The Reviews are in "Promising Policy"....yada yada yada

[ddeclue]

Anyone who needs to hype Hillary's "plan" like a movie advertisement sounds awfully desperate to me.

Usually when you see a movie advertised in this manner it's because its producers are desperate men because nobody is going to see their terrible picture.

I say: Let people judge for themselves thank you very much and stop trying to sell us on what the "critics" have to say.

Why is it that Hillary is always bringing up the rear on the issues and trying to co-opt John Edwards stands on populist issues AFTER he has already been there?

She was the last to speak out against the war and hasn't ever really apologized for her vote.

She's slow and late on healthcare issue too and her plan doesn't really do anything but force citizens to buy private health insurance anyways. Big surprise considering all the insurance and big pharma money backing her...

I want a real leader, not a cheap imitation -

I want John Edwards not Hillary Clinton.

Doug D.
Orlando, FL

[rinsd]

1. Yeah I hate when candidates attempt to sell themselves.

Edwards Gets Rave Reviews At The California Democratic Convention

http://johnedwards.com/news/headlines/20070430-ca-convention-reviews/

http://blog.johnedwards.com/story/2007/2/2/145728/0926

The Reviews Pile On - Pundits And Voters Agree: Edwards Impressive, Has Top Answers

http://johnedwards.com/news/press-releases/20070604-reviews-pile-on/

Surely its a sign of desperation

:evilgrin:

[ddeclue]

2. Yeah right...Edwards LEADS...Hillary FOLLOWS...

She's always a day late and a dollar short..

[rinsd]

3. So if Edwards and Clinton's plan is the same....

How come his plan is good and principled but Hillary's is bad and part of a sellout?

And leaders don't pretend their Senate careers never happened.

[bobbolink]

4. They're NOT the same.

Biiiig difference.

[rinsd]

6. So where is the big difference?

[bobbolink]

8. May I refer you to this: "Edward's plan actually has a strategy in it to force the insurance

companies to compete with Medicare. Hillary's plan doesn't. There is a big difference if you look carefully at how it may play out. Also, Hillary keeps saying how "complicated" the issue is. Whenever someone tries to tell me I'm too stupid to understand the complexities of issues that I'm supposed to learn about because I am expected to vote on them, I see a big fat elephant in the room dictating talking points.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x1830393#1830610

[rinsd]

11. Except Hillary's plan does that as well, Cleita was misinformed.

And was told so quite a few times on that thread.

Both open up the various plans offered to Fed employees (includ Congress) and establish a Medicare like system for the poor.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=3526504

[SaveElmer]

15. Hillary guarantees premiums never exceed a % of income...

Edwards' does not...

[rinsd]

16. See I knew someone would eventually come up with a difference

:evilgrin:

:hi:

[bobbolink]

17. "And was told so quite a few times on that thread. "

Well, if you think that is true, which it isn't, then no wonder you're mislead about Hillary's (mis)plan.

[rinsd]

20. Are you claiming Hillary's plan does not allow people to buy into a government system?

[bobbolink]

22. I'm saying you said Cleita was told she was wrong several times.

YOU are wrong.

[rinsd]

24. Really? So now this is about Cleita, not your erroneous claims about Clinton;s health care plan

Shockingly you;re even wrong on Cleita being told she was wrong

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=1830393&mesg_id=1830908

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=1830393&mesg_id=1830947

And here's the plan itself, detailing the allowing of people to buy into established fed health plans.

1. Offer New Coverage Choices for the Insured and Uninsured: The American Health
Choices Plan gives Americans the choice to preserve their existing coverage, while offering
new choices to those with insurance, to the 47 million people in the United States without
insurance, and the tens of millions more at risk of losing coverage.
• The Same Choice of Health Plan Options that Members of Congress Receive:
Americans can keep their existing coverage or access the same menu of quality private
insurance options that their Members of Congress receive through a new Health
Choices Menu, established without any new bureaucracy as part of the Federal
Employee Health Benefit Program (FEHBP). In addition to the broad array of private
options that Americans can choose from, they will be offered the choice of a public
plan option similar to Medicare.
• A Guarantee of Quality Coverage: The new array of choices offered in the Menu will
provide benefits at least as good as the typical plan offered to Members of Congress,
which includes mental health parity and usually dental coverage.

http://www.hillaryclinton.com/feature/healthcareplan/americanhealthchoicesplan.pdf

[bobbolink]

25. Geeeez, you're the one that made the claim about Cleita ....

You're the one that made it about her....

This is really silly.

And, the sneer is getting more obvious.

Just like Hill's.

[rinsd]

27. Ummm you made it about Cleita when you cited her as proof of Edwards plan being different.

All I did was say she was misinformed and told so on the thread you cited, which you participated in so you should have known that anyway.

And yes it is becoming silly.

[ddeclue]

5. Hillary isn't offering anything but forcing everyone to buy from the existing insurance weasels..

Not much of a plan.

Edwards is offering AFFORDABLE and UNIVERSAL coverage.

The real problem with Hillary is she has no core convictions, just a finger in the wind. She sees that Edwards proposals on healthcare are catching on so surprise, surprise, she does just like Bill Gates at Microsoft when he sees an innovative piece of software and tries to make a copy cat version of his own.

Hillary doesn't have any good ideas or core beliefs of her own, just too much personal ambition and too much calculation and poll driven plans.

Doug D.

[rinsd]

7. How is Edwards plan different from Hillary's?

Here's his website (which includes reviews by the way, must be more of that desperation)

http://johnedwards.com/issues/health-care/

Here's the press release from Hillary's campaign

http://www.hillaryclinton.com/news/release/view/?id=3322

"The real problem with Hillary is she has no core convictions"

LOL to hear an Edwards supporter say that is beyond funny when the man has basically campaigned saying he is against everything he voted for when he actually had influence over policy.

You can say many things about Hillary but she has not disowned her Senate career just because it conflicts with a campaign new image.

[ddeclue]

9. No HILLARY is beyond funny...

She has NEVER had any convictions, just poll numbers.

Edwards has consistently been for the little guy. Blab all you want Hillary-bot. We all know the truth.

Doug D.

[rinsd]

14. Was he for the little guy when he voted for China MNF?

Was he for the little guy when he voted for the bankruptcy bill?

Was he for the little guy when the firm paying him a hefty fee to do nothing while pumping tons of dough into his campaign was out evicting New Orleans residents?

I guess John Edwards candidate is for the little guy, too bad John Edwards Senator was not.

[bobbolink]

10. The Difference.... Edwards will end up with basically HR676

Hillary 2.0 will end up with more of the same -- biiiig profits for insurance companies, zilch actual coverage for many.

[rinsd]

13. How? They are nearly identical. Both offer up Medicare system plans to compete wih private ins

Both eliminate discrimination based on pre-existing conditions.

So explain to me the magic dust that exists that allows Edwards plan to segway to single payer yet prevent the Clinton plan from doing the same?

[bobbolink]

18. "magic dust" I thought you wanted an actual discussion. You just want to sneer.

Hillary is good at sneers.

I dont' want sneering in the White House.

[rinsd]

21. So explain to me the "Biiiig difference" that you claim existed.

If you can.

[bobbolink]

23. So you can sneeer? I was entering what I *thought* was a discussion.

I'm sick to death of DU crap.

Take it elsewhere.

[rinsd]

26. Hmmmm the OP sneers at a Hillary supporter, you say nothing.

Its not until I prove you were incorrect that I was sneering.

I sick to death of people saying false shit about my candidate.

[Cameron27]

28. Apparently Obama and Edwards both said the plan was the same

"I commend Senator Clinton for her health care proposal," said Obama in a statement. "It's similar to the one I put forth last spring, though my universal health care plan would go further in reducing the punishing cost of health care than any other proposal that's been offered in this campaign."

"...if imitation is the sincerest form of flattery, then I'm flattered," said Edwards...

Clinton's plans calls for subsidies, not just tax breaks, for those who can't afford insurance? Like Edwards and Obama, she plans for insurance costs to be based on a percentage of income.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=3529732&mesg_id=3529762

[rinsd]

29. The differences in the plans has to do more with perception of the candidates than substance

[Cameron27]

30. I know.

[MonkeyFunk]

12. Do you object to ALL threads

promoting a candidate, or only ones that promote Clinton?

[Colobo]

19. Edwards and Hillary should fight each other to the point of exhaustion.

In the meantime, Obama will let the country know how he plans to move us forward.