Richardson didn't gaffe, homosexuality can be a choice

[Herman Munster]

Sexual orientation is not a black and white thing. It's a continum. Most people are on the far ends and are exclusively heterosexual or homosexual. Many are in the middle somewhere. A lot of people fall into line because of social or religious pressures and just bury any feelings for the wrong sex. But people can and do choose to flip flop all the time. I don't think there is one right answer for sexual orientation. It can be genetic. It can be a choice.

[Bluebear]

1. Is that so, Doctor?

[China_cat]

2. When did you choose to be heterosexual?

[Herman Munster]

3. it wasn't a choice for me

I've always been heterosexual and at the far end of the continuum. But I've talked to bisexual people who flip flops all the time. And they choose who to be with based on their feelings at the time and it always changes. Lots of straight and gay people ostracize those folks and just don't get that some people are just sexual people and can love anybody. They don't care who.

[Bluebear]

4. So it's NOT a choice for you to be heterosexual, but it's a choice to be gay.

Do you hear how ridiculous that sounds?

[Herman Munster]

6. It wasn't a choice for ME to be straight

It may not be a choice for you to be GAY.

But for some people it is their CHOICE to be.

Why does everyone have to make it a black and white thing? Life isn't like that. There's lots of gray areas. That's my whole point.

[JI7]

11. they are not choosing to be bisexual

bisexuals who are with someone of the opposite sex are still bisexual just as they are still bisexual if they are with someone of the same sex.

[rodeodance]

14. So you say it was NOT a choice for you. This sounds pretty black and white

to me.



It wasn't a choice for ME to be straight

[democratsin08]

9. thats a simple one

we dont choose our genetics. genetically we are born male or femal with the appropriate genitals. what we choose to do with them is our business.

[Deja Q]

5. What does with one's feelings is the choice.

'nuff said.

[China_cat]

13. No, what you're saying is that

those who have 'inappropriate' attractions should not enjoy a meaningful relationship.

(Inappropriate in the sense of 'I don't like that shit so you aren't going to be allowed to do it')

[Wiccan Warrior]

7. You're full of it..n/t

[democratsin08]

29. when did everyone on here choose to be a liberal?

is there a liberal gene? conservative gene? the fact is the only thing genetically proven is that we are born male or female. what we CHOOSE to do with them is our choice.

[Hollow Shells]

34. When I had kids

before I had kids I chose to be Libertarian.

[Wiccan Warrior]

36. I did not choose to be gay....Geeeze wake up...

[JI7]

8. what you describe isn't a choice

homosexuals who feel pressure from society to be with those of the opposite sex and have sex with them are still homosexuals. they didn't suddenly turn hetero .

[EST]

10. I read some of the comments, down thread, and I think you got caught

defending what you didn't quite say.
I've thought about posting a topic that looks at sexual expression as you do, nearly, with people being along somewhere on the spectrum, wherever the hell that is, rather than being assigned to pigeonholes.

The other thing about choice, though, needs to be nailed down a bit more tightly before it means anything.
Peoples' lives don't work too well when they stay stuck in the closet, inauthentic, jamming their own self respect.
Peoples' lives begin to work when they choose reality.

We are the reality based community and the way we stay sane is by actively choosing, moment by moment, to embrace what is, rather than what is not.
Do not, however, confuse choice with decision! We cannot just one day decide to be heterosexual: that decision is gone and we don't get to make it.
To live a satisfying life, however, we do have choice, even though that choice may be limited to only one option. We are the way we are. To live life, get on with it--choose to be the way you are and be that way even more-slather it all over--immerse yourself in it.

Choose it.

[xchrom]

12. but that's not homosexuality -- it's bi-sexuality.

i'm gay -- and even though i have had hetero relationships in my life -- even then i was gay -- not bi{i feel the need to qualify here -- not that i didn't have fun with women -- i did}.

there is no choice in how i feel about men -- none.

[Dawgs]

16. Thanks, finally the right answer.

I'm a heterosexual male that started liking girls when I was 11 or 12. I didn't choose to like them, it just happened. The same is true for homosexuals.

Richardson was wrong.

[Totally Committed]

18. Exactly.

If you feel any element of being able to choose or "flip-flop", you are bi-sexual. If your preference is beyond your control, you are gay.

Regardless, I don't see why the government feels the ability to grant you equal rights under the law. Gays, bis, and straights all pay the same taxes. Why should any group of individuals be singled out as less worthy of protection under the law? I just don't see why it can't be stated that simply, with those who disagree labeled as bigoted. (Because that's what they are! -- They believe not all American citizens are equal. That's a BIGOT.)

My 2-cents FWIW.

TC

[SaveElmer]

20. I agree that sexual preference is not a choice...and Richardson was wrong...but

To be fair to him, he made the exact same point you did in the second part of your answer in response to Etheridge's question...it is forgotten because of the initial blunder...

[pretzel4gore]

15. it's 2k7; why is it still an issue?

people 'choose' to get up in the morning. nevermind that they must go to work. or cook breakfast for the nag rats etc....most societies, even religio-conservative ones like arabia or say puritan england, developed 'don't ask/tell' policies regarding gays, cuz too often it was family members 'suffering' the affliction, and, if the blue noses stfu then the rest of the people did too. IOW, gayness just isn't an issue unless the rightwing pig NEEEDS to exploit it (regardless of family members who are gay, the idea the private power will nudgewink protect them)...while what you suggest is worthy of debate, it should not get in the way of the people seeing that the issue itself is a psych op by mr pig and his gang o thieves. Let's roundem all up, shootem all etc, then, and ONLY THEN, maybe debate whether gayness is choosen, or hard wired etc...
Liberace was a big star in the 50's/60's- mr pig knew better then to try to hurt someone who was genuinely popular with all the people, though as plainly gay as junyer bush! But unlike junyer, or rush limbah humbug etc, Liberace wasn't hiding anything- his persona enriched the culture ...bush and the rest of mr pig are thieves and murderers, and they're in power, ferchrissake! That should be like a flat tire on a long trip: ie the first thing you fix

[sendero]

17. Can be...

... a small percentage of the time, is not the same as "is".

If something is true 10% of the time, I don't go around saying it is "true", because that is a lie.

[CreekDog]

19. Orientation is not a choice

The gender of the partner you choose is a choice. The gender you are attracted to is probably not a choice.

Understand the difference?

[saltpoint]

21. I think I would have liked to have seen Bill Richardson turn the

question into an indictment of the GOP's propensity for using this as a wedge issue.

He might have responded, "A governor or a president must represent all the people. I'd like to know why the Republican Party has almost uniformly used this as an issue to divide people, to polarize public discourse, to alienate and invade the bedrooms of U.S. citizens. I think the burden of explanation is on the Republicans, and urge all voters to bring pressure to bear on a politcal party that uses this issue as a weapon. America should be better than that."

[Karenina]

37. Do send that to him!!!

:evilgrin::applause:

The OP is a bit disingenuous. Sexual orientation as "choice" is a destructive meme. Even if it were, IT DOESN'T MATTER.

[whopgood]

22. let's see...

It can be a CHOICE if you wish to deceive yourself and, as a gay man, sleep only with women. Yes, I can see that as a choice. But a man born gay IS a gay man. A woman born gay IS a gay woman. You can choose to deceive yourself and repress yourself, causing all sorts of mental harm, but you can NOT choose to be gay or not.

[NMMNG]

23. I'm failing to see where the choice comes in

:shrug:


Bisexuality is an inborn orientation, not a choice. You may see it as "flip flopping" but it's not any more than is dating Mary then dating Susie.

[tkmorris]

24. It doesn't matter

You don't say that to a room full of gay people unless you are trying to deliberately yank their chain or you just don't get it.

Bill doesn't get it. He may well be a good egg at heart, but we can't seriously consider someone this out of touch with society can we?

[nickinSTL]

25. you're wrong...at least in your approach

homosexuality is NOT a choice. Whether to act on one's homosexual inclination can be.

If you're so caught up in your fundamentalist religions (of whatever flavor) - that you think homosexuality is a horrible sin...yes, you can suppress your desires...and likely spend your life miserable.

And, as for the other points...sexuality is a sort of continuum, but if you're comfortable being with members of either sex ("flip-flopping", as you'd apparently put it) - you're BISEXUAL.

Some people who are primarily heterosexual occasionally find themselves having an attraction to a particular person of the same sex...this doesn't make them homosexual, but just with some bisexual tendencies.

None of this is a CHOICE. It's a matter of where you fall on the continuum. (which may possibly change over a person's lifetime, I'm not sure on that).

[AnotherGreenWorld]

26. Even if you were right that homosexuality is sometimes a choice,

Richardson didn't say anything like that.

When asked if he thought homosexuality was a choice, he said flatly, "It's a choice," not even "I think it's a choice, and I have no basis for this. I'm a fucking retard, and I say really stupid shit." Then when he realized he said something retarded, he said, 'well, I'm no scientist."

[Bluebear]

28. You summed it up perfectly. nt

[Solon]

27. Your confusing two different issues, bisexuality most likely is biological...

so is Heterosexuality and Homosexuality. The fact of matter is that, for bisexuals it IS a choice, but they AREN'T homosexual or heterosexual, they are BIsexual. Some may fall within a continuum where they have a slight preference for one sex or the other, but fall in love with the person rather than the sex of that person, as I have heard it termed.

[Musty]

30. This isn't the first...

time Richardson has been caught revealing his true feelings about homosexuality. When Imus was still on the air, he called someone a maricon, which is the equivalent of the word, fag. His bigger problem though, is his hypocracy on the matter of gay marriage. He's against it--why? Because he doesn't want to offend voters who believe that gay marriage belittles or threatens straight marriage? It is self-serving to kowtow to specious arguments about gay marriage when your own marriage is rife with infidelities.

[AtomicKitten]

31. Richardson admitted he didn't really know if it is choice or biological.

Ignorance is a reason to not "get" this debate, and Richardson was clear he didn't really know.

Unfortunately his best guess was wrong, but I think his admission that he isn't clear on the subject gives him, or should give him, a modicum of grace.

[bunnies]

32. Youre not close to many gay people, are you. n/t

[goodgd_yall]

33. Is the question of nurture or nature the same as

the question of choice or not choice?

[DuaneBidoux]

35. I think there is a great deal about sexuality that is simply not known and too fluid to know.

Without doubt many, maybe most, would say it is not a choice, but I think there are some people that do make conscious choices and some for whom nothing else could ever be.

One person might say "I didn't choose to be straight (or gay)" and there may be someone else that chooses, intellectually, to be very experimental with sexuality.

I tend to think that for the vast majority of people sexuality (feelings vs. practice), is not a choice, it is simply who they are. But I am not ready to pound anyone into the ground that expresses a different opinion as long as it is a tolerant one.