More Women Feel Skeptical About Hillary's Authenticity

[illinoisprogressive]

The most appealing thing about Hillary Rodham Clinton has always been her enemies, who often seem not in their right mind, screaming that she is a murderer and calling her names like "Her Thighness." They make you want to like her.

Yet in interviews across the country with women of all ages, races, income brackets and points of view, one of the rare patches of common ground was skepticism about the first female presidential contender with a serious shot at the White House. Over 18 months, I traveled to 20 states listening to women speak at length about what they care about and what drives them crazy as they look toward the presidential election in '08. I ought to like her, many of the strongest Democrats among them said. But on no other matter did left, right and center converge as on the view best summed up as "Anybody but Hillary' – to the point that I began to dread the mention of her name, because it meant we would probably not get around to talking about anything else that day.

All of which runs contrary to the accepted narrative of this election cycle, which is that it is women who are leading the charge for Mrs. Clinton's candidacy. Polling, which at this point still mainly measures name ID, certainly shows a far more mixed picture for Mrs. Clinton where female voters are concerned; 51 percent of those who participated in a recent Washington Post-ABC News survey said they support her for the Democratic nomination.

If she won the nomination, however, polls also suggest she'd have trouble winning over the independent female voters any Democrat needs to win the presidency. Forty-three percent of female independents said they definitely would not vote for Mrs. Clinton, compared with the 29 percent who said they would not vote for Barack Obama. Even within her party, she polls least well with women who are the most like her, in terms of education and income, and best with voters her campaign calls "women with needs."

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/dn/opinion/points/stories/DN-henneberger_08edi.ART.State.Edition1.436b630.html

[EFerrari]

1. In the last 24 hours, I heard from a pollster that most independents

are to the left of the Democrats but this brain won't give me the source. :(

[EFerrari]

5. Aha! Here's that poll:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=1273420&mesg_id=1273420

[Forkboy]

25. Tell me something I didn't already know.

:D

[EFerrari]

36. Smarty Pants!

:)

[Totally Committed]

26. We are being driven from this Party by the DLC's cynical triangualation to the Right

on every issue that matters to us. And most of those electeds that are not DLC-ers are mostly cow-towing to their agenda in order to raise money from corporations for their next election.

I don't doubt that most Independents WILLbe to the left of this Party by the next election, and I predict most of them will be as averse to holding their noses while they vote, and will, therefore, stay home in droves.

Just my opinion, but I know an awful lot of Democrats who feel as I do, and are *this* close to changing their Party affiliation to "Independent", and not voting if the nominee of this Party is too far to the Right on our issues.

TC

[EFerrari]

37. It's the money. We NEED pubilcly funded elections but I don't

see a way to get it done.

[The_Casual_Observer]

2. I'd rather speculate that by 2008 the voters will be so utterly pissed

at the republicans that Hillary would win in the biggest landslide in history.

[EFerrari]

6. I think whoever you nominate will win. So, please be careful.

lol

[Radical Activist]

12. That means anyone could win so why not

nominate someone who will really do something more than maintain the status quo?

[enough already]

27. She'd like you to believe that

Reality is that she would fuel the biggest puke turnout in history, while many on our side are lukewarm to her at best.

[William769]

3. An op versus polls.

Guess which one has more credence?

[ShortnFiery]

4. I personally don't think that she is genuine and that troubles me.

I'm one of the few people here who is also troubled by the fact that she helped her husband cover up past love affairs in order to damp down political criticism. Forgive me for being human, but I don't like or trust a woman who stays with a man who is physically cheating on her. I know that's not supposed to matter, but, to me, it goes to TRUST and CHARACTER.

Maybe I'm out of touch being in my 40s and living in a military and retired military environment. Perhaps we shouldn't care at all about our politician's behavior within their marriages, but it reveals other personal elements to their personas that I feel are important for a President to demonstrate.

I'll admit it. I just don't like the person HRC is - BUT - I also have to relent and admit that HRC IS A DAMN GOOD POLITICIAN. :shrug:

[EFerrari]

7. I don't want to start a flamewar (famous last words) but nothing she says

sounds genuine to me. And, she's not progressive. I don't see what the attraction is although I understand a lot of people would love to see a women in office. I've never been a Clinton groupie, maybe that's the problem. :shrug:

[Larkspur]

16. Agree with you. I was never wowed by the Clintons either

I put up with Bill because the Republicans in Congress were so bad, but Bill really screwed the Dems -- Gore and the Congressional Dems -- with his stupid sex affair. Despite all of Bill's supposed charisma, he could not help the Dems retake Congress.

[Donna Zen]

24. They never rebuilt the Dems---true

I'm not sure they even tried. Think about what happened to labor during the Clinton years. Oh, and then there's the effect of all of those crack-pot trade policies. I mean how can you say that you care about women and children while your sending American jobs overseas?

I don't trust Hillary Clinton with good reason; I read and think.

Defending Clinton against the wingnuts at work was one thing; I just did it. But when he pulled out the rug from under the Dems. with his stupidity, it pissed me right off.

When I was Little Rock, I got an education about Bill Clinton's sexual adventures. I was talking to hardcore Dems. and they were just laughing their heads off. Everyone knew that Bill ran around. What Sen. Clinton thought about it, doesn't haven't anything to do with how I think about her. I worry that she's given speeches to AIPAC, that as Juan Cole says, out-Sharron Sharron. This is very hawkish person, and one who is as secretive as our current WHouse. Personally, I don't believe that this is a choice that we need to make to clean up the bush mess. Sen. Clinton will never take on the investigation that needs to be done if we are to rejoin the world community. Too many people still believe in bush and this skewed version of events that the country has been feed. Sen. Clinton will never ever spend the first cent of political capital setting the record straight.

Finally, Sen. Clinton cares more about what the rightwing wants than the concerns of the base. She expects us to line up to vote for her no matter what. Personally, I'd rather hold the congress.

[Larkspur]

30. Hillary said that her model was ultra conservative Margaret Thatcher

just what we need another "Iron Lady".

[Forkboy]

31. Tell me you're kidding....please.

[Larkspur]

41. Nope, Here's the UK's Time Online article about Hillary being billed as America's Margaret Thatcher

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/article1294961.ece

[wyldwolf]

43. where does this say, "Hillary said that her model was ultra conservative Margaret Thatcher?"

:shrug:

[Larkspur]

55. The opening paragraph

HILLARY CLINTON is to be presented as America’s Margaret Thatcher as she tries to become the first woman to win the White House. As she entered the 2008 presidential race yesterday, a senior adviser said that her campaign would emphasise security, defence and personal strengths reminiscent of the Iron Lady.

The fact that a senior adviser to Hillary's campaign is comparing her to Margaret Thatcher is evidence that Hillary is using Thatcher as her model. I have not heard Hillary deny that Thatcher is her model since this came out in public.

[wyldwolf]

59. ummm... still don't see were Hillary said it... nope.... not there.

[Larkspur]

60. She didn't deny it, so she supports that comparison of herself to Thatcher

I love driving Clintonistas insane.

[wyldwolf]

61. LOL! ummm... still don't see were Hillary said it... nope.... not there.

[Larkspur]

50. And as far as Hillary being a strumpet for corporations, this picture speaks a 1,000 words

and none of those words are good for Hillary as a progressive.

[wyldwolf]

52. where does this say, "Hillary said that her model was ultra conservative Margaret Thatcher?"

[Donna Zen]

56. Thanks for the link

I'll read the article. However, I heard Terry McAuliffe say that Hillary would be like Thatcher. Unfortunately, I didn't grab the transcript and thus, stay away from mentioning it. The only time I brought it up the link!!! link!!! link!!! snipers attacked. Personally, I don't need a link; I know what I know...I've seen what I've seen...

The Hillary mean team wants everyone to shut up. Usually they call people "haters" thinking that name calling is all that it takes.

[wyldwolf]

42. no, she's not kidding, she's being dishonest.

[Larkspur]

48. Only Clintonistas, like yourself, are dishonest

[wyldwolf]

49. Then prove what you said is true. Your link doesn't contain what you claim it does

[MichiganVote]

9. Well then, using your logic, you should like *. Afterall, he has not covered up any past love

affairs that his spouse may have had. Course * has lied about a score of other things, things that are directly tied to public policy, money, wars etc.

The much lauded Eleanor Roosevelt covered up her husband's infidelities as did a number of other first wives. Are they good enough for the first lady title but not public office?

It is curious how a female presidential candidate who has presumably 'covered up' her husband's infidelities managed to serve in the senate and to be reelected to a second term. But, why waste time on that. Its only a public office afterall.

[ShortnFiery]

10. I'm sorry but that is how I believe. I've been married 25 years and if I would have had an "hint"

of my husband's infidelity, I would have hired a private investigator and later have divorced him.

I know that marriage is more than physical fidelity to most people, but to me, it's one of the top five most important factors.

Again, I'm sorry because I know that sounds "uncool" but I'm not a bad person. I just have certain values that I hold important. :shrug:

[MichiganVote]

17. Not trying to judge your values but to challenge the way in which you apply them to

a public service position. While I believe that infidelity can be a signal of a character flaw, that is not always the case. Even serial killers can follow a law or stop at red lights. Does that make them moral? No. However their illegal acts DO make them ineligible for public service.

I may not agree with how the wives of philanderers process and make their decisions about their lives. Frankly, I do think that your opinion minus facts suggests that Senator Clinton was without pain and suffering over the whole thing. Sort of harsh don't you think? Imagine your family is all over the press from sun up to sundown, you're raising a kid and by virtue of your public position you cannot avoid the public's scrutiny. Talk about inconvenient truths!

For HRC have gone beyond the 'blue dress' period, secure and maintain a public office, and see her daughter into adulthood strikes me as heroic, as opposed to immoral.

So the wife turned Senator turned the other cheek. Values? Character? Strength? Judgement?

Maybe you and HRC have more in common than you know. She too appears to have certain values that she holds important.

[ShortnFiery]

18. It's not the flaw. We all have personal flaws.

No, everyone has moments of challenge, and some marriages can be saved after the hurt and pain of physical infidelity. No, I have no right to judge "The Clinton's" marriage. Yes, I feel guilty for not liking her because I know that many marriages have one or other spouse that repeatedly strays. That doesn't make them immoral. I'm aware of that fact.

Again, it's a personal quirk since I'm so fiercely independent albeit in (you never know, but I hope) lifetime marriage, that I don't approve what seems to be "a pattern" within her and Bill's personal life. Yes, I know their personal life is their own.

I'm sorry, but it still troubles me. :shrug:

[MichiganVote]

22. I think the whole Clinton marital "pattern" is largely a myth perpetuated by the media. Sells papers

There are some thing I favor in Clinton and some things I don't. I favor a woman with power competing for the office. That's a bug consideration for me. However, I do feel uncomfortable with another pattern--that being the Bush-Clinton-Bush and well, Clinton....you get the idea.

Good talking to ya'.

[ShortnFiery]

23. Thanks MichiganVote, you may be correct.

Truth is, I have to search more inward - introspection - why I feel the way I do. It's embarrassing because I want to be objective. Guess it's time to take a step back and see how it all settles out. Thank you for not getting angry with me because I do come across as sort of staid, but I don't like nor mean to be "a prude"

Have a good one and thanks again. :-) :hi:

[MichiganVote]

58. Well, I think we have enough heat in the country just now...:) take care

[MGKrebs]

47. I divorced my wife after she strayed, but I don't apply that

standard to anyone else. There are circumstances where I would have tried to save that marriage, but as it happened it was untenable for me. The point being that every relationship is different and many things go into the decision about whether to continue or not.

[beaconess]

64. Just because that's what YOU think you would do (and no one really knows what they'd really do until

faced with the situation), doesn't mean that that would be the right choice for someone else. Relationships and marriages are very delicate and complicated things and everyone has to find their own way to handle their situations. Hillary Clinton made a choice to handle hers a certain way and seems fine with it. I don't think its up to me to judge her for it any more than it would be appropriate for her - or anyone else - to determine how I should handle my personal relationships.

[shimmergal]

65. It's not uncool; it's just unrealistic.

Actually, you never know how you'll react until you're faced with the situation. If you swear that you do, that you'd dump him, you're elevating abstract principle above your love for your spouse AND above whatever value the marriage has for you.

Believe me, I've been there. And I know that there are many worse things a husband and father can do than a simple affair. Not that we want them to know this--if your husband's listening, OF COURSE you want him to believe that an affair would mean instant divorce. When the chips are down, though, you may feel otherwise.

[Alamom]

8. Melinda Henneberger is a fruitcake who lied & spun stories about Al Gore

in 2000 (check Daily Howler Archives)

and also wrote these jewels.


http://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/22/opinion/22henneberger.html?ex=1184040000&en=43787b19f5dd3c44&ei=5070

Why Pro-Choice Is a Bad Choice for Democrats

By MELINDA HENNEBERGER
Published: June 22, 2007


http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6153640/site/newsweek/

Where’s the Morality?
By Melinda Henneberger
Newsweek
Updated: 5:27 p.m. CT Oct 1, 2004

On the Terri Schiavo Case - Oct. 1 - Note to the court: If I ever fall into a coma and my husband, after fathering two children with another woman, suddenly remembers that while watching TV one night I remarked, “Honey, if I am ever in a persistent vegetative state, be sure and pull the plug,’’ do not believe it.


http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9D01E4D61F39F930A35750C0A9669C8B63&sec=&spon=&pagewanted=2


THE 2000 CAMPAIGN: THE OTHER McCAIN; Unexpectedly, Cindy McCain Basks in a New Political Role
By MELINDA HENNEBERGER
Published: March 3, 2000

Henneberger thinks Cindy McCain, Mrs. John McCain is a wonderful person

[papau]

14. It doesn't matter that the author if the Hillary hit piece is an enemy of DU and most of our ideas

as long as she blasts Hillary she will find that part of DU is an approving audience.!

:-)

[Arugula Latte]

11. She seems phoney because she bends in the political wind.

Almost everything she says comes across as something she ran through a focus group.

[MGKrebs]

51. Why is that?

Is it because they are often not simple, direct statements? Do you have any specific examples that bother you? Is it possible that a lot of problems facing us are complicated and don't have simple, easy answers? If so, isn't the sophisticated answer actually being more honest than the easy sound bite answer?

[insanad]

63. The Great Chameleon and Shape Shifter

Perhaps my suspicions of Hilary Clinton are linked to some inherent turnoff at the path that powerful women seem to be compelled to take to reach their station, but I've not been a fan of her from the get go, regardless of her Democratic Loyalty. That seems to be the only thing (and Bill) that she seems to remain unwavering in. It's a broad assumption but I feel that people who are willing to deny, cover up, minimize, and otherwise lie through sins of omission are complicit in the crime. Sort of like enablers that buy their husbands the beer at the grocery store and then feel victimized when he gets sloshed and beats the hell out of them.

In some ways I believe Hilary has made a lifetime choice of enabling herself and even Bill for the "greater good" of what they both have to offer. Not that I'm without sin, but acknowledging ones culpabilities and working to overcome them seems more productive and honest than hiding and denying. I would have respected her more if she'd shown some courage and class in denouncing his stupid boorish wanderings, but still stood by him as a sign of her faith in his goodness. She took women back 50 years in her willingness to deny and hide his indiscretions, which is probably why he felt like he could get away with it from the get go. She is an enabler and in her ambitions for power and leadership, seems to be willing to change her "outfit" for whatever the latest trend in thought processes or political gain will get her. She'll buy the beer for the special interests and (initially supporting Bush's war} but then deny her own culpability in the beating that the American Soldiers and our reputation as a nation are taking.

I'm attaching my loyalties to Barack Obama and have great hope that he will be able to make a stained glass window out of the broken shards of glass that are our government. He seems to unify rather than polarize people. So many people dislike Hilary, not just because she's an ambitious woman, but because she does not seem sincere or honest and her actions or lack thereof confirm their suspicions.

[Evergreen Emerald]

13. They are attempting to glean her personality from 30 second sound bites

...created by a press who has for the last decade attempted to ruin her. Why are we not discussing the "authenticity" of any other candidate? This is a bunch of bull. Not one of them appears "authentic" in front of the camera. Do they want her to pick her nose and fart?

[papau]

15. LOL - I like your suggested means for proving you are "authentic" :-)

:-)

[LiberalFighter]

19. Wasn't there a piece within the last week or so about this same thing?

And it was questioned as to whether the extent of the interviews was sufficient to produced support for her theme?

[Tellurian]

21. Yes, they're having a contest to see who can post the same story..

line but not in the exact order of regurgitated words and not allowed the use of the same words from a previous story twice.

So far, DU'ers have First and Second Place covered! :hi:

[MasonJar]

20. The women I know here in Kentucky (except the 25% still Bushistas)

are excited about the prospect of a woman pres.

[wyldwolf]

28. The most telling line from the OP

The most appealing thing about Hillary Rodham Clinton has always been her enemies, who often seem not in their right mind

Yep! Quick check of DU confirms that.

[Alamom]

29. The author is against Pro-Choice for Dems. Her interviews may be a tad bit slanted.

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/22/opinion/22henneberger...

Why Pro-Choice Is a Bad Choice for Democrats

By MELINDA HENNEBERGER
Published: June 22, 2007






edit to add Hennebergers recent op-ed.

[ShortnFiery]

32. She's not Anti-Choice but attempting to state that there are "shades of gray"

and the right wing religious nut-cases are all too primed to use Abortion as a wedge issue. It's better to promote women's choice from a Family Planning, Birth Control first BUT keeping abortion legal and rare. If you qualify yourself then it's harder for the nut-balls to accuse us of "killing unborn babies." :shrug: Still, I don't care much for her headline but, in essence, she's not anti-choice. We need to be *Pro-Family Planning* for women so we can avoid the koolaid drinking right wing fundamentalists using abortion against Democrats.

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/22/opinion/22henneberger.html?pagewanted=2&ei=5070&en=43787b19f5dd3c44&ex=1184040000

"What are we to make of all this? Surely at a minimum that our enduring reluctance to acknowledge the complexity of the abortion issue has only prolonged and hardened the debate. Most Americans fall somewhere between the extremes of “never” and “no problem” when it comes to abortion.

What polling can’t capture and politicians won’t hear is the voice of the nun I interviewed who considers herself pro-choice — and has been disciplined by her diocese as a result — because she does not think abortion is wrong for rape victims. Or the voices of the many women I spoke to who hold far more expansive views yet call themselves pro-life. Most people differentiate between a fetus in the early weeks of development and at nearly full term, and draw the line at a procedure that Democratic Senator Pat Moynihan regarded as infanticide."

[Alamom]

33. I didn't get that.It reads black & white to me ..."a human rights issue comparable to slavery"

I don't have a problem with anyone's personal views. I know moderate & conservative Democrats who are mostly "Pro- Life". They are Democrats because they are not solidly conservative on other issues.
However, this journalist (?), after traveling around talking to all age, race & type women( sound familiar )is saying we lost votes due to this one issue and we will lose them again unless someone changes their stance. She states we can get them back with just this. Hardly any shades of gray in these statements. In reading several of her articles, she likes for her readers to think she speaks for a lot of other women and has all the answers.

YES, our candidates could do a lot of pandering and flip-flopping to get the votes of conservatives, possibly religious fundamentalist and others who normally don't vote for Democrats.

I think the Nominee will get the vote of a lot of people who have had enough of this republican regime without doing this and being hit with the title of flip-flopper and panderer by the more liberal.

Really, SNF. You can't have it both ways on this issue.



Hennerberger:
Over 18 months, I traveled to 20 states listening to women of all ages, races, tax brackets and points of view speak at length on the issues they care about heading into ’08. They convinced me that the conventional wisdom was wrong about the last presidential contest, that Democrats did not lose support among women because “security moms” saw President Bush as the better protector against terrorism. What first-time defectors mentioned most often was abortion.


Why would that be, given that Roe v. Wade was decided almost 35 years ago? Opponents of abortion rights saw 2004 as the chance of a lifetime to overturn Roe, with a movement favorite already in the Oval Office and several spots on the Supreme Court likely to open up. A handful of Catholic bishops spoke out more plainly than in any previous election season and moved the Catholic swing vote that Al Gore had won in 2000 to Mr. Bush.

The standard response from Democratic leaders has been that anyone lost to them over this issue is not coming back — and that regrettable as that might be, there is nothing to be done. But that is not what I heard from these voters.

>

But in a recent New York Times/CBS News poll, 41 percent of respondents favored stricter limits on abortion, with an additional 23 percent saying it should not be permitted at all.

>
What would it take to win them back? Respect, for starters — and not only on the right of the candidate forum on faith. As it turns out, you cannot call people extremists and expect them to vote for you. But real respect would require an understanding that what supporters of abortion rights genuinely see as a hard-earned freedom, opponents genuinely see as a self-inflicted wound and — though I can feel some of you tensing as you read this — a human rights issue comparable to slavery.






edsp

[ShortnFiery]

34. Ok, but in order to bring in people who feel those "shades of gray" we should be willing to

stress the "Family Planning" as an emphasis more so than highlighting abortion with the term "Pro-Choice." Terminology and semantics are very important on these highly emotionally charged issues. I hope that we can agree that with all working correctly, abortion would be legal but truly rare? :shrug:

[Alamom]

39. I believe that message has been sent....eom

edsp

[bonito]

35. She has more advertising dollars supporting her campaign

A corporate product few are buying.

[SaveElmer]

38. Author made hay trashing Al Gore in 2000...

http://dailyhowler.com/h101600_1.shtml

http://216.239.51.104/custom?q=cache:VlyXNjmzzzkJ:www.dailyhowler.com/dh041305.shtml+melinda+henneberger+husband&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=8&gl=us

http://www.dailyhowler.com/h080599_2.shtml

[progressoid]

40. ....umm....some men feel that way too.

[slampoet]

44. Can somebody explain anything she has done for Women who aren't White and/or College Grads?

Honest question. No snarks.

And BTW the attempt at healthcare doesn't count.
(If it's universal healthcare you can't sell it as a women only issue, nor should you.)

[wyldwolf]

46. sure

... for single mothers and low income families, she worked on a major Clinton administration child-care initiative, a huge federal-state children's health insurance program, and adoption. The Clinton administration program to guarantee free immunizations for poor and uninsured children, passed in 1993, was crafted in Hillary Clinton's office.

[shimmergal]

66. wyldwolf, could you give

some more details about the work done by her office toward the new adoption law? I'm not wanting to argue about it, rather to have the info. in hand for any discussions that may come up.

(Two of my grandchildren are adopted, and the Clinton law made the process infinitely more workable.)

[PBass]

45. IMO a whole lot of women would turn out for Hillary, including a lot of new voters.

A lot of women voters would see this election as a historic chance to break down a barrier, even if it is a symbolic barrier.

I don't trust polls sometimes... how do you know the question was framed fairly? How does Hillary's "authenticity" stats compare with every other candidate (I bet it's similar).

I think the whole "authenticity" thing is a crock of crap, invented by spin doctors. And I think the whole "Hillary can't win" thing is a bunch of bullshit. She can definitely win. Anyway, don't let the "electability" issue steer you. It totally screwed up the party in 2004, when the pundits told everyone that Dean couldn't win (and he definitely could have won). So instead we got Kerry, who was a much-less interesting candidate (IMO). Vote your conscience, not the Vegas line.

[MGKrebs]

53. Memo from Mark Penn:

As observers like Charlie Cook have pointed out, Hillary has the coalition of support (women, strong Democrats, lower, middle-income and working families, Hispanics and African-Americans) that has traditionally won Democratic primaries...."

Hillary's support is highest among key voter groups who make up the core of the Democratic coalition: women, Hispanics, African-Americans, strong Democrats and lower, middle-income and working families. Her lead in the Democratic primary widens to 29 points among non-whites. The latest Gallup and CBS polls confirm the extraordinary enthusiasm for Hillary among women, Hispanics and African-Americans. And according to another recent Gallup poll, Hillary has a 22 point lead over her closest competitor among those who earn less than $50,000 per year.

Every major poll shows Hillary's lead increasing in the Democratic primary. In the Real Clear Politics average of recent polls, Hillary has a 14.3 percentage point lead, a widening of 5.5 percentage points in the last 3 weeks.


http://www.hillaryclinton.com/news/release/view/?id=2340

And from the internal link there:

Clinton's widest leads over Obama are with women, seniors, those living in low- and middle-income households, and the non-college educated. Obama performs best with high socioeconomic groups and among those with more independent leanings, including young Democrats.

Only with "Democrats" who aren't really Democrats, but independents who lean toward the Democratic Party, as well as with college educated and upper-income Democrats, is Clinton's current hegemony challenged (though not usurped). Among these groups, Obama roughly ties with Clinton as the preferred candidate.

http://www.galluppoll.com/content/?ci=27676&pg=1

[Larkspur]

54. So college educated Dems, like me, are not considered "real Dems" by union busting Mark Penn

Penn is another reason not to trust Hillary.

[MGKrebs]

57. I think you mis-read that.

The "not real" Dems comment I believe is referring to independents who may lean Dem. If those people decline to refer to themselves as Dems, it seems justifiable for the rest of us to not consider them real Dems.

Then it says 'AS WELL AS" college educated etc. In other words, there are 3 categories where Obama challenges for demographic preference: Dem leaning independents, college educated Dems, and upper income Dems.

[beaconess]

62. This is such bullshit - are men polled about whether the male candidates are "authentic?"