Chung, Huang, Hsu, Chatwal - Hil's Fraudulent Fundraisers

[sandnsea]

Johnny Chung, 43, who delivered a $50,000 campaign contribution to the White House and escorted Chinese businessmen to a presidential radio address, is cooperating with the Justice Department's investigation of finance abuses in the 1996 campaign.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/special/campfin/players/chung.htm

“While a mid-level Commerce Department official, Huang (pronounced "Wong") enjoyed extraordinary access to President Clinton…As a fund-raiser for the Democratic National Committee in 1996, Huang raised $3.4 million for the party and its campaign, mostly from the Asian American community. The DNC has since returned nearly half of the money, determining that it was improperly raised or came from questionable donors, some of them from overseas.”
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/special/campfin/players/huang.htm

“Sant S. Chatwal, an Indian American businessman, has helped raise hundreds of thousands of dollars for Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton's campaigns...
Across the ocean, three Indian banks forced him into U.S. bankruptcy, and he was charged with bank fraud. He was out on bond when he showed up in India in 2001 during a visit by his longtime friend Bill Clinton.
Yet none of the legal and financial woes -- occasionally touched on in American or Indian newspapers or highlighted by political opponents -- raised red flags inside Hillary Clinton's fundraising operation. Chatwal recently said he plans to help raise $5 million from Indian Americans for Clinton's presidential bid…”
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/09/02/AR2007090201436.html?hpid%3Dtopnews&sub=AR

And now, Hsu is added to the list.

[DURHAM D]

1. This isn't going to go well for you. eom

[jefferson_dem]

2. Why not? Should we excuse such shady relationships?

:shrug:

[rinsd]

11. When the poster focuses on only certain shady relationships they shoudl be called on it.

Sandnsea now is claiming that donations to other candidates and the tens of thousands donated to the party where simply to throw people off the Clinton's scent.

This is a Democratic scandal, but some rather turn it into a Clinton scandal.

Since both the Clinton and Obama campaigns have given Hsu's money to charity ,the issue should be done.

But a 15 year old case about a major Dem fundraiser comes to light in the middle of a primary season where the GOP is reeling and the Dems are kicking butt at the polls in the fundraising dept?

I'm not a big tinfoil guy but since this first emanated from the WSJ then was expanded upon a now conservatively owned LA Times I am suspicious.

[karynnj]

34. A better argument might be that he looked legitimate when he became a Hilraiser

This is a guy who was on the board of New School University. It looks like he gradually increased his support of Democrats over the last 3 years. I think that this may signal that the campaigns should attempt to know more about the big donors - but that may be tough. How do you ask someone who is saying they can bundle money for you to provide you with the ability to investigate them. Here, the guy had a 15 yr old warrant out for him - but it would seem unlikely that anyone in the NYC Democratic fund raising circles knew this.

There is also NO claim that he asked any favor from Hillary Clinton in return for raising the money. This is a point that the RW is ignoring as they call him the Democratic Abramoff. This is an important difference - and why Bob Ney resigned and faced indictment.

Rather than blame Clinton, we should:

- Support real campaign finance reform

- If that doesn't work, campaigns may have to investigate the big donors who do fund raising - if only to prevent this.

Even then, there will always be some contributions that come from sources that later are found to be from people candidates do not want to be associated with. Most of the people who got money from Hsu or people whose contributions he later bundled, had nothing that would have red flagged those contributions. (ie in 2004 and 2005, he made many donations as an individual that were within the limits and seemed to have kosher information required for federal records. Even if the head financial person of a campaign personally looked at each donation above say, $250, this would still look ok.)

It seems the Clintons did everything they could on this - quickly cutting ties and returning his money. They likely should be investigating all the bundled money from him as well - just to insure they clear up any potential problems. (If they don't at least look at the bundled money, they are asking for the story to continue.)

Fair or not fair, the campaign finance scandals that McAuliffe and the Clintons were accused of in the 1990s make them more susceptible than others - so they really need to be seen as very open and working to fix this.

[rinsd]

35. Always an impressive post....always.

[karynnj]

38. Thank you -

[sandnsea]

3. Nothing at DU ever goes well for me

what the fuck else is new.

This is who the Clintons are. If the Hsu story hadn't broken, I'd have let sleeping dogs lie. But when people want to try to pretend this fundraising garbage isn't the key and consistent problem with the Clintons - well then hell no, I'll step up. I'm not afraid of a fight.

[redqueen]

8. I'm glad you're still here,

fighting.

[sandnsea]

12. thank you

As we haven't always seen eye to eye, that means a lot. :hug:

[flpoljunkie]

15. The FBI is investigating the Hsu donations. This story is not over, altho cable news is ignoring it.

[Gregorian]

4. There's another article posted today that includes Obama.

I have no idea what the relationship or donation is. I'm just saying I saw it.

Here-

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x1739188

[sandnsea]

5. They are Clinton fundraisers

Quite often a key fundraiser will raise money for many people, but it doesn't change who the fundraiser chiefly backs. This is a Clinton fundraiser and deflecting a few thousand off to other people is to really lie about the relationship. They know what they're doing, even if a lot of rank and file people don't understand.

That's why I posted the others. This is a recurring situation. They haven't learned a thing.

[rinsd]

6. Except when they raise money for other people

Chung - As part of a plea agreement with federal prosecutors in March, Chung was charged with funneling illegal contributions to the 1996 Clinton-Gore campaign by asking friends and employees of his office technology firm to make donations for which they were later reimbursed. Chung was also charged with engaging in a similar "straw donor" scheme to assist the 1996 reelection bid of Sen. John F. Kerry (D-Mass.)

"This is a Clinton fundraiser and deflecting a few thousand off to other people is to really lie about the relationship."

Now donations to other candidates and the party is a setup to deflect attention from the Clintons?

:rofl:

[sandnsea]

10. Yeah I already said that

The ONE campaign contribution that Kerry had a problem with, was a Clinton fundraiser.

Any Democrat that gets mixed up with these mega-million Clinton crooks ends up being USED as the Clintons deflect their bullshit off onto other people.

[rinsd]

13. You get more and more ridiculous with each post.

I knew eventually your hatred of Clinton would get to you but I imagined it happening closer to primaries.

[sandnsea]

16. damn ethics, really ridiculous n/t

[karynnj]

36. In 1996, the Clintons raised money for many people

This was an operation that McAuliffe oversaw. Kerry was one of many - and he returned the money as soon as Chung was deemed questionable. Kerry has a 3 decade record of being a very clean politician. He was the author of the Clean Elections bill with Wellstone and rejected PAC money for all 4 Senate campaigns.

[Gregorian]

7. I'm so innocent.

Our election process is screwed up.

Sadly, by the time we figure it out, we die and the next generation has to learn it all over again. I hope to be wrong this time. The internet has sped up the process.

And thanks for the quick little education.

[sandnsea]

17. I worry about that too

Now I know why my grandparents were always saying "in my day" - good lord, now I do it too. In my day we didn't have to put thumb prints on checks and have pictures taken - we knew that the best security was knowing our neighbors. In my day a candy bar was 3 times this size and only a nickel, and minimum wage was $1.80; you know you're being cheated with $1.00 candy bars and $5.00 minimum wage. In my day, yeah, well, you're nodding off, like my kids do. lol.

[MannyGoldstein]

9. What's Your Problem?

The Clintons got loads of cash, and China got permanent "free" trade status. Nobody was hurt.

[sandnsea]

14. The thing is

I would have fought you on that a few years ago, I really do try to give people the benefit of the doubt. But watching these latest scandals unfold, even as Bill is out of office - wtf. And they go to family weddings of people convicted of bank fraud?? That's just too much for me, just too damn much.

[saracat]

21. I have trouble with this as well.

[karynnj]

37. So true

One of the hardest political conversations I ever had is when my college daughter asked me why I had consistently defended Clinton when she knew my values well enough to know that I could not really approve of the actions and I was well enough informed to know. She was not speaking of Lewinsky, but of the tendency to ignore ethics on things like this. I finally had to admit that I had closed my eyes, because he was "on our team".

[jgraz]

18. Let's not forget this guy

[Colobo]

19. That pic makes me laugh.

[jgraz]

20. I've always found it really hard to laugh while vomiting

[saracat]

22. Ain't that the truth!

[illinoisprogressive]

23. Hsu skipped out today. You forgot Vin Gupta and his millions to the clintons.

[sandnsea]

25. I hadn't paid attention

http://www.sajaforum.org/2007/05/crime_infousa_i.html

Sad. They really can pick 'em.

[illinoisprogressive]

24. the biggest problem is most of the media is covering it up.

[Superman Returns]

26. I hate this stuff

Hillary Clinton would be a decent President, but it's crap like this that really makes me doubt that her presidency would be beneficial to the Democratic Party. We need a nominee with a good set of ethics otherwise independents and moderates will just see the GOP and DNC as the same and remain skeptical about the political process. I don't want to be debating my Republican friends about the latest Clinton scandal, I don't want more polarizing politics, I don't want to keep talking about the petty actions of one political family, we need a President who won't distract from a true progressive agenda! We need to turn the page, this is one of the few elections that provide that chance!

[Tellurian]

27. When you turn the page...page up to Obama's Rezko Scandal..not the house flap either..

leaving people freezing without heat for 2 wks in the middle of a Chicago winter, isn't my idea of a US president.

[sandnsea]

28. Yep, that's one in 11 years

Nobody is going to deny it.

With the Clintons, it's a new fundraising scandal every 11 weeks.

[Tellurian]

29. No, it's an indication of how he'll treat a nationwide constituency..

turning the US into a coast to coast Katrina..

[sandnsea]

30. Pssst, those were Clinton's affordable housing programs

I think you sort of forgot that.

[Tellurian]

32. Obama has ties to the Mob...

OBAMA'S 'MOB-TIE' $IDEKICK

By CHARLES HURT Bureau Chief


September 5, 2007 -- WASHINGTON -

A man who has long been dogged by charges that the bank his family owns helped finance a Chicago crime figure will host a Windy City fund-raiser tonight for Sen. Barack Obama.

Alexi Giannoulias, who became Illinois state treasurer last year after Obama vouched for him, has pledged to raise $100,000 for the senator's Oval Office bid.

Before he promised to raise funds for Obama, Giannoulias bankrolled Michael "Jaws" Giorango, a Chicagoan twice convicted of bookmaking and promoting prostitution.

Giannoulias is so tainted by reputed mob links that several top Illinois Dems, including the state's speaker of the House and party chairman, refused to endorse him even after he won the Democratic nomination with Obama's help.

Giannoulias was the bank's vice president and chief loan officer for most of the more than $15 million in loans.

He was not charged with breaking any laws. The Obama campaign disputed any suggestion that Obama is tarnished by the association.

"Barack Obama has a long record of fighting for ethics reform from his days as a state senator," a campaign rep said.

http://www.nypost.com/seven/09052007/news/nationalnews/obamas_mob_tie_idekick.htm

Google Link: (loaded)

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=Obama+Alexi+Giannoulias+mob&btnG=Google+Search

[sandnsea]

39. Yes, a right wing campaign attack

No laws broken. But nice try.

[karynnj]

41. Your posts that people should not post RW attacks

seem less sincere when you regularly link to RW sources on others.

The Hsu attack can be easily fought on the merits. As of yet, there has been nothing, even in RW sources, that show that there were any red flags on Hsu that were missed. He very likely IS a crook, but there was nothing on the surface in recent years that indicated there was anything wrong with him. Clinton donated the money from him. I hope that she will have the bundled money givers thoroughly investigated - and donate anything not kosher. Otherwise, I suspect we will hear nothing until she has the nomination - then it will return and it will be said they knew in September 2007 and did nothing.

The OP links to fraud cases from the 1990s. This was part of the baggage the Clintons had. What I wonder is if Hsu was working for the Republicans. His contributions etc started relatively recently (either 2003 or 2004). In 2003, it was a good bet that Bush would win and a long term concern was Clinton 2008. Also, had someone else emerged as a front runner, Hsu could have signed on with him. Raising the obscure scandals of the 1990s was always a possibility, but it is far more convincing when done without Republican fingerprints. How better than to have a crook, who is a CHINESE individual raise money for her. It seems designed to bring up exactly what it did. In a time when corruption was second only to Iraq as an issue, this is a liability.

[sandnsea]

43. Except for

Chatwal and Vin Gupta. Fundraising scandals just follow the Clintons a bit too closely for them all to be right wing set ups.

[wyldwolf]

31. google: Obama Alexi Giannoulias mob

[Forkboy]

33. Out of curioisity, how does that change the OP?

I'm not saying I agree with the OP's premise here, but even it were the case, how does pointing out Obama's bad connections change anything about Clinton's bad connections? All this does is highlight the fact that BOTH may be questionable.How does that help defend Hillary? Your line of reasoning just pulls both down into the gutter, not lift yours out of it.

It's not very inspiring, and it's a piss poor defense for your candidate.A lot of people still haven't decided on anyone yet, and I can't imagine anyone with a brain seeing this defense and going, "Oh,well,if Obama did something wrong then I guess it's ok if Hillary does it too."

Honestly, do you think that's the way to go? :shrug:

[sandnsea]

40. How can you disagree with 5 cases of fraud?

You can decide you don't care, but you can't disagree with facts.

:shrug:

[Ethelk2044]

42. The man works in a Bank. Was he ever indicted for anything NO.

With your logic then we need to start digging up the Clinton's past when they were investigated never went to jail.