Is attacking someone's patriotism for not wearing a flag pin

[geek tragedy]

something that is acceptable discourse on a Democratic website?

There appears to be a disagreement here.

[tammywammy]

1. It's just silly is what it is

[geek tragedy]

2. Silly and disgusting, I would say.

[LoZoccolo]

3. Why do people so easily take to playing administrator in this part of DU?

Serious; if you don't think it's relevant, say so. Trying to get a mob together to intimidate one side or the other as being "acceptable" is littered with cowardice.

[geek tragedy]

4. Which side am I intimidating?

I'm asking a simple question.

[LoZoccolo]

7. Lame. n/t

[illinoisprogressive]

5. It's very republican to do so but, some will excuse anything to bash Obama

[geek tragedy]

6. Either that, or there are Freepers here trying

to make supporters of a certain candidate look bad.

[LoZoccolo]

8. Oh, you're not trying to intimidate anyone, but you're calling them FReepers.

Got it.

[geek tragedy]

9. I asked a question.

Some people think that's Freeper talk.

One person disagrees with them.

[Hollow Shells]

10. LoZoccolo

Suggesting that someone MAY be a freeper in not intimidation. I wonder why you can't answer a simple question?

[LoZoccolo]

17. Then why is it against the rules?

Do not publicly accuse another member of this message board of being a disruptor, conservative, Republican, FReeper, or troll, or do not otherwise imply they are not welcome on Democratic Underground.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/forums/rules_detailed.html

I will try to be nice and let you know that it is not your privledge to use this forum to imply that I am a conservative disruptor. Several people who have done so have been met with tombstones, and although I cannot be sure that their actions toward me were the ultimate reason for their banishment, their tenacity in breaking the rules often showed a general problem with the boundaries of this community. Please take care of that problem if you wish to remain here, because it is not my problem to counsel you further.

[Colobo]

11. The posters behind that attack should go back to Freeperville

That's probably where they come from in the first place.

[2rth2pwr]

12. I heard anybody question his patriotism. I see a big gaffe;

why is he accusing people that do wear the flag that they are not in fact patriotic?

It's the other way around.

[tammywammy]

13. But he didn't accuse anyone of not being patriotic

He said for himself that actions speak louder than words.

And BTW, I would agree there are plenty of people out there that wear a flag pin to be "patriotic" but aren't.

[sufrommich]

14. The Clinton/ Obama warriors are both over doing it

to the detriment of our common values and our party.

[Catherine Vincent]

15. This was the best response from that thread:

ronnykmarshall (1000+ posts) Thu Oct-04-07 08:28 PM
Response to Original message

117. BFD!

And I don't mean the Bakersfield Fire Department.

And to suggest that "Hillary will have a field day" shows your attempt to just make this into an "all about Hillary" thread.

So what? Barack doesn't have some flag pin. Big fucking deal!!!!

[illinoisprogressive]

16. anyone who wants to trash Obama for him not wearing a flag pin:

the voice of the american people. I suggest you read the comments on this issue from New York Times. people of all stripes comment here:

http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/10/04/obamas-lapels/#comment-284268

[2rth2pwr]

18. Is attacking someone's patriotism for wearing a flag pin acceptable?

"I said, you know what, I probably haven't worn a flag pin in a very long time. After a while I noticed people wearing a lapel pin and not acting very patriotic."-B Obama
http://www.kcrg.com/news/local/10232921.html

[maximusveritas]

19. He's not attacking their patriotism for wearing the pin; he's attacking their unpatriotic actions

Trying reading the sentence a few more times and I'm sure you'll get it (if you didn't before).

[2rth2pwr]

20. I'm not comfortable with a politician who will publicly

make judgments of who is patriotic and who's not. Are you?

[maximusveritas]

22. Again, you are misinterpreting him. I'm not sure if it's on purpose

He isn't calling them unpatriotic as people, but he's calling out their actions as unpatriotic.
There's a big difference there.
And, just to be clear, I have absolutely no problem with a politician pointing out that the actions of George W. Bush and his Republican allies are anything but patriotic in that they have made this country worse and put is in a more dangerous position for the future. In fact, I'd have a problem with any candidate unwilling to say this.

[Ethelk2044]

23. It is on purpose. The Purpose is to try to smear Obama

[IndianaGreen]

21. Patriotism and militarism are threats to freedom

PATRIOTISM: A MENACE TO LIBERTY (1917)

Emma Goldman

What, then, is patriotism? "Patriotism, sir, is the last resort of scoundrels," said Dr. Johnson. Leo Tolstoy, the greatest anti-patriot of our times, defines patriotism as the principle that will justify the training of wholesale murderers; a trade that requires better equipment for the exercise of man-killing than the making of such necessities of life as shoes, clothing, and houses; a trade that guarantees better returns and greater glory than that of the average workingman.

Gustave Hervé, another great anti-patriot, justly calls patriotism a superstition--one far more injurious, brutal, and inhumane than religion. The superstition of religion originated in man's inability to explain natural phenomena. That is, when primitive man heard thunder or saw the lightning, he could not account for either, and therefore concluded that back of them must be a force greater than himself. Similarly he saw a supernatural force in the rain, and in the various other changes in nature. Patriotism, on the other hand, is a superstition artificially created and maintained through a network of lies and falsehoods; a superstition that robs man of his self-respect and dignity, and increases his arrogance and conceit.

Indeed, conceit, arrogance, and egotism are the essentials of patriotism. Let me illustrate. Patriotism assumes that our globe is divided into little spots, each one surrounded by an iron gate. Those who have had the fortune of being born on some particular spot, consider themselves better, nobler, grander, more intelligent than the living beings inhabiting any other spot. It is, therefore, the duty of everyone living on that chosen spot to fight, kill, and die in the attempt to impose his superiority upon all the others.

<snip>

The awful waste that patriotism necessitates ought to be sufficient to cure the man of even average intelligence from this disease. Yet patriotism demands still more. The people are urged to be patriotic and for that luxury they pay, not only by supporting their "defenders," but even by sacrificing their own children. Patriotism requires allegiance to the flag, which means obedience and readiness to kill father, mother, brother, sister.

The usual contention is that we need a standing army to protect the country from foreign invasion. Every intelligent man and woman knows, however, that this is a myth maintained to frighten and coerce the foolish. The governments of the world, knowing each other's interests, do not invade each other. They have learned that they can gain much more by international arbitration of disputes than by war and conquest. Indeed, as Carlyle said, "War is a quarrel between two thieves too cowardly to fight their own battle; therefore they take boys from one village and another village; stick them into uniforms, equip them with guns, and let them loose like wild beasts against each other."

http://sunsite.berkeley.edu/Goldman/Writings/Anarchism/patriotism.html

[OHdem10]

24. Nationalism and Militarism pushed at Fox can be dangerous.

It certainly makes some of us very uncomfortable.

I love the Flag and I love the Miltary but exploiting
them for political reasons (to elevate the GOP)
is detestable.