Nader's dead end

[LoZoccolo]

At a green party convention in Reading, Pa., on July 14, Ralph Nader provoked admirers and detractors alike when he declared that he is once again "considering" a run for the presidency.

This would be the 73-year-old activist's fourth third-party race. For a decade now and counting, Nader has presented himself as the outsider's outsider, as the reformer's conscience and as a sturdy crusader against a corrupt party system -- meaning, in effect, against Democrats, from whom he siphons votes (a fact amply noted by the Republican donors who boosted his Green Party campaigns in 2000 and 2004).

http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/la-op-gitlin22jul22,0,3334362.story?coll=la-opinion-rightrail

This article is a calm essay on why Nader's strategy is no longer effective, despite him and others continuing to push it.

[LittleClarkie]

1. When you're being used by part of the system you consider corrupt

Yes, that's a problem

[Xipe Totec]

2. This is Ralph's Nadir nt

[Ian_rd]

3. A repentant one here

I voted for the man in 2000. Like many progressives across the country, many on this board to be sure, I was (and am still) sickened by the Democratic Party's slow transformation to Republican-Lite under President Clinton (NAFTA, anyone?). You can't blame the corporations. They're just doing what you'd expect them to. Why give profusely to only one party when you can give to both and win no matter who is in office? But you can blame the Democratic Party leadership for turning their backs on their own voter base, and for that matter, their whole raison d'être.

In 2000 I subscribed to Nader's standard response to the question of the consequences his candidacy would bring as it siphoned votes away from Democrats and contributed to a Republican lead. He basically said that Bush is incompetent and therefore could not accomplish enough to do much harm, and also, How bad could it be? Certainly not much worse than Al Gore. My God, how bad indeed.

He could not, and I could not, have imagined how truly destructive Bush's regime would be in such a short time. True, Bush is incompetent to the extreme, but let that never again be confused with a measure of how much damage can be done. But after seeing what Bush has wrought, many repentant ones like myself realized that compromise, a "fall-back position" if you prefer, was the only option. But there he was again, Nader, running in 2004. It smacked of arrogance and the kind of destructive stubbornness we see in Bush. I'm wrong, so I might as well go all the way, Baby! Wooooo!

If there's only one political disadvantage liberals have when compared to Republicans (and there are oh-so-many), it is our hesitation to compromise our beliefs even slightly in order to advance our general goals. You can call it a sell-out if you like, but there are many Republicans out there who know damn well that the corrupt ass they voted for will support policies that will close their factories and ruin their kid's chance to go to college. But they vote for them anyway because they might, just might, ban gay marriage. Meanwhile, on our side of town, some liberals refused to vote for John Kerry because he doesn't drive a hybrid car or some such bullshit, and meanwhile Bush is re-fucking-elected - the worst President in the history of the country, re-fucking elected. I know they stole it, but they didn't steal it by that much.

We need to learn to compromise if we're to win. And Nader is the personification of many liberals' inability to do it.

[Frances]

4. I am so glad that you realize that Nader was wrong on

so many levels.

But I don't understand why you believed Nader when, as you say, "He basically said that Bush is incompetent and therefore could not accomplish enough to do much harm, and also, How bad could it be? Certainly not much worse than Al Gore."

I found Gore's speaking style boring to the extreme. But he said over and over that he would fight for the working man. I believed him. I thought he would be just as against Clinton's corporate sympathies as he was against Clinton's sexual mistakes.

[applegrove]

5. Sounds like a great book. I will get it in September.

[ProudDad]

6. What part of this do you not agree with???

----------------------

Ralph Nader on Abortion

* If Roe is reversed, decision just reverts to the states. (Sep 2002)
* Threats to overturn Roe are “scare tactics”. (Nov 2000)
* Women should decide whether to use RU-486, not government. (Oct 2000)
* No government role; let women privately decide. (May 2000)
* Roe v Wade is safe; GOP must back off pushing it. (Feb 2000)

Ralph Nader on Budget & Economy

* Jobs lost may not be replaced by new ones. (Jul 2003)
* 47 million full-time workers make less than $10 an hour. (Oct 2000)
* Use surplus to rebuild country & provide for communal needs. (Oct 2000)
* Top priorities: Infrastructure; poverty; preventive health. (Jul 2000)
* High gas prices are the fruit of corporate power. (Jun 2000)
* People indicators are down despite good economic indicators. (May 2000)
* Two-tiered economy is unhealthy & troubling. (May 2000)
* Allow citizen lawsuits for waste in govt spending. (Feb 2000)
* The economy is down, when measured by human yardsticks. (Feb 2000)
* Fed worries wrongly about wage inflation over profits. (Nov 1999)
* Spend surplus on public works & infrastructure. (Jul 1999)
* GNP fails to measure quality of life. (Dec 1995)

Ralph Nader on Civil Rights

* Get rid of gay discrimination fully, not halfway. (Jul 2004)
* African Americans progress is too slow-we can do better. (Mar 2004)
* Women are still second-class citizens in school athletics. (Jan 2003)
* Truth and reconciliation commission for Native Americans. (Aug 2000)
* Disagrees with ACLU on spending money as free speech. (Feb 2000)
* Supports “impenetrable protection of privacy”. (Oct 1996)
* Differentiate discriminatory justice from indiscriminate. (Oct 1996)
* Political discourse narrows when media serves Mammon. (Dec 1995)
Gay Rights
* Nader supports gay marriage; but gay groups support Gore. (Nov 2000)
* Equal gay rights, including civil union. (Oct 2000)
* Supports Civil Union in Vermont and elsewhere. (May 2000)
* Long history of fighting in sexual politics. (Feb 2000)

Ralph Nader on Corporations

* Citizens' agenda for cracking down on corporate crime. (Oct 2004)
* No eminent domain gifts to private enterprises. (Aug 2004)
* Legislative "tort deform" for consumers, not corporations. (Jul 2004)
* Economic powers control our lives and our elections. (Jul 2004)
* Capitalism can lead to fascism. (Jul 2004)
* Corporations should not legally be counted as individuals. (Jul 2004)
* Giant corporations roam the Earth making people into serfs. (Jul 2004)
* Net worth is $3.8 million; owns corporate stocks. (Oct 2002)
* Consumerism is about corporations vs. citizens. (Sep 2002)
* Shift power from corporations to consumers. (Oct 2000)
Auto Safety
* Auto safety devices are simple & cheap; but take years. (Oct 2000)
* Safety regulation works; but Auto Safety Agency sold out. (Oct 2000)
* More regulation for auto safety, with criminal penalties. (Oct 2000)
* Cancel R&D giveaways to auto industry; let them do it. (Oct 2000)
* Gore has given auto industry and other polluters a free ride. (Oct 2000)
* Motor vehicles are the greatest environmental hazard. (Feb 2000)
* DOT: Focus on safety and mass transit. (Oct 1996)
* Automakers avoid replacing internal combustion engines. (Dec 1995)
Consumer Rights
* Help for ordinary people should replace corporate welfare. (Sep 2000)
* Address corporate crimes piecemeal AND by revoking charters. (Feb 2000)
* Stop giving corporations the same rights as people. (Dec 1995)
Corporate Welfare
* Scrutinize even “good” corporate welfare which helps public. (Oct 2000)
* Corporate welfare is a function of political corruption. (Oct 2000)
* S&L bailout helped bankers & hurt consumers. (Oct 2000)
* Rules needed for examining & challenging corporate welfare. (Oct 2000)
* Disallow benefits to companies except for public purposes. (Oct 2000)
* Stadiums & other local tax abatements ignore small business. (Oct 2000)
* Federal regulation of state & local abatements & subsidies. (Oct 2000)
* Bailouts: require payback; practice prevention by regulation. (Oct 2000)
* Legislation to eliminate all corporate welfare. (Oct 2000)
* $1000 bounty for suing for abuse of corporate welfare. (Oct 2000)
* Big business influence hurts democracy. (Jun 2000)
* Corporate sponsorship turns debates into beer commercials. (Jun 2000)
* Corporate government has hijacked political leadership. (Feb 2000)
* States & the public should oppose corporate tax breaks. (Apr 1999)
* Role of government is to counteract power of corporations. (Apr 1996)
* Coined the term “corporate welfare”. (Jul 1995)

Ralph Nader on Crime

* Crime in the suites worse than crime in the streets. (Sep 2002)
* Decreasing unemployment reduces crime; not enforcement. (Aug 2000)
* Death penalty does not deter. (Aug 2000)
* Moratorium on executions. (Aug 2000)
* Some executed by death penalty were innocent. (Jul 2000)
* Pollution & toxic exposure cause more deaths than homicide. (Jun 2000)
* Death penalty does not deter & is discriminatory. (Jun 2000)
* Focus on crime prevention instead of harsher sentences. (Jun 2000)
* Police must follow the law too. (May 2000)
* Product liability suits are a pillar of democracy. (Mar 1996)
* Lawyers & victims need unlimited contingency fees. (Mar 1996)
* Regulatory agencies are needed to fight corporate crime. (Dec 1995)

Ralph Nader on Drugs

* Rehabilitation, not incarceration. (Jul 2004)
* Women targeted by tobacco and alcohol companies. (Feb 2003)
* Failed War on Drugs endangers communities. (Oct 2000)
* Legalize marijuana, and treat addiction as a health problem. (Sep 2000)
* Treat hemp like poppy seeds, not like heroin. (Sep 2000)
* Remove industrial hemp from DEA drug list. (Jun 2000)
* Replace Drug War with treatment and alternative sentencing. (Jun 2000)
* Supports legalization of industrial hemp. (May 2000)
* Solution to addiction is information, not prohibition. (Oct 1994)
* Rated A+ by VOTE-HEMP, indicating a pro-hemp voting record. (Dec 2003)

Ralph Nader on Education

* Abandon standardized testing; focus on teaching civic skills. (Oct 2000)
* Invest in K-12 education; that will reduce poverty. (Jun 2000)
* Teach democratic principles & citizenship in schools. (Feb 2000)
* Kick Channel One & commercialism out of class. (May 1999)
* Focus on civic & consumer education. (Oct 1996)
School Choice
* Support choice within public schools. (Jun 2000)

Ralph Nader on Energy & Oil

* US lags behind Europe & Japan in renewable energy. (Oct 2004)
* Kyoto treaty is so watered down there’s nothing to fight for. (Nov 2000)
* Drilling Alaska is a temporary fix for an inebriated system. (Oct 2000)
* More renewables & more efficency to stave off global warming. (Jul 2000)
* Raise CAFE standards; treat SUVs like cars. (Jul 2000)
* Congress should revive energy policies before crisis. (Oct 1999)
* Promote energy independence to avoid foreign wars. (Oct 1996)

Ralph Nader on Environment

* Charge agribusiness for water; stop charging more to people. (Oct 2000)
* Mining companies get free mines for campaign contributions. (Oct 2000)
* Highway pork leads to sprawl, air pollution, global warming. (Oct 2000)
* End all commercial logging in National Forests. (Jul 2000)
* Head off a genetic engineering rampage. (Feb 2000)
* Protect whistleblowers on health, safety, & pollution. (Feb 2000)
* Corporate collectivism leads toward ecological disaster. (Feb 2000)
* More funds to maintain National Park system. (Jul 1999)
* National corporate charters for environmental bankruptcy. (Mar 1996)

Ralph Nader on Families & Children

* Corporations are commercializing the world of the child. (Jul 2004)
* Democracy needs youth’s energy & participation. (Jun 2000)
* Commercialism & TV make childrearing more difficult. (Jun 2000)
* Support personal responsibility; teach dispute resolution. (Jun 2000)
* TV ads targeting kids are “electronic child molesting”. (Feb 2000)
* Corporate TV marketers are raising our kids. (Oct 1999)
* National speed limit saves lives. (Mar 1996)
* Commercial TV separates children from parents. (Dec 1995)

Ralph Nader on Foreign Policy

* Corporate activity destroys the third world. (Jul 2004)
* Redefine national purpose to solve Third World scourges. (Jun 2000)
* Support foreign peasants instead of foreign dictators. (Jun 2000)
* Support social and economic justice across the globe. (Jun 2000)
* Assist Russia & Israel in moving towards better governments. (Jun 2000)
* Selling arms is not a good way to conduct foreign affairs. (Feb 2000)
* Cuba: corporate sales of junk undermines their system. (Feb 2000)
* Support human rights as cornerstone of US foreign policy. (Jun 2000)

Ralph Nader on Free Trade

* Free trade isn't win-win: we're exporting jobs. (Jul 2003)
* High-tech jobs lost to foreign countries. (Jul 2003)
* NAFTA and GATT supersede national and state laws. (Sep 2002)
* Restrict IMF power, or abolish it. (Oct 2000)
* End export assistance; it’s corporate welfare. (Oct 2000)
* Renegotiate NAFTA & WTO “as if human beings mattered”. (Oct 2000)
* Subordinate the commercial to human rights, enviro, & labor. (Jul 2000)
* It’s not free trade; it’s corporate-managed trade. (Apr 2000)
* NAFTA failures: $50B Mexico bailout; 400,000 exported jobs. (Oct 1996)
China
* China & other dictatorships have no real free trade. (Jul 2000)
Globalization
* Globalization is a betrayal of workers and environment. (Nov 2000)
* Seattle sparked movement to question corporate globalization. (Feb 2000)
* “Battle of Seattle” convinced president to reconsider WTO. (Dec 1999)
* Global trade concentrates power & homogenizes the globe. (Dec 1999)
* WTO’s “trade uber alles” hurts environment, health, & safety. (Dec 1999)
* A growing movement: international labor rights. (Aug 1999)
* Multinational corporations challenge democracy. (Oct 1994)

Ralph Nader on Government Reform

* Civic engagement fights corporate-government fascism. (Oct 2004)
* $13M for "educational" party conventions wastes tax dollars. (Jul 2004)
* The two parties are proxies for corporate government. (Jul 2004)
* Taking away votes from Democrats gains leverage. (Jul 2004)
* Advocate to allow people to vote "no confidence". (Jul 2004)
* Democracy gap: people must claim power, or the greedy will. (Jul 2004)
* Giving information to people overcomes propaganda. (Jul 2004)
* Change requires a critical mass of the involved. (Jul 2004)
* Presidential Debates designed to exclude third parties. (Jan 2004)
* Increase voting by weekend and holiday Election Days. (Sep 2002)
* Primary architect of Freedom of Information Act. (Sep 2002)
* Bush & Gore are same corporate party; would impeach Clinton. (Nov 2000)
* Don’t waste your vote: Gore & Bush only marginally differ. (Oct 2000)
* Supreme Court nominees should have a sense of justice. (Aug 2000)
* Nader in debates will draw out the “priceless truth”. (Aug 2000)
* Justices need sense of justice & sense of history. (Jul 2000)
* Allow voting for “None of the Above”. (Feb 2000)
* Empower citizens via accurate information from govt. (Feb 2000)
* Reinvent democracy via new tools for citizen empowerment. (Feb 2000)
* Concentrated party power weakens democracy. (Feb 2000)
* Focus on anti-trust enforcement to help small business. (Oct 1996)
* 100% publicly funded campaigns, by $100 tax checkoff. (Oct 1996)
* Government delivers more service than people realize. (Dec 1995)
Campaign Finance Reform
* Green Party does not take PAC, soft, or corporate cash. (Oct 2000)
* No private money in public campaigns. (Aug 2000)
* Spending campaign money is not free speech. (Feb 2000)
* Public campaign finance; 12-year term limits. (Feb 2000)
* Public election financing, with free TV & radio time. (Feb 2000)

Ralph Nader on Gun Control

* Support Brady Bill & thoughtful gun control. (Jun 2000)
* Supports trigger locks, licensing, & banning some guns. (Jun 2000)

Ralph Nader on Health Care

* 3.5% payroll tax to fund universal healthcare. (Sep 2002)
* Enforce fair drug prices if sponsored by govt research. (Oct 2000)
* Medicare prescriptions covered under universal health care. (Sep 2000)
* Price restraints on drugs; limit profiteering. (Sep 2000)
* Opposes assisted suicide laws for terminally ill. (Aug 2000)
* Cradle-to-grave health care better than Clinton’s plan. (Jul 2000)
* Use Canadian system as a model for US. (May 2000)
* Health care is a universal human right. (May 2000)
* Recast health care in a non-profit mode. (Mar 2000)
* Keep commercialism out of maternity wards. (Aug 1999)
* Make medicines affordable in Third World. (Jul 1999)
* Challenge the monetization of HMOs. (Jul 1999)
* HMO review procedures must be independent of HMOs. (Jul 1999)
* HMO plan: accountability, doctor-driven, independent review. (Jul 1999)
* Criticizes “sweetheart deal” for big tobacco. (Nov 1998)
* Let FDA regulate nicotine as an addictive drug. (Mar 1996)
* Tobacco is the world’s worst air pollutant. (Oct 1994)

Ralph Nader on Homeland Security

* Weapons corporations indirectly control tax dollars. (Jan 2003)
* Bush attacks civil liberties while saying he defends them. (Oct 2002)
* Cut defense budget by $62B by reducing waste & fraud. (Sep 2002)
* Corporate welfare: taxpayers fund defense industry mergers. (Oct 2000)
* Deter wars by being attuned abroad. (Oct 2000)
* Kill F-22, Seawolf, Osprey, & other gold-plated weapons. (Oct 2000)
* Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell is discriminatory against gays. (Sep 2000)
* SDI doesn’t work; money better spent elsewhere. (Jul 2000)
* Stop using weapons sales to determine foreign policy. (Jun 2000)
* Stop spending on unneeded weapons & non-existent enemies. (Jun 2000)
* Cut defense budget by $100B; time to demobilize. (May 2000)
* Stop unneeded defense of prosperous countries. (May 2000)
* Defense frameworks: how to wage peace while building weapons. (Feb 2000)
* Popular participation instead of corporate involvement. (Feb 2000)
* Supports Test Ban Treaty & arms control. (Feb 2000)
* Arms race is driven by corporate demand. (Feb 2000)
* F-22 aircraft is unneeded; and dangerous to fly. (Feb 2000)

Ralph Nader on Immigration

* Don’t criminalize the border; but no open border either. (Oct 2000)
* Guest workers OK, with labor standards. (Oct 2000)
* Support democracy abroad so fewer will immigrate. (Oct 2000)
* Immigrants don’t come for welfare; restore safety net. (Jun 2000)
* Don’t blame immigrants for social and economic problems. (Jun 2000)

Ralph Nader on Jobs

* Focus on family farms instead of large agribusiness. (Oct 2000)
* U.S. farm policy should focus on family farmers. (Sep 2000)
Labor
* Living wage spreads economic expansion to reach all areas. (Oct 2000)
* Repeal Taft-Hartley; strengthen unions. (Oct 2000)
* Unions struggle even in heart of union country. (Sep 2000)
* Vote for a union supporter, not against Republicans. (Aug 2000)
* Message to Democrats: Don’t take labor for granted. (Jul 2000)
* Raise the minimum wage immediately. (Jun 2000)
* Functional wages are falling despite economic boom. (Jun 2000)
* Top CEOs make 415 times entry wages. (Feb 2000)
* Limit executive salaries & perks. (Feb 2000)
* Student pressure can help oppressed textile workers abroad. (Aug 1999)

Ralph Nader on Social Security

* Social Security is solid; pending bankruptcy is nonsense. (Sep 2000)
* Pensions controlled by people, not banks or insurers. (Feb 2000)
* Social insurance is government at its noblest. (Jan 1999)
* Social Security privatization replaces certainty with risk. (Jan 1999)
* Fears loss of retirement funds in privatized investments. (Jan 1999)

Ralph Nader on Tax Reform

* Stop tax cuts and start dealing with real problems. (Jun 2003)
* Tax code loopholes benefit corporate donors & cost taxpayers. (Oct 2000)
* Sunshine on tax loopholes; sunset on tax breaks. (Oct 2000)
* Put meat in the process of progressive taxation. (Oct 2000)
* More taxpayer input into tax & spending policy. (Feb 2000)
* Tax breaks for big business hurt families. (Dec 1999)
* Tax breaks to big business unfairly hurt small business. (Apr 1999)
* Focus on under-taxation of corporations, not income tax. (Oct 1996)
* Against flat tax; keep progressivity. (Oct 1996)

Ralph Nader on Technology

* FCC is hapless agent in media regulation. (May 2003)
* The media needs more diversity and competition. (May 2003)
* FCC gave away $70B in airwave licenses to large corporations. (Oct 2000)
* Domain name registration needs openness to replace monopoly. (Oct 2000)
* Put all Congressional voting records on Internet. (Jun 2000)
* More free info from govt via computers & airwaves. (Feb 2000)
* Ruling against Microsoft bodes well for competition. (Nov 1999)
* Bold investment needed for public transportation. (Jul 1999)
* Microsoft is anticompetitive and anticonsumer. (Nov 1998)
* Microsoft must be stopped. (Nov 1998)
* The public owns the airwaves; express our rights. (Apr 1996)

Ralph Nader on War & Peace

* Responsible six-month withdrawal from Iraq occupation. (Jul 2004)
* Impeach Bush & Cheney for 5 falsehoods on Iraq war. (Apr 2004)
* Bush is acting as a selected dictator. (Jul 2003)
* US oil companies & Bush Admin eye Iraqi oil. (Feb 2003)
* US deserves to know the influence of the oil industry. (Feb 2003)
* Americans don't believe in Bush on Iraq. (Jan 2003)
* Palestinian statehood and security for Israel. (Sep 2002)
* Afghanistan: Bush burned down haystack to find needle. (Sep 2002)
* Wage peace and anticipate conflicts abroad. (Oct 2000)
* Should have anticipated Yugoslav breakup by “waging peace”. (Jul 2000)
* Forget “hot spots”; ask “How did we get into this?”. (Jun 2000)
* Iraq: Trade sanctions strengthen Saddam. (May 2000)
* Bosnia: Force acceptable to help against mass slaughter. (Oct 1996)

Ralph Nader on Welfare & Poverty

* Charity work is good; but politics addresses root causes. (Oct 2000)
* Attack corporate welfare kings, not poor welfare queens. (Oct 2000)
* Limit executive compensation to 30-to-1 over lowest pay. (Oct 2000)
* Domestic Marshall Plan to abolish poverty. (Oct 2000)
* Democracy can’t co-exist with gross income inequality. (Jun 2000)
* Retail malls siphon off business from central cities. (May 2000)
* Homelessness is peaking despite good economy. (May 2000)
* Big business lobbying subordinates democracy. (Feb 2000)
* Training & earned income credits are corporate subsidies. (Apr 1996)
Homelessness
* Severe shortage in affordable housing. (Jun 2003)
* 14M families spend half of their income on housing. (Jun 2003)
* 1.35 million children are homeless. (Jun 2003)


http://www.ontheissues.org/Ralph_Nader.htm


It's why I voted FOR HIM in 2000 and I am PROUD of that vote...

[LoZoccolo]

11. And all of that is made irrelevant by his methods.

You can't even get to that by going through Nader.

Did you even read the article? I thought people would like this one because it's rather calm and reasoned.

[Bonobo]

7. Boy, that Nader is wrecking this country! If it weren't for him...

This war in Iraq...!

The stalemate in the congress!

Further entrenched partisanship!

Sanctimonious self-righteous bastard!

Who does he think he is running as a 3rd party candidate! Fucker!

Oooops, that was your pal Joe Lieberman, not Nader. Sorry 'bout that...

:hi:

[LoZoccolo]

10. Where did I say that Lieberman was my pal?

You keep following me around saying that, but never substantiate it. I won't alert this post if you can give me an answer in the next, say, four hours? That long enough to find it? I was completely against Lieberman's third-party run.

[Bonobo]

19. You pushed for Lieberman big time. You may have been against his 3rd

party run, but you were all for him and his right-wing policies. I blame you for his undue influence with the Democratic party just as you continue to pursue your scorched-earth policy about Nader and his supporters.

As for your threats, go ahead and "alert" me. I think it's kind of a neo-fascist attitude towards debate, but well within your rights. Enjoy.

[SOS]

8. 2008 in LoZ's world:

Fred Thompson 49.87%
Hillary Clinton 49.83%
Ralph Nader 0.3%

A more realistic prognostication:

Hillary Clinton 55%
Fred Thompson 45%
Ralph Nader 0.0%

Stop worrying!
Ralph was not a factor in 2004 and he won't be a factor in 2008.

[SaveElmer]

9. The new Harold Stassen...

A formerly important figure, who succeeded in making himself completely irrelevant with repeated and increasingly bizarre runs at public office...

At least Stassen was a pleasant person...and got elected to something...

[BigDDem]

12. Sad, pathetic man

Go Away.

[trueblue2007]

13. RALPH NADER ... is one reason we have George Bush as "Resident"

If Nader hadn't been such a stupid stubborn old man.....we would have a different president.

[TheBaldyMan]

14. LZ are you allergic to left wing policies or what?

give it a rest , you started boring me months back with this 'Nader is bad m'kay' stuff.

We get it - you are a party robot.

Here's a challenge - come up with something original.

[LoZoccolo]

15. I reject the premise of your question.

Also, I made it clear a few weeks back that I would be going after Nader again and again. I usually do not post more than one thread a day, and sometimes wait until the next day if I find someone else has posted a Nader thread.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=3331917&mesg_id=3331917

[TheBaldyMan]

16. no surprises then,

Just one thought to leave you with, compare the energy you expended going after Nader to the energy you've expended fighting electoral fraud.

[LoZoccolo]

17. Everyone has a job to do.

I applaud those going after election fraud, but we can't all do one thing.

[Lilith Velkor]

18. If the Repubs had spent both Clinton terms incessantly whining about Perot

..., they'd be whinging about Gore's second term now.

Keep it up. Snatch that defeat from the jaws of victory. Third time's the charm and all that. :sarcasm: