Isn't there a Christian proverb or tenet that says you shall be judged...

[WCGreen]

By how you treat the meekest amongst you...

And didn't Jesus hang out and forgive a lot of people who, shall we say, operated on the fringes of society...

Now I'm no lover of criminals...

I am firmly in the school of if you can't do the time, don't do the crime...

But still...

Read this article about deplorable prisons run for profit and tell me we are still living in America...


http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19638219/

"Hundreds of pages of documents obtained by The Associated Press through an open-records request show Idaho did little monitoring of out-of-state inmates, despite repeated complaints from prisoners, their families and a prison inspector.

More than 140,000 U.S. prison beds are in private hands, and inmates’ rights groups allege many such penitentiaries tolerate deplorable conditions and skimp on services to increase profits.

“They cut corners because the bottom line is making money,” said Caylor Rolling, prison program director at Partnership for Safety and Justice in Portland, Ore., a group that promotes prison alternatives."

(Irony. The prison was located in Dickens County)



It's simply a signal that perhaps too many people are being incarcerated for crimes that don't warrant prison time...

Or else the tough on crime republicans, when elected, can't figure out where the money is going to come from to run the prisons when they also ran on a gut government spending and tax cut platform...

Enter private prisons...

Enter the very very unchristian actions of those who run the for profit prisons...

I wonder if Scooter would have been sent to a for profit prison if the law and order guy sitting in the Oval Office hadn't decided to commute his sentance...

I wonder too, how much the Florida Based company running this prison contributed to GOP politicians over the years...

Just a few thoughts...

[DesertRat]

1. Jesus said:

"Whatsoever you do to the least of my brothers or sisters, that you do unto me."

[WCGreen]

2. Thanks...

I knew there was something I liked about that Jesus fella...

[Bluerthanblue]

3. "whatever you do to the least of these- you do to me"...

-Jesus Christ


Jesus encouraged his followers not to repay evil with evil- he said if someone took your shirt you should give them your coat as well- He said if someone hits you on one cheek, offer up your other one-

I don't think there is much question that he wouldn't have thought much of our prisons-

In the "lords prayer" he tells us we are to ask that our "tresspasses/wrongs" be forgiven as (in like manner) we forgive others their wrongs-....

guess it's no wonder that the bible says "I desire mercy, not sacrifice".

I wouldn't want to be one of the people running this prison.

For more than these reasons-
peace,
blu

[kasseri]

16. The unexamined life

is one not worth living.

Peace.

[CaliforniaPeggy]

21. This is an excellent thought...

I knew a guy back in college who had this quote taped over the top of his TV set...

It's either Plato or Socrates, I think...

Welcome to DU!

:hi:

[nealmhughes]

4. Matthew 7:1 is the verse, direct from the rabbi from Nazareth's mouth.

And in theory, that ought to make it "Gospel Truth." Now in practice. . . it seems that most religions are used for convenience and not followed when the sticky moral and ethical stuff gets involved.

[EST]

5. Despite republican "conservative" protestations to the contrary,

almost anything can be done more cheaply by government, if, and only if, that government is as transparent as possible.
The reason? Probably a big part of it is the absence of a profit motive in the final delivery.

The handing off of essentially state functions to private industry takes away the responsibility of citizens for the treatment of prisoners and the distribution of prison facilities. It also promotes secrecy, since the books of a mega corporation are not open to citizens just because they are citizens.

I don't know if we will ever get away from private prisons, now that we have unlocked that particular genii, but it is worth the effort to try. This is bad policy and bad outcomes are to be expected.

[WCGreen]

7. It just makes me sick...

And it tells a lot about our so-called "Christian" society...

[stellanoir]

6. the beatitudes. . .

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Beatitudes

But the fundamentalists are obsessed with the book of Revelations which reads, according to one of my two spiritual teachers as, "someone's bad mushroom trip from the Dark Ages."

The abomination of justice via the commutation decimates our judicial system more than when selective amnesia seemingly became a prerequisite for employment there.

Methinks they just "jumped the shark." Though I loathe that expression really.

[WCGreen]

8. I believe that fundamentalists are about 90% Old Test, 9% Revelation...

With just a whiff of Jesus Thrown in to keep the faithful happy...

Give me that Old Time Religion...

Well, fundamentalists have their wish...

[stellanoir]

12. Welp

If they are reading King James then there is a whole lot that is "Lost in Translation."

It's sick, depressing, and a distortion and there are far better more current options. . .

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yA1t-nyA0v4

http://www.firethegrid.com

[WCGreen]

13. I think that "King James" is nothing more than a political document

and should not be used for religious purposes at all...

A couple of years ago I read this book, Misquoting Jesus, and it got me to thinking about what religion truly is and to question the institutions even more...

To me, if this is truly the answer, Jesus talked about a personal relationship with God and that he offered suggestions about how to live a pure life, to see life as others see it and to be honest with yourself and those around you...

That is how I try to live my life and if there is some judgment or some entrance exam to get into paradise, then I think I will pass even though I have doubts about God...

[stellanoir]

14. One of my colleagues says that

"all religions are based on a fear of death."

I intuitively feel that the stories of his birth and death have been grossly distorted.

Sorry that's just always how I've felt.

He wasn't exclusionary at all.

Unlike his followers and missionaries.

Ughhhh

[DemBones DemBones]

24. How do you mean the KJV is a political document?

Not disagreeing, just don't understand what you're saying.

I saw a bumper sticker a few months ago that proclaimed in huge letters "If It Ain't the King James, It Ain't the Bible." It did seem like a political statement. This was on a college student's car.

[ClassWarfare2008]

9. Here's what JC said, in context

From Matthew 25. (This is from a recent Bible translation called "The Message" which I chose for easy readability with all the "thee's" "thou's" and "verily's" of the King James Version)

The Sheep and the Goats
31-33"When he finally arrives, blazing in beauty and all his angels with him, the Son of Man will take his place on his glorious throne. Then all the nations will be arranged before him and he will sort the people out, much as a shepherd sorts out sheep and goats, putting sheep to his right and goats to his left.

34-36"Then the King will say to those on his right, 'Enter, you who are blessed by my Father! Take what's coming to you in this kingdom. It's been ready for you since the world's foundation. And here's why:

I was hungry and you fed me,
I was thirsty and you gave me a drink,
I was homeless and you gave me a room,
I was shivering and you gave me clothes,
I was sick and you stopped to visit,
I was in prison and you came to me.'

37-40"Then those 'sheep' are going to say, 'Master, what are you talking about? When did we ever see you hungry and feed you, thirsty and give you a drink? And when did we ever see you sick or in prison and come to you?' Then the King will say, 'I'm telling the solemn truth: Whenever you did one of these things to someone overlooked or ignored, that was me—you did it to me.'

41-43"Then he will turn to the 'goats,' the ones on his left, and say, 'Get out, worthless goats! You're good for nothing but the fires of hell. And why? Because—

I was hungry and you gave me no meal,
I was thirsty and you gave me no drink,
I was homeless and you gave me no bed,
I was shivering and you gave me no clothes,
Sick and in prison, and you never visited.'

44"Then those 'goats' are going to say, 'Master, what are you talking about? When did we ever see you hungry or thirsty or homeless or shivering or sick or in prison and didn't help?'

45"He will answer them, 'I'm telling the solemn truth: Whenever you failed to do one of these things to someone who was being overlooked or ignored, that was me—you failed to do it to me.'

46"Then those 'goats' will be herded to their eternal doom, but the 'sheep' to their eternal reward."

[compote_tom]

22. It is interesting

that neither side knew that had fed...ect. Jesus, or denied him food...ect. Both the do-gooders and the not do gooders are surprised. As if the goat(bad guys) thought the were righteous, and the sheep(good guys) never knew they were feeding Jesus.

[Ecumenist]

10. There is also a verse that says:

"Judge not lest ye be judged; for as ye judge, so shall ye be judged".

[WCGreen]

11. I don't claim to hide behind scripture....

I respect and try to live my life in a way that would be called Christian, if you will...

I just point out hypocrisy and let others decide...

If we all walked through live with out judgement, then we would be ruled forever by the strongest and those that would take advantage of the situation...

I believe that without judgement there would be no action...

And I will live with the judgement that falls upon me...

[DemBones DemBones]

15. Yes, but that doesn't mean we can't say someone has

done something wrong when we know it to be a fact.

It means to remember that God will judge you -- and not to throw stones if you're living in a glass house.

For example: Newt Gingrich, Bob Livingston, Henry Hyde, and Bob Barr were part of the "Impeach Clinton" cabal. Every one of them had committed adultery, or was in an adulterous relationship at the time. Newt and Livingston had to resign their House seats because of their hypocritical acts. What right did they have to judge Bill Clinton for doing what they had done? Newt was even known to have told people he preferred oral sex because he could deny having slept with a woman not his wife!

[Ecumenist]

18. I completely agree with you!!

[DemBones DemBones]

23. Thanks! That's nice to hear, and too rarely heard, I think.

I've been trying to agree more and disagree less lately, admittedly with mixed results. I think we have a lot of arguments here because we're really mad at the political situation and taking it out on each other.

Jesus said there were two great commandments: "Love the Lord your God with all your heart" and "Love your neighbor as (much as) you love yourself."

You don't have to be Christian at all to benefit from the second commandment. I think every religion says much the same thing.

To do it right, you have to love all your neighbors, which makes it more difficult. As Jesus also said, everyone loves their friends, you need to love your enemies, too.

You don't have to become their best friends, but you can be kind to them, recognize them as fellow human beings, deserving to be loved -- and often not being loved enough.

There has never been enough kindness in the world. Meanness is always abundant. We could change that with a little effort.

:hippie:

[Bluerthanblue]

17. it fits right in with "forgive us, as we forgive others"

in like measure-

(i'm old enough to remember the "Winston tastes good as a cigarette should")

If we truly followed this precept, i dare say there'd be much less (if any) need for prisons.

[DemBones DemBones]

25. Yes, it does, and I'm also old enough to remember

the Winston commercials. They drove my dad nuts! He was a real stickler for proper word usage and grammar. I thought he overreacted to the Winston commercial but it drives me crazy the way "may" and "might" are used interchangeably now, as if they have the same meaning. I asked a grammarian about it years ago and she said it had become acceptable usage. She didn't like it any better than I did.

[Igel]

19. A lot of repubs are only cultural Xians.

Rather like a roommate of mine was only a cultural Jew: He went to synagogue once a year, ate Jewish food (not at the same time as ham and shrimp), and liked Jewish folklore. He was an atheist.

As for not judging, my take is that it means not condemning: and since I'm not a judge, I can't actually condemn. However, it does mean that the church I was in had as a minor doctrine not serving on juries or in law enforcement. Take that and apply it to 99% of the population and you'll have a thugocracy that makes anything in this country for the last 300 years seem meek and mild.

However, the real problem with what you wrote is the assumption that this isn't just a nation of people, most of whom are Xian, but a nation that is founded on Xian doctrines. It's not, even if you could actually come up with a decent list of laws that "Xian" would entail.

You assume that those running companies are Xian. They're usually not. Church attendance means nothing, just as being "Muslim" doesn't mean you've been in a mosque for decades, or cared about what the imam said.

[WCGreen]

20. They hide behind the cross...

[Ecumenist]

26. Well as the saying goes:

Going to a church doesn't make you a Christian anymore than being in a garage makes you a car. It means nothing if you don't live it.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

27. A lot of them attend suburban megachurches where a self-appointed minister

with no formal theological training preaches only on his obsessions and understands that he keeps his job by making the congregation feel good about themselves. This includes preaching "the American way of life," as if mindless materialism is a good thing.

[WCGreen]

28. Here is a piece I wrote last summer for a local mag...

http://www.clevelandcurrent.com/site/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=43&Itemid=58

It's my experience attending a "mega" church for a month...