Pillorying Hillary

[wyldwolf]

Why do people detest her? Let Lexington count the ways. First, and most obviously, conservatives cannot stand her. They see her, as Bay Buchanan (Pat's sister) put it in another recent Hillary-bashing book, as an “ardent feminist, anti-war activist and student radical” who “did not leave her passion for all things liberal behind on the campuses of Wellesley and Yale”. The Hillary of conservative demonology is practically a socialist...

...many on the left loathe her too. The anti-war crowd resents her for voting to allow the use of force in Iraq... Many ardent feminists also abhor Mrs Clinton. In These Times, a left-wing magazine, published an essay in April entitled “Why Women Hate Hillary”, arguing that in her determination to appear as ruthless and macho as her male rivals, she has betrayed the women's movement. The Nation, another lefty periodical, recently ran a cover story arguing that while many women approve of Mrs Clinton, a lot of feminists think she is “a ventriloquist for the patriarchy”, in the words of Jane Fonda, an actress.

The anti-Hillary jibes of left and right cannot all be true. For all her talents, Mrs Clinton cannot be a warmonger and a peacenik, or a radical feminist and a shill for the patriarchy. Perhaps if extremists of both left and right detest her, she must in fact be a nice, reasonable moderate. There is something to this. Since the debacle of Hillarycare, and especially since she joined the Senate in 2001, she has eschewed radicalism in favour of cautious, incremental steps to improve health care, the environment and national security.

Mrs Clinton may not be the most likeable of candidates, but she has enormous strengths. She has learned from past mistakes, even if she has not admitted them. She has a prodigious memory, a bottomless capacity for hard work and a quarter-century of experience of national politics. In debates, her grasp of policy makes her Democratic rivals look callow or shallow. Her campaign organisation is second to none. She can borrow credit for the peace and prosperity of the first Clinton era. And whatever Ms Fonda would prefer, she gets a huge boost from women who want to see one of their own in the White House. In part because there are more female Democrats than black ones, she leads Mr Obama by double digits in polls of likely primary voters.

But as the publication this month of two exhaustive new biographies showed, there is little fresh dirt to dig up on Mrs Clinton. And since Americans have already heard the worst, her negative ratings may already have hit a ceiling, which is probably not true of any other candidate.

http://www.economist.com/world/na/displaystory.cfm?story_id=9366224

Yes, there are part of this piece I didn't put in this post. No, there was no nefarious reason for that.

[polichick]

1. imo, it's just the smart, strong woman thing...

Some men are threatened by it ~ and some women feel better about themselves when they put women like her down. If it were just a matter of her politics, all the nastiness wouldn't be necessary.

[BoneDaddy]

12. Such drivel

It has nothing to do with that. I can't stand Hillary due to her duplicitous politics, and it has nothing to do with having a vagina. Posts like yours are so ridiculous because you reduce it to the lowest common denominator instead of actually reading the reasons why people don't think she is the best candidate.

Look around, everyone trashes everyone else's candidacy, and when Clinton is trashed, the "she is a woman" excuses come flying out and any criticism is transformed into "men feel threatened". Nonsense.

[polichick]

14. Of course it's not about a vagina...

It's about guys like you being threatened by a smart, strong woman. Nobody is trashed the way she is! As I've said, if it was just about politics the nastiness wouldn't be necessary ~ even your response here is nasty. Maybe you're not such a bone daddy after all! :rofl:

[ellisonz]

19. "Nobody is trashed the way she is!"

Care to give an example?

For the record, I support and respect Nancy Pelosi and many of the female House and Senate women (Hilda Solis, Barbara Boxer, the Sanchez sisters, Maxine Waters, Lois Capps, the late Patsy Mink; I'm from California so I won't speak beyond those I've have familiarity with). I have zero respect for Hillary Clinton and not just for her marital infidelities.

The poor woman is simply confused about what she really stands for and so she puts on a show.

‘The most radical of political faiths’
In the end, she judged that Alinsky's “power/conflict model is rendered inapplicable by existing social conflicts” — overriding national issues such as racial tension and segregation. Alinsky had no success in forming an effective national movement, she said, referring dismissively to “the anachronistic nature of small autonomous conflict.”

Putting Alinsky's Rochester symphony threat into academic language, Rodham found that the conflict approach to power is limited. “Alinsky's conclusion that the ‘ventilation’ of hostilities is healthy in certain situations is valid, but across-the-board ‘social catharsis’ cannot be prescribed,” she wrote.

------

“His offer of a place in the new institute was tempting,” she wrote in the end notes to the thesis, “but after spending a year trying to make sense out of his inconsistency, I need three years of legal rigor.” She enrolled at Yale that fall, a year ahead of a charming Rhodes Scholar from Arkansas.

“I agreed with some of Alinsky's ideas,” she explained in “Living History,” her 2003 biography, “particularly the value of empowering people to help themselves. But we had a fundamental disagreement. He believed you could change the system only from the outside. I didn't.”

A decade later, another political science major started out on the path that Hillary Rodham had rejected, going to work for a group in the Alinsky mold. That was Barack Obama, now a U.S. senator from Illinois and her leading opponent for the Democratic nomination. After attending Columbia University, he worked as an organizer on the South Side of Chicago for the Developing Communities Project. Obama and others of the post-Alinsky generation described their work in the 1990 book “After Alinsky: Community Organizing in Illinois,” in which Obama wrote that he longed for ways to close the gap between community organizing and national politics. After three years of organizing, he turned to Harvard Law School and then the Illinois legislature.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17388372/

She's all talk and no walk.

[polichick]

27. Her marital infidelities???

Lol ~ you give yourself away.

[ellisonz]

37. Not really.

Maria Shriver and Schwarzenegger get similar treatment (the L.A. Times waited until the last week before the recall election to drop the bombshell): http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gropegate

Books have been written on the Kennedy sex scandals, but even Jackie Kennedy was hardly handled with kid gloves after the assasination (if the media had been more enterprising in those days you probably wouldn't have Hillary on such a pedastal):

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacqueline_Kennedy#Invasion_of_privacy

And for good measure to show such criticism has always been around see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrew_Jackson#Family_and_personal_life

Jackson met Rachel Donelson Robards after her divorce from her first husband, Colonel Lewis Robards; Jackson and Mrs. Robards quickly married. Mr. Robards returned two years later without ever having finalized the divorce. Rachel quickly divorced her first husband and then legally married Jackson. This remained a sore point for Jackson, who deeply resented attacks on his wife's honor. Jackson fought 103 duels, many nominally over his wife's honor. Charles Dickinson, the only man Jackson ever killed in a duel, had been goaded into angering Jackson by Jackson's political opponents. In the duel, fought over a horse-racing debt and an insult to his wife on May 30, 1806, Dickinson shot Jackson in the ribs before Jackson returned the fatal shot. The bullet that struck Jackson was so close to his heart that it could never be safely removed. Jackson had been wounded so frequently in duels that it was said he "rattled like a bag of marbles".<25> At times he would cough up blood, and he experienced considerable pain from his wounds for the rest of
his life.

Rachel died of an unknown cause two months prior to Jackson taking office as President. Jackson blamed John Quincy Adams for Rachel's death because the marital scandal was brought up in the election of 1828. He felt that this had hastened her death and never forgave Adams.

As we can see Hillary has not been alone in being tarred and feathered by the media and the public over marital infidelities...and I would point out pre-emptively that the JFK sex scandal would have been inevitable had he not be assasinated. Maybe she deserves some of the criticism becaused Lord knows if I was a woman I would have divorced the Big Dog.

"Lol ~you give yourself away":thumbsdown:

[Binka]

58. Thank You For Your Replies To This Poster

I appreciate your thoughtful prose and applaud your ability to discourse with someone who is in dire need of a clue phone.

[polichick]

64. How utterly silly...

You're saying the "pillorying" of Hillary is peachy keen 'cuz lots of other folks are pillorying people for the same stuff? That's just another lame excuse to trash her.

I stand by my original statement ~ the "pillorying" of Hillary has to do with some men and some women feeling threatened by her. Disagreement on politics alone doesn't inspire such vitriolic reactions.

Jeez ~ with Democrats like some of you around, Hillary sure as heck doesn't need to worry about Republicans!

[BoneDaddy]

55. Wow you have a real sickness

I am not threatened by strong woman, I applaud it. As for nastiness you should just look in the mirror and look up the word projection.

[polichick]

65. Just "sick" enough to see through you...

Look at your overreaction to my initial post. I said SOME men and women are threatened by her, and you go off. If you aren't one who is threatened, there was no need to take it personally.

Dems who trash their own as they do Hillary are only doing the work of the lowest Reps for them.

[roguevalley]

35. its ridiculous equating serious concerns with having female parts.

its like not liking Obama for serious reasons and getting the race card thrown at you. half the people on this board have a vagina. many of them don't like Hillary for serious issue reasons. are they all full of shit too? since when do i have to 'like' and support ANYONE!?!?!?!?!

[BoneDaddy]

57. Re-read my post

you obviously misunderstood what I was saying... in fact, I agree with your statement.

[AZBlue]

67. When exactly was she duplicitous?

If these are her "politics," give me, say, at least 5 good examples - things that stand out from any other politician ('cause they're all somewhat duplicitous, ya know).

[Alexander]

49. Hillary and Blair are equally duplicitous.

Nice straw man. :eyes:

Most people who hate Hillary because she's a "smart, strong" woman would never vote for a Democrat in a million years, even if the Democrat was Jesus himself.

[Name removed]

2. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[SaveElmer]

3. Howard Dean on outsourcing and India...

The new chairman of the Democratic National Committee, Dr Howard Dean, believes the Indian-American community should find the Democratic Party more attractive as it is not only more favourable toward immigration, but also is a more diverse and welcoming than the Republican Party.

In an exclusive interview with rediff India Abroad Managing Editor Aziz Haniffa in Houston, Texas, recently, Dean, the former governor of Vermont, said he intends to bring Indian Americans to the upper and senior echelons of the party. He also said he would continue to reach out to the idealism and activism of the younger generation of the community at the grass-roots level that constituted the core of his presidential campaign.

Dean is travelling across the country trying to rally the faithful and undecided for the Congressional election in 2006 and the Presidential election in 2008.

On foreign policy, Dean said newly transformed US-India relations in recent years had a lot to do with policies adopted by New Delhi as much or more, than actions undertaken by Washington to push the relationship forward.

On outsourcing -- where the perception persists that Democrats are vehemently against it -- Dean said the party stood for free and fair trade and found India much more palatable than China.

...

On outsourcing, there was a perception that the Democrats were against outsourcing and it was perceived as India-bashing in a sense. How do you feel about outsourcing?

We are not against outsourcing. But we are in favour of fair trade. Now India is not the problem.

The problem frankly is China. In India, you can join an independent trade union. You cannot do that in China.

In India there are environmental laws. Now, we prefer the environmental laws be more similar to the United States.

Trade is not the problem. The problem is fair trade. We need to have the same kinds of rules apply to protecting workers and protecting the environment in every country and not just in some and others. India is closer to the model than China is.

India is not the problem. The problem frankly is China

http://in.rediff.com/news/2005/sep/09inter1.htm

[rinsd]

5. Someone who would use the word whore is unlikely to care about the similarities. (nt)

[wyldwolf]

8. oops! wait... I hear... crickets...

[rinsd]

4. Awwwww the Hillary campaign will really miss your positive attitude and influence.

:eyes:

[OHdem10]

6. That woman thing has done in Katie Couric, Seligmen Royale,

(France). Three is the charm???????

Is this fair, heck no. Is Life Fair, heck no!

The Clinton Hater--main culprits here, American Media.

The DLC Mantle, Third Way, New Democrat casts a long dark shadow.

These are the obstacles.



It is convenient just to say it's the Lefties and the War.

It is much more complex than that. Timing is everything in
politics. Do the times in which we live and circumstances
in the country make it easier or more difficult for her
to bring up her favorable rating. This is the issue.

[mod mom]

7. My problem w HRC is her ties to corporations. Her stance of free trade and her

acceptance of big $ from special interest is BAD for this country-literally ruining the middle class. My circumstances now are much different from my father's who was a blue collar union man. I believe the strength of the unions allowed him, and many from his generation to raise their families to the middle class. My mother remained home raising 7 children thanks to the strength of his union wage and benefits. Nowadays, thanks to folks like Hillary who pushed for free trade, many of the well paying jobs have moved overseas and families are left with multiple low paying jobs without much in benefits and with boths parents working. This has benefited the few that belong to the investor class but has had a very negative effects on working people and families.

There is also the issue of national security. As we ship our manufacturing overseas we depend on relationships with nations to provide us those same manufactured goods. What if those nations decide to no longer deliver over some international dispute?

Also the Clintons position themselves of champions of the Af Am community. Where was Hillary's leadership when hundreds of thousands of Af am voters (Dem base voters) were disenfranchised in 2000 and 2004? Her silence was deafening.

I am a woman. I believe I am well informed on the issues. I see the Democratic Party as the party of the working people. I believe their are elements within our party who have allegiance to big corporate interest. I do not write about the DLC out of spite but out of concern for the direction they attempt to take the party. I was very active during the '04 campaign and met many other equally motivated Dems who organized and worked the GOTV events in Ohio (and I even travelled outside my county to help when asked.) The folks who worked canvassing and getting folks to the polls (AND IN OHIO KEEPING THEM IN THISE LONG LINES) were not the DLC types but instead were progressives like myself. I believe our party can survive with out the big interest money but we can't do without the folks dedicated to Democratic values who are the backbone of the party. The folks who organize community groups where I live are NOT backing HRC.

I do not want a candidate who is owned by corporate interest. I do not want a candidate who poll tests every decision. We have very serious problems facing our future on this planet. I believe, perhaps more than ever (due to climate crisis), we need a leader with vision, strength and honesty. Wile I think HRC is fine as a senator (if that is who the good people of NY want) but to oversea the entire nation-NO THANKS!

[OHdem10]

9. Tongue in Cheek. Hilary should do a "Sista Solja"(SP?

Moment. Instead of appealing to RWers appleal to Lieberals.
Instead of attacking a black entertainer, show a little
wrongheadedness of DLC.(you know, those FreeTraders, taxcutters,
those who hate FDR and think he was wrong on everything
especially programs for the poor. Those who pander to the
RWers and try to call themselves Moderate.)

Liberals have a responsibilty after accepting Capitalism
as an Economic System--TO Make It FAIR and JUST for the
larger society. (NOT THOSE AT THE TOP OF INCOME SCALE--
Capitalism itself rewards them well)

[paulk]

10. the irrational hatred shown toward HRC by both the

left and right extremes on the political spectrum.... are a positive in my book.

(Not to say that there aren't rational reasons for not liking her...)

[bvar22]

47. It is also the end result of a political strategy of triangulation.

*

[bpeale]

11. another one like bush who can't admit their mistakes? no thanks.

[ellisonz]

18. A reporter should ask her that question in public.

I'd like to hear the answer.

*crickets*

[Solo_in_MD]

13. I saw the title and first read it as "Pillowing Hillary"...is that a bad sign or is it the pain meds

talking

[assclown_bush]

15. I agree with you wyldwolf...the worst has already been hurled against her...

Thank you for posting.

k&r

[polichick]

16. "Pillorying" is the right word...

There's a huge difference between people disagreeing with a candidate's positions or political moves and pillorying ~ "to expose to public contempt, ridicule or scorn."

The hatred is probably beginning to backfire though, as more people recognize it as fear-based and irrational. Hillary is not nearly as progressive a candidate as I'd like, but I have a special place in my heart for her just because she's strong enough to keep on truckin' regardless of the shit thrown her way. It makes me think, YOU GO GIRL!

[Kingstree]

21. This is a bunch of crap

People do not like her because she is too much like a republican. She voted for the War. She will trianglulate the issues. She to say what she thinks we want to hear. I want someone in office who cares about the people. She does not. She cares about what she can get from the corporations.

[polichick]

25. Good grief, can you read???

Disagreeing with someone's politics has nothing to do with the hatred spewed at Hillary ~ you're only fooling yourself if you believe that kind of vitriol is about her positions.

[EndElectoral]

17. Why? Iraq vote, NAFTA globalizaiton, anti-labor, non-single payer health care, polarizing to party

[JTFrog]

20. Right, but they don't see

those things because she has a vagina.

It goes both ways, don't it?

Getting damn sick and tired of people trying to tell me why I don't like Hillary.

[sendero]

22. I find it funny..

... that so many people seek to characterize being unimpressed with HRC or even disliking her as a politician as "pillorying" or "irrational hatred" and basically blaming the left.

Sure, the right has demonized her very very effectively and frankly that is the root of the problem. 40% of the population, mostly wingnuts, does hate her and really if you ask them why you will not get a cogent answer. You act as though because a group of people are not thinking in your version of rational, that you can "fix" that. Those who think they can fix something like that are as delusional as the Iraq war cheerleading team, they just don't know it.

So, we are supposed to throw away the presidency by defying their irrational hatred. Do you really think that her campaign ads will win those folks over? Please, the window of opportunity for accomplishing that closed years ago.

I don't care for HRC as a pol, her positions on the issues are too far out of line with mine, especially her pandering about the war. But, I will vote for her if she is nominated. But the problem is, if they run Thompson, she WILL NOT HAVE A CHANCE. NOT ONE. Even though the existence of ultra-partisan politics is largely a creation of Rove and the Republicans, the country is sick of it at some level. HRC couldn't be a better Dem symbol of more of the same. Thompson will run as the "outsider" and the "independent", a position that McCain has abdicated, and he will win.

It's really too bad that we find ourselves in 2008, with the Republican party in tatters and we don't have a single announced candidate who can easily walk away with this race. We should.

And the fact that we don't tells me something is really rotten in the Democratic party. That's how I see it.

[JTFrog]

23. very well said. nt

[illinoisprogressive]

24. It has to do with several things with me.

I dislike her dishonesty and greed and selfish thinking. Why is she running? Not for the good of the country.
But, why I don't like her has to do with her anti progressive thinking and DLC ideology. Her pro corporation and free trade. her pandering. The people around her. Her arrogance. Personally I also cannot stand to listen to her. Nails on a chalkboard.
she is irritating to me.
I hate her style of politics and blame everyone else thinking. No responsibility. Her secretiveness. Her inability to admit when she is wrong.
I fear she will crush the progressive wing. Bring the party back to the spineless, republican lite ways of the 90s.
But, I really would not attack her like I do here if her supporters were not so negative and disrespectful of everyone else. They began the war and so, they have to expect us to go on the offensive.

[SaveElmer]

26. C'Mon Illinois...I know you can do it...

Post something to back up what you are saying...

You are getting quite good at puking up the standard "progressive" talking points...but how about something to back 'em up

[wyldwolf]

33. If she did that, she wouldn't be a "progressive." She'd be a realist

[mckeown1128]

28. Why should we vote for Hillary if she is

a moderate as you claim. I want a Progressive Liberal for president.

[SaveElmer]

39. Well then why are you supporting Obama?...nt

[draft_mario_cuomo]

43. Don't expect anyone to respond nt

[SaveElmer]

44. Yeah I didn't expect anyone would...nt

[zulchzulu]

29. The "Poor Me" Complex, Version 2.0

There are some obvious misinformed spin tidbits like "she leads Mr Obama by double digits in polls of likely primary voters", "a quarter-century of experience of national politics" (First Ladies get political experience without the ability to legislate?) as well as the usual treasure trove of right-wing lexicon like "anti-war crowd", "The Nation, another lefty periodical", "she has eschewed radicalism" and other indications that the Right Wing wants to pimp the easiest candidate to destroy after the nomination process.

Picking on Jane Fonda is an obvious giveaway clue... :crazy:

[lumberjack_jeff]

30. The truth doesn't always lie half way between

Alternative explanation:
Her heart suggests that progressivism is probably a good idea, but her head tells her that she should never do anything progressive lest she be criticized as a liberal.

A liberal who won't do any liberal things. There's little for anyone to support.

It ain't a woman thing. That's the motive suggested by people unused to thinking.

[1776Forever]

31. Her speech the other day was positive but can we believe her?

I had heard of George W Bush many years before he became President and most of it seemed to be positive. I had no idea at all about his drinking problem or his lack of the English language. It is obvious that Cheney and his gang are in most of the control. Now that we have been under this kind of Administration for 8 years, what happens if HRC gets in and we find out she too is part of the same crowd? I don't want to see Mexican truckers in our country, and more jobs taken from our own people here! What is going to happen within this country if we too are turned into a have and have-not society? It will be unbelievable! Civil war might break out! I am not exaggerating here!

My main question is "Can we believe her?" Is she truly for the Middle Class?

[Tom Joad]

32. We detest this war that she and browback and guillini and Biden support.

The whole lot has no redeeming social value.

[Discord]

34. And the number one reason Hillary is a bad choice???

Look how she has managed to split her own party. Created a sub-division between moderates not wanting to rock the boat and let Washington just go for more of the same, and the liberals/preogressives who fear the implications of more of the same. If she wins the nomination, she will lose the general against most of the top repuke candidates. Like it or not, this is exactly the example of her "leadership skills" when it comes to her presidentiality. The Repukes in Washington will never work with or for her. It will be more gridlock in congress. Also, not only if she runs, will she be divisive and likely bring out a huge turnout on the repuke side, but that it turn will throw many of the house and senate seats up for grabs in 08 into question with the increased turnouts. So not only could she cost us the presidency, but she could also cost us congress as well. Frankly, it really upsets me how shes turned half her own party against her, while still drawing all the vitrol the repukes have to offer. She is not the solution for what this country needs, and IMHO, supporting Hillary is the single biggest THREAT to the Democratic party, its mission, its principles, and its integrity. 19% congrssional approval. Yeah, more of the same please... :eyes:

[wyldwolf]

36. except she hasn't split her party.

What evidence is there of that?

She leads all Democrats nationally and in most of the state primary polls.

[mckeown1128]

40. She averages 40% of Derm support....

How much of the other 60% can't stand her???

[wyldwolf]

41. well, Obama averages 25% and Edwards 12%. Kucinich? About 2%

How much of the rest can't stand them?

[SaveElmer]

42. Not much...

She not only leads in primary polling ... her lead grows in head to head matchups with Obama or Edwards...

Meaning that she not only achieves a significant plurality when all candidates are included, she is also the second choice by the vast majority of those whose first choice is Obama or Edwards...

[ellisonz]

38. This just in: conservatives are rabid fools.

*shocking*

[eridani]

45. You and the rightwingers are doing exactly the same thing--

--constantly redefining "center" as further and further to the right. Calling the Clintons "liberal" is saying that promoting media consolidation, shredding the safety net, outsourcing and the race to the bottom is "liberal". The right lies about her, and the left tells the truth. Big difference.

Obviously she can't be a warmonger and a peacenik at the same time. Therefore one of the two groups calling her those things is lying. I think it's the righties.

[wyldwolf]

46. "me" and the rightwingers?

Just because I disagree with you on the center, I'm a rightwinger??

[Name removed]

48. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[wyldwolf]

50. ah, yes. When there is no fact, personal attack. The calling card of "prooogreeesssiiives"

Idiot.

[bvar22]

54. The difference is:

I'm not ashamed to call myself a "Progressive" or a "Liberal", even though my position on The Issues is aligned with the majority of Americans....that makes me a REAL Centrist.

Apparently, you cringe from the label Rightwing, though you are vocal and belligerent in your support of the DLC and its policies. At the very best, the DLC must be considered the "rightwing" of the Democratic Party?

Have you disavowed your allegiance to this organization and joined the Center? If so, my apologies.


"There are forces within the Democratic Party who want us to sound like kinder, gentler Republicans. I want us to compete for that great mass of voters that want a party that will stand up for working Americans, family farmers, and people who haven't felt the benefits of the economic upturn."---Paul Wellstone

[wyldwolf]

60. the difference is you quickly become void of anything of substance

[Binka]

59. You Cry Personal Attack And Then You Make One?

:wtf:

[wyldwolf]

61. yeah, notice the sequence of events there.

[draft_mario_cuomo]

51. WW did not endorse Holy Joe over Lamont

I think you must be confusing him with some candidates who pose as progressives. ;)

[Name removed]

52. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[eridani]

56. Do google the use of conjunctions sometime, 'kay?

Or just look it up in your Funk and Wagnalls. If I said "you and the rightwingers", most people would take that to mean two different entities. Maybe it's your conscience that says different?

What I said was that rightwingers are lying about the "liberalism" of the Clintons, deliberately trying to make apologists for corporate power seem middle of the road. They're just as full of shit as the Kremlin generals who whined that the 98% controlled Soviet press was biased against them because a few reporters occasionally let some truths about Afghanistan slip by. Less than 100% domination = they're biased against me. You are doing the same thing.

[wyldwolf]

62. what a dodge!

psst! I didn't write the article in the OP.

[jcrew2001]

53. She won't get 43% of the general election vote

she'll do far worse.

[assclown_bush]

66. Do you have a crystal ball...

or do you possess other powers of divination?:shrug:

[sellitman]

63. If ....and I mean if.....

Hillary is in a commanding lead in Sept I believe Al Gore will step in and basically cake walk to the nomination. I don't believe he will jump in if Edwards or Obama is in the lead. So using logic....


Go Hillary!