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bookman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-05-07 02:06 PM
Original message
Need Help: Canadian Health Care
Please help me fact check this email from a righty:



Subject: Canada's Health care system ???

(Very important reading. Don't know who the author is,
but I heard this same info in the '90's and I've heard the same info
discussed on TV.)


Hey Guys I saw on the news up here in Canada where Hillary Clinton
introduced her new health care plan. Something similar to what we have in
Canada. I also heard that Michael Moore was raving about the health care
up here in Canada in his latest movie. As your friend and someone who
lives with the Canada health care plan I
thought I would give you some facts about this great medical plan that we
have in Canada.
First of all:
1) The health care plan in Canada is not free. We pay a premium every
month of $96. for Shirley and I to be covered. Sounds great eh. What
they don't tell you is how much we pay in taxes to keep the health care
system afloat. I am personally in the 55% tax bracket. Yes 55% of my
earnings go to taxes. A large portion of that and I am n ot sure of the
exact amount goes directly to health care our #1 expense.

2) I would not classify what we have as health care plan, it is more like
a health diagnosis system. You can get into to see a doctor quick enough
so he can tell you "yes indeed you are sick or you need an operation" but
now the challenge becomes getting treated or operated on. We have waiting
lists out the ying yang some as much as 2 years down the road.

3) Rather than fix what is wrong with you the usual tactic in
Canada is to prescribe drugs. Have a pain here is a drug to take-not what
is causing the pain and why. No time for checking you out because it is
more important to move as many patients thru as possible each hour for
Government re-imbursement

4) Many Canadians do not have a family Doctor.

5) Don't req uire emergency treatment as you may wait for hours in the
emergency room waiting for treatment.

6) Shirley's dad cut his hand on a power saw a few weeks back and it
required that his hand be put in a splint - to our surprise we had to pay
$125. for a splint because it is not covered under health care plus we
have to pay $60. for each visit for him to check it out each week.

7) Shirley's cousin was diagnosed with a heart blockage. Put on a waiting
list . Died before he could get treatment.

8) Government allots so many operations per year. When that is done no
more operations, unless you go to your local newspaper and plead your case
and embarrass the government then money suddenly appears.

9)The Government takes great pride in telling us how much more they are
increasing the funding for health care but waiting lists never get
shorter. Government just keeps throwing money at the problem but it never
goes away. But they are good at finding new ways to tax us, but they don't
call it a tax anymore it is now a user fee.

10) My mother needs an operation for a blockage in her leg but because she
is a smoker they will not do it. Despite her and my father paying into
the health care system all these years. My Mom is 80 years of age. Now
there is talk that maybe we should not treat fat and obese people either
because they are a drain on the health care system. Let me see now, what
we want in Canada is a health care system for healthy people only. That
should reduce our health care costs.

11) Forget getting a second opinion, what you see is what you get.

12) I can spend what money I have left after taxes on booze, cigarettes,
junk food and anything else that could kill me but I am not allowed by law
to spend my money on getting an operation I need because that would be
jumping the queue. I must wait my turn except if I am a hockey player or
athlete then I can get looked at right away. Go figger. Where else in
the world can you spend money to kill yourself but not allowed to spend
money to get healthy.

13) Oh did I mention that immigrants are covered automatically at tax
payer expense having never contributed a dollar to the fund.

14) Oh yeh we now give free needles to drug users to try and keep them
healthy. Wouldn't want a sickly druggie breaking into your house and
stealing your things. But people with diabetes who pay into the health
care system have to pay for their needles because it is not covered but
the health care sy stem.

I send this out not looking for sympathy but as the election
looms in the states you will be hearing more and more about
universal health care down there and the advocates
will be pointing to Canada. I just want to make sure that you hear the
truth about health care up here and have some food for thought and
informed questions to ask when broached with this subject.
Step wisely and don't make the same mistakes we have.


Chuck Leonard Entertainment & Photography
908 862-4378
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FormerDittoHead Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-05-07 02:12 PM
Response to Original message
1. My experience is that EVERY SINGLE ONE of these mass emails is BS...
I'm not even going to Snopes.com this because even if it's not listed there, there's plenty here to be ridiculed.

I think the best recommendation is to see Sicko and get a better idea of the overall situation.

We're not "required" to copy Canada's health system - which seems to be the worst among the industrialized nations (ie: non-banana republics)

One other thing - WE HAVE NO "SYSTEM". The only "system" we have is what grew out of the desire for large corporate profits. Yes, I would call any company which pays its CEO over a BILLION DOLLARS a large corporation.

Again, Sicko is the best and quickest source of the overview...
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IntravenousDemilo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-05-07 02:16 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. Um, who told you that Canada's system "seems to be the worst among the industrialized nations"?
No, you're not required to copy our system, but it would be a really good idea for the States to follow our lead once in a while. An overwhelming majority of us are very satisfied with Medicare.
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FormerDittoHead Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-05-07 02:33 PM
Response to Reply #4
11. I was wrong - USA is the worst by far, but among countries with single payer...
Oh, I would LOVE to have the Canadian system over here, don't get me wrong, it's WAY better than OURS. The point is that the USA doesn't HAVE a "system" outside of making profits for corporations.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=Y9EgyAgO1JE

But, it seems that England and Canada run a close race for the number of most complaints I've read online.

I was just going by the complaints I've heard from Canadians, but I will quickly concede that perhaps being in American I would naturally read more things about Canada than about England.

Again, I can list other countries, and not one of these others, Germany, France, the Netherlands, etc., etc. have I heard as many complaints about as I've heard from Canadians about the Canadian system. Again, I'd take it to replace ours in a heartbeat.
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IntravenousDemilo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-05-07 02:12 PM
Response to Original message
2. Check out the Canada forum
Someone else has also asked about it, and here are some of the answers.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=190x22465

There are lots of debunking links in that thread, and near the bottom I also link to an older thread on the subject of Canadian health care.
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applegrove Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-05-07 02:13 PM
Response to Original message
3. Since one never has to pay for anything but drugs in Canada - I would
guess that alot of what you say is not true. I cannot be bothered to go through the list bit by bit.
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IntravenousDemilo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-05-07 02:18 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. You have to pay for the ambulance, too, at least in this province.
But it's only $45.
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LakeSamish706 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-05-07 02:20 PM
Response to Original message
6. Some of what he/she says is true, however some I question...
Edited on Fri Oct-05-07 02:26 PM by LakeSamish706
None of my side notes came up....

I agree with a post above.... See Sicko and you will see where Canada's health care rates... Not the best but certainly not the worst... France and UK are better.
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woodsprite Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-05-07 03:10 PM
Response to Reply #6
13. My friends just moved to Canada.
It was a 5 year application process, during which, she developed breast cancer. She was so afraid they wouldn't take her, but no problem. She just had her records reviewed by one of the docs approved to review/examine prospective immigrants. She said that they had to provide their own insurance for the first 4 months they were there, to allow the National Health Insurance time to kick in. Even after that point, they were going to continue to pay for a rider that added to the basic coverage. They live in NJ, so the 4 months that they pay on their own is $800 for full coverage for a family of 4. The additional rider was $75/mo for a family of 4. Yes, she is obese - I would say maybe 260 lbs. and she also does not work, she homeschools their 2 kids. Her hubby works contract computer programming.

In NJ, they were paying $420 per month for a family of 4. Literally though, they just made settlement on their house and had the moving vans deliver their furniture this morning, so they haven't been there long enough to 'test' the system.
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Beaverhausen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-05-07 02:24 PM
Response to Original message
7. I just checked SNOPES - when did it become a messageboard?
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Nederland Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-05-07 02:25 PM
Response to Original message
8. Where's Iverglas?
S/he is Canadian, and I'm sure we can get straight answers...
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Beaverhausen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-05-07 02:27 PM
Response to Original message
9. Michael Moore's site has a lot of info on healthcare in Canada
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bookman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-05-07 02:33 PM
Response to Original message
10. Thanks

Thanks to all for such a prompt reply. DU'ers are the best.
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Warpy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-05-07 02:58 PM
Response to Original message
12. Google is your friend
Edited on Fri Oct-05-07 03:00 PM by Warpy
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FormerDittoHead Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-05-07 03:10 PM
Response to Reply #12
14. Here's a link to a usenet thread about this very email. Informative
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