I'm doing a 180: Allow Sharpton and Kucinich to debate on 2/26

[bluestateguy]

I posted earlier that that Sharpton and Kucinich should be excluded from the debate on the 26th. I now think that that would be wrong. Any value that would come from having a 2 or 3 man debate would be outweighed by the indignation and anger that would come from Kucinich and Sharpton supporters. These are voters that we will need in November. We should be the party of inclusion. I would suggest that Edwards and Kerry should politely acknowledge the presence of Sharpton and Kucinich, let them say their pieces, but in the end the attention would be focused on Edwards and Kerry.

[THUNDER HANDS]

1. If they can't get at least 10% of the vote

They don't deserve more than 10% of the airtime.

It's not fair to Kerry or Edwards.

[MuseRider]

2. When have they ever had

more than 10% of the air itme?

[Padraig18]

3. Answer: never. n/t

[GodHelpUsAll2]

4. Never ever

[MuseRider]

5. Exactly, thanks my friend.

How many cover stories have they had in major magazines? How many stories period? There have been some good articles in newspapers but it takes this whole community of DU to find the few there are. They spend half of their interview time defending thier right to be where they are. I am so depressed, not by the primary results but by my own party.

[THUNDER HANDS]

6. in the debates

Even though Sharpton and Kucinich don't field as many questions as Kerry, Edwards and Dean have, they still receivied more airtime and exposure just being on the same stage with them than they deserve based on the percentage of votes they've receivied this primary season.

[MuseRider]

9. Do you

realize exactly what you are saying? More than they deserve? Do you have any idea what Kucinich has done over the years for this party and this country? I have been so totally disgusted by the way the media has treated all of our candidates with such disrespect, how they tried to direct the debate to small change, small issues or no issues at all and now I see the same treatment in my own party. I can't believe that respect is only reserved for those you agree with.

[Rainbowreflect]

10. We need Kucinich & Sharpton in the debates as long as possible.

They are able & willing to make the attacks on bush that the front runners are not. And the make Kerry & Edwards seem more central by comparison. That is important for the GE.

[anarchy1999]

12. Unbelievable post!

You have got to not be thinking straight! Just exactly what I posted in another thread. Just because they were on the stage with the "others" (who have since obediently dropped out), they were given all the exposure they deserved!

I'm sorry, this line of thinking is making my head spin. Kucinich and Sharpton are campaigning as Dems, right? They aren't closet Indepedent, Green or Libetarian are they? I am so confused. Remind me why again, I'm supposed to just line up and go with the "party"?

[IrateCitizen]

14. Just goes to prove the Democratic Party is "democratic"...

... in name only.

Amazing. Simply amazing.

[anarchy1999]

20. Thanks for the back up, IC.

n/t

I want to see more of a real debate. Anyone else? How about DK, Edwards, Kerry and Sharpton all being asked the same question and given 5 minutes to expound and then x number of minutes to rebute?

I wonder who would be determined to be the winner of a debate such as that?

[Rooktoven]

8. When has Edwards?

excluding the WI debate where Kerry had twice as much.

[OhioStateProgressive]

7. Kucinich, 15% in Maine

the threshold rules say that you must have gotten 10% in a binding primary or caucus...Dennis has met that threshold with Maine, Sharpton hasn't met it yet

I expect Dennis to be at the debate and not Sharpton

[goodhue]

19. but didn't Sharpton have 10% in SC?

I believe they will all be there as they should. Otherwise the exlcusion issue will harm the party. Edwards for one should recognize that and stand up for the inclusion of Kucinich and Sharpton. I know he is going with two-man race meme but he should take high road here. Kerry I assume would prefer not to debate at all.

[OhioStateProgressive]

22. officially Sharpton was at 9.6% in South Carolina(nt)

[genius]

24. Do we want African Americans boycotting the election. Let's keep everyone

There are four candidates left. Sharpton and Kucinich have shown the courage to bring up issues that others are afraid to addresss. We need them.

[genius]

23. Kucinich had 16%. He's earned a spot

If anyone wants me to support him later, he better support the right of my candidate to have his say now.

[Tinoire]

15. Right. We don't want to risk losing the 5 seconds it takes to figure out

that the main difference between the two is NAFTA.


Some of us don't give a rat's ass about what's "fair" to Kerry and Edwards; we're more concerned with what's fair to the American people and innocents from all over the world being exploited and dying because of certain votes.

[Sean Reynolds]

17. That is so....Democratic of you.

[youngred]

28. Since they've both managed that in different primaries.....

and since they don't get 10% of the airtime/press coverage as is that's fine.

I'd settle for DK getting 10% of the media coverage rather than the complete hack-job blacklisting going on now

[ewagner]

11. One reason I'd like to see them in the debate

is because they could be part of a coordinated attack on Bush*.

If you accept the fact that neither Dennis nor Al will actually become the nominee (at this stage of the primaries anyway) they could be very useful in attacking Bush* in ways that Kerry and Edwards never could. Sharpton has always been a very effective political "bomb thrower" and he did a great job in the last debate of lobbing verbal grenades at dubya. The mainstream candidates have to worry about gaining the so-called moderate votes and they would lose them if they threw bombs like Sharpton. At the same time, Dennis reminds us (our base) of who we are underneath the politically safe veneer and our base needs to be constantly reminded of who we are.

Let Kerry and Edwards be mayonaise on white bread. That's what they have to be. But Dennis and Al can still use the sharp elbows on Dubya.

Just my opinion.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

13. Can you say "vicious circle"?

Dennis Kucinich has been practically under a media blackout since day one. The fact that he's gotten any votes at all has been due to the devotion of countless volunteers.

In fact, looking at the results from the Wisconsin primary from neighboring Minnesota, the patterns of where DK did well and didn't do well make no sense unless you factor in the possibility of extra-dedicated volunteers in places like Viroqua or Prairie du Chien.

How are candidates supposed to get votes if the media decide the summer before the first caucus that they're "minor" and therefore feel entitled to diss and ignore them?

If Kucinich had gotten the same amount of media coverage that Dean, Kerry, Clark, Edwards, Lieberman, and even Gephardt, got in the summer of 2003 (remember when polls were calling Lieberman the front runner?), and if he had then still come in at single digits in most primaries, then you might have a point.

But it is manifestly unfair to refuse to cover someone because you've decided on your own that he's "minor," and then when he comes in at single digits, to say, "See? I told you no one liked him."

That is precisely what has happened to Dennis Kucinich.

[Tinoire]

18. Media chiefs(Murdoch's, Sony, Viacom, MTV) back Kerry campaign

Oh and what a media!

Media chiefs back Kerry campaign

Owen Gibson
Tuesday February 10, 2004

As John Kerry's campaign to secure the Democrat nomination - and with it a crack at the White House - continues to gather pace, it has emerged that it is being bankrolled by key executives from News Corporation, MTV-owner Viacom and Sony.

<snip>

Mr Chernin, one of Mr Murdoch's most trusted lieutenants, is among several media chiefs who have pledged to raise between $50,000 and $100,000 to support the Vietnam war veteran's campaign for the White House.

Others who have pledged to raise more than $50,000 include the Viacom chief executive, Sumner Redstone, and Sony chairman Howard Stringer, whose name has recently been linked with the vacant chairmanships at ITV and the BBC.

Most of the money raised from these contributors will have to be raised through business associates, relatives and friends as individuals can only give a total of $4,000 each to presidential candidates - $2,000 during the primaries and another $2,000 during a general election.

US political commentators have speculated that Mr Kerry has enjoyed the support of the media community in an effort to head off the challenge of Howard Dean, who has fallen back in the race despite being the frontrunner before the primaries began. Mr Dean made statements last year about wanting to break up media conglomerates.

<snip>


http://www.guardian.co.uk/uselections2004/story/0%2C13918%2C1144797%2C00.html

[diamondsoul]

26. Donations from a Murdoch

loyal employee. Um, NO. Sorry Kerry you're high up on my sh*t list now.

[edzontar]

16. Sharpton and Kucincih are, frankly, better than K and E

They should obviously be in the debate.

[DemBones DemBones]

21. David Podvin has asserted that the media

turned against Dean when he said in early December 2003 that he would break up media monopolies.

Dennis Kucinich pledged to break up media monopolies long before that.

Perhaps that is the main reason the media has always called Kucinich an unelectable and "minor" candidate.

Not that they haven't have found other ways to rule him out.

[youngred]

25. Thank You

For saying that, its nice to feel included and not excluded.

They already are allowed to say their pieces with the majority focus going to Kerry and Edwards.

[rucky]

27. Gee, thanks for the scooby snack

No need to mandate that Kerry & Edwards get all the attention, it happens naturally.

Why do you concern yourself with this?