Why I'm angry.

[diamondsoul]

I'm angry because I'm tired of putting up with the most juvenile superficial and sneering insults to both my Candidate and myself on a regular basis. For whatever reason some people, including several right here at DU sem to think this will make me abandon a man who has reminded me how NOT to give up and support their candidate, or the current front-runner.

Fantasy-land, no chance, unelectable, looks like an elf, not Presidential....blah blah blah.

Well guess what, folks? I don't live in a fantasy-land. I live in a very ugly little section of reality. I'm one step away from losing everything my spouse and I have worked for, my home needs repairs I can't afford to have done and can't tackle myself. I can't even get a job at McDonalds because NOBODY is hiring and certainly not with a wage high enough to pay for daycare for two children.

Until George Bush showed up in the Oval Office we were managing to scrape by. I could sometimes take on temp work when we came up short, and things were improving slowly but steadily for us. Now it's all in the crapper again. I went downtown to file some legal papers today, and saw gas prices are now up to $1.79 a gallon. Meanwhile I get to try to spread about $4-500 a week across about 6 different bills plus groceries for a family of three and the proper needs for a 2 yr old. Just in case anyone here didn't know it, raising a family isn't cheap.

The hounds of hell are nipping at my heels and the only man who seems at all seriously concerned about that is Dennis John Kucinich. Maybe because he knows exactly how I feel! NONE of the others can say that with any sincerity that I can sense.

I'm fed up with all the malicious little jabs when all ,most Kucinich supporters have ever done is try to make something positive happen. I'm tired of being told to just roll over and be trampled in favor of the corporatocracy that put me in this position to begin with. I'm tired of being figuratively spat on by supporters of other candidates because I actually manage to keep hoping the world isn't quite as shitty as it appears.

Tell me this, what do any of you gain from treating others so shabbily? Do you think you'll get votes? Support? Make new friends? And WHAT is so all-fired wonderful about accepting that the foulest we humans can possibly be to one another is how it will always be and we may as well just give up trying to make it better?!

We have a basic premise on the Kucinich forum- what we say and do reflects on our candidate. Maliciousness and personal attacks aren't tolerated. I've gone so far as to ask people to edit nasty posts about other candidates lest wavering supporters or even just visitors get offended by it and turn that offense against the Congressman. Meanwhile I go to another candidate's forum to express sympathy and respect and am met with one poster there gleefully boasting about running me off, and another calling me an "idiot" because I support Kucinich.

Then I come here and it's the same crap over and over and over again. Every decent thread posted about Kucinich is invaded by someone who just can't resist verbally slapping us around a little. At the same time, ask who is the best on such-and-such issue and the overwhelming response is usually Kucinich. For Gawd's sakes people, look at your own posts. Look at MY posts! Look at what is happening here and consider who you are and who you want to be. Then make the same considerations for your country.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

1. I love Dennis Kucinich

I am sorry for your angst.

[bigwillq]

2. Don't let people frustrate you

Continue to believe in and support your candidate, I am and he's out of the race but the fight will never end.

[Slice]

3. I understand

You make some good points, and little jabs to try and diminish any of the candidates are not right. I have no problem with Dennis staying in the race, he's a good candidate. The only person I wanted to drop out was Al Sharpton because he is such an anti-semitic/racist. I do have a lot of respect for Dennis Kucinich though.

[Debi]

21. Don't forget Republican attack dog!!

I still love Howard Dean!!!

[Slice]

24. Ok

[XanaDUer]

4. Someone accused you of living in a Fantasy because you support DK?

Why does supporting DK make you seem like you are living in a Fantasy Land?

That's absurd. DK is very progressive, was truly anti-war (and actually had to vote on it).

I do remember the junk about the "looking like an elf", like that matters, anymore than Kerry "looking like Lurch" freaking matters!

Stay true to yourself and don't worry what others think.

DK supporters have been wonderful friends of mine on this board.

If any Kerry supporters said this to you, let me apologize for them.

Peace.

[liberalhistorian]

7. Hey, I thought Kerry

was "French-looking", according to the great Rushbot LIEbaugh, lol! I'd never heard of him looking like Lurch, sheesh, how low can people go?

[XanaDUer]

9. The "Lurch" thing was here on DU

yep. :eyes:

[Debi]

17. Geez.

I said I was sorry already!!! :spank:

[XanaDUer]

25. That was you?!

Eom.

[Debi]

32. !!!

:shrug:

[XanaDUer]

54. Lol.

;)

[liberalhistorian]

5. I fully agree,

and I'm near Cleveland where people either love him or hate him, there appears to be no middle ground. I remember when he was mayor of Cleveland, he couldn't catch a break even then, no matter what he did. The press decided they didn't like him, so that was that, there was very little favorable coverage.

The man spent some of his childhood homeless and living in a car with his family, so he knows exactly what you're dealing with and it's actually important to him. The problem is, the media has decided that he's irrelevant and has summarily and arrogantly dismissed him, which makes it extremely difficult, if not impossible, for him and his supporters to make any headway at all.

[JohnLocke]

6. Good for you!

:yourock: :yourock:

[Faygo Kid]

8. Thanks for a great and heartfelt post. And best wishes.

Your points are very well taken, and should be a wake-up call for all of us here. I sincerely do not believe Kucinich can win, and my position is ABB. I respect yours; more importantly, I sympathize with your difficult situation, and hope you will continue to post. The world is not as shitty as it appears, but for many, it's pretty shitty right now. You are a bright and well spoken individual (and I do not mean to be patronizing). And, you are lucky to have a family to love. I am sure, from your post, that they love you too. In the midst of the madness that surrounds us, that counts for more than anything. Take care, and I am with you.

[dweller]

10. I know how you feel

and i have to let the anger bounce back sometimes, there is no way you can ignore it all the time.
I may not be the 'perfect DK supporter', but i'm not giving up

don't let the bastards get you down.
dp

[Astarho]

11. Well said

Great post.

[emulatorloo]

12. I LOVE DK and am sorry to hear you are angry n/t

[RichM]

13. Where is there a "Kucinich forum?" (ie, the URL)

I'd like to check it out.

[diamondsoul]

22. Here's a link.

http://us.denniskucinich.us/phpBB2/

You'll have to register with a valid e-mail to post. We've had a lot of troll hits ever since Eric Blumrich gave us the use of one of his flash animations, so we had to impose a few tighter controls.:(

[Kanary]

14. My boat is leaking too

yet, with rare exceptions, that matters not here.

I have posted many, many times about my circumstances, and only a few are willing to show concern. That, more than anything, has soured me on the whole election. If I'm no longer worth anything to even the Dems who come together to discuss issues, then there's no longer anything for me to "hang in there" for.

I would propose one thing... how 'bout those of us left start recognizing the ultimate truth... that we ARE ALL IN THIS TOGETHER. How 'bout actually facing the fact that WE NEED EACH OTHER.

Then, actually start living from that premise. How 'bout broadening what has been done in many threads when a candidate drops out... supporters from other campaigns simply caring and lending an ear and a pat on the back for a job well done. I fail to see why that same general tone can't be used in ALL THE THREADS.

I am demoralized about being shunted off to the side more than I can even express. Being ignored and razzed has sapped my spirits. And, NO, I don't need to be told to Buck Up.... I NEED for others to show their human side and just plain care.

The result here has been that I've stopped caring about others... something I've never done before in my entire life. But, one can't keep responding and caring about others and in return get either ignored or slapped without eventually closing down to others.

Is that what we really want? To build our own little barricades, and not let anyone else in? Is that going to gain us the society we most desire?

Kanary

[MuseRider]

23. It does matter.

I have to tell you that there have been a few times I have been near tears and you have brightened me. I guess you probably didn't know that, I was most likely remiss letting you know. Well, now you know. You are right, we do all need each other. Not just us in the DK camp but all of us and that, to me, seems to be the prevailing message from DK. Everything is related, everything. So, my DU friend :hug:

[Kanary]

37. Nope, didn't know that.

I guess I need to ammend my profile, and include that I flunked Mind Reading 101 :) :hi:

I'm glad to know that, in my own bumbling way, I somehow added some brightness to your outlook. Dunno how that happened.... guess I slipped up. ~~gigglesnort~~ I *do* know it would have added a spot of bright to my day to have known that.

So... here's my proposal..... how 'bout we all make a real effort to SPEAK those positive thoughts that flit through, but often don't find expression. For most of us, our days have quite enough of the spirit-robbing things flung at us, and those little expressions of appreciation can mean more than we know.

I once had a kumu hula (master instructor) who reminded us repeatedly that we never know where another person might be on any given day, and an expression of Aloha could even pull back someone from the brink of their own despair. Words of great Hawai'ian wisdom.

So, I offer you...

Aloha!

Kanary

[MuseRider]

40. Mahalo!

I will make an honest effort. It should not be hard since my friends always come to me when they need something, I am "The Rock" HA! If they only knew. There is something really good about spreading support and happiness. I hate that I had not expressed that. Well, now you know. :loveya:

[Kanary]

61. Warm fuzzies to ya... ^_^

I had a feeling I could say that to you, as I thought you would be one to be able to hear it. I thank you for that.

It's so easy to forget those things..... we're surrounded by a very critical and negative society. So, while we all have those supportive thoughts of others from time to time, we often don't get them past our teeth because we're so socialized to look for what we can disagree with. It's what sets us apart, donchaknow..... :) I think we just all need to be reminded that voicing those more positive thoughts is A Good Thing. :)

I don't know if you ever read the whole Warm Fuzzy Story, but it fits in great here. Too bad I wouldn't be allowed to post it here.

Hah.. much to my surprise, I was actually able to find it.... So, here's to you, MuseRider... a fine story:
http://www.storybin.com/sponsor/sponsor138.shtml

I met Claude Steiner back in my dirtyhippiecommiepinkobum days... at the time when he wrote that story. He was quite a thinker.

Thanks again for hearing me... much appreciated...

Kanary

[diamondsoul]

33. EXACTLY!!

That's exactly what it is! It's like we come here trying to talk about the things that are vitally important to every one of us just to run headlong into someone else's brick wall!

I mean that's why we're in this mess in the first place....because nobody cares enough to actually FIGHT for the changes we need! Except Dennis, and I think maybe Howard Dean.(I hope, I hope, I hope!)

:grouphug: Hold on. We'll get through this somehow, but you're right we need to stick together. My PM and my e-mail are yours to use anytime you need.

[InvisibleTouch]

15. Hang In There

DiamondSoul, I sympathize, and can only recommend that you follow your candidate's example and hang in there, keep fighting the good fight, and don't let the negative opinions of others drag you down. Easier said than done, I realize, but we've got a lot of good inspiration around here. I myself am a sadly disappointed Dean supporter, but I've always loved DK as well, and I'm so glad he's sticking it out and staying in the race. I had the privalege of meeting Dennis Kucinich in Yellow Springs yesterday during his tour through Ohio - he spoke for about half an hour in front of a book store, and one of the themes he touched upon was courage: having the courage to follow our convictions, to pursue true freedom (as opposed to ever-increasing restrictions and Big-Brother style monitoring of the public) and to do what's right in the world. On the topic of whether he was electable, he said "I am if you vote for me." :) Keep the faith.

[flaminbats]

16. Just look at the undecided voters if you want a reason to keep posting.

Giving people reasons to vote against Kucinich will not work, mainly because the majority of Democrats already have their reasons to vote against the contenders. But people like you are their best source for learning why they should vote for a candidate.

I have narrowed my choice down to Kerry and Kucinich, but negative campaigning will not win my vote.

[diamondsoul]

27. I know, flamin'

but the negative campaigning is exactly what I'm so angry about. Not too long ago, I went to a Democratic Club meeting and gave a stump speech for Dennis. There were something like 20-30 Dean supporters there, and one of the first things I overheard after setting out some Kucinich literature was a Dean supporter telling others "That's the guy who bankrupted Cleveland for Gawd's sakes!" and watched him roll his eyes.

I'm not suggesting his nastiness was indicative of all Dean supporters, not by any stretch. Other Dean supporters that were there were some of the nicest people I've ever had the pleasure to meet. Most had nioce things to say about Kucinich, told me after we all spoke that I gave a first rate speech, and even signed ballot access petitions- we all did for each of the candidates represented.

I think, after a while of being met with that, the nastiness starts to overshadow the good people we meet and that's why I needed to post this. Maybe just one of the people who has been so vicious to Kucinich and his supporters will think before they post that way again, you know?

(BTW, in case you haven't heard the refutation of the bankruptcy myth, Cleveland went into default while Kucinich was Mayor, not bankruptcy. What that means is he ran the entire city for the next 2 years on a cash only basis, and kept it functioning without declaring bankruptcy.)

[MuseRider]

18. For you

:hug: :hug: :hug: :hug:

You are so good, so faithful and so bright. I have learned from you and I think many have learned a lot about Dennis Kucinich from you. There are jerks everywhere. If I could hold my tongue like you do I would be very proud. I'd say keep on keeping on and let the jerks fall by the wayside. You do all of this with a 2 year old? My goodness, I feel like such a slacker. One more for good measure :hug: and thanks for all you do.

Edit to add I am angry too but we HAVE made a difference

[Debi]

19. Damn Ted Koppel

for starting the trend of "So, when are YOU gonna drop out?"

Since when did debate moderators get to decide who our candidates should be?

[maddezmom]

20. I'm very sorry you feel this way, I respect everyone's choice

and I've made a point of posting positive articles on DK and even donated to his campaign.

[MuseRider]

26. Yes you have.

Thanks for that. There are so many good people here, just a few really nasty folks who just have to tool us around and it gets old. I had one on ignore for a while but I hate that so now I just put up with it. I would say the majority of people here who do not agree with DK are at least kind and able to discuss thoughtfully. It is just the few. And since I seem to be in the mood a :hug: for you too. I am feeling very huggy tonight.

[maddezmom]

29. thanks MuseRider

:hug: back at you and a :grouphug: for all the DK supporters. It's been a tough road for all of us.

[diamondsoul]

30. You've been great.

Please don't tkae this as a broad-brush indictment of DU posters, because it isn't. I've become very fond of DU and most of the people here. That's what makes it so much more frustrating, I think. To come here and realize good people like you aren't quite able to counter the nastier people's affect. It's just messed up any way you look at it, imho.

[maddezmom]

36. sorry overreacted

please read your pm's. :pals:

[diamondsoul]

43. Got it, and thanks.

For what it's worth, I didn't take offense to your post, just felt bad for upsetting you when you've been so nice to everyone.:pals:

[maddezmom]

53. it's worth a lot, a ton, more than you know

:pals:

[no name no slogan]

64. maddezmom may be a Wes Clark Democrat...

but she's all DK, too! I really appreciated the article you posted about DK earlier today (or was it yesterday?). You are definately one of the 'good guys'!!!

:grouphug:

[Mairead]

28. Brava, DS! Brava!

Well the hell said!

There are some VERY juvenile people around here.

[Rowdyboy]

31. I'm sorry you had this nasty experience ...I can empathize...

My former candidate was called a murderer, a war criminal, a nut-case, and a Republican; his supporters accused of being infiltrators. But, please realize, EVERY candidate has had their fair (or unfair) share of mud thrown at them. The only way these posters could attack DK is by minimizing him as a serious candidate. They couldn't attack his experience, or his voting record, or his intelligence so they were left with "electability" as the only avenue of attack.

Admittedly, Kucinich was in a very difficult situation. He's not telegenic in a society that is obsessed with television. He was "only" a member of the House, not a senator or governor, or party leader or general. He had virtually no national name-recognition. His politics preclude any serious financial support from business interests. He has no personal fortune to fall back on and he's to the left on the political spectrum.

Dean co opted Kucinich's only serious potential base-disillusioned, anti-war young people/college students. There are only so many of them to go around, and, fairly or not, Dr Dean got the lion's share. When you add Dean's phenomenal fund raising, DK never had a serious chance to get off the ground.

[buddhamama]

34. who holds the key

to reality? does only one reality exist, with a myriad of perceptions? and is the perception greater than the reality?

i am sorry that you are angry, diamondsoul.
i understand your anger, and frustration.

fantasy land is the same dream world
is the same as hope.
the change must begin somewhere.
someone must be willing to take the first step.
the problem, imo, is that people are afraid of change,
of disappointment, and have come to expect so little
that they are willing to settle.
our society also thrives on instant gratification.
if it ain't going to happen now, forget it.
the issues of struggle, often appear not to apply to 'us'.
we separate ourselves from the reality of others
and lose in the process our compassion and empathy.
keep yourself, who you are, above the fray.
the hope that resides in you, in me, and countless others
DK supporters or not, is the ripple that can and will effect change.

[revcarol]

35. Sometimes I get so angry I can just spit

and I know how you feel. We have the finest candidate, a lot of us are just barely hanging on, and we know that Dennis is for us.

and then some snark...and we know Dennis wouldn't strike back like we want to do...and then we are ashamed because it's hard to live up to such goood candidate...but we try.

I'm not going to tell you to hang in there, because you already have a lot more guts and spirit than I would have in your position, but know that I and many others appreciate you and do care.:grouphug:

[Kanary]

39. That is, indeed, it! I can't live up to that example as I'd like

That's very hard, to have someone who is such a fine leader, who inspires the same idealism and high standards. I have those standards, also, but that was one of the first casualties when I arrived here.... I realized I just don't have it in me anymore to receive an endless amount of slings and arrows and still respond with kindness. I have many good qualities, but I'm realizing that isn't one of them. It's increased by the goal of reflecting Dennis in our public posts. That is a harder expectation to realize than many know. It has increased my appreciation for him. I truly don't know how he does it.

I appreciate your anger. I can reassure you that it's justified. However, I'm not angry so much anymore as hurt and discouraged and .... just plain down in the dumps.

Thanks, revcarol.....

Kanary

[OhioStateProgressive]

38. WE are the elite

The 1-10% of people who are actively supporting Kucinich, we are the elite who have figured it out. We should take comfort in the fact that we can see the truth while others cannot.

[diamondsoul]

41. There are a couple of song lyrics-

that always remind me of Kucinich. I posted them somewhere, can't recall if it was here or some other forum. I got the response "Only a Kucinich supporter could use song lyrics to describe their candidate!" and used one of the eye-rolling smileys. I keep wondering what's so horrible about it.

They suit him so well, I bought him a copy of the CD and plan to give it to him whenever I finally get to meet him. I think he'll love it.

[OhioStateProgressive]

44. song lyrics

Are a most poetic and beautiful way to express feelings. In time, people will learn that art=truth, and all else is speculation.

As Kucinich supporters we already know this:)

[MacCovern]

56. art equals truth?

what about the ability to think clearly using logic, and other
intellectual pursuits? Art does not equal truth.

[OhioStateProgressive]

58. intellectual pursuits are nice

But they aren't art.
Art equals truth, say it louder if you didn't cath it the first time.

[Kanary]

59. You're so right... right-brained vs left-brained

USians glorify left-brain functions.

Often to the exclusion of right-brained functions.

Truth dies in that scenario.

Kanary

[Name removed]

55. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[LWolf]

42. For you, DS.

:hug::hug::hug::hug::hug::hug::hug::hug::hug::hug::hug::hug::hug::hug::hug::hug::hug::hug::hug::hug::hug::hug::hug::hug:

[maggrwaggr]

45. you've hit on the reason I rarely visit this forum

it seems like the internet equivalent of a room of people all shouting at each other

[NC_Nurse]

46. I am new, but

let me tell you that Dennis Kucinich seems like the candidate with the real vision. I have worked for campaigns before and I'm just not sure I'm ready for all that stress, especially since my finances aren't far from yours.

Good for you for getting involved and making a difference! I admire you and hope I can get off the fence and do more myself.

:)

[diamondsoul]

50. If you want to be

actively involved, pm or e-mail me and I'll be glad to share a few things that don't cost a penny. No pressure, just an offer. Thanks very much for the kind thoughts. :)

[democrank]

47. Just keep believing....

That`s all you have to do. Forget the pundits, forget the media, forget the DLC,forget the polls, forget the critics. Just hold your head high and vote what you believe. Chin up!

[Fargin Ice Hole]

48. You should point your finger at corporate media.

They have already chosen your candidate.
<>

[Kanary]

52. Um, really? Is it corporate media who comes here and blasts us?

Y'know, everyone is responsible for what comes out of their mouths, or their keyboards.

"The media" doesn't make 'em do it.

Truly.

We all have the choice to respond to each other with kindness and understanding and support, or to blast away.

Kanary

[Fargin Ice Hole]

62. agreed.... but Sheep are so easily manipulated........n/t

[eridani]

49. I'll let the Grateful Dead have the last word here.

If my words did glow with the gold of sunshine
And my tunes were played on the harp unstrung
Would you hear my voice come through the music
Would you hold it near as it were your own?

It's a hand-me-down, the thoughts are broken
Perhaps they're better left unsung
I don't know, don't really care
Let there be songs to fill the air

Ripple in still water
When there is no pebble tossed
Nor wind to blow

Reach out your hand if your cup be empty
If your cup is full may it be again
Let it be known there is a fountain
That was not made by the hands of men

There is a road, no simple highway
Between the dawn and the dark of night
And if you go no one may follow
That path is for your steps alone

Ripple in still water
When there is no pebble tossed
Nor wind to blow

You who choose to lead must follow
But if you fall you fall alone
If you should stand then who's to guide you?
If I knew the way I would take you home

-- Robert Hunter and Jerry Garcia

[buddhamama]

51. beautiful

gives me chills every time i hear it.

gonna go put it on. :thumbsup:

[indigo32]

57. DiamondSoul

I am sorry you were treated poorly, I don't understand why people can't follow the golden rule.
I am especially sorry that even this post appears now to have been invaded by negativism.
There are some out there that still care.

[diamondsoul]

60. Thanks indigo.

It helps to hear from Dean supporters that aren't intent on slapping down Kucinich.

I'm so adamant about NOT telling people how to vote. I mean that's something I'd be embarrassed to even consider asking someone face to face! Places like that Democratic Club I mentioned it's kind of obvious but generally speaking it's not my business how people vote.

Dean supporters will probably relate to this one. In the midst of this thread, I popped in a Tracy Chapman CD, the one with "Gimme One Reason" (Gimme one reason to stay here, and I'll turn right back around....Said I don't wanna leave you lonely, but you gotta make me change my mind). All I could think was "I just found my theme for the Democratic Party!" and started laughing.

It seems I wasn't the only one who got blasted. I just discovered a thread at the Kucinich forum asking that a thread title be edited for being inflammatory to Dean supporters. People seem to be reacting instead of stopping to consider their choices, and that's just so dangerous and destructive! :(

[no name no slogan]

63. Thanks for a great thread ds

I know the situation you're in-- mine was very similar three years ago, and now that I've lost my job, it's going to get like that again, I fear.

I know what you mean about how DK is the only one who not only addresses these things, but can actually RELATE to us-- the "normal" people in this country.

I have to admit that I'm not always the best DK advocate out there, but I'm definately sick and tired of the lies and personal attacks against DK and all the other candidates, for that matter.

Thanks for providing the shining light in the never-ending river of sh!t that is GD-2004. You are greatly appreciated!

WE WILL NEVER GIVE UP!

:hug: :hug: :grouphug: :hug: :hug:

[MSchreader]

65. "It's the class war, stupid!"

The day a Democratic candidate figures out that THIS is the overarching slogan for 2004 is the day they will waltz into the White House. Until then,...

You and I are in about the same economic position, so I can fully and completely understand from where you are speaking.

Martin

[Vernunft II]

66. Kuchinich is the only one left in the race who´d

get my vote. The US needs a president, not a new Emperor.