Ding Dong the Bill is Dead!!!!

[Bullet1987]

I'm glad that travesty never saw the light of day!!! The corporate strong-armers took a severe blow today...as did Bush. I'm very pro-labor and pro-union and I didn't want to see this bill ever passed. HIP HIP HOORAY!!! HIP HIP HOORAY!!!!

It was reported on CNN not too long ago.

[soothsayer]

1. I'm with you! Glad especially that it defeats buscho. Maybe he'll finally lame up.

[pat_k]

27. Oh yeah. Sure. That'll stop the bushcheney steamroller. . .

. . .that'll stop their "other" war -- their War on the Constitution.

And if any Member of the so-called Congressional "leadership" ACTUALLY believes that, it's time to call the men in the white coats.

[Rydz777]

2. Yes, the bill was a corporate boondoggle and a lot of good

Democrats - e.g. Dorgan, Harkin, Stabenow, and others - voted to kill it.

[redqueen]

6. YAY!

I will have to call all those who stood up for us! :)

[ShortnFiery]

13. Did Webb vote against it too? Is there a link for the breakdown of votes in the Senate? n/t

[Warpy]

19. Senate Roll Call

http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=110&session=1&vote=00235

It's very unusual to see Domenici and Bingaman on the same side of any issue.

All this vote did was open the bill up to filibuster, and I think filibuster was pretty much assured. It's dead for now.

The yea votes would have put a time limit on passing it. It's obvious that Senators on the left thought that would defeat it, and only a few Senators on the right like Vacant Lott thought it would pass.

This vote means that the same rotten bill can be brought up again in the future, though, and not quite as the same worker hostile bill it is now.

[thoughtanarchist]

32. Yup. It was the OP-Ed from Byron Dorgan

That convinced me to contact Teddy and plead with his office (in an appeal as a lifelong supporter, needless to say) to let this bill die.

http://www.in-forum.com/Opinion/articles/170160

...of course that was before I read Wonkette's piece on the Dorgan / Kennedy chicken plucker altercation.

http://wonkette.com/politics/dept%27-of-grumpy-old-men/ted-kennedy-cares-about-the-chicken-pluckers-262969.php

There is no good choice for dems on this matter. On one side it's a partisan trick to push dems closer to Bush, on the other side, no legislation will hit the floor without this "compromise" that would hurt far more than it would help.

There are a thousand other issues more deserving of congress' attention.

[michreject]

37. Levin voted for it.

:wtf: :wtf: :wtf:

[5X]

3. Immigration reform is only a distraction and talking point for the gop,

and is not a real problem, anyway. Just like abortion,
only a divisive point to bring up in election time or to
distract from the more important issues.

[Bullet1987]

4. Does anybody know if they were ever planning to go after the people

who actually HIRE illegals? What's the point of immigration reform if jobs are still being dangled over Mexico practically asking people to cross the border?

[Saturday]

7. You've got to be kidding. Not a real problem?

It is a huge problem almost everywhere and a valid issue for many.

[old guy]

18. I kinda agree with 5X in a sense

I do think this is a political diversion. However, you also make a very valid point that it is a serious problem for many and one that must be dealt with soon. This bill IMO will not really do much to solve the issue. My fear is that if this bill were to pass any problems that were not addressed would never see the light of day as the problems would be considered solved. Perhaps I'm looking for the bee in roses, but these things happen all too often.

[Recursion]

29. Why?

Maybe it's just that I'm living in a city with an unbelievably tight labor market and labor shortages, but is it really a problem for people "out there"? Are people being driven out of their jobs by undocumented workers?

[Forkboy]

16. I think the issue hurts Repubs far more than it helps them.

The debate over immigration has spurred Hispanic leaders and voters to mobilize like few issues in recent memory have. The National Association of Latino Elected Officials has joined with the Hispanic television network Univision on a national campaign to help Hispanic residents fill out citizenship applications and to help those who are already citizens register to vote.

Stephanie Pillersdorf, a spokeswoman for Univision, said the number of Hispanic residents who had applied for citizenship in Los Angeles County alone had gone up 146 percent since the campaign started several months ago.

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/10/us/politics/10hispanics.html?ex=1183176000&en=02f7de67d242cc74&ei=5070

Hispanic voters, many of whom responded favorably to President Bush's campaign appeals emphasizing patriotism, family and religious values in Spanish-language media in 2004, are turning away from the administration on immigration and a host of other issues, according to a new survey.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/05/20/AR2006052000964.html

[sinkingfeeling]

5. Glad you're happy to keep things the way they are. That bill was the best we'll ever see.

It would have given you a chance to add millions of new union workers and more support against 'big business'.

[sabbat hunter]

17. it wouldnt have added any union jobs

it would have legitimized the exploitation/underpay of SOME of the illegal aliens here already.

[RaleighNCDUer]

23. It depends on the unions -

the old industrial unions were against it because it legitimized workers that undercut their unions' wage structure. They'd see little growth from these workers.

But the service industy unions, which have been growing expansively in the past decade, favored it, and most of the workers would be going into those unions.

I don't know where the agricultural unions fell on this - I suspect they favored the bill also, as undocumented workers compete directly with them.

There needs to be some kind of labor summit, so the different factions can get across to the others what their concerns are, either way. (But would that violate Taft/Hartley?)

[kikiek]

44. I think they were hoping to bust our nurses unions by importing nurses. What this

country needs to do is start expanding the nursing programs in colleges. You wouldn't believe how hard it is to get into the college programs for nursing right now in MN. They're flooded! People want these jobs because we make a living wage. The admin wanted to change that. It needs to be a bill that isn't going to threaten more of our jobs and security. The Dems were wrong on this one I think.

[Zywiec]

8. As Borat would say: great success!

[Double T]

9. Round 2 of the illegal alien amnesty bill goes to the OPPOSITION.

Prepare for Round 3 after the summer recess. The borders need to secured and the bill in its current form must continue to be defeated. corporate america's attempts to destroy what's left of this country will be STOPPED!

[pampango]

33. Ironically, "this corporate attempt to destroy what's left of the country"

was stopped by the Repubs in the Senate. They voted Against the bill 36-12, while the Democrats voted 32-15 FOR the bill.

Don't worry about Round 3, the Repubs will come to the rescue again, just like they did in the first two rounds. If the RW in the Senate doesn't kill it in Round 3, those in the House will tear it to pieces.

[Double T]

36. It is unfortunate that the Democrats are becoming what the rethugs.......

have always been; corporate shills.

[pampango]

40. I am still having trouble referring to Kennedy and Feingold as

corporate shills.

[aquart]

10. What bill? Which bill?

[acmavm]

12. Are you serious?

[aquart]

31. Since I don't have cable, yeah, I was serious.

I know now it was the immigration bill, but there was no way to know that from your cliquish, incomplete, inadequate statement.

[acmavm]

11. Could it be all the calls they got? I understand from an earlier

thread that the Capital switchboard crashed or something.

Good.

[European Socialist]

14. I agree--I have nothing against the illegals--but paying fines and

having to return to the Home Country was a bunch of BS that was unworkable anyway.

[SaveElmer]

15. Too bad...

Was certainly better than leaving things the way they are...

[partylessinOhio]

20. Bravissimo!

Harry Reid now looks like a complete puppet for * orchestrating the Senate debates limiting the opposition to an unequal time of ten minutes.

What did this gain Mr. Mouse?

When you don't play fair you cannot expect to be treated fairly by others in the future.

This was a bad bill opposed by a huge majority of the voters.

[ShortnFiery]

21. Senator Jim Webb (D-VA) was true to his word: His excellent Amendment was tabled & he voted "Nay."

:applause: :thumbsup:

[sampsonblk]

22. Amen. Back to business

This helps the GOP, although not Bush himself.

Can we please get back to business now? This was a ridiculous sideshow that helps GOP candidates.

[pat_k]

30. the only "business" that means a thing is the "business" of impeaching. . .

. . .Bush and Cheney.

In Bush World, the only REAL fight is the fight to escape Bush World. And the ONLY possible escape is impeaching and fighting to remove Bush and Cheney. All else is impotent sham. All else is reprehensible surrender to fascists. All else is betrayal of their oath to "support and defend" (which, BTW, means to "fight," win or lose).

[sampsonblk]

35. Well, yeah. That too

There are a lot of things that need to be dome immediately. This bill was not one of them.

[Ian David]

24. 80% of the public opposed it, 100% of the agribusiness and sweatshops promoted it.

EVERYONE-- Liberal, Conservative... across the spectrum... HATED this for one reason or another.

If we can cross the isle to create a bill that is so universally reviled... can't we also work together to make one that everyone LIKES?

Oh, wait.

Those get vetoed.

[polichick]

25. Now, that the bill's out of the way...

How soon do you think they'll get to the little problem of protecting our borders? :sarcasm:

[Lugnut]

26. Hooray.

My husband is a UMWA union brother so he'll be happy to hear this news.

[Bridget Burke]

42. Since the UMWA is part of the AFL-CIO....

That must mean that your husband wants the more liberal immigration reforms favored by the AFL-CIO & several other unions. It's a PDF file, so I'll list the major points. With a bit more detail provided for one "point" that might be misinterpreted.

1. Protect the well-being and safety of immigrant and U.S. citizen children.

2. Achieve faithful enforcement of immigration laws by reinstating the jurisdiction
of the federal courts to review agency decisions involving immigrants.

3. Achieve maximum protection of the labor rights and working conditions of U.S.
and immigrant workers.

4. Achieve maximum reduction in the size of the undocumented population. Enact a
single-tier and truly comprehensive legalization program offered to all undocumented
persons who have not committed serious crimes so as to make them a danger to their
communities. Provide an expedited legalization program for long-time resident Central
American and other refugees previously granted some form of temporary status.

5. Achieve a realistic legal framework for future migration.

6. Achieve rational and humane operational control of the borders.

7. Achieve rational and humane interior enforcement and related policies relating to
the presence of immigrant communities.

www.aflcio.org/issues/civilrights/immigration/upload/UnityBlueprint.pdf

As it is, we've still got millions of workers with no protection.

My senators, Republicans Kay Bailey Hutchison & John Cornyn, voted "No." They aren't known for their sympathy with labor.

[SKKY]

28. I think he was probably hoping to hang his hat on this bill...

...Now we can put up the neon "LAME DUCK LIVES HERE" sign over the White House.

[Stop Cornyn]

34. Obama, Dodd, Biden, and Hillary voted for the bill. How would the other candidates have voted?

[hughee99]

38. An odd situation here...

based on the Roll Call, it looks like most of the Democrats were on the *'s side, while most of the repukes were opposing him. Many here are applauding what happened, and yet it was the repukes for the most part, that killed the bill.

You don't see this too often.

[pampango]

39. I wonder if that has ever happened before on any issue.

It is surreal to see DU'ers and Freepers both cheering the outcome of a vote in which the repubs trounced the Democrats.

[Enthusiast]

41. Most Democrats think Bush was way wrong.

Most of the Democrats out in the nation, most of us are against amnesty for illegal aliens. We want border enforcement and we want it now. Why does our party support illegal immigration when the people do not? Who are they to dictate to me? Their judgement isn't superior, that is clear.

This wave of illegals would be considered an invasion if it took place years ago. Think about it, thousands of people are coming into your country uninvited and without documentation, they don't even speak the language of the land. This is an invasion, pure and simple.

[pampango]

46. If most Democrats are against amnesty for illegal aliens and want

border enforcement now, in what way do we differ from Freepers on this issue? (I know that our motives are much "purer" than those of freepers.) There is much common ground on this between DU and freeperland.

I know there is much joy at DU tonight that the repubs carried the day and defeated the immigration bill that the Democrats in the Senate overwhelmingly voted for.

[Stop Cornyn]

43. This graph explains that phenomenon:

What you see is the furthest right-wing corporatists most heavily favor loose immigration rules (71% to 25%).

On the other hand, the furthest left liberals are the group which is the second most supportive of loose immigration rules (58% to 36%).

The corporatists want to exploit the cheap below-market labor (and to drive down the legal labor market) while the liberals do not believe someone's economic destiny should be determined by whether that person was born on one side of a river or the other.

Loose immigration laws are not very popular among the vast middle to the left of the corporatists and to the right of the liberals. This is a classic populist issue which is reverberates differently among the corporate and liberal "elites" as compared to the populous middle.

If you are looking for a term to describe the minority of Democrats who voted against the immigration bill, you may accurately call them populists (whose interests happened to align with the conservative Republicans). And if you are looking for a term to describe Bush and the minority of Republicans who voted for the bill, you might accurately call them the corporatist elitists (whose interests happened to align with the liberals in the Democratic Party).

[enough already]

45. Anything Bush is for, I'm against

It's dead. Good. Bush loses.

[madmunchie]

47. Me tooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!! I want to start dancing in the streets on this

one. Bush tried to sweet talk or strong arm to get votes and he FAILED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!can you tell I'm happy?

[rhiannon55]

48. Congress said no to Lil Bushie--HaHa!

I bet he's curled up with his bwankie right now, sucking his thumb and kicking his widdle feet! :rofl:

[AtomicKitten]

49. I think it's a mistake to oppose this bill.

First of all, the Rs have had wide-open borders since 9-11 which is the epitome of security negligence and the Democrats need to pound that and fix it.

Secondly, it gives immigrants a foothold in the doorway that prevents the door from slamming in their face. The task of gaining citizenship is outrageously arduous according to this bill, but it is something.

Last but not least, keeping this issue open will provide a platform for the GOP to rally behind in 2008. Their hatred of brown people will coalesce their vote. Finish it and deprive them of that issue. Then when Dems gain more power in 2008, they can go back and fine-tune the bill.

[pampango]

50. I agree with you, AtomicKitten.

Fortunately, most Democratic senators, including most of the really liberal ones, did support this bill. Our support of this bill could go a long way towards enhancing our political power in DC in 2008 largely because Kennedy was right to show compassion towards Hispanics.

[AtomicKitten]

51. thanks

We appear to be in the minority here at DU but that's okay.

If you separate out the knee-jerk inclination to oppose everything Junior wants, you begin to see this as a panacea for a lot of problematic issues on the left. It's ironic that the wingnuts are so adamantly opposed to the path toward citizenship calling it amnesty; I see it as jumping through a fiery hoop, harsh and really quite cruel in some aspects. But it's a foot in the door nonetheless.