C'mon people, it's no contest.

[Drunken Irishman]

[AtomicKitten]

1. Ouch!

[zalinda]

2. Sorry to disappoint you but

to the average American voter, a man who looks like a 9 year old versus a man who was a prisoner of war, there will be no contest. A man who talks above the average persons head versus a man who can be understood even if you have a 5th grade education, there will be no contest. A snooty black man versus a down to earth white man, there will be no contest.

Do you people never learn? Right now there is an "As Seen On TV" effect, we'll vote for the popular one, the one that the media says is so great. After the primaries, don't count on them still liking that Infomercial. What you think is all that, is not what Joe or Jane six pack wants. You think Obama will will this in a walk, well be prepared for President McCain.

zalinda

[sandnsea]

3. Then they'll choose him over Hillary too

so we might as well not elect Democrats at all anymore.

[Drunken Irishman]

4. We're dooooomed!

[JVS]

47. dooooooooomed

[tridim]

77. -dramatic pause-

DOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOMED!

[JVS]

79. screwn

[alphafemale]

6. Snooty? As in uppity? And you think McCain is "down to earth"

:rofl:

[zalinda]

28. How many of you thought that

the Lieberman - Lamont race was going to be a cake walk? Damn, grow up. Obama is not a saint, he can't walk on water, and most people will not see him that way.

zalinda

[PhD]

40. Agreed

You can't campaign on vague, lofty, unspecified "change" forever.

[blondeatlast]

53. My tax dollars didn't help pay for that "degree," did they?

I don't care for the professional student types...

[reggie the dog]

78. how nice

Nothing like blind hatred of a group. I am happy to say that my taxes here in France pay for nearly all the PHD's in the country. Universities only cost a few hundred dollars a year for tuition. It is still too much. Education is free up until the PHD in Scotland if you live there.

In the USA most teachers are unionized, what do you have against studying?

I hold an MA do you conisder me to be a professioinal student?

I am unionized, does that change your opinion?

The union I am a part of is called Sud Education in case you wanted to know.

[PhD]

83. Don't worry

My masters and doctorate were paid for by my employer. Far from a professional student, I've been in the working world full time since the age of 22.

And if we are to engage in petty tit-for-tat, I personally don't care for labor unions. They have totally sold out the engineers in my profession.

[butterfly77]

54. Especially, the people who are not paying attention now..

[thoughtcrime1984]

66. Grow up if we don't think McCain will be the next President?

C'mon now.

[Usrename]

72. Lieberman v Lamont?

Isn't CT still smarting over that debacle? IIRC, the Republican in that race got less than 10%. Do you think CT will go to McCain?

[beachmom]

73. I certainly didn't. Lamont campaigned mostly on the war only. That is

not the case with Obama who has detailed plans on healthcare, the environment, the economy, and foreign policy.

[PhD]

84. News to me

Do vague promises of "change" and "hope" constitute "detailed plans"?

:shrug:

[Laurab]

81. OMG - I didn't see your post before I posted -

and I had the exact same thought!

[Der Blaue Engel]

7. "You people"

Bwahahahahaha. Thanks for the laugh.

[lligrd]

8. Snooty Black Man???

Someone is being snooty and it ain't Obama.

[zalinda]

32. I have yet to have ONE

Obama supporter tell me in plain simple English what he says, and what he stands for. Every time any one requests info, we are sent to a link on his web site. He doesn't talk to people, he talks down to people. He sends them into some sort of Evangelical euphoria, and people walk out of his revival tent without knowing what he said, except for hope and change. College educated people may love him, but I only had a little bit of college and I find him snooty. Kerry was almost as bad, but Obama, really bad.

zalinda

[lligrd]

34. For Me It Is More What He Doesn't Stand For

and that is the Iraq War and giving my rights away. I cannot forgive Hillary for that. Their platforms are not that much different but Hillary has had more chances to stand up and do what was right and she bent over and let Bush have his way.

I don't really give a rats ass about either of their political speeches since I don't put a lot of faith in feel good platitudes that mean little. I have never listened to an Obama speech. I tried to listen to one of Hillary's the other night and turned it off after 5 minutes.

I used to like and support Hillary but her votes betrayed my support. I view it as a choice between someone who already has sucker punched me and someone who might or might not. I have at least a 50% chance with Obama.

Obama didn't win my vote, Hillary gave it to him.

Now explain to me why you think I should vote based on your dislike of Obama simply because some people are excited by his message. I don't vote based on looks, race, sex or "snootiness". Maybe you could also explain how he talks down to you. If anyone talks down to you it is our current President.

[Recursion]

48. People link his website because his polices aren't sound-byte-able

His main differences with Clinton on policy are also what I like most, namely:
A packer ban (though I think Clinton has picked this up now; they both get it from Edwards)
The AOTC in exchange for community service.
The transparency in contracting database
The executive branch lobbying ban by former employees
Expansion of AmeriCorps
Expansion of the EITC
New farmer recruitment and education programs (particularly the emphasis on regional food networks and sustainable agriculture)
Farm subsidy payout limits of $250K and tightening the Monsanto/ADM loopholes that let them game that system
Ending no-bid contracts over $25k
5-day public comment period before signing non-emergency legislation

And a few others that get even more tedious to list.

[ieoeja]

61. A packer ban?

I mean, Wisconsinites hate Illini enough as it is. But if he's actually advocating a ban on the Packers then he doesn't stand a chance up north.

However, I do know a couple of Chicago GOPers who'd probably vote for him based on that issue alone.

:)


Seriously though, what is this packer ban?

[thoughtcrime1984]

68. He is the only candidate talking about transparency in gov't

That's the only way to get the masses involved and interested in what is happening in Washington, and actually getting the legislators they can believe in, in office.

[coalition_unwilling]

58. Obama was right on Iraq. HilBilly was wrong. End of story. Q.E.D. -n/t

[Jed Dilligan]

65. He stands for helping all Americans, not just the middle class

He offers programs for our most vulnerable citizens, and he even offers the rich a chance to live in a less violently divided society. He offers leadership qualities that a great majority of Americans relate to at a time of great crisis. He offers affordable housing and programs for our millions of ex-prisoners to reintegrate into society. He offers a choice to sign up for affordable healthcare rather than a mandate.

Hillary Clinton offers none of the above. All of her policies are tailored to benefit a statistical bulge in the middle of the population. She leaves the poor out in the cold, just like her husband did.

[Olney Blue]

70. Maybe there is a better word out there than "snooty"

:shrug:

[Laurab]

82. I only have a little bit of college, too and I find him

quite easy to understand, and far from "snooty". I loved his first book, liked his second - what did you think of them? I've never felt any type of "Evangelical euphoria", either. Maybe you shouldn't assume so much.

If you really wanted to know what Obama was saying, I'm sure that you could go to his website, because it is all there, in straight English, just like on Hillary's website - and it's pretty easy to understand if you WANT to.

[FrenchieCat]

9. Looks like Nixon vs. Kennedy to me.

and that's not even as good a pic as Obama can take....and that's probably a not bad one of McCain.

By the time it is all said and done, McCain will be seen as someone past his time.

The election is about the future.....and McCain just isn't.

[Guaranteed]

16. It does. nt

[FunkyLeprechaun]

44. That is exactly what I thought

And I'm looking forward to the Obama-McCain debates before the election in November.

[Zodiak]

71. One of our best strategies for the GE

...would be to "Bob Dole" him. McCain looks terrible compared to his last run for President....he's even more pale and puffy, now. As much as I hate these kinds of politics, it would play strongly into our hands for us to emphasize his appearance as emblematic of the "old way that got us into this mess".

[MzNov]

74. Dole is to Viagra as McCain is to

GERITOL??

[Ichingcarpenter]

17. "Do 'you people' never learn?

Nice one.

I will always cherish the initial misconceptions I had about you.

[zalinda]

29. Good, I hate to disappoint

You people refers to the plethora of people on this forum that don't face reality. Some how you seem to think that all the electorate are well informed people. They aren't. There are many, many people who don't vote along party lines. Given a choice between a skinny black guy, who sounds like a preacher and a white guy who spent years in a prison camp, they'll vote for the white guy.

Some how Obama supporters think that he will wave a magic wand and all things bad will disappear. Yeah, that was what everyone here thought about the 2006 election. Wow, have things changed in this country, a majority in the house and senate have just turned things around. Reid and Pelosi were celebrated, now what do you hear about them?

zalinda

[Ichingcarpenter]

35. I'm not delusional on the ties that bind the power

structure together. However, your racism is apparent even in this reply
in that you think that it will decide this election vs the issues.

Reed and Pelosi are the past even to their most stringent defenders.
I am see no recourcse except to support the future and optimism vs
the tired policies and faces of the past.

No matter who wins, the nation will suffer with what has been laid upon our table
by this regime. The military industrial complex is a force that is driving this
economy and destroying this nation and ruining this planet.

Now, who gets the most money from these guys?
We know the answer.

[zalinda]

37. We don't know, and that's the truth

Obama got a LOT of money really fast in the start up of his campaign, before anyone really knew who he was. I can't get behind either of them. I am an issues person. And why is it okay to say, I want a woman in the white house, but not that woman, and not be labeled sexist. But, if you say I want a black man in the white house but not that black man, you are a racist.

zalinda

[blondeatlast]

56. You rarely do, either (disappoint, I mean). I won't "ignore" you

because I want to witness your demise under granite or with a dramatic riff in GD about how you've been so mistreated...

[zalinda]

62. I never complain about how I've been treated

I'm not a whiner like Obama supporters.

zalinda

[coalition_unwilling]

59. If I'm designing TV ads for Obama, here's what I'd do:

Run the snippet of McInsane on Meet the Press recently saying he'd be happy to be in Iraq for 100 years (or even 1000), then cut to a picture of the little girl pulling petals off the daisy while the announcer counts down from 10 to a mushroom cloud (from the LBJ '64 campaign), then cut to the clip where McInsane says he has "always hated gooks."

Run it massively in all 50 states. By the time of the election, voters (even the ill-informed will have three impressions of McInsane:

That he's pro Iraq war (70% of Americans now opposed), thus 4 more years of Bush
That he's crazy enough to start a nuclear war, thus CRAZY unfit to be Prez
That he's racist and hateful, thus unfit to be Prez

Obama will grind McInsane into the dirt. It will be a blowout similar to LBJ vs. Goldwater in '64 or Nixon vs. McGovern in '72 (or FDR in 1932).

[tridim]

76. Or just put this image on the screen for 60 seconds with no commentary

McCain is going to be easy to beat.

[angie_love]

18. Wow,

"A snooty black man versus a down to earth white man, there will be no contest."

Your thinly veiled racism speaks loud and clear. I've said it before and i'll say it again, with ugly 'democrats' like these, theres no need for repugs.

[zalinda]

31. Honey, I grew up in Detroit

I've seen racism up close and personal. You have a lot more faith in the American electorate than I have. Some how people on this forum think that people actually care who the President is. The truth is that most people could care less, because it doesn't matter who it is, nothing will change for them anyway.

You don't think that the 30 something white man doesn't remember being passed over for a scholarship at school because they had to meet an affirmative action quota? Or the 40 year old who didn't get promoted because they had to have a certain amount of minorities in upper management?

Yeah, lots of young kids are out there for the primaries, but will they show up for the GE? I doubt it, because by then the Obama fad will have faded.

zalinda

[fortyfeetunder]

36. Please don't underestimate the youth!

Today's youth vote are more attuned to diversity than their elder counterparts. And I think they are now more inclined to invest in changing the country also...since they know what 8 years of the past administration left them in terms of global policy, environment, education and the economy.

[zalinda]

38. Yeah, that's what we heard in Kerry's campaign too. n/t

[TheDonkey]

22. You are a JOKE wow

Your entire argument is cyber-diarrhea

[zalinda]

33. As is so much of Obama's rhetoric

He must say 50 words to mean a 5 word sentence. I have never heard anyone with such mouth diarrhea as he has. How anyone can listen to him is amazing to me.

zalinda

[donheld]

25. Guess we'll get no help outta you.

You've already given up.

[emilyg]

27. Good post.

[Kahuna]

41. "Snooty," huh? Speaks volumes about why your side is losing. nt

[Strelnikov_]

45. "A snooty black man "

Wow.

[Catchawave]

49. Obama's dovish and no risk positions

will not help voters feel safer. That's what it will come down too I'm afraid :(

[blondeatlast]

52. Reality--it's that thing past your TV tube. Hve you ever paid attetnion to McC?

Gad.

[JackORoses]

57. just because your snooty white woman is getting her ass kicked is no reason to misrepresent Obama

[zalinda]

63. I don't care for either one

I just dislike Obama more. And Obama supporters are the reason that I dislike him more. If that is the type of people he attracts, then I don't want any thing to do with him.

Just take a look at this thread. If I had said that I'd like to see a woman in the white house, but not that woman, absolutely no one would bat an eye. But, if I said I'd like to see a black man in the white house, but not just that black man, I would be called a racist. And, I have been called a racist in an PM that someone so kindly sent to me.

I'm not a racist, but I am a pragmatist and I see that Obama is not the cake walk that Obama supporters think he is. And if I dare say anything against him, I'm called a racist. No big deal, I've been called worse by better people.

zalinda

[JackORoses]

64. will you at least admit that he is not snooty?

[PassingFair]

69. Nobody said it would be a "cakewalk".

Obama polls HIGHER against McCain than Hillary does.

Many dems will stay home if Hillary is the nominee.
Many 'pukes will stay home if Obama is the nominee.

It's just MATH.

[Laurab]

80. A "snooty black man"?

maybe that should say "uppity"? I see a down to earth, smart as hell, charismatic, presidential-looking man, who happens to be black, next to a loony, close-to-senile, nice enough, not-the-sharpest, white man. But then, I've seen both of them speak many times.

[The Traveler]

5. Erin Gobama

'Nuff said.

[cboy4]

10. Uh huh. I've heard that before.

[Dogmudgeon]

11. If it's no contest, there will be no contest

Too many Obama supporters have gotten overconfident. The GOP is a nasty motherfucker of a political party, and we're not. If you think DU GD-P is tough stuff, you're not playing in the grown-up leagues. The challenges that Hillary and Obama have issued to each other resemble "dueling" slaps with a pair of lace gloves. We need to think in terms of drowning the Republican party. Subduing it for at least 16 to 20 years. Forcing it to "reboot" the way Teddy Roosevelt did to it a century age (though that failed when Bob Taft beat out TR).

Whether Obama or Hillary goes up against McCain, it will be a death match. The GOP has their industrial-capacity shit machine all ready, and if they can't find the shit they need, they'll invent it.

And no matter who wins, we can't sit home and commiserate about "conscience". We HAVE to win. We can settle scores and reconcile debts at our convenience, AFTER the inaugural ball.

--p!

[TheWraith]

19. Relax. We're not going to blow it. But we've got all the advantages.

We're motivated, numerous, and excited, while the GOP is angry, riven, frightened, fractured, and drowning in their own poison. Remember the concerns prior to 2006? Confidence didn't prohibit a landslide victory.

[MADem]

24. Two words. SWIFT BOAT. Two more words: ALEX POLIER.

Two more still--ON STEROIDS. (Google Alex Polier if you don't recall that mess--it served to derail for a good week or more, and was just one dirty trick of many dozen).

John Kerry was a sure thing at this time four years ago. Couldn't lose! Cakewalk!

[RummyTheDummy]

26. That's bullshit

Nobody in their right mind was characterizing Kerry as a "sure thing" at this time in 2004. The key words being in their right mind. Those words aren't necessarily DU inclusive.

[MADem]

51. No, it's NOT bullshit--you have a VERY SHORT MEMORY.

I am amazed at how many amnesiacs post here--and assert, with great HUBRIS, that what was true is bullshit, simply because they have poor memories!!!

Here, I cite, because I 'don't' bullshit:

http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/02/02/elec04.poll.prez/index.html

Kerry leads Bush in new poll

Bush's approval numbers dip
Tuesday, February 3, 2004 Posted: 1:38 AM EST (0638 GMT)

(CNN) -- Sen. John Kerry, the front-runner among Democrats vying for their party's presidential nomination, leads President Bush in a head-to-head matchup, according to a CNN/USA Today/Gallup poll released Monday.

-----------------------------

http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/02/18/elec04.prez.poll/

Kerry, Edwards both top Bush in poll

Bush campaign chairman cites 'huge focus' on Dems
Wednesday, February 18, 2004 Posted: 8:34 PM EST (0134 GMT)

(CNN) -- Democratic presidential hopefuls John Edwards and John Kerry both hold leads of 10 percentage points or more in hypothetical match-ups against President Bush, according to a CNN/USA Today/Gallup poll released Wednesday.


------------------------------
http://www.tipponline.com/articles/04/ibd/i031004.htm

Kerry Leads 44%-41% As Bush Gives Ground Even In GOP Bastions

Sean Higgins
Investor's Business Daily - March 10, 2004
President Bush's popularity sank to an all-time low in March, just as Sen. John Kerry, D-Mass., sealed the Democratic nomination.

Kerry now beats Bush 44% to 41% among registered voters. Another 6% say they prefer consumer advocate Ralph Nader.

-------------------------------


Check the archives here--we couldn't LOOOOOOOOOOOOOSE!!! We were gonna smoke 'em outta their holes!!! The cheery cockiness was pervasive.

That chicken counting thing is a dangerous game. All we need is for Cheney to clutch the pearls, resign due to "ill health," Bush slides McCain into the VP job (unanimously approved by the Senate, because they're collegial--even though they might be PISSED about it, the House, which also has to weigh in, grumblingly goes along) and then......

A terrorist attack happens. McCain steps up and is MANLY and REASSURING. He meets with the brass at the Pentagon, pictures appear in the NYT and WAPO of him "strategizing" (as opposed to "strategerizing") with the JCS, and next thing ya know, they CAPTURE a few n'er do wells!! The "McCain Strategy" kept AMERICA SAFE!!!!!

And the media plays it up with waving flags and dramatic music.

And McCain campaigns on AF2, owns the media spotlight, and cruises to a win.

Four more years.





:grr:

[beachmom]

75. Hillary opted not to run in 2004 because she deemed it "unwinnable"

Bush never got much below a 50% approval rating in '04, numbers which nearly guarantee an encumbent's re-election especially during a time of war.

Nobody is getting overconfident here. But SOME confidence, based on polls and the back to back speeches of Obama followed by McCain, is in order.

[coalition_unwilling]

60. If I'm designing TV ads for Obama, here's what I'd do:

Run the snippet of McInsane on Meet the Press recently saying he'd be happy to be in Iraq for 100 years (or even 1000), then cut to a picture of the little girl pulling petals off the daisy while the announcer counts down from 10 to a mushroom cloud (from the LBJ '64 campaign), then cut to the clip where McInsane says he has "always hated gooks."

Run it massively in all 50 states. By the time of the election, voters (even the ill-informed will have three impressions of McInsane:

That he's pro Iraq war (70% of Americans now opposed), thus 4 more years of Bush
That he's crazy enough to start a nuclear war, thus CRAZY unfit to be Prez
That he's racist and hateful, thus unfit to be Prez

Obama will grind McInsane into the dirt. It will be a blowout similar to LBJ vs. Goldwater in '64 or Nixon vs. McGovern in '72 (or FDR in 1932).

Enjoy it - you're living through your very own 'Hoover moment'

[Arugula Latte]

12. Yikes. looks like an "after" and "before" for teeth whitening.

:scared:

[FrenchieCat]

21. Looks like what? 20 shade lighter?

:rofl:

[TSIAS]

13. This will be like Clinton/Dole in '96

The contrast can't be clearer. McCain represents the past, and Obama is the future. I'm fully convinced that Obama will be a 2-term president once he disposes of HRC and wins the nomination.

[TheWraith]

20. Oh, McCain represents a future. It's a really scary post-apocalyptic future, but it's a future. NT

[Sapphocrat]

14. "C'mon people"... C'mon and what?

Or is this just another gloating post?

[Drunken Irishman]

15. C'mon and stop predicting doom and gloom for us in the general if Obama is the nominee.

[terrya]

43. "Get Happy"?

I guess this is a Partridge Family moment or something.

[rodeodance]

23. I await the Limit Rule--designed for crapola like this. Think 50 already just today!

[Levgreee]

30. my friends... *evil cackle* MY FRIENDS! *full-blown insane laughter*

[OzarkDem]

39. Obama's economic advisors

Austan Goolsbee: U. of Chicago neoclassicist and “single payer universal health care critic claiming "it doesn't follow free market principles"
David Cutler: Harvard economist who believes that high health costs are good for the economy
Jeffrey Liebman: another Harvard economist and former Clinton adviser who favors privatizing social security

http://www.economicpopulist.org/

[Catchawave]

50. Ouch.

These are the type of people he'll surround himself with in the WH?

[Orsino]

42. No contest. McCain's going down.

Obama looks and acts like hope (if he's been short on actual execution), while McCain strongly resembles the despair most Americans feel. The MSM will slander Obama (or Clinton) shamelessly, and Rove will steal all the votes he can, but it won't be enough this time.

[boricua79]

46. THANK YOU

Crusty old man vs. handsome, inspirational black man. C'mon now

And I didn't even have to go into comparing feet sizes... :P

Besides, McCain looks like this guy in that picture (the alien from Fire in the Sky)

[quantass]

55. CREST WHITE-STRIPS for McCain '08 Please

[mathewsleep]

67. mccain/botox '08