Mike Huckabee: The Man I Knew

[democrat2thecore]

As some of you may know from my postings, I am a Progressive Christian firmly planted on the left of the political spectrum. I am a member of Evangelicals For Social Action, Sojourners, CrossLeft, am involved in Emergent Village. Jim Wallis is a friend and someone I consider to be a true-blue progressive who also has a deep and abiding faith. That gives you some idea where I come from.

Now, my story....and how Huckabee's undoing with the conservatives has begun today.

In 1990 I was doing some traveling and speaking for the cause of the Christian Left. It was a lonely pursuit at the time, much lonelier than it is now. (There are actually lots of us, it's just that the media ignores us!) One of my speaking events was a workshop at the Arkansas Baptist Convention. I was expecting a fairly hostile crowd, but actually I was well received and people were nice, if not all being in agreement. The President of the Arkansas Baptist General Convention was a nice guy by the name of Mike Huckabee. It was Huckabee who had invited me to speak (not to the GC, but a smaller workshop). I remember Huckabee for being a controversial leader in the Baptist church as he was considered a "moderate" - a bad word at the time, even though they actually had the leadership of the whole SBC at one time. Still, they were considered the "liberals." Huckabee had been pastor at a church in Texarkana (I'm pretty sure that's where it was) and I had met him through a phone call. He wanted copies of our magazine to give away in the foyer of his church! That's how I got to know Mike Huckabee. We have maybe talked 5 or 6 times in my whole life, but the times I did, I considered him a friend of real social justice inside the church.

I have often wondered if his days as a "moderate" (again - read 'liberal' to Baptists) would ever be brought up if he was making any moves in the polls. Apparently someone feels threatened. The reason I chose to write this today was because of John Fund's hit piece on Huckabee in the Wall Street Journal. Now don't get me wrong, I could never support Huckabee because of some obvious issues that divide us. But, the column by Fund is typical Fund as he writes of the Huckabee I once knew as if he was a left-wing monster. It's been a lot of years now and I've been amazed at Mike Huckabee's political career. I also know, he's probably a tad more to the left on some economic issues than some of our own Democrats. But, his views regarding certain social issues and foreign policy rule him out for me. But, the Republican Party could do worse. That's why he'll never get the nomination and why John Fund and Phyllis Schlafly have been sent on an errand to nip his rise in Iowa in the bud . Here's a link to Fund's Huckabee piece. http://opinionjournal.com/diary/?id=110010782

Sorry for the length, but I have felt I should someday share this story here at DU. Now I have.

If you're interested in some of us Christians on the Left, you'll find many of us around these places on the net:
http://www.sojo.net Sojourners
http://www.christianalliance.org Christian Alliance For Progress
http://www.crossleft.org CrossLeft
http://www.tcpc.org Center For Progressive Christianity
http://www.ecapc.org Every Church a Peace Church
http://blog.beliefnet.com/godspolitics The personal blog of Jim Wallis
http://www.emergentvillage.com Emergent Village
http://www.brianmclaren.net Brian McLaren

[TwilightGardener]

1. Um, they don't like him because he was a fiscal flop. Calling abortion a "holocaust"

and comparing gay marriage to marrying your dog only carries the GOP faithful so far. At some point, you have to face up to your record. He's actually pretty corrupt--he invented a "charity" that paid him money for speeches, and he refused to release the donor list. He tried to claim (steal) $70,000 worth of furniture from the Gov's mansion. He doesn't sound very Christian to me. But regardless, he deserves some scrutiny, especially from his own party. I think he's an insincere creep.

[democrat2thecore]

2. I'll say this

Those sound like Rudy's talking-points. Frankly, I've heard of none of that. Like I said, I cannot support Huckabee due to some obvious differences - gay rights and abortion being the two most important. But I would never consider him corrupt. Honestly. I just wouldn't. Like I said, they could do a lot worse and it's clear Rudy and Romney's people are running scared in Iowa. I knew his record - within the church - would come back to haunt him among conservatives and the Fund piece attempted to do that today.

[TwilightGardener]

9. Rudy's talking points? Uh, no--MY talking points. I consider myself to

be very informed on all of the Republican candidates. I read their speeches, I read most articles and story that pertains to any of them. I called Thompson a dud a long time ago, while everyone else on DU was in a lather about how FORMIDABLE he would be, because I actually dug around for his record. Did the same with Hucksterbee, Rudy and Romney. I don't really care if you like the guy and don't consider him corrupt, but the fact was that he was reprimanded by his state ethics board 5 times, investigated 14 times, and his record shows a guy who really, really liked having the wealth and power of the governorship at his disposal (improper use of public funds, state planes, etc). And to top it off, he's got the Wayne Dumond problem. I think he's truly scary--not in a "he might win" way that you're suggesting, but in a "seriously deranged" way. I think he believes God is calling him to the WH. He reminds me of my student-nurse psychiatric nursing experiences, when I would speak to an inpatient who seems very personable and rational, and you start to wonder why this person's been committed. And then, before the conversation ends, this person says something that makes your hair stand on end and you think, "Oh yeah, he's crazy". Still, I would love to see him become the nominee, because Hillary would gut him like a trout.

[democrat2thecore]

13. Ouch! Did you miss the part where I said I couldn't ever vote for him?

It's not that I "like" him or support him in any way. I am still trying to decide between Obama, Biden and Clinton! I am suggesting that the Fund piece today in the WSJ is an opening salvo at Huckabee from Rudy and/or Romney's people - and I saw that coming from my personal dealings with the man. Crazy? A nut? I don't know, weinerdoggie, I just find it all interesting.

[TwilightGardener]

17. Didn't say you would vote for/support him. Just pointing out

that he's receiving some well-deserved scrutiny finally--I don't consider the article to be a "hit". 5 months ago, there were WaPo articles stating that Cheney should resign and Fred Thompson should be put into the VP slot, because "eveybody loves him". Then we started to hear more about what a doofus he was. We're at that point with Huck, where nobody seems to know much about him, but thinks he's swell. I listened to him say, at the Michigan debate, that he would ignore the will and laws of Congress and bomb Iran if he felt like it. That sounds like someone declaring a dictatorship. I read an interview in which he said the GWOT and Iraq were more crucial than WW2--can he really be that stupid and still be a national figure? I heard him make really weird, tasteless, creepy jokes. He did say that gay marriage would lead people to marrying their children and their dogs next. He called legalized abortion an American Holocaust, which might just offend actual Holocaust survivors who lived through immense horror and suffering, and he said that the reason we have illegal-immigrant problems today is because all of our lettuce-pickers were aborted. I'm not making this shit up--he makes Rudy, Romney and McCain look sane, intelligent, and rational by comparison. And I think Rudy LOVES him. He's splitting the social conservative vote in the early states, and then Rudy will take the big states.

[durrrty libby]

3. K for later( means I will read all this later when I have time. Chill)

[democrat2thecore]

6. You obviously didn't read my post - or the link to Fund's piece

What does "K for later" mean anyway?

"All the repukes are assholes. I hope you know that." Thanks, durrrty libby, for the education. I'm pretty well aware of the problems with Republicans and am a committed Democrat. No lecturing needed - especially at such a high level of sophisticated discussion.

[democrat2thecore]

16. I was just wondering? Thanks. -nt

[flpoljunkie]

4. Yep. Creepy John Fund is doing someone's dirty work here, and it smells.

[TwilightGardener]

11. Huh? What "smells" about this article? I LOVE negative articles about R candidates.

[democrat2thecore]

15. We're looking at it from a political perspective

It IS interesting. The timing is interesting. Nothing there is new. Who wrote it is interesting. Conservatives in Iowa will not like what they read. It IS interesting and DOES look like a "planted" piece.

[flpoljunkie]

28. That is a well orchestrated hit job on a Republican by his Republican opponents and Republican Fund.

[ruggerson]

5. Interesting

I wonder if Fund (who I loathe) has written a hit piece on Romney for the same thing.

[TwilightGardener]

14. My theory is that Hucky is an unintentional stalking horse for Rudy. He's serving to

split the Socon votes with Romney and Thompson, thus ensuring a Rudy majority. I wouldn't be surprised to see neocons looking real happy with Huck winning in Iowa. He's no threat to Rudy--they don't compete for the same Republican votes. But he will hand Rudy a victory. I don't think this is a "hit" piece, unless you consider scrutiny of someone's record and history of governance a "hit". The fact is, fiscons don't like the guy. He caused that himself.

[grasswire]

7. Huckabee: what I know

Huckabee is a bona fide member of freerepublic.com, the site known for its gutter politics, attacks on innocents, and even known for Jeff Gannon, perhaps its other most famous posting member. Huckabee is a longtime member, having even played the freepers' inaugural ball in 2001.

No one with ties to this scurrilous group could ever exhibit the judgment necessary to be taken seriously as a presidential candidate.

And, by the way, I consider myself a member of the Christian left and am myself pretty well traveled in those circles. But I consider Huckabee dangerous for America. A shape shifter. Just the same sort of cozy conservative that snookered the media in 2000.

[democrat2thecore]

8. I don't disagree

I only said they could do worse. I was unaware of his association with Free Republic. Doesn't sound like him at all as they were so anti-Huckabee when he announced because of his immigration stance. But, I don't doubt it either. Opportunism is dangerous - a Shape Shifter, I like that. Probably very true.

[grasswire]

10. if you're looking at it from GOP perspective...

....I think if they let Rove manage Huckabee, he could be the new George Bush. Rove always said that Bush was a blank slate, to be packaged.

[democrat2thecore]

12. Are you sure?

I just put "Free Republic" and "Mike Huckabee" in Google and the first post that came up is a post from a few days ago lambasting him with everybody chiming in on the "he's a liberal" line. Are you sure it was Huckabee? The post is headlined, "Mike Huckabee? Are you kidding? Who are you people?" and the first paragraph says, "Arkansas Governer Mike Huckabee suddenly seems to be the established GOP savior. True, he is great on the stump. He is and should be a preacher. But president? NOT if you're a conservative!" Looking at the long list of comments they don't seem to like him at all. And wow, those people are downright mean. Time for a shower.

[TwilightGardener]

18. He is a member. The Freepers talk about it all the time.

[democrat2thecore]

20. I don't ever visit FR, so I wouldn't know how often they talk about it.

By the way, I've pretty much got my choice down to Obama and Biden.
Could you tell me your personal reasons for supporting Senator Obama?

[TwilightGardener]

22. Obama strikes me as very intelligent, thoughtful, decent, and ethical--

he's ambitious, but not a grasper for power for its own sake, and he's not especially driven by money. He doesn't pander. He really, really seems to love this country, and I believe he's wise enough (despite his age and his limited time in national politics) to make the right choices for us. I can see that he's in a bad spot right now, because he is reluctant to go negative on Hillary--I think he doesn't want to damage her (and thus our party's chances) for the general, and he's not that kind of guy anyway. His attacks have been very fair, mild, and policy-related, and he's been trying to stick to the high road, which won't get him nominated, but makes me respect him all the more. Even if he doesn't win this go-round, I see him as a major player in the future of the Democratic party.

[democrat2thecore]

24. Thanks. A lot of very good points.

"...and he's not especially driven by money."

"His attacks have been very fair, mild, and policy-related, and he's been trying to stick to the high road, which won't get him nominated, but makes me respect him all the more."

I have to agree with you 100%. I really respect the two things above. I saw him in Des Moines back on the day of his "Iraq Speech Anniversary" and was very, very impressed.

[grasswire]

30. I wouldn't be able to say if he is still a member...

....without doing more research over there than I care to.

But here's his note to the freepers:

"To Connie and the incredible people at the Freep Ball:

Our band had the time of our lives with you at the Inaugural Ball. From all I can hear, the Freep Ball was THE real deal where people had fun, while most reports of the other balls were of long lines, crowded settings, and music for old people.

We have been blown away by the kind comments about the band from those who attended--we usually have to play behind chicken wire to keep from being hit by flying bottles and chairs! You guys were the VERY BEST crowd we've EVER played to! People were more than nice--they were simply awesome!

It was a great honor for us to be with you and experience the energy of that room--enough to make a liberal squeal like a pig!

Thanks! You guys are more fun than is probably legal in most states!

Gratefully,

Mike Huckabee, Governor
Arkansas "

And here's a photo of that event:

http://home.att.net/~alanj.hall/BushInaugural/PhotoPage3.html

[AlinPA]

19. Thanks for the links. re: Huckabee, his believing that the earth is only about 6000 years old

tells me he has problems with reality.

[TwilightGardener]

21. Makes it very hard to explain the Grand Canyon, doesn't it?

[democrat2thecore]

23. Actually, Huckabee never said that

He repeats over and over that he has never said that. In fact, I just found an interview with Bill Maher where he discusses this. I was looking because of the other post.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fhBcO-OZk6c&NR=1

I am not a pure "Seven-Day Creationist" and I was pretty sure Huckabee was not either. He makes it clear in this interview that he believes there was design, that he didn't accept it was a proper yes/no question to be asked at the debates and that he doesn't believe the earth is 6,000 years old. He says creation could have taken six billion years, but he believes that there was definitely a designer.

I had to respond to this because I know FEW Christians who really are 7-day purists. With the Christian crowd I run with, that would be ZERO. Yet, the media took his not holding up his hand at that debate as some kind of proof that that he believes the Earth is only 6,000 years old. To be fair, that's not his position. We're not all stupid. Really!

[TwilightGardener]

25. Yeah--he realized how stupid the evolution thing made him look, and attempted

to backtrack and do some damage control. Huckabee has deliberately targeted left-leaning media, trying to pull off a McCain-maverick thing.

[democrat2thecore]

26. Your profile comment

Honestly, we don't really know Huckabee's theology when it comes to creation and how old he thinks the earth is. They are entirely unrelated in his mind - and mine as well. Creation/Intelligent Design doesn't put a time-stamp on the age of the earth.

"I have a crabby dachshund, whose pugnacious and slightly evil persona I have borrowed for this forum."

I have to agree about the crabby part! :)
Just kidding. We agree on 99.9% of things, I am sure. Well....99.250% maybe....but still!

[TwilightGardener]

27. LOL!

:toast:

[AlinPA]

29. His saying that creation could have taken 6 billion years casts him as not

believing Genesis and I wonder how it will go over with the fundamentalists who can make a difference in his being able to get the nomination.