How do Kucinich supporter feel about ol' Ralph?

[eileen from OH]

Seems to me that you guys might be the one most ticked about this. What does Nader offer that DK does not? (That's a legit question - I don't know the absolute specifics of their positions enough to know the ground that separates them.) In fact, I used to be kinda scared that the two of 'em would join forces and run third-party which COULD really impact the election, as Ralph running alone could not. (Thanks to DK supporters for straightening me out on that!)

So what do you guys think?

eileen from OH

[benburch]

1. I wonder what his price was.

If he gave a damn about this country, he would have supported Kucinich in the primaries and the Dem nominee in the general election.

It is obvious to me that he is a Quisling; A sellout. All I wonder is, what did it take to get him to drop to his knees and whore himself for the Bush Crime Family?

-Ben

[hippywife]

2. Nader said he wouldn not run

if Kucinich got the nomination. Since the party hard-liners have chose to minimalize Dennis, Nader has chosen to run.

[eileen from OH]

4. But doesn't Nader running minimalize

Dennis even MORE?

eileen from OH

[hippywife]

5. Not at all.

He sees that the Dem party doesn't take him seriously so he is going to make sure there is at least one true progressive in the race after the convention. He can drop his bid any time he likes, my instincts say he would drop out if Dennis emerged as the nominee.

[Frances]

8. Give me a break

Gore endorsed Dean

Kerry had to mortgage his house to get money to campaign

Sharpton took money from the Republicans

John Edwards gets money from lawyers

Kucinich has been in every debate. He is a good man whose views reflect my views. But the "hardliners" in the Democratic party are not controlling the voters. And most voters prefer either Kerry or Edwards.

I refuse to whine about the voters' preference. Neither Kerry nor Edwards will not do the damage that Bush has done to the environment, the judiciary, social security, medicare, the budget, etc.

[GreenArrow]

3. Voted for him in 2000

won't be voting for him this time. I don't think it's a serious run, however. He's in it to bring up issues that the front running candidates won't dare to bring up, and in the process he'll make Edwards and Kerry look even more moderate than they already are. Once he's made his points, he'll get out. In the long term, this could be a boon.

DK and Sharpton are already bringing up many of these issues, but for seem reason the mainstream press doesn't want to focus on them. I'd love to see him endorse DK instead, but simply by virtue of being Ralph Nader, Ralph will get more face time than either of the truth telling Democratic candidates.

[mgc1961]

6. Voted Nader twice,...

...but probably not this time.

As someone else has stated, Mr. Nader may not campaign "seriously" until after the convention when, presumably, DK will be gone along with Dr. Dean. It would be the perfect time to keep additional progressive issue-pressure on the nominee by proxy since the other candidates have already said they would support the nominee.

Just speculating.

[Tinoire]

7. Your late concern is... touching. n/t

[eileen from OH]

17. Concern?

I wasn't concerned - I was curious. That's allowed isn't it?

eileen from OH

[Mairead]

9. My feelings can be largely summed up as "It's still not too late"

followed closely by "fat lot of difference that will make".

I can't remember who it was, Galbraith possibly, who remarked that the wealthy would rather risk losing everything including their lives than loosen their grip on wealth and power even a little. I think we're seeing the same dynamic at work in the way the Dem Party behaves.

[DemBones DemBones]

10. It's the media who marginalized Dennis Kucinich, which was

hardly a surprise, since the media are corporate-controlled and have the well-being of corporations as their priority, not the well-being of people. They don't want an anti-corporatist candidate, as evidenced (if David Podvin's data is correct) by their turn against Dean once he said he would act to break up media monopolies.

Kucinich has been saying that for far longer than Dean and the media never gave him a chance, much less a boost such as they gave Dean. Dean, after all, is a fiscal conservative, and his record in Vermont shows he was unlikely to do much harm to corporate interests, while Dennis's record as mayor of Cleveland shows he would stand up to monopolies. It was somewhat out of character for Dean to say he'd break up media monopolies, and probably had a lot to do with his perceptions of media slighting him at times. Little did he know how much more they could slight him.

Nader will say his piece, probably with more media coverage than Kucinich ever got, and if he takes votes away from the Democratic nominee, what do the media care?

[cryofan]

11. I love Ralph, and love Kucinich

DK ran a pure CRAP campaign, but he is still a progressive. In fact, if Nader gets some decent campaign cash (from the GOP or wherever) before the convention, he should walk into the convention and threaten to use that money to run only in the swing states, unless the Dems give Kucinich the VP spot.

[GreenPartyVoter]

12. I think it's fine that Nader is running, Dennis supports democracy

But I think Ralph will not be pulling in the votes dems are so worried about.

Still, to be safe they ought to get Dennis on the ticket then the issue is moot.

[LWolf]

13. I don't care about Nader one way or the other.

I don't hate him. I don't think he's Satan. I don't blame him for the 2000 fiasco. I'm not in a hysterical frenzy because he decided to run. I've been expecting it for months. He also doesn't generate any enthusiasm, or even any interest. I've never voted for him. I can't see a situation at this point that would bring me to vote for him. But his running does not bother me. Democracy does not bother me.

I think Nader is a non-issue that provides a perfect distraction from the real issues in the rest of the democratic primary process.

[RichM]

14. Nader's presence might conceivably HELP Dennis by giving voice to

the very issues that are most central to DK's campaign.

On the issues themselves, Dennis & Nader are extremely close. Nader, however, may well get far more media attention, especially if the elite decide this summer that they prefer Bush to Kerry (this "matter" is still under consideration). In that case, the media might give Nader lots of face time, as a way to lure away progressives and hurt Kerry.

Since Dennis holds virtually all of Nader's positions, he might gain, as it dawns on people that here's a real progressive in the Democratic Party, who's been saying the same things as Nader all along. Nader is known to be very favorably disposed to Dennis; perhaps if a motion in DK's direction gets under way, Nader might announce, "I'll pull out if Kucinich is nominated."

Somehow, adding another voice that speaks pretty much the same truth as DK seems potentially positive to me.

[Kanary]

15. Hmmm, you don't know the policy specifics,

yet you've been vociferously running down Dennis every chance you get?

How..... droll.....

Kanary

[Maddy McCall]

16. Party credentials and affiliation.

[Desertrose]

18. I don't think Nader is that big a deal...he isn't running Green

he's running as an independant.

He's running cause the DNC/DLC pretty much cut Kucinich out. Seems as though it comes down to the corporate party and those not in the corporate party. Nader obviously feels that Kerry or Edwards offer voters a clearcut difference....and the corporate party/media has made sure no one knows about Kucinich..

I give DK tons of credit for sticking with the dem party in spite of his being marginalized by them.

Like some posters said above- Nader shares the same positions as Dennis does so perhaps it will help Kucinich. Pisses me off the way folks get "face time" anymore...certainly not based on what they have to say but by what the media decides.

I guess I shouldn't be surprised by all the freakout Nader threads on here...man, you'd think he was the devil and was coming to get all DUers & force them to vote against their will!

Dems need to get a clue....

Peace
DR

[Lydia Leftcoast]

19. I lost all respect for Nader

when he went AWOL once Bush got into the White House and didn't speak up against the administration's abuses. For him to pop up again four years later after hobnobbing with the Republicans is the height of effrontery.

And that's the only thing I'm going to say about Nader in this forum.

Somebody has to talk about something else. :-)

[jazzsammich]

21. he has been speaking out...

...but he's been persona non grata among so many people since 2000 that it seems most mainstream news organizations (and even many liberal/progressive ones) won't touch him with a 10-foot pole. not as if they were particularly kind to him in 2000 either -- he had a media blackout almost as bad as my man Dennis has been getting this go 'round.

--jim k.

[Zomby Woof]

20. utterly indifferent

Attention is what the egomaniac craves, and he will get none from me.

This is the first and last mention of him I will make for the entire campaign on through November.

[morgan2]

22. i like the guy

the only thing I disagree with him about is that he didn't come right out and say if candidate x or y win the Dem nomination I won't run. If x or y win I will run. I understand that its not an easy decision to make, but think he should have made it much earlier so as to give the Dems a chance to respond by either voting in one of the candidates he would compromise with or not.