At debate, Obama doesn't soar

[KennedyGuy]

http://www.observer.com/2008/debate-obama-does-not-soar

"The paradox that is Barack Obama came into sharp, almost painful, focus tonight: He is, at once, one of the best television candidates in political history and one of the more underwhelming.

Obama’s political star was launched when he delivered a dazzling address on national television at his party’s convention in 2004. His oratory was mesmerizing, his message inspiring, and his appearance and manner made him an instantly likable figure to millions of Americans. That Obama—Big Speech Obama—is tailor-made for television.

But then there’s Debate Obama, a hesitant, stuttering, easily rattled and mostly unsmiling public performer who litters his platitudes and “uh’s” and misses countless opportunities to throw his opponents’ taunts back in their faces. Debate Obama unwittingly affirms Hillary Clinton’s suggestion that he lacks the seasoning to withstand the scrutiny of a fall campaign and leaves those who have only seen Big Speech Obama wondering, “Is this really the same guy?”

The shortcomings of Debate Obama were once again on display tonight in Myrtle Beach, S.C. They aren’t easily visible in transcripts and print news summaries, but anyone watching the proceedings on television—and there were several million such people tuning in on CNN—could see them, particularly when Obama’s two rivals directly engaged him.

His extended exchange with Hillary Clinton early on, in which he ridiculed her for sitting on the Wal-Mart corporate board and she labeled him a slumlord coddler, vividly illustrated Obama’s weaknesses in debate settings".

[calmblueocean]

1. It also says that Hillary's attacks rely on "gross distortions and factually inaccurate assertions"

Which is worse?

I hate what TV has done to our political process. We're not supposed to be electing a freaking movie star. The notion that a debate that will determine the life or death of thousands of citizens has to be scripted and delivered like a fucking action movie is pathetic. It's shameful to make appearance more important than reality here.

[OHdem10]

2. One gets the impression that Obama is not quick on his feet.

He is a better orator--giving speeches in which he can be prepared.

It has been said in the past Obama is not as good Debater.

[jefferson_dem]

6. One = you.

:)

[Jai4WKC08]

13. Make it two

Obama had some good lines, but good lines can be prepared in advance. When he was attacked directly, the stuttering was awful. I think he needs a script. Not that that's a bad thing -- all presidents use them. The only drawback to it would be the GE debates if he were to win the nomination.

[redqueen]

16. That, IMO, is a GIGANTIC frickin drawback. (nt)

[water]

23. I disagree.

There weren't any instances where he didn't have an answer nearly immediately. You may not have liked his answers, however.

[CoffeeCat]

3. Hilarious....

The Clinton supporters--guided by Hillary herself---constantly remind us
that, "You've got to be more than a good speaker!", as they degrade
Obama for simply inspiring his supporters---who support him for his IDEAS.

Those same attackers---now suggest that his manner of speaking and style
is JUST SO important. Important enough to inspire an entire opinion piece!

So....Obama is attacked for his speech when he's soaring; AND he's attacked
for his speech, when the opinion writer deems that his speech is imperfect.

Is anyone else sick of this meaningless "gotcha" bullshit spin that endlessly
attempts to hack up a person and their personal attributes?

Didn't we get enough of this petulant CRAP from George Bush?

I thought Obama was dignified and restrained. He's trying to put forth his
agenda, in spite of dealing with the 24/7 Clinton hatchet machine.

[Laurab]

11. I am.

Sick of it, I mean. So much so that I'm avoiding (almost) all such threads. If everyone who doesn't like it did that, the threads would sink quite fast, or certain supporters could all sit around agreeing with each other.

Most of these things on DU are meaningless - the everyday voter knows nothing about them, so I decided to no longer feed them.

It is indeed "meaningless "gotcha" bullshit spin that endlessly
attempts to hack up a person and their personal attributes"

[sunonmars]

4. Yup he was shown to be very bad at debates last night

[dkf]

5. Your candidate wants all politicians to look just as bad as she does

She is awful for politics in our country.

But you people are proud of her. I find it sickening.

[Rydz777]

7. Just compare the three with Orator Bush and Debater Bush, and

they all look great. That John Edwards should be a skilled debater is no surprise; that's his profession. Hillary was an unknown to me. I had never really seen her in debate before this campaign, and I'm impressed. I pretty much agree with the Observer article about Obama's performance.

Whichever of the three gets the nomination will have to face off with John McCain or Mitt Romney - or less likely Giuliani or Hucklebee. They're all pretty good on their feet but they all carry the heavy vulnerability of Bushism.

[Seabiscuit]

8. "Television Obama" says it all

I was not impressed with Obama at all in regards to his debate skills, but was even more unimpressed when he wasn't able to respond quickly and succinctly to defend his positions or his reputation (re: Hillary's slum lord comment). I am troubled by him, because it is becoming more clear to me that he isn't prepared enough (perhaps its lack of experience) for that type of tough discussion. The general election is going to be tougher and how would he do in a match up against McCain (a seasoned politician)? How would Obama do in discussions, negotiations with very quick minded world leaders as president? I realize that Obama does better in a "TV" format where he can memorize certain lines and present pretty speeches, but when it comes to getting down and dirty I don't think he can do it. I like Obama, in my opinion he's just not ready yet. Hillary surprised me as well with her tough talk and I can see that nobody pushes this lady around (although at times it seemed a bit harsh). Edwards no doubt about it is prepared for any debate and even more so listens carefully to what is being said or better yet not said and that's a great skill to have as president. Edwards is one cool cat.

[Beacool]

9. Yep, very true.

Obama has demonstrated this campaign season that he's a fantastic speaker but a poor debater. Of the top three I think that Hillary is the best debater and then Edwards. Obama hems and haws in every debate I've watched so far.

I'm not questioning the validity of anyone's response, but in style and effectiveness I think that Hillary is a much better debater than Obama.

[CyberPieHole]

10. I've been saying he "stutters" for some time now. When rattled he becomes Machine~Gun Obama...

It's quite comical to watch~~~I am glad someone else is pointing it out.

:kick: and recommend

[Scriptor Ignotus]

12. I've seen posts declaring Obama, Edwards and Hillary

the winner of last night's debate. It's all in the eye of the beholder.

I support Obama and thought he was great last night. Not fucking awesome or anything, but solid. He hammered back and had some great lines. I don't hear him speak in platitudes either, but that's because I've heard him speak so often that my mind probably blurs those lines or phases them out or something. On the other hand, I heard Edwards and Clinton (mostly Clinton) say some very vague and nauseating statements. Hillary talking about "change" and "we've got to move forward" stand out.

I can admit I'm biased, strange how no one else can.

[juajen]

27. I believe John-John won the debate, and I support Hillary.

He was at his best last night. I would much rather have him than Bam-Bam as President, that's for sure.

[jillan]

14. Uh-bama.

I can't take credit for that tho, someone else calls him that.

[redqueen]

17. I hope it's a republican.

*sigh*

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

15. Clinton got pwn3d.

I welcome anybody to watch the whole thing in its entirety.

[THUNDER HANDS]

18. he's like the anti-John Kerry

great at speeches, average at debates.

[Adelante]

21. I think Obama is average at debating, too

It's a particular skill others are better at, but it doesn't say anything else about his abilities. I think it's pretty overrated as a qualification.

[THUNDER HANDS]

22. i was talking about Obama

Kerry - great at debating, average at speeches
Obama - great at speeches, average at debating.

[Adelante]

25. Nobody this year is as good a debater as Kerry

I think Obama is superior at speech making, but I would say Kerry is way, way better than average.

[THUNDER HANDS]

28. i know

that, um, was also the point I was making.

[Adelante]

29. I keep missing it?

Is that it? :dunce:

You must be too clever for me :D

[juajen]

30. I think Hillary has been superb at all of the debates, with the

possible exception of last night's debate and though not as good as usual, I believe she came in second to John Edwards.

Why are ya'll leaving her out of the discussion? From the beginning, the general consensus has been that she is an excellent debater, and the best on the stage.

[Iceburg]

19. Yup -- Hillary kicked ass, Obama lost his silver tongue, and the press have much to chew on...

No wavers, no flinches, so stammers, no hesitating, she knew exactly what she wanted to say -- she was the Commander in Chief of the facts. Obama, who clearly at this point in his career, is no match on policy and facts fumbled and flinched repeatedly and in desperation through what he hoped would be a Hail Mary pass (aka Walmart remark). Hillary responded with awesome weight and without missing a step, slammed him with the Rezko remarks. He opened the door -- she closed it. His only defense was a magic wand ... and thus, Obama turned his 17-year relationship with Rezko into “five hours of work” for Rezko’s project. Any non-comotose journalist can now chew on that mess.

Hillary has an uncanny sense of timing in these debates -- she knows she can take a hit and uses it to her advantage ... but she waits for you to deliver a low blow and then POW!!!! Boom! Biff --- she's scary smart and tough as nails. She may not be somebody you want to have a beer with, but she is definitely someone you want to occupy the most powerful office in the world.

Don't get me wrong -- both Edwards and Obama are forces to be reckoned with -- each has his own endearing strengths. John Edwards earned a first class ticket to the convention with his progressive ideas. Obama is an inspiration to the youthful wing of the population. But let's face it -- America is a mess at home and abroad, and only formidable strength and competence in leadership will change the course. You don't have to like Hillary -- but one would be hard pressed to say they didn't respect her.

If I was a Republican candidate I would be very depressed today.

[arewenotdemo]

24. "definitely someone you want to occupy the most powerful office in the world"

Not me.

She should be good with the attack dog rhetoric...she's made plenty of threatening speeches about Iran and Iraq to AIPAC.

[KoKo]

20. Interesting read from a German Reporter...

[Proud2BAmurkin]

26. He's a poor debater. Rambling and rattled.

[NJSecularist]

31. All the Obama homers need to give it up

Do you guys even watch his debates? He is not quick on his feet at all. When he gets attacked, or asked something where he needs to ad-lib, he stutters. He isn't nearly as smooth when he needs to think on his feet as opposed to when he can read a speech and be a terrific orator. This is in sharp contrast to Hillary and Edwards, who are both quick on their feet but aren't as talented an orator as Obama is.

And I'm a guy who will probably vote for Obama on February 5th, but I call it like I see it. Obama struggles in the debate format.