Ship of Fools: A liberal journalist stows away on a National Review neocon cruise

[Douglas Carpenter]

This is an absolutely precious and priceless article. And I encourage everyone to read the whole thing:

link to full article:

http://news.independent.co.uk/world/americas/article2766040.ece

"Ship of fools: Johann Hari sets sail with America's swashbuckling neocons
The Iraq war has been an amazing success, global warming is just a myth – and as for Guantanamo Bay, it's practically a holiday camp... The annual cruise organized by the 'National Review', mouthpiece of right-wing America, is a parallel universe populated by straight-talking, gun-toting, God-fearing Republicans.

By Johann Hari - Published: 13 July 2007



I am standing waist-deep in the Pacific Ocean, both chilling and burning, indulging in the polite chit-chat beloved by vacationing Americans. A sweet elderly lady from Los Angeles is sitting on the rocks nearby, telling me dreamily about her son. "Is he your only child?" I ask. "Yes," she says. "Do you have a child back in England?" she asks. No, I say. Her face darkens. "You'd better start," she says. "The Muslims are breeding. Soon, they'll have the whole of Europe."

I am getting used to these moments – when gentle holiday geniality bleeds into... what? I lie on the beach with Hillary-Ann, a chatty, scatty 35-year-old Californian designer. As she explains the perils of Republican dating, my mind drifts, watching the gentle tide. When I hear her say, " Of course, we need to execute some of these people," I wake up. Who do we need to execute? She runs her fingers through the sand lazily. "A few of these prominent liberals who are trying to demoralize the country," she says. "Just take a couple of these anti-war people off to the gas chamber for treason to show, if you try to bring down America at a time of war, that's what you'll get." She squints at the sun and smiles. " Then things'll change." "

snip:"Now that this barrier has been broken – everyone agrees the Muslims are devouring the French, and everyone agrees it's funny – the usual suspects are quickly rounded up. Jimmy Carter is "almost a traitor". John McCain is "crazy" because of "all that torture". One of the Park Avenue ladies declares that she gets on her knees every day to " thank God for Fox News". As the wine reaches the Floridian, he announces, "This cruise is the best money I ever spent."

They rush through the Rush-list of liberals who hate America, who want her to fail, and I ask them – why are liberals like this? What's their motivation? They stutter to a halt and there is a long, puzzled silence. " It's a good question," one of them, Martha, says finally. I have asked them to peer into the minds of cartoons and they are suddenly, reluctantly confronted with the hollowness of their creation. "There have always been intellectuals who want to tell people how to live," Martha adds, to an almost visible sense of relief. That's it – the intellectuals! They are not like us. Dave changes the subject, to wash away this moment of cognitive dissonance. "The liberals don't believe in the constitution. They don't believe in what the founders wanted – a strong executive," he announces, to nods. A Filipino waiter offers him a top-up of his wine, and he mock-whispers to me, "They all look the same! Can you tell them apart?" I stare out to sea. How long would it take me to drown?"

link to full article:

http://news.independent.co.uk/world/americas/article2766040.ece

A version of this article has appeared in 'The New Republic' (www.tnr.org)
My thinks to Richard Silverstein for mentioning this piece on his blog where I first learned about it: http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/

link to full article:

http://news.independent.co.uk/world/americas/article2766040.ece

.

[mohinoaklawnillinois]

1. I read this article this morning.

Parts of it are absolutely hilarious and chilling at the same time.
K & R

[Douglas Carpenter]

29. hilarious and chilling describes it quite well

and I would guess that people with view like this are definitely in the minority, but hardly and an insignificant minority considering the power their worldview exercises

[WCGreen]

44. Yea but they got money and access....

That's the chilling part...

[Douglas Carpenter]

202. indeed chilling it is

[Douglas Carpenter]

209. /

[Douglas Carpenter]

216. /

[richards1052]

46. Thanks Doug for crediting my blog for alerting you to the Independent article

I thought is was alternately hilarious & scary beyond belief.

My only consolation is it looks like these people are going to be in the political wilderness for some time, esp. if George Bush keeps messing up as he has been. Bush reminds me of Pharoah in the Book of Exodus who keeps hardening his heart about liberating the Jewish slaves. Though I don't wish the death of a single American soldier--the longer Bush maintains this pig headed failed strategy the more likely we win the White House & possibly increase our Congressional majorities.

[Douglas Carpenter]

48. sure thing Richard...you have a great blog

http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam /

[Douglas Carpenter]

205. /

[Douglas Carpenter]

210. /

[calimary]

62. Welcome to DU! Glad you're here!

Your comparison sounds pretty spot-on - bush as the hapless Pharoah who just refused to give up, insisting he had the divine right to steer his country into infamy and his military into the Red Sea. He wound up being the Pet Goat of that era, didn't he? bush, I think, is headed down the same sewer pipe.

I swear - EVERY day he makes me feel prouder and prouder that I doubted him so strongly. Remember MP George Galloway ripping smarmy normy coleman a new one during that Senate hearing when he was purportedly to be led to the slaughter? And he turned it around on that blank-faced, frozen-stiff bush apologist by saying "everything I said about Iraq turned out to be right and everything YOU said turned out to be wrong, and some 100,000 people paid with their lives, including (at the time) some 16-hundred American troops." Or words to that effect. I have this intense and increasing sense of the Galloway Syndrome, as I think most people here have for a long time now - 'cause we WERE correct and the bad guys were WRONG. And the majorities in America who have finally started to wake up and come to their senses now feel the same.

[Raksha]

150. Welcome to DU, Richard! I read the "Ship of Fools" article

last night after it had been been posted on another forum I frequent, but I want you to know I bookmarked your blog. You seem to cover everything Jewish and progressive, and I was looking for something that advocates for Tikkun Olam. I'm already a subscriber to Michael Lerner's Tikkun magazine and a big fan of his, but the movement needs ALL the help it can get to fight the entrenched power of Podhoretz et al. NOT a pretty picture of the Jewish neocons in that "Ship of Fools" article! In fact, Podhoretz sounds downright delusional.

[poverlay]

50. Seems to me these people are around 30 percent of this country. Not an insignificant number. What

is the population of America? 300 million-ish, give or take I believe. That puts the wackjobs at damn near 100,000,000. 100 MILLION???! That's a lot of unread books, unfaced facts, and pure unadulterated hatred...

[Douglas Carpenter]

59. yeah, I would guess somewhere between 25% and 30% of Americans

share similar views. Just take a look at the bestseller list on Amazon Some of the crazy nut case stuff there sounds straight out of 1930's Germany at least in its mentality.

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/new-for-you/top-sellers/-/books/11079/books/2/ref=pd_hn_ts_b/002-0111505-2227272

Also some polls regarding civil liberties are scary. According to one major poll 27% of American think Muslim-American should be required to register with the federal government:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6729916/

.

[pokercat999]

68. And enough people for their own country. JESUSLAND

Lets give em AZ, NM, TX, OK, NE, CO and UT and maybe a small bit of SoCal so they have access to the Pacific. They could build fences and walls on all their borders and live happy lives worshiping nonexistent gods and abusing their offspring. We could make America the country our founders could never envision. Free of hate with real equality and justice. Words that are a sour joke in todays amerika.
:hippie:

[mwb970]

79. I do wish these fools would somehow Go Away.

But I guess it's not in the cards. Reading this article made me deeply sad about America. With ignorant, foolish people like this holding so much power, how will our nation ever emerge from the cesspool the right wing has sunk us into?

What are we normal people supposed to do? Go to another country? Start our own enclave somewhere with no right-wing wackos allowed in? I really don't see any hope for the American Experiment. It looks to me like it has failed.

[glitch]

160. Pray for their Rapture. Even if you don't believe in God. I know I do. :) nt

[Patriot Abroad]

213. check the current signs at:

http://www.raptureready.org

[XemaSab]

122. Like hell....

Some of us LIKE AND ENJOY those states....

I think we should round them up and put them on the rez... Nevada, Oklahoma, the Dakotas, and parts of the desert in California would be particularly suitable...

[YOY]

137. Give them Vegas???

Hell no, and no Rushmore or Grand Canyon Either. (Give em North Dakota and Oklahoma...)

[roxnev]

152. no

Most fun city on the earth They would fuck it up give them Utah

[XemaSab]

174. Give them Vegas

a la The Stand. :D

[poverlay]

142. I'm going to have to take umbrage with AZ, and maybe NM and CO. They are way too

beautiful for those freaks. Utah too. It would be hard work, but we might have to empty it too. Put them all in Texas and let them have their wall...

[vietnam_war_vet]

155. Please not New Mexico!!

There are a lot of progressive, intelligent, critically thinking folks here in the Land of Enchantment. ;-) -- Michael

[Douglas Carpenter]

185. yeah, Sante Fe has that reputation

maybe they just need to be treated

[verdalaven]

183. Hey there, I grew up in AZ

I vote to NOT give up that state to the neocons. Besides, there are more liberals there than you'd think.

How about Washington ST, Idaho, Montana, S. and N. Dakota, UT and NE?

Hehehe, oh never mind, it is too early in the morning to divvy up the US. I have to go to work. :)

[pokercat999]

184. HMMMM, after all the replies I can see this

separate but equal BS isn't going to work here either. It would cost a lot; but is the technology available to build man-made islands that would realistically hold 100M (I hate to use this word) people?

[peacetalksforall]

116. Child minds that believe that others know what is good/better for them

combined with fear of the world outside their State combined with need to believe in U.S. superiority, therefore, their superiority combined with a propensity to fear, leading into hate - despite the Bible and what others taught Jesus was all about.

The entities that rule them are fine -

the Federalist Society whose members are replacing our Constitution
the Reverends who must teach the evil in the Bible
in the wrong way

[astroBspacedog]

112. Want to read a hilarious book ?

Republican Like Me --- infiltrating red state, white ass, and blue suit America.

Written by Harmon Leon,
Prometheus Books,
www.prometheusbooks.com

"Harmon is insane, hysterical and after reading about all the lunatics he's ripped apart in this book, -- I hope bulletproof."
---- Dan Bova, Executive Editor of Stuff Magazine

Remember the book, "Black Like Me"? This is a book about a Northern Californian who cut his dread locks, invested in some square attire, then dove into the Kool-Aid for at least a year or two. This book made me laugh so hard I'd have to put it down once in a while to get my breath back.

Even some of the chapter titles crack me up.

My Dinner at Applebee's with White Supremacists!
Jokes about Those Traitors Who Love Jerry Lewis ---- The French
How to be a Christian Ventriloquist

"One might also say my mission is like that of Jane Goodall, living among the chimps, but that would be insulting to the chimps. My subject is much more savage and, in some cases, much hairier (especially around the knuckle region)."
Harmon Leon

[EVDebs]

169. LOL, great review, astroBspacedog ! nt

[tblue]

2. I would've jumped overboard.

Printing it out so I can read it in entire. Thanks for the link!

[rockymountaindem]

3. Wow. Those people are nuts

And the worst part is that their scions (like Podhoretz) still get treated like experts by the media.

[dugggy]

4. I woulda loved that cruise

But then I have'nt met a cruise I did not like LOL.

Most ships have 14 bars and 5 restaurants including 24
hour buffets with food better than what Queen of England
eats everyday. I would just skip all the meeting halls
where the RWers are blowing hot air. Also there always
are the swimming pools, hot tubs, movie theater, library,
massage therapy, miniature golf, beds made 3 times a day, with chocolates on the pillow before nightfall.

[Douglas Carpenter]

182. yeah, cruises are great

and the 24 hour night life and the endless amounts of excellent food all included in the fare. And taking your hotel room a long with you is certainly convenient.

I suppose if one could keep a sense of humor about the whole thing.

[dugggy]

194. Yes, and the ship is large enough to avoid any group on the ship

whom you dont care for. We have not taken any other
vacation in 17 years after we discovered what a bargain
a cruise vacation is. Fine dining, room, and good
entertainment included in one reasonable price. If we
had to pay all these items separately, we could'nt
afford a vacation of this quality.

[Douglas Carpenter]

195. yeah and a 7 day cruise for less than 7 nights in a 5-Star hotel

not a bad deal

if one is interested in a political cruise on the progressive end of the spectrum salon.com has had them before and The Nation has one annually

link for the Nation's cruise: http://www.nationcruise.com/

--------

Hey, I have an idea, how about a DU Cruise?

:bounce: :toast: :wtf:

[Stevepol]

5. Rec #5. This is what we get when the American people no longer decide

who their leaders will be. If the vote were counted fairly, these people would be underground and nobody would even be worried about them.

Until the "liberals" and "greens" and "independents" can face up to the fact of fraudulent elections, these are the kind of people who will keep coming out of the woodwork.

[mod mom]

26. The Dems silence on the fraudulent elections has worked like enablers.

Every single day, I can't believe we have to live another second with these criminals in power.

[The Count]

190. and we still have to hear how "bush was reelected". In US and in the world!

[ProudDad]

55. Excuse me but it was the Greens

who filed suit against the fraudulent election in '04 in Ohio...

It's the Centrist Dems who chickened out in 2000 and again in 2004...

Don't blame Greens or Independents or Liberals...

[YvonneCa]

180. The Glibs...

...Green Party and Libertarian Party...and I was there. :7

[ProudDad]

215. Right ON!!!

To the Barricades! :bounce:

[The Count]

83. Best comment to this! It's the root of it all evil: lack of democracy.

Everything else - war, torture, corruption arises from it. Yet the 2004 theft is still kept a polite secret.

[dickbearton]

135. Quite right, exactly!

[thereismore]

6. It's D'Souza again! read:

Yes, they concede, we are fighting another Vietnam; and this time we won't let the weak-kneed liberals lose it. "It's customary to say we lost the Vietnam war, but who's 'we'?" the writer Dinesh D'Souza asks angrily. "The left won by demanding America's humiliation." On this ship, there are no Viet Cong, no three million dead. There is only liberal treachery. Yes, D'Souza says, in a swift shift to domestic politics, "of course" Republican politics is "about class. Republicans are the party of winners, Democrats are the party of losers."

[mitchum]

39. I see that Gunga Dim is still..dim

[dugggy]

199. now now ...that sounds racists...no place for that on DU

[The Count]

84. Republican politics is about class - important words that we need to throw back

at them whenever they blab about "elitism" and "class war".
On this cruise they show their red ass - and it's not always dementia. This was a candid, sentient important statement: Republicans are for the rich people out to steal from everyone else. It merits repeating. I shall make myself a signature of this.

[Zorro]

156. What kind of 'Murikan name is Dinesh?

Sounds like the name of a Pakistani terrorist to me.

[The Count]

191. sounds like a non-monotheistic heathen to me (you know, the kind you boo

in the senate!)

[Douglas Carpenter]

203. .

[Alamom]

7. Very thought provoking. Thank you. eom

[madfloridian]

8. Terrifying..."we need to execute some of these people"...liberals.

"I am getting used to these moments – when gentle holiday geniality bleeds into... what? I lie on the beach with Hillary-Ann, a chatty, scatty 35-year-old Californian designer. As she explains the perils of Republican dating, my mind drifts, watching the gentle tide. When I hear her say, " Of course, we need to execute some of these people," I wake up. Who do we need to execute? She runs her fingers through the sand lazily. "A few of these prominent liberals who are trying to demoralise the country," she says. "Just take a couple of these anti-war people off to the gas chamber for treason to show, if you try to bring down America at a time of war, that's what you'll get." She squints at the sun and smiles. " Then things'll change."

[Chulanowa]

20. I laugh at this sort of thing - more of a rueful chuckle, really

So many on the right seem to picture we liberals as flappy-handed 90-pound sissies who would be utterly defenseless against any sort of aggression - be it foreign needing "strong conservatives to defend them" or their (not so secret) favorite idea of roughing us up, perhaps "killing a few"

Almost every liberal I know, personally, has this well-tended ferocious side just waiting for someone to do something very stupid to them. yes, right-wingers, do try to "round a few of them liberals up". I don't think the cowards of the right will be very happy with the response that wins them.

[loudsue]

32. "Conservatives" only go after "liberals" in gangs, when the liberal is alone.

They do this to the black people, and they do it to gays, and whenever they get the opportunity, they do it to liberals. More than one of them vs. ONE black, gay, or liberal of any stripe. They're just so fucked up. And they're the worst kind of cowards.

:kick::kick::kick:

[lefador]

63. I don't laugh...

Because it is the right-wingers who always try to frame liberalism as some sort synonym for violent extremism, yet it is always a right winger who advocates publicly for violence or death. I am getting tired that Ann Coulter can say in public how she wished the whole NY Times editorial would have been blown up and yet she is still embraced as a "pundit."

I am sick that people still use a bunch of jackasses who were robbing banks and got some filthy heiress under a severe case of Stockholm syndrome as the ad-hominem example/argument of liberals gone wild. Yet, they conveniently forget that it has been right wingers gone rogue who have brought the largest acts of terrorist attacks from McVeigh's blowing up the federal building in OK, all the lynchings and murders that victimized people of color and civil rights activist for so many years, all the way to the Bath Township massacre in the 20s where some asshole right winger got pissed of with having to pay taxes to fund the school so he decided to blow up the whole building. Funny how right wingers are afraid of liberals as if we were walking ticking time bombs, but it has always been liberals who have managed to do all the dying: Huey Long, JFK, RFK, MLK...

I am even sick and tired that these assholes get to frame the word "liberal" as some sort of insult, and no one of the so called liberal pundits calls them on it. It gets a bit old when some GOP asshole gets to frame the debate as if liberals are trying to bring forth the second coming of Stalin's purges. Yet they get their feathers all raffled up if anyone dares bring the fact that Hitler, Mussolini, a big chunk of the death squads in South America, Pinochet, the Argentinean Junta, Somoza, Batista, Franco, and heck even Mr. Osama bin Landen himself all have something in common: they are all ultra-conservative ideologues.

Liberals tend to care for the well being of everyone, conservatives -at least whatever passes for conservative these days in this country- are just concerned with their own shit. Funny how we turned out be the bad guys because we want such unchristian things like Peace, Justice, Equality, Health, advancement of our achievements as a society, preservation of the beauty around us so our children's great grandchildren can enjoy our beautiful earth, sustainable futures, clean industries so that we don't shit in the well where we drink from, etc. etc. etc.

And yet we are still wasting our time with people who if given a chance they would not hesitate in eliminate us, and I am not thinking about a figurative sense of elimination, these people and I am not talking about a fringe group of them from my experience... would like nothing less than having a bunch of us expired.

And yet, somehow... when they are the ones advocating for our violent elimination... we are the extremists.
Somehow we are the people lacking conscience because we love our fellow humans.
Somehow we are the ones that hate America because we want to preserve its beauty, because want to preserve the health of its people, because we want to have everyone to have a nice start in life, a chance to educate and become a complete human being, because we don't want to have poverty anywhere in this country.
Somehow we advocate to have the right to privacy, to do as we please in our bedroom between two consenting adults, because everyone should be free to worship to whom they want to and should not forced if they don't want to worship anyone or anything, because we believe that it's more important to have a kid not going to be hungry than having some rich asshole buying yet another luxury yatch, because we believe that everyone should contribute to the full extent of their abilities and should receive to the full extent of their needs, because we want all those things we love big government.

So no it is not funny anymore, I am sick and tired of having to deal with people who feel that it is OK to insult me because of my political beliefs. Yet I have to be polite, understanding and trying to establish a dialogue with people who will never listen, will never bother to learn, and whose only drive in life is to screw me and piss on me. This country was built on a relative sense of enlightenment, the founding fathers were less than perfect... however they were for the most part thinking and progressive men (with serious caveats, mostly due to the limitations of their historical context). And I refuse to have the knuckle draggers bring down the level of discourse even further, I refuse to have to apologize to mental midgets and try to accept their mental laziness. Sorry, being part of the human race has a set of requirements, amongst them using your brain. If you don't want to do that, just go back to the swamp and marry your cousin and have unnatural sex acts with swamp creatures... just fuck off and leave us alone, and don't dare tell us how to conduct our business. It'll be a cold day in hell when I need to take civility lessons from a knuckle dragger too afraid to fight a real war yet to eager to bring harm -always trough a proxy or a mob as they are too weak to do it on their won- to those who can't o won't fight back.

I am tired of this shit... I am tired of people who feel that it is somehow OK to lay on a pool and nonchalantly advocate for the dead of my peers.

[XemaSab]

125. Well put

:patriot:

[Roland99]

128. You have put forth so eloquently blunt what all of us up here know but yet

it seems there's almost nothing we can do about it. As long as the media is owned by those right-wingers and the American masses are subjected to the likes of Conservative News Network, MSRNC, FOX Noise, etc. there is almost no hope.

I keep waiting for the day that Soros funds a true news network and gives the American public its first glimpse w/o a filter.

[Mythsaje]

146. This deserves its own thread.

Excellent.

[LongTomH]

147. Well said, Sir!

And a hearty "Right On!"

[ninkasi]

153. Wonderful post...

I'm sick and tired of them, too. It's not enough for them to have enormous wealth, it's the feeling they have that along with having everything they want, they're only happy when others are suffering. They're sadists.

[libodem]

158. Welcome to DU

Now, that's just good, thinkin' and writin'! Nice to meet you. :)

[Libby2]

167. Applause, applause, very well said.

[DBoon]

165. All they need is covert sanction

some encouragement and funding from above, plus protection against prosecution and you will see something very ugly emerge in this country

[ellisonz]

64. The old stab in the back myth re-packaged and re-sold...

Post-war reactions and reflections

Conservatives, nationalists and ex-military leaders began to speak critically about the peace and Weimar politicians, socialists, communists, and Jews were viewed with suspicion due to their extra-national loyalties. It was rumored that they had not supported the war and had played a role in selling out Germany to its enemies. These November Criminals, or those who seemed to benefit from the newly formed Weimar Republic, were seen to have "stabbed them in the back" on the home front, by either criticizing German nationalism, instigating unrest and strikes in the critical military industries or profiteering. In essence the accusation was that the accused committed treason against the "benevolent and righteous" common cause.

These theories were given credence by the fact that when Germany surrendered in November 1918, its armies were still in French and Belgian territory. Not only had the German Army been in enemy territory the entire time on the Western Front, but on the Eastern Front, Germany had already won the war against Russia, concluded with the Treaty of Brest-Litovsk. In the West, Germany had come close to winning the war with the Spring Offensive. Contributing to the Dolchstoßlegende, its failure was blamed on strikes in the arms industry at a critical moment of the offensive, leaving soldiers without an adequate supply of materiel. The strikes were seen to be instigated by treasonous elements, with the Jews taking most of the blame. This overlooked Germany's strategic position and ignored how the efforts of individuals were somewhat marginalized on the front, since the belligerents were engaged in a new kind of war. The industrialization of war had dehumanized the process, and made possible a new kind of defeat which the Germans suffered as a total war emerged.

Nevertheless, this social mythos of domestic betrayal resonated among its audience, and its claims would codify the basis for public support for the emerging Nazi Party, under a racialist-based form of nationalism. The anti-Semitism was intensified by the Bavarian Soviet Republic, a Communist government which ruled the city of Munich for two weeks before being crushed by the Freikorps militia. Many of the Bavarian Soviet Republic's leaders were Jewish, a fact that allowed anti-Semitic propagandists to make the connection with "Communist treason".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dolchstosslegende

[grace0418]

99. When I read that I thought to myself "That's funny. I was *just* thinking how

it's a shame that cruise ship didn't sink and the only survivors were the author and the minority crew that 'all looks the same'." But it would be wrong to wish for that. :eyes:

[Douglas Carpenter]

9. please keep this kicked for awhile

I think its such a great article that all of us can enjoy and be illuminated by.

link to full article:

http://news.independent.co.uk/world/americas/article2766040.ece

.

[Douglas Carpenter]

200. /

[thereismore]

10. OMG what cognitive dissonance! A black man defends KKK, has no compassion for Katrina victims!

[ProudDad]

56. Connelly is the worst of the worst

He used and worked and finagled affirmative action to become a millionaire

and now he's pulling up the ladder so no one else can follow him...

The worst kind of race traitor is our ward connelly...

[mcking]

123. Stockholm syndrome carried to its logical conclusion

I don't think that man even realizes he's black any more.

[BornagainDUer]

159. Finally we have found the chicken who would vote for Colonel Sanders.

[MrMickeysMom]

198. But, he managed to be the single black man on board!

Can you imagine how desparate was his need to be accepted in the club? (or maybe he was under cover, too?)

This is the darkest and crreepiest of humor... as bizarre as Fear and Loathing HST!

[tblue37]

11. K&R

[AlCzervik]

12. printing it out now. Thank you!

[proud patriot]

13. I apologise , I could read about half of the article

I think I would have bailed out or something ..

[Lochloosa]

27. I think I left about the same time you did.

[AntiFascist]

14. One thing can be said about the pharmaceutical industry....

soon right-wingers will be so out of it that they won't be able to run anything, including their own lives.

[Douglas Carpenter]

16. when Fox News is too liberal and Rich Lowry and William F. Buckley sound like voices of reason

And they are on a cruise where everyone thinks they have lost it:

""Aren't you embarrassed by the absence of these weapons?" Buckley snaps at Podhoretz. He has just explained that he supported the war reluctantly, because Dick Cheney convinced him Saddam Hussein had WMD primed to be fired. "No," Podhoretz replies. "As I say, they were shipped to Syria. During Gulf War I, the entire Iraqi air force was hidden in the deserts in Iran." He says he is "heartbroken" by this " rise of defeatism on the right." He adds, apropos of nothing, "There was nobody better than Don Rumsfeld. This defeatist talk only contributes to the impression we are losing, when I think we're winning." The audience cheers Podhoretz. The nuanced doubts of Bill Buckley leave them confused. Doesn't he sound like the liberal media? Later, over dinner, a tablemate from Denver calls Buckley "a coward". His wife nods and says, " Buckley's an old man," tapping her head with her finger to suggest dementia. "

"The panel nods, but it doesn't want to stray from Iraq. Robert Bork, Ronald Reagan's one-time nominee to the Supreme Court, mumbles from beneath low-hanging jowls: "The coverage of this war is unbelievable. Even Fox News is unbelievable. You'd think we're the only ones dying. Enemy casualties aren't covered. We're doing an excellent job killing them."

Then, with a judder, the panel runs momentarily aground. Rich Lowry, the preppy, handsome 38-year-old editor of National Review, says, "The American public isn't concluding we're losing in Iraq for any irrational reason. They're looking at the cold, hard facts." The Vista Lounge is, as one, perplexed. Lowry continues, "I wish it was true that, because we're a superpower, we can't lose. But it's not."

No one argues with him. They just look away, in the same manner that people avoid glancing at a crazy person yelling at a bus stop. Then they return to hyperbole and accusations of treachery against people like their editor. The ageing historian Bernard Lewis – who was deputed to stiffen Dick Cheney's spine in the run-up to the war – declares, "The election in the US is being seen by as a victory on a par with the collapse of the Soviet Union. We should be prepared for whatever comes next." This is why the guests paid up to $6,000. This is what they came for. They give him a wheezing, stooping ovation and break for coffee. "

link to full article:

http://news.independent.co.uk/world/americas/article2766040.ece

.

[The Count]

81. "We are doing an excellent job killing them" - I wanted all the casualties covered too

but for the opposite reason. leave it to Bork to be fully demented, the opposite of reason!

[nolabels]

102. Of course, by Robert Bork's projected opinion that the outrageously liberal Fox News...........

is also doing a terrible job not highlighting and celebrating all those natives that have been killed in Iraq.


It's no wonder these folks also hate poor people, you get to notice some of the more well seasoned people who lived through harder times in them poor neighborhoods are quick to shut out the trash talkers who can't back up their words with the same kind of action. Not that i agree with violence or gravitate to it but do know on the street the purposeful quiet types get from point A to B more often.

The body follows the mind, the weak and ugly find misery is served up best in like company. I don't find much of any of this enlightening, mostly see it as a disappointment on how unworthy they are at actually being an a real adversary. Of course that too should seem par for the course :shrug:

[mitchum]

104. For the past several years, I have been noticing Buckley's changed public role in...

the conservative movement.
The whole time that I was growing up, Buckley, through his TV appearances, was THE public face of conservatism. However, after the republicans "remade" themselves as "the party of regular folks", Buckley was swept off the stage. His country club elite manner certainly is an ill fit with the ruse that the republicans have been working on the Yahoos. And it is indeed a ruse.

[AlCzervik]

15. holy Shite, i just finsihed reading the whole thing--Wow! That line Hannity uses

all the time on the air "the Wmd's were shipped to Syria!" well Podhoretz says the same thing with one big difference---"As I say, they were shipped to Syria. During Gulf War I, the entire Iraqi air force was hidden in the deserts in Iran" Gee i guess Hannity didn't get that memo yet. these people are out of their minds.

[Patriot Abroad]

214. Does anyone know the truth to that rumor?

I remember the MSM telling us that Iraq's air force fled to Iran, which at the time would have been the equivalent of a Catholic Bishop taking up residence in a mosque . . .

I suppose it's all irrelevant anyway, after 16 years they'd have trouble getting any of them off the ground; and the planes weren't exactly new at the time anyway.

[muntrv]

17. Where's an iceberg when you need one?

By the way, here's another group to add to the Iraqi surge.:evilgrin:

[fencesitter]

193. After the ship hits the iceburg....

and the last few survivors are pulled from the water 2 days later, "What took you guys so long to rescue us?" "Sorry, budjet cuts on the coast guard you knw, all the funds are being diverted overseas t o fight that war in Iraq."

-or-
Sorry, the coast guard has been privatized.

[Sarah Ibarruri]

18. Have you noticed that the only minorities Repukes hire, are those that hate their own and themselves

D'souza, Ward Connerly, etc. The message being loud and clear: "Only whites are good, right, and deserving. The rest are scum, and here are these minorities that will tell you so."

[AlCzervik]

19. Connerly and his empathy for the Klan, just unreal.

[mwb970]

80. Homophobic gays, misogynist women, racist blacks.

So many emotionally disturbed hypocrites. So many perverts. So many crooks. So many liars.

I am so sick of Republicans I could scream.

[mitchum]

106. That is why I coined the name "Gunga Dim" for D'souza...

in the context of Kipling's poem "Gunga Din", D'souza willingly fits that "Yes, master!" role perfectly.
And, of course, D'souza is...rather dim.

[Tellurian]

21. Well, then, Obama is a problem child..

he is an apostate of the Muslim world, seeing his father was a Muslim, as well as his Step-father. He has denounced his affiliation with the Muslim world and been designated a sure thing by the Neocons because he is an apostate.. Having the Muslims deal with an apostate is the worst insult there could possibly be to the Muslim World. This means never ending war if Obama is elected Prez.

[Crunchy Frog]

36. Sounds like you would have been right at home on that cruise.

"Yee haw!!11! We gotta stop that Hussein Osama Obama from bein 'lected to the presidency. He just another one o' them EVIL Muslims". :eyes:

[Divine Discontent]

49. I don't look at tellurian's comment like that...

I think they serve a wise commentary on what could occur if someone who was raised Muslim but who became an apostate to Christianity became President, because some very shocking threats could come from the militant portion of the religion. Their post does not seem anti-Muslim at all, they're commenting about the violent portion that sends kids with explosives onto buses and such.

You know how the militant part of the Muslim world lives their lives and how violent they are to people in many Muslim-led countries to people who do not obey their religious beliefs. If you forget how cruel and inhumane that part of their religion has been to people they disagree with, would you like about 100 quick links showing just a few of the incidents? The one of the two young men being hung for being gay is just great

www.cafepress.com/warisprofitable <<--- top '08 items & antib*sh stickers!

[Douglas Carpenter]

54. as someone who has lived half their life in the Muslim world -I do not believe it would be a factor

at all -- one way or the other...although I don't doubt that it might get occasional mention

They recognize the Western World is a very different place and operates under very different assumptions. After all they recognize that most of their own leaders are quite secular and are regarded by almost all militant Islamist as Muslim in name only.

I'm neither a supporter or opponent of Sen. Obama's Presidential bid. But I think the perception that he has at least some understanding of the region and Islamic sensitivities would be more of an asset than a liability.

But just as former President Clinton's marital matters were not a particular source of outrage in the Islamic world neither would be Mr. Obama's background. It will be policy more than everything else which determines how the region views any given President.

[Divine Discontent]

178. interesting viewpoint, thank you! n/t

[Crunchy Frog]

58. The poster in question has a long history of posting RW type attacks on Obama.

I believe I took that post in the spirit in which it was intended.

The Talibornagains in our own country practically see Hillary as the anti-Christ. I'm far more worried about what they would do should she become president than I am about how some Muslim fanatics might view Obama. It actually wouldn't surprise me if some small scale civil war broke out in this country over it. I won't be posting hit pieces on Hillary because of those wackos though We just need to take the existence wackos as a given, and deal with it as best we can.

[rosesaylavee]

78. He was not raised muslim. This is an untrue and repetitively malicious

talking point against the Obama campaign. See my post 72.

Obama is not my candidate but he is my senator and damn good one at that.

Peace.

[rosesaylavee]

72. Obama was raised by his mother and

his grandparents primarily as a Christian within the Unitarian Universalist faith. He had limited contact with his birth father and his step-father didn't require that he and his mother convert to his muslim faith when she married him.

He never denounced the Muslim faith - why would he have to? Read about his life before you start making stuff up.

"Never-ending war" if Obama was elected? Please.

[Douglas Carpenter]

75. thank you I think that pretty much sums it up

As I mentioned before I am neither a supporter or opponent of Sen.Obama's Presidential aspirations.

But whether I or anyone else decides to support or oppose ANY candidates nomination, that decision should be based on actual concerns rooted in the real world; not a fantasy land version of what some people like those on the cruise think the Middle East is.

[rosesaylavee]

77. The article posted was strangely

enjoyable to read. I am printing out for my recently converted from Republican to Independent elderly aunt who will hopefully find it as ludicrous as I did.

My first post was to Tellurian's concern that Obama as pres would result in constant wars based on his rejection of his "muslim upbringing" - which was grossly inaccurate as he was not raised at any time as a muslim. He has family who are muslim and he would be an interesting bridge between the cultures if elected.

He is not currently my candidate either.

[Douglas Carpenter]

82. actually this subject came up a few weeks ago on a discussion here

and this is what I found in trying to look the whole question up:

"Barack Obama has arguably the most diverse religious background of any candidate, ever. He was raised in Indonesia by a Christian mother and Muslim stepfather, and attended a Catholic school, but while growing up, also studied Islam. That background sparked rumors that he had studied in a radical madrasa, or Koranic school – rumors later disproved . Obama is now a practicing Christian.

Last month, the Los Angeles Times interviewed a person who grew up with Obama. In the LA Times article he said, "We prayed in the mosque, but not seriously," noting that Obama also prayed with his Catholic schoolmates. In a later Chicago Tribune article, however, the source said he was not certain whether they prayed together"

link:

http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2007/04/11/couricandco/entry2673784.shtml

.

[rosesaylavee]

97. The best source for his earlier life is an autobiography

he wrote several years ago titled: Dreams of my Father (http://www.amazon.com/Dreams-My-Father-Story-Inheritance/dp/0307383415/ref=pd_bbs_sr_2/002-6302153-7900832?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1184510111&sr=8-2)

You state he is now a practising Christian... he has always been a practising Christian. You see how that can be misinterpreted? RWingers grab that and use it to imply that he was formerly a muslim.

I state this as a non-Christian and with the understanding that many people in this country and abroad are deeply afraid of those who are not Christian.

[Douglas Carpenter]

117. .

[Douglas Carpenter]

206. /

[Forkboy]

87. Your posts are free comedy at it's finest!

Thanks for saving me some money.I no longer have to travel to the Chuckle Hut for my laughs.

[PBass]

22. Hilarious and frightening. Recommended (eom)

[melody]

23. That's who these people are and how they think

My father was one. He hung out with them.

They think intellectuals are arrogant even though the neocons go around talking about killing people
with whom they disagree, and that people with the wrong color skin are "breeding". They're the wealthy
arrogant republican party, as we used to call them -- the war party.

A right-wing British friend of the family once observed, "There's no such thing as equality. It's
useless to educate the underclasses' children. Who will take out the garbage?" I wish I was joking.

[Douglas Carpenter]

24. indeed that is exactly how they talk

And there are lots and lots of them.

I remember the father of one of my childhood friends (a wealthy local dentist) who mouthed all those phrases and was convinced that Earl Warren was a genuine Communist agent and considered paid vacations for workers to be a grave injustice.

[melody]

52. My dad used to say the same crap

His rant was that Nelson Rockefeller (that famed lefty lol) was going to become President
and suspend the Constitution then cancel all elections. He used to say "you're either a
fascist or you're a communist."

He and his friends were almost, to a one, morally reprehensible in all the ways that count.
The number of wife-beaters, date rapists and child abusers among them was staggering.

[Douglas Carpenter]

31. one of the most fascinating things I find about these sorts is that they are convinced that

everyone or practically everyone agrees with them. I suspect one of the main reasons for this is that ordinary people including those (most people) who are not particularly politically engaged just don't argue with them. This leaves them under the illusion that they are speaking the universally recognized truth.

I recall the travel writer Paul Thoreau once commenting on how he has sat in expatriate bars all over the most far flung places on earth hearing some inebriated American Republican or British Conservative sitting at the bar ranting and raving away on a right wing tirade. And he wishes that just once he would hear some intoxicated soul sitting at the bar in one of these place proclaiming that he is sick and tired of that god damned death penalty and bloated military budget and he wishes the government would do more about childhood health care.

[melody]

51. Because they're almost always the Alpha primates

They yell very loud and many are violent.

My father's friends were a scary brood. Every bit as dumb as they were scary, too.

[TheBaldyMan]

86. You need empathy and smarts to be top dog

These unfortunates are emotionally stunted, far too stunted to show affection for their kids, family or their friends. Unthinking and unfeeling they are 'useful idiots' to the right wing, fleeced at $1000 per seat function raisers marginal to policy formation.

No wonder these rich zombies are so fucked up. I just hope that they tell the nanny to bring Junior up in a more emotionally nurturing atmosphere, I suspect they won't because that would be vulgar. The vicious cycle will continue to the next generation.

[Canuckistanian]

25. "the getting-to-know-you chit-chat, then some light conversational fascism"

LOL! :rofl:

This love this guy!

The idea that Europe is being "taken over" by Muslims is the unifying theme of this cruise. Some people go on singles cruises. Some go on ballroom dancing cruises. This is the "The Muslims Are Coming" cruise – drinks included. Because everyone thinks it. Everyone knows it. Everyone dreams it. And the man responsible is sitting only a few tables down: Mark Steyn.

He is wearing sunglasses on top of his head and a bright, bright shirt that fits the image of the disk jockey he once was. Sitting in this sea of grey, it has an odd effect – he looks like a pimp inexplicably hanging out with the apostles of colostomy conservatism.

:rofl:

[NastyRiffraff]

28. Ye gods

I just read the article. It's like watching a train wreck, seeing how these people "think" (if it can be called that).

I never thought I'd call Bill Buckley reasonable, but compared to the rest of this bunch, he's the voice of reason.

K&R. Everyone should read this, to see what we're up against.

[Swede]

30. Was this on the good ship Bismarck?

"execute a few prominent liberals." What a neat way to save America.

[lala_rawraw]

33. kick!!!

good to see this posted here as well... see here:
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2007/7/14/215039/773#c125

spread far and wide

[Douglas Carpenter]

67. thanks for the link to the Kos article

I see that it was a big hit over there as well

[Gelliebeans]

34. Who in the hell are these people?

As many people pointed out up thread, "When Buckley is the sane voice on the cruise, you have to be worried".
The sickening thing here is that they (the neocons) won't be embarrassed of this article and no one in the media will question their sanity. :wtf:

[Change has come]

119. These people own the media.

No wonder they're squawking so loudly about the fairness doctrine. Hate and bigotry are the tools they use to control they're peons.

[Crunchy Frog]

35. You couldn't PAY me enough to go on one of those.

(Well, maybe if it were in the millions, and I'd still spend the entire time in the cabin pretending to be seasick.)

This story makes me wonder how long it will be before one of these loonies straps on a suicide vest. They really are completely off the deep end.:crazy:

[Douglas Carpenter]

37. I think it was the late Hunter S. Thompson who probably originated this kind of reporting

with his 1971 classic "Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas: A Savage Journey to the Heart of the American Dream ". Mr Thompson along with his attorney and friend attended a national conference of deputy sheriffs in Las Vegas.

The two of them handled this adventure by consuming enormous amounts of drugs including large quantities of hallucinogens. I suspect thats the only way I could imagine handling the cruise with any sense of humor.

But make no mistake about it, there are lots and lots of people who think like the folks on that cruise and lots of them are in the very center of world power. They are absolutely convinced they are right and equally convinced that practically everyone including all sensible folks agree with them.

[Douglas Carpenter]

136. .

[ProudDad]

57. I think it would be fun

Read the article again. I think the author had a gas pulling their legs to see how far they'd go in the ballistic direction...

[pokercat999]

70. Don't worry the only thing these clowns will strap on is

a dildo. You'd be better served to worry about childern especially young boys when these "armchair heros" are around.

[Douglas Carpenter]

98. they don't need to use suicide vest

those kind of terror tactics are the weapons of the weak and relatively powerless ... people who think like the ones on this cruise play a leading role in the corridors of power and are able and willing to exert that might through the greatest military super power in the history of the world.

That is the scary part.

[mitchum]

38. Pity the ship didn't sink with all of those fuckwits aboard

[Madspirit]

42. Wow...and now you sound JUST like them...

THEM: ..."we need to execute some of these people"... (liberals)

I really don't wish for the death of a whole shipload of people but hey...whatever.

...and as a far-leftist lesbian I really really hate them.

Lee

[brg5001]

100. I see a major difference between the two modes of thinking

One group -- the so-called conservatives -- is asking for liberals to be executed as a matter of public policy. It's something that enough of them could actually make happen if they had the numbers and the votes.

The poster you referred to was sighing that the ship didn't spring a leak and sink. That's not something that liberals could carry out without hostile attack. It's just a generalized wish that the universe would hand them a little justice for a hateful, awful ideology.

Personally, I think the comment about the ship sinking was puerile. But he's not making plans to sink their ship, whereas the people on the boat are making serious plans to execute US. He's getting some imaginary schadenfreude while American right-wing religious fascists are literally organizing death squads because they cant' win in the court of public opinion. Not the same.

[mitchum]

107. Thank you (n/t)

[mitchum]

101. Wow...and now you sound just like someone with a tin ear for hyperbole

[Madspirit]

40. k&r...n/t

[stevedeshazer]

41. Freaking hilarious, yet astonishingly frightening

Podhoretz should be in a padded cell.

[Skittles]

43. pretty much explains who the remaining 26% are

a lost f***ing cause

[WCGreen]

45. It sounds like a David Sidaris piece from the New Yorker...

[vietnam_war_vet]

47. Same frightening mindset presented today on CNN segment

Earlier this afternoon, CNN's Rick Sanchez presented a segment of supposedly random interviews of "people on the street." This one 50-ish, well-dressed woman quickly went into a rant about how our nation's liberals have "undermined" America....the War on Terror....our constitution....our President....and such liberals needed to be charged with and convicted of treason....and sent to prison....

Sadly, she was totally serious. -- Michael

[ProudDad]

53. An amazing walk throught the kafkaeske

world of the far-right loonies...

Thanks...

[TheBaldyMan]

60. The truly bizarre thing is Johann Hari is considered a RW journo in the UK

He (and William Buckley!?! ) appeared positively liberal against the backdrop of neo-cons.

I know it's not funny but I couldn't stop myself from laughing out loud at the antics of these looney toons.

[intaglio]

65. Funny thing is that Johann Hari is gay

Do you think they knew? (the can't have done he's still alive)

[TheBaldyMan]

66. they had William Buckley on board and he survived the trip.

I could be mistaken about Mr. Buckley perhaps he a gay acting straight?

[mitchum]

109. Buckley is not gay, his mannerisms and affectations are quite characteristic...

of much of the true ruling elite class of America.
That is why they need "tough red-blooded plain spoken" front men such as Hannity, Beck, etc...to deliver the propaganda to the proles.

[TheBaldyMan]

111. Tucker Carlson is NOT butch n/t

[mitchum]

113. You are absolutely correct about that...

I can't imagine in what universe Carlson would be considered butch :)

[muriel_volestrangler]

89. I wouldn't have said he was right wing

He's a centre-to-left writer, who supported the war in Iraq, but did admit that was a very stupid thing to do, later.

See, for instance, this argument that the BBC is biased to the right, not the left: http://www.johannhari.com/archive/article.php?id=1093 ; or one about raising the taxes on the rich: http://www.johannhari.com/archive/article.php?id=1142

[TheBaldyMan]

108. he's RW from my perspective, admittedly I'm an anarcho-syndicalist

saying he's is left of centre to someone like me means well to the right. It's just the reading I get from my political meter when I read his stuff or see his TV reports.

I wouldn't say that the BBC has a right wing bias, it certainly had an establishment bias and has been notably muted in its criticism of HM Govt. since the Hutton report.

[LeftishBrit]

92. He's not really right-wing...

He did initially back the Iraq war, when many people in the UK had the sense to oppose it from the start; but he turned against it fairly early on. He is a strong and courageous voice on behalf of refugees and asylum seekers, who are often badly treated in Britain and a target of the tabloid press; and he is rather to the left of the Blair government on most economic issues. He is also openly gay and a supporter of gay marriage, which would probably not have made him terribly popular with some of the people on that cruise.

William Buckley OTOH is a right-wing NUT; if he seemed sane compared with many of the cruise members, that says it all.

[TheBaldyMan]

110. Any decent human being should have empathy for ones fellows

expressing sympathy for refugees and openly supporting gay marriage is happily not exclusive to left wingers. Even the Pope was against the war in Iraq.

As I said in my post to Mu earlier, that's the reading I get from his articles. I admit I have a profound left-wing bias and that does colour my views.

btw if you haven't read the article yet you should, it'll make you laugh for all the wrong reasons - the RW nuts are grotesques.

[Seabiscuit]

61. I am truly embarassed that this ship of fools departed from San Diego.

San Diego has its fill of right-wing loonies, but this is just too much to stomach.

[ClintonTyree]

69. I've said it before.......

and I'll keep saying it: conservatism is a mental illness. These people are sick and as far as I know there's no cure. The upside is that they're a dying breed. The majority are well into their "golden years" and will soon be greeted by the greatest equalizer of all: death. Perhaps there is a cure after all? ;)

[The Backlash Cometh]

71. A strong executive!

Weren't these people in favor of state's rights before 2000?

[Rabrrrrrr]

138. And from 1992 - 2000, they also favored a weak presidency

with power in the legislature, "where it belongs, to keep one person from running amok" and other bullshit.

Jesus, these people have no fucking shame. Nor memory.

[deutsey]

73. These people (and many more like them) would delight in seeing us executed

If they could (and who's to say they won't be able to someday?), I'm sure they'd stage liberal executions in large stadiums and broadcast them on pay-per-view.

:evilfrown:

[brg5001]

74. Beneath the "thoughtful conservative" exterior: Fearful, fascist, Rush-licking xenophobes

I have an uncle who would email boilerplate crap from right-wing DC talk station WMAL about immigration.

I attempted to engage him in an intellectual conversation. I explained that while I too didn't support the bill (too messy and unenforceable), I believed it a huge error to deport the undocumented parents of US citizens since we all shared a collective role in the lack of border enforcement seen since the 1986 amnesty. Yes, laws were broken, but speeding, jaywalking and taking deductions without having receipts are against the law too and we don't give everyone the maximum sentence for that, do we? I also thought it unwise to deport the undocumented parents of US citizens -- their children.

Anyway, after numerous attempts to discuss immigration intelligently, I received a mass email from him containing a vile image of a "Mexifornia" driver license, caricaturing all Mexicans as criminals and thieves. So much for thoughtful discussion or an exchange of views that might lead toward consensus.

I know exactly what it was like on the OP's cruise. These fuckers don't do nuance. Behind the smiles and the facade of thoughtful conservativism in general are a bunch of fearmongering jerks who prefer dictatorship (by their adherents) to democracy. I simply don't recognize Republicans anymore. One would think that those who claim to embrace the Bible might exhibit the wisdom of Solomon in repsonse to modern problems. Nope! It's all just an excuse to launch one war after another -- with the biggest war reserved for anyone who dares to think independently.

[last_texas_dem]

76. Great article

Interesting and entertaining, and it's always enjoyable to read about conflicts among members of a party/ideology that for the last several years have mostly succeeded at looking unified, no matter what.

[frogcycle]

85. can you imagine a 'stealth' film

like the Borat guy did, focusing on this crowd?

[rox63]

88. Sounds like a vacation in hell

I probably would have jumped overboard due to all the cognitive disonnance. :scared:

[muriel_volestrangler]

90. Link to "Sadly, No!" posting on it when the New Republic article came out

http://www.sadlyno.com/archives/6321.html

It's always worth reading 'Sadly, No!' comments - some of the best snark on the net.

[Douglas Carpenter]

94. great link ... thanks

one little passage that I noticed when I read it on this blog that I some how missed missed earlier:

"Several days later, the nautical counter-revolution has docked in Puerto Vallarta, Mexico, where passengers will clamber overboard into a nation they want to wall off behind a 1,000-mile fence. One expresses horror at my intention to find a local street kid to show me around, exclaiming, “Do you want to die?” D’Souza summarizes the prevailing sentiment by unveiling what he modestly calls “D’Souza’s law of immigration”: An immigrant’s quality is “proportional to the distance traveled to get to the United States.” In other words: Asians trump Latinos. "

then again the racism just goes all around:

"A Filipino waiter offers him a top-up of his wine, and he mock-whispers to me, "They all look the same! Can you tell them apart?" I stare out to sea. How long would it take me to drown?"


and again:

"There are, he says, " those who condemn the Klan based on their past without seeing the human side of it, because they don't want to be in the wrong, politically correct camp, you know... "

and of course:

""But then you think – it's surrounded by Muslims." The first lady nods: "They're out there, and they're coming." Emboldened, the bearded Floridian wags a finger and says, "Down the line, we're not going to bail out the French again."

link to original article:

http://news.independent.co.uk/world/americas/article2766040.ece

.

[melody]

118. That was hysterically funny

It almost made the original article worthwhile ... almost.

Thanks for posting it.

[LeftishBrit]

91. Scary stuff!

He paid $1200 to go on that cruise? You'd have to pay ME more than that to go on a ship with people like that.

Pinochet was a hero who saved Chile *and* he privatized social security?

Britain has been taken over by the Muslims? I hadn't noticed. And there are Canadians for suicide bombing? Mind you, I noted that this lot seem to think suicide bombing is a good thing if the UN are the target.

CRAZY CRAZY CRAZY.

[YankeyMCC]

93. This one quote says it all to me:

"No one argues with him. They just look away, in the same manner that people avoid glancing at a crazy person yelling at a bus stop. "

No one argues...that is the difference between these conservatives and liberals. Liberals examine, question, strive to understand. Conservatives just don't know how to deal with something that conflicts with their beliefs, they are the very epitome of sheeple.

[Laelth]

95. Thanks for posting this.

Good read. Recommended.

Of course, what I found most chilling was the ready willingness to the people described to simply kill those who disagree with them, as if it were of no great moral consequence to kill those with whom you disagree. Then, to my astonishment, as I am describing the article to a close friend, she suggests nuking the boat at sea, and I was crestfallen. There's a lot of animosity on both sides.

-Laelth

[KG]

96. RW conservatism is a mental disorder.

[Midlodemocrat]

103. Why is there never an iceberg around when you need one?

[JAbuchan08]

105. The remark by the filipino waiter made me laugh out loud

hahaha

[0007]

114. Nothin' has changed much since the artist painted this picture....

month of Sundays ago. dick & junior are easy to find, 'eh?

[Submariner]

115. Makes me think back to my torpedo attack days

in the Navy. Ohhh....the thoughts I am having now of the service I could have done sinking this cruise ship. :evilgrin:

[Downtown Hound]

120. If that was to happen, that day should be declared a national holiday

Did I just say that? Oops my bad.

But then again, they did talk about executing us now, didn't they?

[Wapsie B]

121. That is absolutely frightening.

" Of course, we need to execute some of these people," I wake up. Who do we need to execute? She runs her fingers through the sand lazily. "A few of these prominent liberals who are trying to demoralize the country," she says. "Just take a couple of these anti-war people off to the gas chamber for treason to show, if you try to bring down America at a time of war, that's what you'll get." She squints at the sun and smiles. " Then things'll change."

So.........anyone who disagrees with them is a traitor? Oh god I would love to just give these people a few states just so they could create the conservative utopia they masturbate over everyday. Every last one of them move there. All of them. Let them have their truly free-market economy, Faux News, Jeff Christie and all the rest. Civil disobedience will be met with a firing squad.
The parallels to Nazi Germany are beyond their feeble grasp.


Nominated.

Bookmarked.

[kevinbgoode]

132. Perhaps we should have used all of the money spent on Iraq

and purchased Guyana for them. . .I'm sure they could rebuild Jonestown and drink all of the kool-aid they require. .. .

[Wapsie B]

134. Yeah anywhere they can have their ideal society.

Let 'em go at it. Once and for all I would really like to see something like this happen.

[treestar]

124. They can't believe this BS

I think they had made the intruder.

They talk like this for the benfit of the liberals. If they thought they were alone, they'd be telling the truth. That's the stuff they trot out to try to fool dissenters, whom they believe are stupid. Like their whole thing about bringing democracy to Iraq. They thought that would shut the liberals up, and that the liberals are too stupid to wonder - well if they are Muslims who hate us, why do we send our kids to die in the name of bringing them a good thing?

Their real reason for all of us is they want control of middle eastern oil. But they can't face up to that. They know it's selfish and wrong and that according to their own philosophy, they should just pay the Iraqis the market price.

[WindRavenX]

126. well that was a nice terrifying morning read

:scared:

[Turbineguy]

127. It does seem a bit ironic

all these "conservative patriots" on a non-US Flag ship.

Here's some more from the American Thinker.

http://www.americanthinker.com/2006/12/cruising_with_the_national_rev.html

[Douglas Carpenter]

129. 52% of Republicans still say Bush is doing a good or excellent job in Iraq

link: http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/war_on_terror_update

and 38% of Republicans say the troop surge has already been a success:

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/poll_19_consider_troop_surge_a_success

so we can see that some people do indeed live in a different world. They might be a minority of the population as a whole; but not an insignificant minority.

[glitch]

161. Yes, but the total number of Republicans is shrinking rapidly. That 52% ain't what it used to be. nt

[mzmolly]

130. Apt title.

Off to read. :hi:

[Roland99]

131. The only thing missing from the story was if the ship's name was Titanic or Lusitania

These modern-day, Rockefeller-wannabes are SO far removed from reality but it is their mindset that is furthering its reach each day in America.

It will take another Great Depression lasting just as long to wake America up to its apathy that allows these cretins to take and maintain control.

[MLFerrell]

133. Those people give a whole new meaning to the word "delusional".

I'm ashamed to call them countrymen.

"There were WMD, and they were shipped to Syria ... This picture of a country in total chaos with no security is false. It has been a triumph. It couldn't have gone better."

No, there weren't any WMD. And if you want to invade Syria to make your dick feel bigger, you're going to have to do a little better than that.

"The left won by demanding America's humiliation."

No, the Vietnamese won by strenuously fighting against an occupying army. Why does that sound familiar?

"They should suicide-bomb that place (The U.N.)"

Wait, I thought that you conservative types thought that suicide bombing was cowardly, but launching missiles from thousands of miles away was heroic? What am I missing here?

Oy, I could pull more tidbits of madness out of this survey of utter insanity, but my head already hurts enough from a severe tequila hangover...

[Douglas Carpenter]

197. other than the fact that people who think like this control many of the levers of world power

I don't think there is much to worry about

[ginnyinWI]

139. The good news: they are old and dying out

And thanks to the current administration, many fewer are going to be signing on to RW ideology.

The populous is trending leftward--count on it. They are much more liberal, even now, than the MSM is letting on.

[Douglas Carpenter]

140. /

[Whoa_Nelly]

141. These people sound like the top 1-2% of the "haves"/tax-exempts...

...who donate large sums to keep the GOP up and running, and delivering more of the kool-aid that continues to make their lives and consciences within a narrow comfort zone. Woe be to anyone who points out irrefutable facts that are a direct assault on their boxed in world view; Cognitive dissonance rules the day for them, from their choices for breakfast to whom they will verbally eat for dinner.

[pacalo]

143. And a few words with Ken Starr, who is no Patrick Fitzgerald...

The ghosts of Conservatism past are wandering this ship. From the pool, I see John O'Sullivan, a former adviser to Margaret Thatcher. And one morning on the deck I discover Kenneth Starr, looking like he has stepped out of a long-forgotten 1990s news bulletin waving Monica's stained blue dress. His face is round and unlined, like an immense, contented baby. As I stare at him, all my repressed bewilderment rises, and I ask – Mr Starr, do you feel ashamed that, as Osama bin Laden plotted to murder American citizens, you brought the American government to a stand-still over a few consensual blow jobs? Do you ever lie awake at night wondering if a few more memos on national security would have reached the President's desk if he wasn't spending half his time dealing with your sexual McCarthyism?

He smiles through his teeth and – in his soft somnambulant voice – says in perfect legalese, "I am entirely at rest with the process. The House of Representatives worked its will, the Senate worked its will, the Chief Justice of the United States presided. The constitutional process worked admirably."

I wish she had asked him what he thought about (1) the current situation in the White House & whether or not impeachment is justified, and (2) the difference between the job done by Patrick Fitzgerald & him.

[ooglymoogly]

144. These psycho's are dangerous hillbillies with money, access and

with the IQ of a dumb bulldog...watch out....oops too late.
ship of fools is a perfect title for these retards, in fact for this entire administration and it is sailing us right off the edge of the earth.

[wryter2000]

145. Thanks

I printed it out so I don't have to sit at the computer to read it.

I expect rwers to have odious opinions. What's truly amazing is that they have a whole different set of facts. I don't know how we're going to save this country as long as there are large numbers of people who believe things that are obviously wrong.

[WillyT]

148. Oy Vey... My Favorite Line...

<snip>

"The civilised countries should invade all the oil-owning places in the Middle East and run them properly. We won't take the money ourselves, but we'll manage it so the money isn't going to terrorists."

The idea that Europe is being "taken over" by Muslims is the unifying theme of this cruise. Some people go on singles cruises. Some go on ballroom dancing cruises. This is the "The Muslims Are Coming" cruise – drinks included. Because everyone thinks it. Everyone knows it. Everyone dreams it. And the man responsible is sitting only a few tables down: Mark Steyn.

He is wearing sunglasses on top of his head and a bright, bright shirt that fits the image of the disk jockey he once was. Sitting in this sea of grey, it has an odd effect – he looks like a pimp inexplicably hanging out with the apostles of colostomy conservatism.

Steyn's thesis in his new book, America Alone, is simple: The "European races" i.e., white people – "are too self-absorbed to breed," but the Muslims are multiplying quickly. The inevitable result will be " large-scale evacuation operations circa 2015" as Europe is ceded to al Qaeda and "Greater France remorselessly evolve into Greater Bosnia."

He offers a light smearing of dubious demographic figures – he needs to turn 20 million European Muslims into more than 150 million in nine years, which is a lot of humping.

<snip>

Link: same article.

:rofl::wow::rofl:

[Kablooie]

149. God what horrible people.

I can't understand how anyone can be so willingly blind to humanity.
They are the kind of people that all through history have spawned revolutions and hatred.

I just don't get how someone can put themselves in such a disgusting position.

[Lint Head]

151. From my travels in Germany years ago I found that this is

exactly the way the average German citizen was speaking right at the time the people gave Hitler the power to do his dirty deeds.
Yes Hitler was voted in in 'some what' the same way Bush was installed by the Supreme Cowards. I know it's become somewhat taboo to compare Bush to Hitler. The problem is, there is no other comparison. This traitor is a fascist dictator. :dem:

[progressoid]

154. Oh...My...Gawd...

[HuffleClaw]

157. scary stuff

bigot loons, the lot of 'em. nearly everything about 'em comes down to simple racism it seems.

[Maat]

162. Wow.

Thanks for the post!

[SKKY]

163. I've often had the impression that wealthy republican women only think...

...like that because their husbands do. It's as though their level of "Conservatism" is directly proportionate to the limit on their credit cards.

[Progressive Friend]

164. Great article: it shows just how evil our enemy is

[southpaw8]

170. It's like 1940 all over again...

They talk about liberals and Muslims as if they themselves are the Nazi's in 1940 discussing the extermination of the Jews! These people are full of hatred and are certainly not compassionate, unless the neocons, in their own way, rewrote the dictionary to describe "compassionate conservative" as ridding the world of those you hate by wanting to see them blown up by a suicide bomber. God help us all.

[hiaasenrocks]

166. A good read, at least in terms of content, but the writing is horrible.

The bad grammar and punctuation is kind of distracting.

[Pierre.Suave]

168. Wow, this took balls...

"And one morning on the deck I discover Kenneth Starr, looking like he has stepped out of a long-forgotten 1990s news bulletin waving Monica's stained blue dress. His face is round and unlined, like an immense, contented baby. As I stare at him, all my repressed bewilderment rises, and I ask – Mr Starr, do you feel ashamed that, as Osama bin Laden plotted to murder American citizens, you brought the American government to a stand-still over a few consensual blow jobs? Do you ever lie awake at night wondering if a few more memos on national security would have reached the President's desk if he wasn't spending half his time dealing with your sexual McCarthyism?"



The people on that cruise were appalling.

[LeftishBrit]

188. I can still remember in 1998 thinking that it was a good job...

that America didn't have as many overseas enemies plotting against it as some paranoid righties think, or they would find the endless distraction over a president's blow-job a fine opportunity to plan bad actions.

Maybe I was closer to the truth than I thought.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

171. One of the great pleasures of traveling in the UK is

reading their newspapers, including the Independent. :7

[pwb]

172. Unite against the neocons.

Democrats, Republicans, Independents, Unite against these humans who feel good about looking down on almost all of us. Most of the neocons do not believe in hell, but Hell believes in them.

[ProudDad]

173. I doubt that this cruise will be as loonie

A much more humane and intelligent group:

http://www.nationcruise.com/

At least it's on a different ship...don't have to hurry the fumigation of the ship of fools...


here's the grouping on the right-wing nut-job cruise...

http://www.nrcruise.com/

[Douglas Carpenter]

175. well I always wanted to do a cruise in Alaska

I noticed that both the National Review and the Nations cruises are both going roughly the same time (last week of July -- first week of August) and they are both going to Alaska. Maybe they could combine the two groups together? That would be interesting.

National Review Alaska speaker list for their August cruise:

link: http://www.nrcruise.com /



_________________________________________________________________________
__________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________


The Nations Alaska Cruise speaker list:

link: http://www.nationcruise.com /

[ProudDad]

176. I heard or read that someone from the Nation

remarked that they were going to follow the neo-con wacko's cruise and clean up the air befouled by their drivel...

Or maybe they were going to overtake and board them. I'd put my money on the Nation Readers!! :)

[goodgd_yall]

177. All the anti-muslim remarks reported in the article

are scary. What does this mean for regular law-abiding Muslims in this country? If they had their way, I hate to think what would happen to American Muslims.

[Douglas Carpenter]

179. their vulnerable victims are the Muslims

you notice from the article that their racism is also directed against, Mexicans, Filipinos and blacks. But it is a little bit hushed. And it is more murmured than spoken boldly.

But with Muslims they feel they can just let loose and let the hatred flow. Just like the Nazis of the 1930's they found a vulnerable scapegoat knowing that many people intimidated by a nasty political climate will not speak up in their defense.

[LongTomH]

181. Somebody please warn the Chupacabras.............

.......just in case these vile creatures visit some of the Caribbean Islands where Chup is supposed to roam. I mean, what does a poor monster have against REAL evil?

Sorry for the flippancy. I couldn't resist! :evilgrin:

[AX10]

186. Chilling is a kind word to describe conservatives.

[Douglas Carpenter]

187. one kick before work because its such a good story

[ginnyinWI]

189. I kept thinking about this article, so came back to print it out! n/t

[Scurrilous]

192. Great article Doug!

Thanks for posting.

:kick:

[Douglas Carpenter]

201. thanks

[Douglas Carpenter]

196. I see this story was picked up by Alternet today:

http://www.alternet.org/story/57001/

[Douglas Carpenter]

204. one kick before work because its such a good story

[BreweryYardRat]

207. People like this scare the fuck out of me.

I haven't heard comments this stupid since I was in high school.

Shit, I was a Republican through half of high school, and I wouldn't have thought or said anything this bad.

These are people who have no idea what being an American means. They'd fit perfectly into the worst parts of the Middle Ages or prehistory, given how willing they are to persecute/kill anyone different.

[opihimoimoi]

208. They are into MEism....they think only of themselves...selfcentered and selfabsorbed

[bhumikag]

211. maniacs

"Who do we need to execute? She runs her fingers through the sand lazily. "A few of these prominent liberals who are trying to demoralize the country," she says." and they call us liberals maniacs!!

chilling account of what goes inside neocon's brain..after reading this i am sure republicans will have even harder time finding a date..who wants to date such disturbed people..??

now they are saying that anyone who questions iraq policy is aiding the enemies..how does that work??http://www.thenewsroom.com/details/517696/Politics?c_id=wom-bc-bg

bhumika
politics desk,the newsroom

[Patriot Abroad]

212. reminds me of the day I was in DC with 50000 Promise Keepers

Every time you turned a corner in one of the Smithsonians, you overheard another unusual interpretation of science. It's amazing how people with a common creed can convince themselves of the "truth", but events such as this one are critical to them as they need the positive reinforcement of others with the same viewpoints.

(YearlyKos, anyone?)