Romney's treatment of family dog on 1983 vacation becomes issue

[pnwmom]

Source: Boston Globe

TIME.com's Swampland blog has been flooded with more than 200 comments from readers complaining of animal cruelty, YouTube viewers have posted satirical videos, and hundreds of personal blogs are brimming with opinions and jokes.

For some, the story has become an occasion to consider larger issues of ethics and animal abuse. Romney, who has built an image as a strong manager, is now facing concerns about his ability to empathize with the less powerful, in this case, his dog, Seamus, riding atop his station wagon.

"I'll admit that I`m coming from a dog-centric point of view," Tucker Carlson, the conservative pundit, said Thursday on MSNBC. "But I'm feeling that maybe Mitt Romney lost my vote here. Do you need to be a PETA member to be disturbed by the fact that this guy put a dog on the roof of his car? Does that bother you?"

SNIP

"Well, I am a dog owner, and I can say with certainty that strapping your dog to the roof of the car for a 12-hour drive, windshield or no windshield, is, well, nuts," David Kravitz wrote on BlueMassGroup, a liberal blog. "It also strikes me as classic Romney: it solves a problem efficiently, in a business-like manner, and with no regard whatsoever for the suffering that the solution may cause."

Read more: http://www.boston.com/news/politics/politicalintelligence/2007/06/romneys_treatme.html

[gaspee]

1. It should be an issue

How can anyone can think it's OK to tie a dog on the roof of a car? My dogs don't even ride in crates in the back of my pick-up. They ride in the front.

Too bad he can't be arrested for animal cruelty.

[pnwmom]

3. And he says that he did it every time they went on trips!

As if that makes it better.

[momster]

19. I wondered about that...

the 'building a dog windshield' made it seem like this wasn't just for one trip. I had also wondered how they brought the dog back from that Boston to Ontario trip in the original story. Guess I know now. What an utter unregenerate SOB.

[pnwmom]

25. Speaking of the windshield,

this other article talks about how that wouldn't have been much help:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=1215120&mesg_id=1215120

[MADem]

6. I'm astounded that the Canadians let him through. I thought they were strong on animal rights.

Maybe they came late to that party as well....

[slampoet]

35. See my post #32 below.

[Flatulo]

16. That's not safe either...

If you should have an accident, or even have to slam on the brakes, the dogs could be badly injured.

They sell dog harnesses that act like a seatbelt. They go around their chests and restrain them pretty good in the event of an accident.

[pnwmom]

18. I doubt they sold those years ago. But they could have left the dog at

a kennel or put it in the car with the boys. The wife should have driven and Romney should have ridden in the box on top.

[Flatulo]

24. Now that would be funny.

This whole thing reminds me of Nat Lampoon Vacation, when thye strapped the old dead aunt to the roof of the car.

[pnwmom]

27. I think a lot of people are making that connection.

But I'd prefer the real Chevy Chase for President.

[CatholicEdHead]

28. Of course the dog was dragged behind

[gaspee]

48. I probably wasn't clear

They ride in crates in the back seat of the front of my pickup - mostly on their way to dogshows - I have six champion Shiba Inu, one of them currently in the top ten. We even did Westminister this year. When they ride around going to the store or to the park, then they wear their harnesses and seat belts.

[cassiepriam]

53. It certainly raises questions about his judgment.

[Gman]

2. Talk about insight into someone's personality

if he would do that to a dog because "it solves a problem efficiently, in a business-like manner, and with no regard whatsoever for the suffering that the solution may cause". That's a sorry SOB.

[MADem]

4. Kravitz is absolutely right on that score--it is "classic Romney"

He is one stone-cold muthafucka.

I'm so pleased this is an issue, and I hope it doesn't go away. That guy needs to be out of the running. He's stupid, and he's dangerous. And he has lots of campaign cash. Sound like anyone we know from past campaigns?

[pnwmom]

5. Yes, and he sounds like someone who would have no problem

continuing on with the Bush torture policies.

[MADem]

9. Didn't he want to DOUBLE Guantanamo? And didn't he find "enhanced torture techniques" to be a

swell idea? Why, I believe he did: http://www.crooksandliars.com/2007/05/15/gop-debate-ii-romney-double-guantanamo/

Romney - Yes on Torture Enhanced Interrogation Techniques and while you're at it, Double Guantanamo! (loud applause from audience)

[pnwmom]

15. These guys are sickening. n/t

[Sequoia]

14. I'm with you.

But what surprises me is in other website's comments and even here at DU some people have no problem with it at all.

[rubberducky]

7. This will be his Macaca Moment.

[MADem]

10. I do hope so, but he has money. I really thought Mister Tough On Immigration having a crewful of

undocumented Guatemalans crawling all over his lawn at Belmont would be an issue, but that one died on the vine.

Americans DO like their dogs....I hope it is his Doggie Doo Waterloo.

[rinsd]

8. How depraved does one have to be to creep out Tucker?

I guess now we know the answer.

[DesertRat]

11. Mitt says: "My dog likes fresh air"

:wtf:
Here's Mitt blaming PETA for picking on him and defends his actions:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPpaJrJecjA

[pnwmom]

20. Yeah, and the prisoners at Gitmo are lucky to be out in the fresh air, too.

And the Katrina flood victims really enjoyed their stay in the football stadiums.

[ozymandius]

22. Does his dog like defecating at 70 mph?

That's a question I'd like to hear answered.

[Flatulo]

26. A trained dog would rather explode than go in the crate. n/t

[TwilightGardener]

40. Exactly. I crate-trained both of my dogs to housebreak them, for JUST this reason--

so not only did the dog have the terror and discomfort of being levitated over the highway watching semis blow past him and being wind-blasted, but he had the discomfort of fighting his urge not to soil his crate--I'm sure he held it as long as he could, poor thing.

[Cameron27]

47. That the dog was in terror

bothers me even more than the physical danger. He's a cold, sick person.

[poverlay]

12. Oh please please please God don't let me miss John Stewart, Stephen Colbert,

Lewis Black, Bill Maher, Robin Williams etc. etc. on this little gem. I have all sorts of beverages which I'm looking forward to spraying out my nose...

On a more serious note to self: Let the dog know she'd better behave or we're going on vacation...

[CountAllVotes]

13. Romney/Frist '08

These two would make one fine ticket. :sarcasm:

Honestly, they BOTH belong in JAIL for cruelty and abuse towards animals!!! :mad:

:kick:

[Louie the XIV]

17. I think Romney is a scumbag

and I'm a dog lover and dog owner. However I don't see how this is any worse then people who drive around on the highway with their dog sliding around unsecured in the back of a pickup. The fact that the dog supposedly enjoyed it and would jump into the carrier shows it wasn't cruel to the dog. At most you can say he is irresponsible.

[Flatulo]

21. Can someone help me to understand why this is somehow

more cruel than a dog sitting on the front seat? If you're in an accident, or even have to slam on the brakes, the dog is going to be a projectile going right out the windshield. It could break it's neck even if it doesn't leave the vehicle.

I agree it seems silly and tacky, but is it actually unsafe for the animal? At least if the crate seperates from the car, the dog is in a protective shell.

And what about all the dogs you see with their heads hanging out the window? They seem to love the wind in their face.

[pnwmom]

29. Why compare it to the front seat? Obviously, a dog would be safer

in the back seat. But it isn't just a question of safety, it's comfort and anxiety and loneliness. That dog was having diarrhea inside his crate (which a dog would never purposely defile) -- that means he was under extreme stress. But there's also the factor of the wind. Here's some info from a physics perspective:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=1215120&mesg_id=1215120

[earthlover]

34. There is a difference

between a dog putting his head out a window and "enjoying the breeze" and being put on the top of a car. I had a dog who loved to put his head out the window....for a while, that is. He wouldn't leave it out there for hours on end. And besides he had a choice in the matter.

Seems to me a trained dog would not go in a crate, and I would also think diarrhea would be an additional sign of stress.

I don't buy for a minute that the dog enjoyed the trip. He probably jumped in the cage because he knew he would be beaten otherwise.

[ecstatic]

57. or the back of a pickup truck

I agree with you. I'm just curious as to why its OK for dogs to be in the back of pickup trucks. I also hate to see little kids placed back there.

[Cha]

23. Recommended!

This is dead on.. "It also strikes me as classic Romney: it solves a problem efficiently, in a business-like manner, and with no regard whatsoever for the suffering that the solution may cause."


This from The Boston Globe, too..isn't that a fascist rag?

[pnwmom]

30. The Globe is actually a more progressive paper. I think you're thinking

about the Boston Herald.

[Cha]

37. Ah, I guess I am!

Thank you, for straightening me out on that, pnwmom! :)

[FuzzySlippers]

31. I like this part:

"He scrambled up there every time we went on trips," Romney said. "He got <[up>] all by himself and enjoyed it."

Must be one of those rare flying Irish Setters.

[durtee librul]

33. nahhh..it was an airdale....nt

[slampoet]

32. Has anybody figured out that he was probably SMUGGLING this dog into Canada?

Has anybody figured out that he was probably SMUGGLING this dog into Canada?


Every international crossing i have seen has limits on the animals that can go back and forth. The Niagra crossing to Canada is no different.

Unless Romney had some pretty involved paperwork, (or he bribed a guard) the dog would have had to stay in 30 days of quarantine.

And even if he had the paperwork I find it HIGHLY unlikely that any border guard would have let them into Canada if the guard had seen how the dog was secured to the roof.

Once you add this up, (and there are records for these border crossings that go back a long way) the story sounds almost made up.


Either that or the Romney kid just outed his dad as a Smuggler. As i recall unauthorized animals is a felony in the US and Canada.

[earthlover]

36. the whole thing could be a story made up to make Romney look like a cold calculating decision maker

Perhaps whoever thought up the "story" didn't think things through enough. Like the Canadian border crossing. Like the idea that it was fun for the dog. Like the idea that the dog leaped to the top of the car to get in . Like not being aware that dogs don't like to shit in pens and diarrhea is a sign of stress. Hell, this invented story almost sounds as dumb as what got us into Iraq!

[momster]

41. Originally in Time

this story was told by Romney's oldest son, Tagg, as an example of his father's ability to make unemotional decisions.

[MADem]

43. Gee, that photograph of the dog carrier on the car roof was a photoshop, eh?

PLEASE.

The story was a family joke--a laugh riot. His evil spawn and he and his wife used to chuckle over the shit pouring down the back window--ha, ha, ha...the idiot told on himself. To a hundred or more of his closest friends.

Go to the source documents. The Globe doesn't fuck around when they do an expose.

It wouldn't surprise me AT ALL if the bastard stopped before the border, crammed the dog in with the kids (this was 83, no seat belt laws), went through the crossing, and then made poor Seamus get back up on the roof.

You get in a dog crate and spend twelve hours being buffeted by seventy mile an hour winds, indifferently strapped down to a station wagon, and then report back to us about how much you loved it. Tell us how the dehydration, exhaustion and terror "invigorates" you. Maybe you can shit and piss yourself to get the full experience, why doncha?

Every vet in the country calls it what it is: cruelty.

Invented story, eh? How long have you been working for Shittsy's campaign? :eyes:

[MADem]

42. No, that's not true--all you need is a health certificate (vet exam within thirty days of travel)

and an up to date rabies shot.

I've gone across the border with a dog, a cat and a parrot. It's not a day at the beach in terms of paperwork (the parrot, especially), but it's totally do-able.

There's no quarantine coming from the US. There is from some other countries, but not for their southern neighbors.

You're thinking of Hawaii and the UK, maybe (where I had pets in the slammer for six long miserable months, years ago).

[gaspee]

49. I don't think so

My dogs go to Canada all the time for dog shows. All they need is proof of shots and a health certificate from their vet. Canada doesn't quarantine. I don't know about back then, but they don't now.

[kestrel91316]

38. Veterinary perspective:

Because this placed the dog at risk of certain death if it came loose, and injury in the event of being struck by debris, and the great likelihood of eye injury from speeding dust partices.......I'm calling ANIMAL ABUSE, pure and simple.

This man should never be allowed to own another pet. Period. What a dumbass.

[CK_John]

39. I understand it was in a carrier case like they use on the airlines. n/t

[MADem]

44. That have HUGE HOLES in the sides, like a fucking giant whiffle ball

Not the thing to provide a stable ride with seventy mile an hour winds buffeting the case.

The airlines put the dogs IN the aircraft, not strapped to the wing......

[gaspee]

50. And don't forget

If they fall to the ground, they break apart. They are held together with screws but come apart fairly easily. Someone upthread had the dumbass idea that if the crate came off the car the dog would be "safe."

I swear some people spout off when they have no clue.

[MADem]

52. Yep--with a good sized dog, those foolish screws need "augmenting"

I've been lucky--I've dragged dogs, cats AND birds all over the world, through quarantines, indifferent airlines, sketchy facilities, you name it, and I've had luck and not lost a pet. But I can see, all too clearly, how it might happen.

Putting a dog in a carrier atop a car going 70MPH (and possibly more) is BEGGING for an accident to happen!

[kestrel91316]

45. BFD. STILL completely inappropriate. The man's an ass.

[polichick]

46. Mitt really does seem like a robot...

An empty shell of a person who looks like a Ken doll. He should have to ride on the top of a car for the next leg of his campaign jaunt.

[intheflow]

51. As well it should.

Can't believe Romney's even made it this far on the campaign trail.

[tailwind]

54. He's blown it now !

One less psychopath for the Whitehouse.
Good.

He's finished now : )

[radfringe]

55. gives a new meaning to "getting on the bus"?

I think this is Romney's "BARK-caca" moment...

[Vinca]

56. If he treats the family dog that way, why should anyone think he'd

be judicious about things such as sending our young to war? It's an apparent disregard for life, no matter how many times he beats the "Save the Embryo" drum.