedoms, we must keep our own moral compass pointed in a true direction."

"We have real enemies in the world. These enemies must be found. They must be pursued and they must be defeated."

"Launching some missile strikes into Iran is not the optimal position for us to be in ... On the other hand, having a radical Muslim theocracy in possession of nuclear weapons is worse."

"Pot had helped, and booze; maybe a little blow when you could afford it. Not smack {heroin} though."

"We Democrats are just, well, confused. There are those who still champion the old-time religion, defending every New Deal and Great Society program from Republican encroachment, achieving ratings of 100 percent from the liberal interest groups ..."

"That Reagan’s message found such a receptive audience spoke not only to his skills as a communicator; it also spoke to the failures of liberal government… Nevertheless, by promising to side with those who worked hard, obeyed the law, cared for their families, and loved their country, Reagan offered Americans a sense of a common purpose that liberals seemed no longer able to muster ..."

Apparently, it's quite easy to take someone's old speeches or quotes and use them to give a biased impression of that person. But it's kind of unfair, don't you agree?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rinsd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-24-07 12:24 PM
Response to Reply #10
14. Response
"Apparently, it's quite easy to take someone's old speeches or quotes and use them to give a biased impression of that person."

If the quote was taken oout of context(kind of like some of what you posted) I would agree. If the speech was from when they were in HS or college, I would agree. But a speech on the Senate flooor that is all of 5 years old isn't exactly a hit piece. Though I was of course a bit snarky with the "Great Edwards Speech" OP headline.

"But it's kind of unfair, don't you agree?"

As opposed to allowing said person to pretend it never happened?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Tejanocrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-24-07 02:18 PM
Response to Reply #14
26. You didn't take a quote out of context; you took a whole speech out of context; Edwards has admitted
he was wrong, and he's said and done as any other candidate to show that he would do whatever he could to fix his past incorrect vote. Yet you quote Edwards's speech without any indication that he's completely admitted his error. You may as well quote Kucinich's pro-life nonsense, or Clark's statements from when he was a Reagan Republican, or Gore's Lieberman love-fest, or Obama statements on Iraq funding. Do you remember who said this:

"Tomorrow, I expect cloture votes on two other proposals. One is the Reid-Feingold plan, which would begin a withdrawal of troops in 120 days and end all combat operations on April 1. The other is Senator Levin’s proposal, which would create standards and benchmarks for additional funding. I will support both, not because I believe either is the best answer, but because I want to send a strong statement to the Iraqi government, the President and my Republican colleagues that it’s long past time to change course."


Are you sure that Obama's position on this issue hasn't changed?

Edwards made the mistake of the vast majority of Senators; he trusted the President at a time of national crisis. I wish he'd been more skeptical, and Edwards himself wishes he'd been more skeptical.



Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rinsd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-24-07 02:29 PM
Response to Reply #26
30. How does one take a whole speech of out context?
You may try to argue that his views have changed.

But then you have to confront his speeches on Iran given recently.

Here he is in Jan talking tough about Iran

http://www.thenation.com/blogs/notion?bid=15&pid=161493

Here he is in Feb talking about non-agression towards Iran after getting blasted.

http://abcnews.go.com/Nightline/story?id=2905550&page=1

He is a politician. No better or worse than our other candidates.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Tejanocrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-24-07 02:36 PM
Response to Reply #30
31. The same way you can take Kucinich's old pro-life views our of context - he's openly abandoned those
views and to quote his old views without noting that he has completely disavowed and apologized for them implies that he still stands by those words, which is absolutely false.

Edwards couldn't be more plain about the fact that he does not now believe the speech you quote.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rinsd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-24-07 02:44 PM
Response to Reply #31
32. What? I gave perfect context for Kucinich's abortion views.
5 years ago he voted pro-life positions. In the last 5 years, he has voted pro-choice positions.

"he has completely disavowed and apologized for them "

He has said the vote was a wrong one based on flawed intelligence and that he wouldn't vote the same way again. Which happens to be the position of Hillary Clinton. The only thing he did on top of that was apologize. And completely disavowed? I must have missed where the other reasons he gave for confronting Saddam militarily were disavoed. Perhaps you can find them below?

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/11/11/AR2005111101623.html

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
info being Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-24-07 01:39 PM
Response to Reply #10
20. No, I don't think you could do that with Kucinich
The point is, this is how these people really think.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Tejanocrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-24-07 02:01 PM
Response to Reply #20
22. Doubt someone can use Kucinich's old statements to unfairly characterize him? His old pro-life views
can be distorted to unfairly characterize him despite the fact that no candidate has a more progressive record than Kucinich and he's been consistently pro-choice for some time now.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rinsd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-24-07 02:11 PM
Response to Reply #22
24. "consistently pro-choice for some time now"
Within the last 4 or 5 years? Yes.

Voted NO on restricting interstate transport of minors to get abortions. (Apr 2005)
Voted NO on banning partial-birth abortion except to save mother’s life. (Oct 2003)

But not that long ago....

Voted YES on banning Family Planning funding in US aid abroad. (May 2001)
Voted YES on federal crime to harm fetus while committing other crimes. (Apr 2001)
Voted YES on banning partial-birth abortions. (Apr 2000)
Voted YES on barring transporting minors to get an abortion. (Jun 1999)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Tejanocrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-24-07 02:29 PM
Response to Reply #24
29. We're in agreement on this, but i.b. asked if Kucinich's old statements could be mischaracterized to
Edited on Thu May-24-07 02:37 PM by Tejanocrat
make him look like something other than the most progressive candidate in the field (which he is). Once upon a time, Kucinich had a 95 percent anti-choice position rating from the National Right to Life Committee, 10 percent agreement rating from Planned Parenthood, and 0 percent rating from NARAL. Once upon a time, Kucinich voted against funding research on RU-486 and against contraception coverage in health insurance plans for federal workers. Kucinich even used to oppose stem cell research.

Thankfully, Kucinich is a changed man now and he GREAT on woman reproductive freedom and every other issue you could think of, but even Kucinich is susceptible to having his past statements thrown in his face.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rinsd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-24-07 02:47 PM
Response to Reply #29
34. Kucinich's view on this has evolved.
I wouldn't exactly see him as a staunch choicer but he is certainly no longer a pro-lifer.

The difference with Kucinich and Edwards? I see Kucinich's transformation as more sincere. His abortion views were not going to be what made him sink or swim as a Presidential candidate or Democratic nominee. The blessing and curse of not being seen as a viable candidate.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
benny05 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-24-07 02:16 PM
Response to Original message
25. Invalid Site to be Quoting for Snark
:donut:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
JNelson6563 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-24-07 02:26 PM
Response to Original message
28. OMG! Edwards supported IWR!!!
:rofl:

I see by your profile that you missed out on the primary season for 2004 here at ol' DU. Many of us were truly heartsick that the nomination went to two such candidates way back then. I mean, really sick about it. I cannot tell you how sickened I was to see what lengths my own party would go to stop Howard Dean.

Fast forward a bit.....

The primaries are over (at least in reality, to be honest some DUers are still fighting those 04 primary fights but nevermind that) and there is a galvanizing of the party behind our ticket because we all knew we absolutely had to get rid of Bush.

Many of us had to swallow pretty hard to move on. Key word: swallowed. Key syllable: swallowed.

Not only are many if not all aware of Edwards actions then, we were pretty much forced to get over it (this also applied to Sen. Kerry as our nominee). Trying to whip up the masses with this already fought about stuff is kinda funny. Futile but funny.

Those who find it unacceptable to ever support ANYONE who supported that bill will always feel that way. Those who don't feel that way most likely arrived at that point during the last cycle.

Julie
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU GrovelBot  Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-24-07 02:44 PM
Response to Original message
33. ## PLEASE DONATE TO DEMOCRATIC UNDERGROUND! ##
==================
GROVELBOT.EXE v4.0
==================



This week is our second quarter 2007 fund drive. Democratic
Underground is a completely independent website. We depend on donations
from our members to cover our costs. Thank you so much for your support.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
MethuenProgressive Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-24-07 05:19 PM
Response to Original message
35. How is Edwards going to vote tonight? Oh yeah, that's right, he can't... he quit.
Edited on Thu May-24-07 05:20 PM by MethuenProgressive
Maybe he'll post an e-petition/fundraiser on his webpage...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Fri Apr 26th 2024, 05:42 AM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion: Presidential (Through Nov 2009) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC