Kos: It is no longer the DLC's party

[draft_mario_cuomo]

The DLC desperately tries to remain relevant, with Harold Ford and Maryland Gov. Martin O'Malley arguing some nonesuch about Democrats and the "center":

"In the past 150 years, only three Democrats, one of whom was Franklin Roosevelt, have won the White House with a majority of the popular vote."

As LithiumCola put it, one could also say, "In the past 63 years, only three Democrats, one of whom was Franklin Roosevelt, have won the White House with a majority of the popular vote." Fun with statistics and all...

But beyond that, here's a simple fact -- one of those presidents WASN'T Bill Clinton, the DLC's patron saint.

The DLC doesn't want a victorious Democratic Party unless such victories happen using their formula. We've been there, done that, and it simply didn't work. Even working out of their own playbook, we couldn't get that magical majority of the popular vote. We lost control of the House and the Senate. Things truly seemed hopeless. We as a movement sprung from those failures.

So we arrived on the scene. We didn't flinch from our position on the war. We held the line on social security, even as the Very Serious People told us it was irresponsible. We championed Dean when we were told it would kill the party. We championed Lamont when we were told it would cost us the Senate. We celebrated Nancy Pelosi when we were told we would be demonized as "San Francisco liberals".

And we won in 2006. And we didn't eeke out a victory, but won a wave election. And yes, we won the popular vote in 2006. (54-42 in the Senate, 54-46 in the House, and 56-44 in governor races.)

Funny, the DLC's top candidate -- Harold Ford himself -- lost even as populist Dems won all over the country, in every region (even in the South).

We helped build this majority. Not the DLC's 350 or so members. This is no longer their party. And as such, we can look forward to finally being truly competitive for years to come.

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2007/8/7/13300/36366

[kenfrequed]

1. Amen

I agree completely. I have never understood how you think you can get the popular vote without a little bit of populism.

[killbotfactory]

2. I certainly hope so

I'm getting sick of that fifth column irresponsibly wielding so much power in the democratic party.

[Totally Committed]

3. I read that earlier today, and thought about posting it here, but....

I'm glad you posted it. And, I'm glad Markos wrote it.

TC

[Catchawave]

112. I crosspost a lot of good diaries from the kossacks to here.

I should do it more when the forums start to get sticky with negative threads. Just to give the more serious DUers something to read :D

[wyldwolf]

4. the funny thing is, it never was. Glad to see some corners of the left expelling their demons.

[SaveElmer]

5. I'm glad to see Kos has defeated his imaginary bogeyman...

Should give him peace of mind...

[killbotfactory]

6. The DLC guys are boogeymen now?

wtf?

[wyldwolf]

7. what do you mean "now?" They always were to the left.

[killbotfactory]

14. Right.

I guess the DLC leadership hurling down scorn on any politician who didn't support the Iraq war was just in my imagination.

[wyldwolf]

16. ... but did they control the party? THAT is the question.

And the answer is no. They never did.

[killbotfactory]

19. Considering most of the party followed their advice?

They have had a major influence on the democratic party since Clinton was elected until the last election.

I'm not going to ignore their record of failure, selling out, and political cowardice.

[wyldwolf]

20. Really? How so?

[killbotfactory]

23. You're unreal.

Are you this clueless about their activities?

During the 2004 Primary campaign the DLC attacked Presidential candidate Howard Dean as an out-of-touch liberal because of Dean's position of only pursuing Osama Bin Laden instead of invading Iraq.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democratic_Leadership_Council

That's just what we need, democrats trying to out-republican republicans!

Fuck those DLC idiots.

[wyldwolf]

24. Because they criticized Howard Dean means most ot the party followed their advice????

:shrug:

[killbotfactory]

26. They criticized anyone against the Iraq war.

Fuck them.

[wyldwolf]

28. and that means most ot the party followed their advice????

[killbotfactory]

30. They are the poster children for Republican-Lite.

They represent everything that was wrong with the direction of the democratic party until Dean took over at the DNC.

[wyldwolf]

31. and that means most ot the party followed their advice????

[killbotfactory]

34. Yes, that's what happened.

Until we shitcanned their strategy in 2006 and finally won.

[wyldwolf]

36. ok, Finally. Now, give examples of how "most of the party followed their advice."

...leading to election losses.

[killbotfactory]

39. the 2002 IWR vote, followed by the 2002 election.

[wyldwolf]

41. Most of the party didn't follow their advice on the Iraq vote

A majority of Dem house members voted against it. Further, there is no correlation between the Iraq vote and 2002 election losses. Disagree? Show me the data.

[killbotfactory]

43. Not enough voted against it.

The DLC position was to support it to make us look tough, because they thought the public was too stupid to understand that opposing the Iraq war didn't make you a peacenik hippie.

[wyldwolf]

45. still, there was no majority as you asserted. Ok, want to try another example?

[SaveElmer]

8. For the left they have been...

They ascribe every ill of the party at the feet of an organization that up until recently wasn't even allowed to make contributions to candidates...

It is a convenient fall guy for the left to blame their inability to get and sustain a majority...

I wonder what they will use next...Lobbyists perhaps!

[killbotfactory]

10. You people are too much

[wyldwolf]

12. do a DU search of "DLC." You might even find they sunk the Titanic

[SaveElmer]

15. I heard they were responsible for the Dinosaur's dying out...nt

[killbotfactory]

17. Losing elections is enough

Their approach to issues led to failure after failure for democrats, and I'm supposed to ignore this because some people exaggerate their influence?

Bullshit.

[wyldwolf]

18. Losing elections? You must be talking about "progressives."

[killbotfactory]

21. Oh, I forgot the great democratic victories of 2000, 2002, 2004..

[wyldwolf]

22. How did the DLC lose those? What about the great Dem victories of '68, '72, '80, '84, '88?

[killbotfactory]

25. The DLC was founded in 85

Do you even know what the fuck you are talking about?

[wyldwolf]

27. uh... yes they were. Who do you blame losses on BEFORE 1985?

Do you even know what the fuck you are talking about?

[killbotfactory]

32. Obviously the democrats weren't following DLC principles back then.

The first major DLC victory was the election of Clinton/Gore, and the democrats followed their strategy until 2004. I blame them for that period, because the DLC was extremely influential at that time.

Once again, fuck the DLC.

[wyldwolf]

33. and yet Dems were losing elections in landslides before '85. Imagine that!

[Name removed]

35. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[wyldwolf]

37. It's obtuse to point out Dems lost elections more often and by larger margins pre-DLC?

[killbotfactory]

38. Yes, since that is irrelevent.

Do you think the political situation in the country has remained static over 50 years?

[wyldwolf]

40. it's completely relevant. If you're going to lay Dem losses since '85 at the DLC's feet...

...whose feet should loses before then be laid at?

[Name removed]

42. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[wyldwolf]

44. There was no loss in '85 and I didn't say you said that. What you DID say in post 17 was...

Losing elections is enough... Their approach to issues led to failure after failure for democrats

Then, you pointed out the DLC was formed in 1985. So, if the DLC's approach to issues "led to failure after failure for democrats" AFTER the DLC was formed in 1985, whose approach to issues "led to failure after failure for democrats" BEFORE 1985?

It really is a simple question.

[killbotfactory]

46. I was specifically talking about 2000,2002,2004

I don't need another lost election to realize their strategy needs to be scrapped, and why democrats lost 40 years ago is irrelevant to that.

[wyldwolf]

48. ok, show us with data, sources, and links how the DLC caused the losses in 2000,2002,2004

[killbotfactory]

50. Oh, okay, I'll get right on that

That's just the project I need to jump on in order to justify my opinion of the DLC to you.

Give me a week, and I'll have an essay turned into your desk. Will I get college credit for this?

Meanwhile here are some stats:

18,000. That's the number of people killed every year due to lack of health insurance.
1,000,000. That's the approximate number of people killed due to the Iraq war.
1,000,000,000,000. That's the amount of money the Iraq war will cost us if we are lucky.

The DLC opposes universal health insurance and supported the Iraq invasion.

Zero. That's how much influence I want the DLC to have among the democrats.

[wyldwolf]

63. sure you will. You have no facts to back your asserttions.

[killbotfactory]

76. Opinions aren't facts

In my view the DLC strategy is cowardly, disasterous, and loses election.

If you have a problem with that, go cry about it somewhere else.

[wyldwolf]

80. first correct thing you've said in this thread

[killbotfactory]

82. Here's a few more correct things I've said.

18,000. That's the number of people killed every year due to lack of health insurance.
1,000,000. That's the approximate number of people killed due to the Iraq war.
1,000,000,000,000. That's the amount of money the Iraq war will cost us if we are lucky.

The DLC opposes universal health insurance and supported the Iraq invasion.

Zero. That's how much influence I want the DLC to have among the democrats.

[jgraz]

53. Um...remind me again when the Dems lost control of Congress?

Hmmm...that wouldn't be RIGHT AFTER THEY ELECTED THEIR DLC PRESIDENT, would it?

[wyldwolf]

62. which time? And look up the definiton of this...:

post hoc ergo propter hoc

[jgraz]

87. So I'm assuming you have an explanation

...of how the DLC managed to piss away control of Congress two years after Clinton was elected? It couldn't have had anything to do with NAFTA or that ridiculous insurance company subsidy known as the Clinton Health Care plan, now could it?

[wyldwolf]

92. how would I have an explanation for something that did not happen?

[jgraz]

107. See, in my universe, the Dems lost control of Congress in 1994

What happened in your universe?

[wyldwolf]

114. but the DLC didn't "piss it away" as you asserted in post #87

[noiretextatique]

89. no...you are wasting your time

:hi:

[Tesha]

95. No, they were just for "staying the course".

> do a DU search of "DLC." You might even find they sunk the Titanic

No, they were just for "staying the course" as it
approached the iceberg.

Tesha

[wyldwolf]

102. then avoided it.

[Mythsaje]

9. Don't bother...

DLC apologist in the house.

[killbotfactory]

52. I should have followed your advice.

[KaptBunnyPants]

54. You're not saying they might be under my bed are you?

*shudder*

[wyldwolf]

11. remember way back when he was gonna make them "radioactive?"

That was a hoot!

[ulysses]

67. hey, you're back! we missed you guys.

Take a break after the FISA vote?

[SaveElmer]

70. HUh?

[ulysses]

71. that's what I'm saying.

You were missed! :D

[beachmom]

69. Did you read Harold Ford's letter? It was beyond lame.

The DLC had its time in the '90s. But its time is now over.

[KoKo]

13. Good! Thanks Kos...well said! n/t

[Bullet1987]

29. Is it a coincidence that all the DLC apologists on DU are most likely

Clinton supporters for 2008?

[jgraz]

55. Of course not! The DLC loves losing elections

That's the only explanation I can think of. The won that one in 1992, realized they had no functional ideas about governing and figured it would work out better if they just asked for corporate contributions without actually putting anyone in office.

[KaptBunnyPants]

56. That's like asking if it's a coincidence that freepers are Bush supporters.

Clinton epitomizes the DLC, except during the primary. Just like Lieberman was antiwar during the general election in 2006.

[flyarm]

59. no coincidence!!..good for Kos!! about time it was said! eom

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

47. "Populist Dems"?

That's a rather convenient choice of words, if I must say so. Most of the candidates that wound up winning are aligned with, even if not formally members of, the DLC.

Nice try, Kos. YOU, alone, didn't win anything. Democrats, DLC and San Francisco-style alike, won in 2006.

[wyldwolf]

49. over half the new House seats won in 2006 went to the DLC. Kos ignores that point.

[killbotfactory]

51. If we listened to the DLC, we wouldn't have the 50 state strategy

Which they decried as a waste of money.

So the only people elected would be DLC-aligned.

[jgraz]

61. If only DLC candidates had won in 2006, we wouldn't control either house

If only non-DLC candidates had won in 2006, we'd still have the House by a good margin. Simple math.

[wyldwolf]

64. LOL! DLC candidates DID win in 2006 - giving us the House.

[KoKo]

72. Why are you ALWAYS...Sooooo Gleeful? It's as if you are a cheerleader

in a stadium with the losing team and you are sitting there with the last die hards who can't get over...the "TEAM" IS LOSING! The STAR Quarterback has crashed and burned! There's nothing to pull out of this? :shrug:

I admire your sloggin on...but sheesh...it's getting to be a broken record...it just stops in one place and hits the same grove...or maybe that CD that got that spot that just won't let you got past it until you wipe it off or do a skip hoping it won't gum stuff up. :shrug:

[wyldwolf]

75. because it's funny to watch people get the facts wrong again and again

It's as if you are a cheerleader in a stadium with the losing team and you are sitting there with the last die hards who can't get over...the "TEAM" IS LOSING! The STAR Quarterback has crashed and burned! There's nothing to pull out of this?

Sorry. The DLC won over half of the new seats in the House in 2006. The star quarterback is currently kicking your asses.

:shrug:

[KoKo]

81. Wyld...what you just said is the truth of it...

but...I know you don't get what I say. Still..admire your Pluckiness.

[killbotfactory]

77. You are very good at misreading posts

congrats.

[wyldwolf]

79. "If only DLC candidates had won in 2006, we wouldn't control either house"

But they DID win in 2006.

[killbotfactory]

83. Yes, but not JUST DLC candidates.

That's the point of the sentence.

If the DLCers were still in charge, there would be no 50 state strategy, and 2006 wouldn't have been a victory for us.

[wyldwolf]

93. Here are the 16 DLC House candidates that won in 2006

- Gabby Giffords (AZ-8)
- Michael Arcuri (NY-24)
- Ed Perlmutter (CO-07)
- Joe Courtney (CT-02)
- Ron Klein (FL-22)
- Tim Mahoney (FL-16)
- Joe Sestak (PA-07)
- Heath Shuler (NC-11)
- Bruce Braley (IA-01)
- Chris Carney (PA-10)
- Nick Lampson (TX-22)
- Jason Altmire (PA-04)
- Kirstin Gillibrand (NY-20)
- Baron Hill (IN-09)
- Chris Murphy (CT-5)
- Patrick Murphy (PA-8)}

[Capn Sunshine]

113. But the disingenuous part of this argument

It wasn't the DLC that won the election for these candidates- it was the agreement by the populist wing of the party to support them, *DESPITE* DLC connections. It was Bill Clinton and his coat tails who won elections- not the DLC party line. There's such a thing as politics, and it's impolitic of you to crow victory every time we compromise to further things for the good of the entire party.

These homilies of yours are so wearisome.

Unlike you, my job isn't to live online at DU, so I can't engage in your Q&A designed to make that OK in your own minds. Bye for now.

[wyldwolf]

115. that's the fantasy part of the argument you just gave

t wasn't the DLC that won the election for these candidates- it was the agreement by the populist wing of the party to support them,

Nope. It was a combination of the right candidates in those districts. All the "populist" support in the world could not have elected Dennis Kucinich in Heath Shuler's district.

Further, those candidates were aided by the DCCC and voted into office by Democrats and Dem leaning independents.

Unlike you, my job isn't to live online at DU, so I can't engage in your Q&A designed to make that OK in your own minds. Bye for now.

See, you and yours (I guess the populist wing?) always have to take little personal swipes like that. No, I guess your job is to live online at that less traveled site across the highway. Dean Underground. LOL!

[jgraz]

85. It must be fun for you to just spew information without regard to accuracy

So much easier than actually having your facts straight.

Rahm's candidates got us 8 seats in 2006 -- not enough to take the House. Non-DLC/DCCC-backed candidates won 23 seats. In other words, following to Rahm we get 8 seats and lose the House. Following to Dean and the 50-state strategy, we get 23 seats and still win the majority.

Were you perhaps watching a different election on Nov 7th? I think Tajikistan held one that same week...

[wyldwolf]

91. here are the 16 DLC candidates who won House seats in 2006

- Gabby Giffords (AZ-8)
- Michael Arcuri (NY-24)
- Ed Perlmutter (CO-07)
- Joe Courtney (CT-02)
- Ron Klein (FL-22)
- Tim Mahoney (FL-16)
- Joe Sestak (PA-07)
- Heath Shuler (NC-11)
- Bruce Braley (IA-01)
- Chris Carney (PA-10)
- Nick Lampson (TX-22)
- Jason Altmire (PA-04)
- Kirstin Gillibrand (NY-20)
- Baron Hill (IN-09)
- Chris Murphy (CT-5)
- Patrick Murphy (PA-8)}

[jgraz]

58. So what's your point? You try to pretend above that the DLC hasn't controlled the party

yet then you say that over half the new house seats went to the DLC. Which is it?

[wyldwolf]

65. there's a major difference in winning elections and "controlling the party."

The DLC won over half the new House seats, bringing their total to 63. But how many Dems are in the House?

[flyarm]

60. sure when state dem party money is only going to DLC candidates..not hard to do!

while ignoring great dem candidates in our states!! saw it happen to many grest dems ..in my state..Rahmn did a great job fucking our local dem candidates..going so far as having repugs change their registration to run against great dems and giving the repug transfers all the state dem money!!

Rahmn fucked all our dem candidates in my county in fla!!

great job dlc..we all know it...and we know who was behind it!!
oh and the chair of our FDP..took $35,000. last year from
a repug lobbiest...

makes one all warm and fuzzy you know!!

fly

oh and ps..we did not win any seats in 2006..thanks to the dlc fucking our real dem candidates...when everywhere else in the country seats were picked up..we all thank Rahmn for that!!

[wyldwolf]

66. which is how it's always done.

[OzarkDem]

68. Care to provide a list?

and how many Senate seats did you win?

[wyldwolf]

73. sure,

- Gabby Giffords (AZ-8)
- Michael Arcuri (NY-24)
- Ed Perlmutter (CO-07)
- Joe Courtney (CT-02)
- Ron Klein (FL-22)
- Tim Mahoney (FL-16)
- Joe Sestak (PA-07)
- Heath Shuler (NC-11)
- Bruce Braley (IA-01)
- Chris Carney (PA-10)
- Nick Lampson (TX-22)
- Jason Altmire (PA-04)
- Kirstin Gillibrand (NY-20)
- Baron Hill (IN-09)
- Chris Murphy (CT-5)
- Patrick Murphy (PA-8)}

http://www.house.gov/apps/list/press/ca10_tauscher/NDCMEMBERSELECT.html

[jgraz]

57. (Big Ben Chimes) Wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong. Wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong

You're wrooong....you're wroooong.

• Bernie Sanders: First Socialist in the Senate.



• Sherrod Brown: Unapologetic liberal beats incumbent DeWine by 12 points.



• Jon Tester: Populist wins Senate seat after destroying DSCC favorite, center-right John Morrison, in the primary.



• Amy Klobuchar: Democratic-Farm-Labor senatorial candidate wins by 20-point margin.



• Sheldon Whitehouse: Liberal Democrat beats centrist Republican Lincoln Chafee.



• Jim Webb: Beats George "Macaca" Allen with a strong anti-war, pro-economic justice message.



• Jerry McNerny: Beats Richard Pombo after a primary win over DCCC-backed Steve Filson.



• Keith Ellison: Anti-war Muslim wins multi-candidate primary, goes on to take MN 5th district seat.



• John Hall: Musician and environmental activist wins Sue Kelly's house seat after taking 48% of the vote in a 4-way primary.



• Carol Shea-Porter : Wins NH house seat after beating centrist and party favorite Jim Craig in the primary 54%-34%.



• David Loebsack: Strong anti-war, pro-universal healthcare Dem beats centrist Jim Leach in Iowa's 2nd.



• John Yarmuth: Progressive, independent newspaper publisher beats three moderates in the KY 3rd district primary, then beats Anne Northup with zero financial support from the DCCC.



• Zack Space: Wins Bob Ney's seat after beating three primary opponents including (wait for it...) DCCC-backed centrist Joe Sulzer.



• Tammy Duckworth: DCCC-supported, ambiguously centrist candidate loses IL house seat to Pete Roskam.



• Harold Ford, Jr.: Pro-life, anti-gay, pro-war Dem loses TN Senate race to Bob Corker.

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

94. Once again, nice try.

That's only 15 seats, and you very inaccurately describe a lot of those races as well.

And next time you try to be clever, try not to steal your material from a TV show.

[jgraz]

106. It's called an allusion

Probably a bit too sophisticated for you, but that's ok

Oh, and would you mind pointing out which part of my information is inaccurate? None of it? I thought so.

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

118. See post 110

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

120. Still got nothin?

Or was my post too sophisticated for an ignorant pompous ass like you?

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

110. Let's see if I can't give it a go...

You seem to have one common thread among your examples - anyone anti-war must not be DLC, which is baffling in its ignorance.

# Bernie Sanders: First Socialist in the Senate.
-Not even a Democrat!

# Jon Tester: Populist wins Senate seat after destroying DSCC favorite, center-right John Morrison, in the primary.
-Tester's platform is almost entirely DLC. This is probably the most bone-headed of your inclusions.

# Sheldon Whitehouse: Liberal Democrat beats centrist Republican Lincoln Chafee.
-...in one of the most liberal states in the U.S.

# Jim Webb: Beats George "Macaca" Allen with a strong anti-war, pro-economic justice message.
-Again, platform almost entirely DLC.

# Jerry McNerny: Beats Richard Pombo after a primary win over DCCC-backed Steve Filson.
-Why, exactly, do you think DCCC=DLC? Is there any basis for this whatsoever?

# Keith Ellison: Anti-war Muslim wins multi-candidate primary, goes on to take MN 5th district seat.
-Do you even know anything else about Ellison?

# John Hall: Musician and environmental activist wins Sue Kelly's house seat after taking 48% of the vote in a 4-way primary.
-Are you saying no DLC members are environmentalists?

# David Loebsack: Strong anti-war, pro-universal healthcare Dem beats centrist Jim Leach in Iowa's 2nd.
-Hillary Clinton was one of the first to propose universal healthcare, and she's in DLC leadership.

# John Yarmuth: Progressive, independent newspaper publisher beats three moderates in the KY 3rd district primary, then beats Anne Northup with zero financial support from the DCCC.
-Why, exactly, do you think DCCC=DLC? Is there any basis for this whatsoever?

# Zack Space: Wins Bob Ney's seat after beating three primary opponents including (wait for it...) DCCC-backed centrist Joe Sulzer.
-Why, exactly, do you think DCCC=DLC? Is there any basis for this whatsoever? By the way, he is officially a Blue Dog Democrat.

# Tammy Duckworth: DCCC-supported, ambiguously centrist candidate loses IL house seat to Pete Roskam.
-Why, exactly, do you think DCCC=DLC? Is there any basis for this whatsoever?

# Harold Ford, Jr.: Pro-life, anti-gay, pro-war Dem loses TN Senate race to Bob Corker.
-He's also black and suffered a very racist campaign in a state not known for its open-mindedness.

Might I also add a few items?

-Congressman Heath Shuler
-Congressman Brad Ellsworth
-Congresswoman Kirsten Gillibrand
-Congresswoman Gabrielle Giffords
-Congressman Baron Hill
-Congressman Nick Lampson
-Congressman Charles Wilson
-Congressman Tim Mahoney
-Senator Claire McCaskill

All DLC, all Freshmen Democrats. So in addition to your three woefully misguided inclusions above, there are 9 more DLC-type Democrats for you, which I believe reduces your 15 examples to 12, most of which are poor examples at best anyhow.


And, by the way, an allusion is a literary device, and is almost never taken word-for-word. Further, your post is hardly literature.

[wyldwolf]

116. ouch! Damn! By the way, I did a position by position break down on Webb and Testor

They are very DLC -like.

John Tester took several pages out of the Clinton/DLC playbook at the state level, specifically on his balanced budget proposals.

He believes the government should work to limit abortions and believe, again like Clinton, the procedure should be safe, legal, and rare.

He is tough on crime, and especially believes in enforcing illegal drug laws.

He believes in a strong national defense.

He's a strong Second Amendment rights advocate and will "stand up to anyone - Democrat or Republican - who wants to take away gun rights."

He believes health care should be affordable and assessable (not necessarily provided by the government.)

He believes we should secure our borders to keep out illegal drugs and illegal immigrants. Companies who hire illegal immigrants should be punished.

Webb, a bit too conservative for my tastes, but still a welcome change...

... an absolutist on Second Amendment rights — the right to keep and bear arms.

... not real big on affirmative action.


I don’t like the fact that he doesn't care much for Bill Clinton and once refused to shake John Kerry’s hand because of his opposition to the Viet Nam war.

He's been described as “the most deeply conservative national Democrat since Grover Cleveland.”

[Lerkfish]

74. "unless such victories happen using their formula"

interesting line there.

[IndianaGreen]

78. My fellow Kossacks are so busy in self-congratulations that they haven't noticed

how the ruling class and their DLC pals are fixing the nomination so that no candidate posing a threat to them is nominated.

Who got over $800,000 from the health care industry? Do you think that this candidate, who is currently leading in national polls, will support either Kucinich's single payer health system, or extending Medicare to all Americans?

[Broke Dad]

84. I'm glad that the Internet allows us to communicate outside the media

Except for a couple of Hillary storm troopers who keep beating us over the head, the DU has been a great source of progressive political information and news. DU posts has been hours if not days ahead of the national media on breaking stories. My daughter works for a Gannett paper and they are struggling to cover emerging stories with ongoing budget cuts as readership continues to decline. She has as many as nine stories on her desk at a time. Not only does she have to cover presidential candidates in Iowa, she has to cover the local university, local businesses, the upheaval at our local hospitals, etc. And it doesn't help that Hillary, among others, will not agree to answer direct questions from the local media. My daughter are relegated to press releases and face time with handlers. She says it sucks. The flip side for her is that bloggers don't have to double check their facts before posting.

So keep sharing your observations from your local scene, and we'll keep injecting an alternative point of view every time a Hillary drone posts their propaganda.

[AtomicKitten]

86. Who?

[Geek_Girl]

88. I find it telling that no Presidential Candidate attended the DLC convention

But almost all the candidates attended the annual Kos convention. I really do think that the DLC is loosing ground in the democratic party.

[KoKo]

90. Didn't want to be CAUGHT THERE....Bad Cred if they show up...but

they probably sent Videos there and their high priced Campaign Aides were there schmoozing the crowd.

Just because some of them weren't there doesn't mean that their "presence wasn't there" in some way or the other.

I'm just glad that it's "NOT COOL" to be seen on THE LIST of ATTENDING DLC Convention this year. Maybe it will get better years after this where our Dems will start to hit back at DLC Outmoded/Outdated Policies that were in many ways as bad as what the Right under Gingrich were working for... It's just when it comes out of Dem Mouths it goes down like honey..out of Gingrich's mouth it's bitter vinegar that no Dem would swallow.

End result, though is that Repugs just LOVE Vinegar...and Dems stick with the Honey....:-(

[harun]

96. On the front page of the DLC website...

It lists Health Care under the section "Economic Opportunity".

How depressing is that?

[wyldwolf]

97. seems to me that free or reduced healthcare costs would open a wide economic door for me

[Odin2005]

98. Sometimes I wish that Clinton had LOST the 1992 election.

Clinton won because of his charisma and because a chunk of the Republican Party bolted to Ross Perot, yet the DLC try to pretend that they got Clinton elected as used that lie to maintain thier stranglehold on the party. Had Clinton lost the DLC would of never had the chance to infiltrate the party so easily.

[wyldwolf]

100. two myths in one post. Wow!

[Odin2005]

109. Myths?

[wyldwolf]

117. yeah, things that have been made up....

"Clinton won because of his charisma and because a chunk of the Republican Party bolted to Ross Perot."

Two myths - the latter of which began as a rightwing excuse for Bush losing and has been debunked on DU countless times

[jmp]

99. Ask Al Gore ...

Even working out of their own playbook, we couldn't get that magical majority of the popular vote.

The "popular vote" doesn't mean spit. What matters is who gets the electoral votes.








And Clinton secured a heck of a lot more than 50% of those ... including winning several southern states.

[RestoreGore]

101. We won in 2006?

And that's not to side with any side, just asking, because I don't see it.

[OHdem10]

103. Democrats before85------Had more Real Democrats

who belonged to the Democratic Wing of the Democratic Party.
Dems often controlled the house.

Regan came in--Many DLC drank Regan Koolaid and have
never recovered.

[wyldwolf]

104. A compact yet ultimately false assessment

[karynnj]

105. Isn't he ignoring the obvious?

The front runner is Hillary Clinton, who may have chosen to apppear at the YearlyKos over the DLC, but who is part of the DLC leadership. Which type of policies and who will she likely appoint to her cabinet - progressives or DLC people? Look at people associated with her campaign.

Oh, as to the decision to go to YearlyKos - where could she likely get more votes she doesn't already have?

[wyldwolf]

108. he's feeding red meat to his readers.

KOS has been on his anti-DLC jihad for at least four years, a period which has seen a DLC candidate win the Democratic nomination, DLC candidates sweep into Governorships, DLC candidates taking over half the house seats we won, and a DLC candidate running away with the nomination for 2008

I've said it many times - KOS hatred of the DLC severely clouds his sense of reality.

[cmkramer]

111. I don't trust Dailykos

Besides, the DLC actually supports the vast majority of Democratic issues and disagrees with Bush 99.9% of the time

[Totally Committed]

119. kick

:kick:

TC