Bush... I mean Chavez widens attack on opposition media

[wyldwolf]

Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez on Tuesday called opposition news channel Globovision an enemy of the state and said he would do what was needed to stop it from inciting violence, only days after he shut another opposition broadcaster.

Tens of thousands of Venezuelans marched in Caracas in a fourth consecutive day of protests over Chavez's closure of the RCTV network - a move which has sparked international criticism that the leftist leader's reforms are undermining democracy.

State television showed hundreds of government supporters marching in downtown Caracas celebrating Chavez's decision.

"Enemies of the homeland, particularly those behind the scenes, I will give you a name: Globovision. Greetings gentlemen of Globovision, you should watch where you are going," Chavez said in a broadcast all channels had to show.

http://www.reuters.com/article/topNews/idUSN2949211020070530?feedType=RSS&rpc=22

Enemies of the homeland? :rofl:

[mduffy31]

1. This could be fun

:popcorn:

[Skink]

2. If we had an army we could invade.

[wyldwolf]

3. or we could simply call a spade a spade

[pretzel4gore]

4. tens of thousands of our mediawhores need '5 in the noggin'

says john gobson, and Venezuela's got the right idea. Alan Berg was MURDERED! JFK was MURDERED! CHE was MURDERED! Malcom X, Robbie, Martin King were MURDERED! It's time the busheviks tasted their own medicine....
btw according to foxnews, there were tens of thousands of government supporters marching versus a few hundred anti Chavez protesters! And foxnews rarely lies unless it's got something up its sleeve....scheming somehow(?) foxnews knows everything it says is diametrically opposite to real facts, so maybe they're jumping on the 'foxnews is a goddam liar' bandwagon(?) exploiting the gillible(?)
too bad we haven't got a free press to tell us what's true and what's just bushloving bs :(

[LBJDemocrat]

5. Government-supporting protesters mean very little in a dictatorship

If you're penalized for being part of the opposition, why not score points by supporting the government?

[wyldwolf]

6. awww...

Che was murdered? Couldn't have happened to a nicer guy. He doesn't belong in the same sentence as JFK, RFK, and MLK.

[IndianaGreen]

7. If WABC was getting money from Iran and broadcast Hamas propaganda, you all applaud the FCC

for getting its license revoked.

The only way to secure democracy in our country is by busting up Murdoch's media empire and reverse decades of media concentration.

As to RCTV, they got what they deserved, and what Faux News deserves.

RCTV ran nonstop ads encouraging people to attend a march on April 11 aimed at toppling Chavez and broadcast blanket coverage of the event. When the march ended in violence, RCTV and Globovision ran manipulated video blaming Chavez supporters for scores of deaths and injuries.

After military rebels overthrew Chavez and he disappeared from public view for two days, RCTV’s biased coverage edged fully into sedition. Thousands of Chavez supporters took to the streets to demand his return, but none of that appeared on RCTV or other television stations. RCTV News Director Andres Izarra later testified at National Assembly hearings on the coup attempt that he received an order from superiors at the station: “Zero pro-Chavez, nothing related to Chavez or his supporters…. The idea was to create a climate of transition and to start to promote the dawn of a new country.” While the streets of Caracas burned with rage, RCTV ran cartoons, soap operas and old movies such as “Pretty Woman.” On April 13, 2002, Granier and other media moguls met in the Miraflores palace to pledge support to the country’s coup-installed dictator, Pedro Carmona, who had eliminated the Supreme Court, the National Assembly and the Constitution.

Would a network that aided and abetted a coup against the government be allowed to operate in the United States? The U.S. government probably would have shut down RCTV within five minutes after a failed coup attempt — and thrown its owners in jail. Chavez’s government allowed it to continue operating for five years, and then declined to renew its 20-year license to use the public airwaves. It can still broadcast on cable or via satellite dish.

Granier and others should not be seen as free-speech martyrs. Radio, TV and newspapers remain uncensored, unfettered and unthreatened by the government. Most Venezuelan media are still controlled by the old oligarchy and are staunchly anti-Chavez.

http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2007/05/30/1534/

[MonkeyFunk]

8. So revoke the license

why should the government take it over? Why not let another independent entity run it?

Or is an independent media not important to Venezuelan democracy?

[IndianaGreen]

10. The license was revoked, and RCTV is still broadcasting on cable (like Faux News)

They can no longer broadcast on Channel 2 frequency, a public airway. A new station has gone on the air.

[Colobo]

11. A government run, pro-Chavez station (TVES) is running... leftist authoritarism it is.

[rinsd]

12. Someone watched Legacy of Star Wars recently....

:hi:

[IndianaGreen]

15. A Venezuelan version of PBS before Reagan decided to destroy it

Rightwingers hate anything with the name of "public" attached to it: public transportation, public libraries, public good, etc.

[MonkeyFunk]

16. Chavez

already has a big channel. Why does he need another?

Do you disagree that independent media are vital for democracy?

[IndianaGreen]

20. Don't tell me that ABC, CBS, and NBC are independent media?

They are mouthpieces of their corporate owners. News went out of the window when corporations put their news services under their entertainment division.

From Walter Cronkite covering the Vietnam War, we have gone to wall to wall coverage of Paris Hilton and Lindsey Lohan.

Americans willingly surrendered their democracy in December 2000 and their freedoms right after 9-11. We have no business telling the people in Latin America how to break the chains of imperialist and colonial oppression.

[MonkeyFunk]

23. they are not owned by the government

and if you think government ownership would make them better, you're nuts.


Do you think that independent media are valuable to democracy or not?

[mitchum]

49. You are correct; they own the government

[MonkeyFunk]

54. So you'd be happier

if ABC, NBC, CBS et. al. were all owned and operated by the government?

[mitchum]

55. They have a fucking PARTNERSHIP now

[MonkeyFunk]

56. stop deflecting

with vague claims.

The US media may not be to your liking, but do you think it would be better if the government owned and operated them?

[mitchum]

57. Who the fuck are you...The Grand Inquisitor?

[MonkeyFunk]

58. aww....

I hit a nerve by asking a simple question.

One thing I've noticed about the Chavez apologists here is that they get really nasty when anybody tries to pin them down on some things.

It's much easier to spout slogans than to actually take a position and defend it.

[mitchum]

59. Okay... I wish Chavez would execute every CIA operative in his country

Straightforward, enough for you?

[MonkeyFunk]

60. fine

but not the topic at hand.

Do you think government-controlled media are preferable to independently-controlled media?

[mitchum]

61. If Ma Kent did make Superman's indestructable costume from...

his baby blanket, what did she use to cut the fabric and what did she use for a needle?
See...both of us can ask ridiculously simple minded questions. The difference is that mine is a hell of a lot more entertaining.

[MonkeyFunk]

62. the difference

is some of us are capable of answering some questions. Evidently Chavez apologists are not.

[mitchum]

63. So you concede that yours is also a ridiculously simple minded question?

Well, it's a start...

[MonkeyFunk]

64. If it's so simple

why not answer it?

Do you think government-controlled media is preferable to independent media?

[mitchum]

65. I said your question was simple MINDED...

but that would be only natural

[MonkeyFunk]

69. deflect again

then complicate it if you must. Explain why making it a government-controlled media outlet is preferable to making it an independently-controlled outlet.

[JNelson6563]

77. That depends

Here in America, a blossoming oligarchy, there is little difference.

I don't think government controlled media is preferable to independent media. In fact it is my fondest wish that we may one day actually have an independent media.

Julie

[1932]

21. I think that's what happened. They took the transmitters and the frequency

but isn't the station free to broadcast on satellite and cable, which is what they're doing.

No?

[MonkeyFunk]

25. Why seize the station and turn it into

yet another government-run outlet?

Why not auction it off and let another, independent entity run it?

Or is government-run media the hallmark of democracy?

[1932]

27. They didn't seize the station. The station still operates (cablecast/satellite)

They lost their license to broadcast over the air on the public airwaves (because they supported the coup). Because they can't broadcast, I believe the government took over their broadcast towers. The rest of the station still operates.

[MonkeyFunk]

28. don't be thick

they seized the studios, the equipment, the transmitters, the towers.

yes, I'm sure all the people of Venezuela with satellite dishes are happy, but don't be so disingenuous as to claim they didn't seize the station.

[1932]

33. They're still broadcasting on satellite and cable

http://www.rctv.net/

[MonkeyFunk]

39. So what?

I never said they weren't.

Chavez seized the broadcast assets.

Don't be thick.

[1932]

41. Are you high?

[MonkeyFunk]

42. Nope

Are you denying that Chavez seized the broadcast facilities and converted them to a government-run station?

[1932]

44. Yes. They didn't seize anything.

They didn't renew the license, and they issued a license for a VHF frequency to someone else. Which, if you read your post that started this subthread, is exactly what you wished they had done before you knew what they did.

[MonkeyFunk]

47. You are laughably

misinformed.

[1932]

48. If you're not making this up, then why no link?

[MonkeyFunk]

51. I didn't think it necessary

I presumed anybody who would dare argue about this would be minimally informed about the facts.


http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/2007-05-28-venezuela-chavez-tv_N.htm?csp=34

"Oswaldo Quintana, RCTV's legal representative, told The Associated Press that armed military personnel "took control of our station's transmitters" shortly before midnight to guarantee TVES could broadcast."


You can, if you wish, find dozens of reports that confirm that the government seized these assets.

[1932]

66. Transmitters do not equal station. The station still operates.

[MonkeyFunk]

70. From another news report

http://www.taipeitimes.com/News/world/archives/2007/05/27/2003362674

Venezuela's Supreme Court ruled that broadcasting equipment and infrastructure used by a television channel critical of leftist President Hugo Chavez must be made available to the state-run TV channel that will replace it.

The Supreme Court said on Friday on its Web site that Venezuela's telecommunications commission would assume responsibility for Radio Caracas Television's (RCTV) equipment, including microwave dishes and antennas, while the court reviews RCTV's appeal of Chavez's decision not to renew its licence.

The court also ordered the military to temporarily guard the equipment used by RCTV, Venezuela's most widely watched channel, which is scheduled to go off the air at midnight tonight.


and from wikipedia:


RCTV may continue broadcasting over cable or DTH systems (DirecTV Latin America) when its license expires, but the government will take over the equipment, studios and even the master control for their use in the new station it has created on May 27, 2007

[1932]

72. The stuff in bold isn't supported by the article you cited.

And it also TOTALLY contradicts your claim in the other thread that "All the physical assets of the broadcast operation were seized."

(You also said I was "totally misinformed" in that post!)

So, did wikipedia have a cite for that claim?

[MonkeyFunk]

73. You claimed

"they didn't seize anything"

That is a bald-faced lie.

[1932]

74. and you're claiming somethign that is directly contradicted by your cite

And it also directly contradicts your claim that all the assets were seized.

By your standard, you're a bald-faced liar.

Seriously, how can you criticize me for saying they didn't seize anything, when you've claimed they seized everything repeatedly.

[MonkeyFunk]

76. The government

took the broadcasting facilities. Why do you deny that in the face of all evidence to the contrary?

I can't believe somebody so ignorant would be so passionate.

[1932]

79. Then how are they still broadcasting on cable, internet and satellite?

[1932]

35. Don't be uninformed. Link:

In spite of their lawlessness, the Chavez government treated all five broadcasters gently opting not to prosecute them, but merely refusing to renew one of RCTV's operating licenses (its VHF one) when it expired May 27 (its cable and satellite operations are unaffected) - a mere slap on the wrist for a media enterprise's active role in trying to overthrow the democratically elected Venezuelan president and his government. The article explained if an individual or organization of any kind incited public hostility, violence and anti-government rebellion under Section 2384 of the US code, Title 18, they would be subject to fine and/or imprisonment for up to 20 years for the crime of sedition.

http://venezuelanalysis.com/articles.php?artno=2050

[MonkeyFunk]

37. I never claimed their cable and satellite operations

were affected.

Why are you arguing against something I never said?

Chavez seized the broadcast station.

Again, don't be thick.

[1932]

40. Now you're being thick. It's one station. And nothing was seized.

Their license wasn't renewed for over-the-air broadcasting.

[MonkeyFunk]

43. Then you are badly

misinformed.

All the physical assets of the broadcast operation were seized.

[1932]

46. Then how are they broadcasting on satellite and cable and running a website

which shows all their programming?

[MonkeyFunk]

53. Do you not know the difference

between broadcast and cable?

Perhaps you really ARE that thick.

[1932]

67. Broadcast means send out signals. Cable, over-the-air, satellite, internet

are the ways you send out the signals.

You desperately want people to believe the entire station was shut down so you're pretending that not renewsing a license to broadcast a station that corroborated with a coup and had the highest number of violations of broadcast regulations in the country (most of which predated Chavez) equals shutting down a station (even though they continue to operate on the internet, and as a cable and satellite broadcaster.

But, hey, whatever. Keep going. I'm sure this isn't going to stop you from posting a childish reply.

[MonkeyFunk]

71. Yes

my links and facts are childish, where your silly insults backed up with nothing are mature. :eyes:

I love when people who are so wrong get so snotty about it.

[unkachuck]

9. relax....

....Hugo is just giving some fascist corporations a hard time, when he does this:

"President Bush, without so much as issuing a press statement, on May 9 signed a directive that granted near dictatorial powers to the office of the president in the event of a national emergency declared by the president."

....you can start to worry....

[NoPasaran]

14. Hugo, the guy who's ruling by decree?

Can I be worried yet?


Or should I just once again marvel at the Chavez Brigade's propensity for excusing every outrage committed by their hero by saying "Bush does it"?

[IndianaGreen]

17. Bush is the one that is ruling by decree, but you guys don't want him impeached

Get back to us whenever Pelosi puts impeachment on the table.

[BootinUp]

22. How about we let the American people put it

on the table.

At this point I don't see the clamoring for it, hence there is a need for continued gathering and reporting facts and investigating BushCo until they do, or until his office is virtually stripped of influence over congress. But there is no political justification to begin impeachment proceedings, which is a political event after all.

[IndianaGreen]

24. Tell Speaker Pelosi to stop blocking impeachment.. She is tougher on the base than she is on Bush!

John Dean, Jonathan Turley, and others, have written extensively about Bush's high crimes and misdemeanors. I don't see why you all shake with fear at the mere mention of impeachment. Don't you care about the Constitution and the Republic?

[BootinUp]

26. Oh dear, I am but one of 200 million or so

registered voters. I would be gleeful to see the criminals ousted are you kiddin me? We just need tens of millions or more to join our way of thinking and I am sure Pelosi would jump on it in a flash.

[IndianaGreen]

13. US Media: Distorting the Venezuelan media story (FAIR)

Notice that the same crowd that had utter disdain for Cindy Sheehan and the antiwar movement, are the same people that are now siding with the rightwing media. Birds of a feather flock together.

The day will come when Newscorp will be held accountable for all their crimes and deception. I don't want to hear any whining from appeasers when their license gets pulled.

US Media: Distorting the Venezuelan media story

By FAIR

Coup Co-Conspirators as Free-Speech Martyrs

Distorting the Venezuelan media story

The story is framed in U.S. news media as a simple matter of censorship: Prominent Venezuelan TV station RCTV is being silenced by the authoritarian government of President Hugo Chávez, who is punishing the station for its political criticism of his government.

<snip>

As FAIR's magazine Extra! argued last November, "Were a similar event to happen in the U.S., and TV journalists and executives were caught conspiring with coup plotters, it's doubtful they would stay out of jail, let alone be allowed to continue to run television stations, as they have in Venezuela."

When Chávez returned to power the commercial stations refused to cover the news, airing instead entertainment programs?in RCTV's case, the American film Pretty Woman. By refusing to cover such a newsworthy story, the stations abandoned the public interest and violated the public trust that is seen in Venezuela (and in the U.S.) as a requirement for operating on the public airwaves. Regarding RCTV's refusal to cover the return of Chavez to power, Columbia University professor and former NPR editor John Dinges told Marketplace (5/8/07):

What RCTV did simply can't be justified under any stretch of journalistic principles?. When a television channel simply fails to report, simply goes off the air during a period of national crisis, not because they're forced to, but simply because they don't agree with what's happening, you've lost your ability to defend what you do on journalistic principles.

The Venezuelan government is basing its denial of license on RCTV's involvement in the 2002 coup, not on the station's criticisms of or political opposition to the government. Many American pundits and some human rights spokespersons have confused the issue by claiming the action is based merely on political differences, failing to note that Venezuela's media, including its commercial broadcasters, are still among the most vigorously dissident on the planet.

http://www.politicalaffairs.net/article/articleview/5337/1/260/

[BootinUp]

18. All channels had to show this statement

Good night from Pravdazuela your free minded media.

[1932]

19. When he drops a bomb on Al Jazeera's cameraman in Baghdad

you can compare him to Bush.

[AtomicKitten]

29. Like Mike Malloy said -

the reason most Venezuelans are protesting is because the TV channel also produces crap like their version of American Idol and soap operas.

Funny how little tidbits of info tweak the reality of situations.

[NoPasaran]

31. Why does Mike Malloy hate soap operas?

Could it be that they're commercially viable but he's not?
:shrug:

[AtomicKitten]

32. Mike Malloy aside -

it adds a dimension to this discussion that is being conveniently overlooked.

Americans have a tendency to view issues from a POV that is more convenient towards our own agenda than realistic as to how it plays out elsewhere.

[SaveElmer]

30. We are watching a dictatorship unfold in Venezuela...

One with a huge amount of cash available to it...

Venezuela is turning into Cuba with Oil...

[Colobo]

34. Exactly.

[IndianaGreen]

36. The only dictatorship I see is right here, in our own America

and Cuba has large deposits of oil, as yet untapped.

What's wrong, wasn't Iraqi oil enough for the neoliberals of DLC/PPI?

[SaveElmer]

38. My pity for you grows day by day...nt

[Colobo]

45. It's a fanatical thing... which is sad.

[mitchum]

50. Yes, to be suckered by the DLC is indeed a pitiable thing

[Colobo]

52. No; to give Chavez a pass just because he hates Bush and is a socialist is sad indeed.

[Larkspur]

75. Chavez is to Venezuela what FDR was to the USA

Chavez is no dictator. He's got 60-70% approval ratings. Bush could only dream about getting those numbers now.

The wealthey elite of Venezuela hate Chavez because he supports lifting up the poor, whom the elite despise and neglected when they were in power. The TV station not getting it's license renewed is owned by these wealthy elite and they used it to broadcast what a glorious day it was when Chavez was arrested by their forces in the coup they supported. Now they are suffering the consequences of the fruits of their failed coup attempt, an attempt thwarted by the majority of the Venezuelans.

The hatred of Chavez by this elite is eating them from the inside out. They know they have no hope of ruling Venezuela in the near future. If only the America people could be as passionate about our government as the average Venezuelans are about theirs.

[endarkenment]

68. I really am far more concerned with our escalation in Iraq. nt.

[Hippo_Tron]

78. Okay, but the Cold War has been over for almost 20 years, why are we so concerned about Chavez?

He's not a threat to US National Security, so it's for Venezuela to decide whether they want him or not. Meanwhile, not denouncing a coup against his government is not exactly the best way to make oil prices go down.

[burrowowl]

80. Go here for some facts

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x1024022

[IndianaGreen]

81. Venezuela and the Media: Fact and Fiction

Published on Friday, June 1, 2007 by CommonDreams.org

Venezuela and the Media: Fact and Fiction

by Robert W. McChesney & Mark Weisbrot

To read and view the U.S. news media over the past week, there is an episode of grand tyranny unfolding, one repugnant to all who cherish democratic freedoms. The Venezuelan government under “strongman” Hugo Chavez refused to renew the 20-year broadcast license for RCTV, because that medium had the temerity to be critical of his regime. It is a familiar story.

And in this case it is wrong.

Regrettably, the US media coverage of Venezuela’s RCTV controversy says more about the deficiencies of our own news media that it does about Venezuela. It demonstrates again, as with the invasion of Iraq, how our news media are far too willing to carry water for Washington than to ascertain and report the truth of the matter.

<snip>

If RCTV were broadcasting in the United States, its license would have been revoked years ago. In fact its owners would likely have been tried for criminal offenses, including treason.

RCTV’s broadcast frequency has been turned over to a new national public access channel that promises to provide programming from thousands of independent producers. It is an effort to let millions of Venezuelans who have never had a viable chance to participate in the media do so, without government censorship.

The Bush Administration opposes the Chavez government for reasons that have nothing to do with democracy, or else there would be a long list of governments for us to subvert or overthrow before it would get close to targeting Venezuela. Regrettably, our press coverage has done little to shed light on that subject.

http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2007/06/01/1607/

[Monk06]

82. Keep posting this IndianaGreen along with these two links ......

RCTV's collusion with Corona and his gang,

The Revolution Will Not Be Televised

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0QTRlPKQWbI&mode=related&search=

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gkcq7WpoAmc&mode=related&search=