CNN: Obama- Clinton "dodging" Social Security

[Colobo]

Obama's campaign arranged for him to be introduced at the event by Tod Bowman, an undecided caucus-goer and a teacher from Maquoketa, Iowa, who tried to pin down Clinton during a debate in Iowa earlier this month on whether the government should tax workers' earnings above the present cap of $97,500 to help pay for Social Security benefits.

Clinton sidestepped the question in public, but told Bowman +privately afterward that she didn't want to put an additional tax burden on the middle class but would consider a "gap," with no Social Security taxes on income from $97,500 to around $200,000. Anything above that could be taxed. Her answer was overheard by an Associated Press reporter.

"A candidate for president owes it to the American people to tell us where they stand," Obama said. "… because you're not ready to lead if you can't tell us where you're going."

"She's not alone in avoiding answering this question directly — she's not alone in ducking the issue," Obama said. "Because conventional thinking in Washington says that Social Security is the third rail of American politics. It says you should hedge, and dodge, and spin, but at all costs, don't answer."


Bowman said he "got the feeling (Clinton) really didn't want to answer my question."

"After the forum ended, she came up and spoke to me, it was nice of her to do that, and I appreciated her taking the time to do that. But, when I asked my question again, hoping she would answer it, this time she gave me a conflicting response," he said. "It left me feeling disappointed, because I just didn't understand why she wouldn't tell me where she stood on an issue this important."

Bowman added: "It made me wonder, if a candidate won't answer a question on the campaign trail, how can we be sure she'll be honest with the American people when they're president?"

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2007/10/27/obama-clinton-dodging-social-security/#more-2759

[cuke]

1. But, but, but I thought CNN was part of the media that was PUSHING Hillary

What happened? They weren't supposed to attack her until AFTER she was nominated

[Colobo]

2. Notice how they say that Obama is "lashing out at"

when he's just pointing the obvious differences in a very civil manner.

[cuke]

5. I ALWAYS notice that stuff

It's one of my bugaboos. I'm so conscious of it that I even notice when it goes unnoticed, like when one article (by Imawhore Puffington) claimed that Bill Clinton "shouted" at protesters.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

3. Does Obama Have Plans Of His Own Or Is He Just Going To Attack His Opponents?

DSB

[Colobo]

4. LOL! You sound like Howard Wolfson now.

His plans are clear:

www.barackobama.com

Feel free to donate.

[cuke]

6. I have to say, I don't think there's anything wrong with a lively discussion of the issues

[phen43]

11. me either!!

:)

[hfojvt]

15. actually they are kinda vague

http://www.barackobama.com/issues/seniors/

"Protect and Strengthen Social Security. Social Security is indispensable to our workers and our seniors. It is a great reflection of our values as a country. Barack Obama will make sure Social Security is solvent and viable for the American people, now and in the future. Two-thirds of beneficiaries depend on Social Security for more than half of their monthly income. Barack Obama fought against President Bush's efforts to privatize Social Security. As president, Obama will preserve Social Security by stopping any efforts to privatize it. Obama will work in a bipartisan way to maintain Social Security's solvency for future generations."

He does not say how he intends to do it, except that he intends to 'work in a bipartisan way'.

And personally, I think this just sucks:

"Eliminate Income Taxes for Seniors Making Less Than $50,000. Since the New Deal we've had a basic understanding in America: If you work hard and pay into the system, you've earned the right to a secure retirement. But too many seniors aren't getting that security, even though they've held up their end of the bargain. Lower and middle income seniors are struggling as their expenses on health and energy skyrocket while their incomes do not keep pace. This strain has been greater since 1993, when taxes on social security benefits were raised. Millions of seniors saw their net benefits go down."

So, a non-working retired person (or is it couple? is he talking about $50,000 per couple or $100,000) making $49,000 pays no income taxes, while a person like me, making $13,000 pays about $1,000 in FICA taxes, and pays state income taxes, and loses a mandatory $520 for my retirement, and will need to put $600-800 into an IRA just to avoid income taxes, and pays $2700 for health insurance, unlike seniors who get medicare.

But that's okay. Retired people, unlike working people, need some breaks. Because they have their own lobbying group. Unlike working people.

[cuke]

18. Yeah, it's vague but

pitting working people against seniors is not the solution. We need each other

[hfojvt]

19. I think it is plans to give even more tax breaks to retired people

that pits retired people against working people. Lord knows I don't wanna fight with them. They are wealthier and more organized.

BTW - the state of Kansas, under the 'leadership' of its Republican legislature has already done what Obama is proposing. Created a tax exemption for seniors making less than $50,000 a year. It must be nice when both parties are working to give you hand-outs.

[cuke]

20. They are wealthier and more organized b/c they face financial uncertainty

My mom saved and invested for thirty years, including throughout the Wall Street bull market, and didn't do too badly for someone with a not large income. She has a pension and SS. She has insurance up the wazoo. Yet, she and myself are going to end up penniless because of her medical condition. Nearly all of MY retirement savings are gone, and hers are also going to go to her care.

30 years of her savings, and 30 years of my savings, and it only covers a few years of her care

And I have some problems of my own, but no insurance because I can't work and take care of her. So my problems go untreated

[papau]

7. So Hillary likes Edwards idea - interesting -I find the gap wierd and artificial as the FIT can

be changed to take a little less from the 97 to 200 grand crowd - and Edwards idea moves a benefit to the ulta-rich who I would prefer not get it (amazing as it may sound, when you make 10,000,000 a year there were dollars that moved you from 97 to 200 grand and those would not get hit with a payroll tax - even the ultra rich would benefit).

But as a way to explain the idea in an election the Edwards - and now Clinton - idea is clear, albeit not the best policy.

As to Hillary saying she wants to increase taxes - even getting her to admit this payroll tax wage cap change - it is not going to happen except for the tax cuts for the rich that will pay for health care.

[cuke]

13. They're all trying to thread a very small political needle

Edwards has taken the politically wise position of "tax the rich", though in this case, it's not entirely true for the reason you mentioned

Obama is putting "everything on the table", sort of a corrolary to his Unity theme. It's both noble and noble-sounding, so it has it's political appeal. The dangers are if he is forced to choose and give details.

Clinton has been trying to avoid talking about the details, claiming she is not going to give anything away before negotiations begin. It has both it's political risks and rewards. If pressed, it seems she will head towards a politically safe position like Edwards.

I see a debate where Obama will press Clinton to take a stand, and Clinton will respond that putting something on the table means giving something to the republicans while getting in return, and will press Obama to appear supportive of politically unpopular solutions such as raising the retirement age, cutting benefits

By the time they get done denying and defining, they're going to sound a lot like Edwards

[sandnsea]

8. Upper 10% is the middle class

That's what she said right there. I wish the 90%, or more specifically the median wage worker, would get this through their heads. When people like her talk about middle class, they aren't talking about us.

[Evergreen Emerald]

9. but...she has been clear where have people been? Oh yes, campaigning.

[SaveElmer]

10. Obama's latest campaign tactic...

Which is all this is...

Plan what D...E....F...

Wonder what he will try next?

[phen43]

12. GO OBAMA GO!!!

An honest, truthful man for sure!!!:hi:

[Nedsdag]

14. Does Hillary have any ideas of her own?

Oh, yes, that's right! She doesn't!

[NovemberRain]

16. Obama!

Obama is being honest; I like what he had to say.

[illinoisprogressive]

17. i have read and heard many people complain that she won't answer questions.

And, she's lost votes in Iowa for not being open and straight with people. They want answers now.
When Bush ran he was with republican audiences who don't care. And things have changed alot since then.
People are taking a good look at candidates and wanting real answers.

[AtomicKitten]

21. Hey Katz.

You posted Tod's candidate-shopping on Social Security. I hope people get a chance to hear it.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x3653629

[phen43]

22. Can't wait for the debate!!!

Obama puts on the gloves and calls Hillary to the mat!!!:popcorn: