27 Reasons I'm DivorcingThe Clintons Today

[WillYourVoteBCounted]

Dave from Queens, who voted for Hillary twice for US Senate - does not support her for President or anything now it looks like:

27 Reasons I'm DivorcingThe Clintons Today
by davefromqueens

So why am I divorcing them? In some order it was

1. "I" "I" "I" in virtually every Hillary speech ad nauseum.

2. Mark Penn. (The incompetent jackass who couldn't get 50% against Bob Dole and took the surest thing {Tony Blair's 3rd term} and turned it into a close race.

3. Terri McCauliffe and the establishment machine.

4. "turn up the heat."

5. Smearing Obama with a kindergarten essay

6. The Rezko hypocrisy.

7. The drug use smears.

8. The attempt to freeze out Iowa students.

9. The anti-choice smear of Obama in New Hampshire.

10. The cooked books and $5 million dollar loan.

11. Playing the race card in South Carolina and elsewhere.

12. Bill Clinton's fairy tale remark.

13.Attempts to prevent service workers from caucusing in Nevada.

14. The cactus tears in NH. (She attacked Obama dried eyed next sentence.)

15. The mischaracterications of present votes in the Illinois state legislature.

16. Her failure to apologize for her politically calculating vote on Iraq.

17. Her equally politically calculating vote on Kyl-Lieberman.

18. The vicious attempts to play the misogyny card when 99% of Obama voters don't have a sexist bone in their bodies.

19. HRC's Michigan shenanigans.

20. HRC's Florida shenanigans.

21. Bill Clinton's caucus v. primary comments.

22. The cheesy Wisconsin attack ad while she's in Texas.

23.Lanny Davis (yep the Lieberman jackass) echoing the Clintons elitist attitude about upper middle class voters "not counting."

24. Hillary Clinton saying that Patti Solis' decision to step down was Patti's decision when Hillary knows Patti was fired.

25. Mark Penn's significant states comment telling people in 22 states to go F off.

26. Hillary attacking Obama this week saying she gives solutions while he gives speeches. (During a speech of course.)

That's 26 straws and there were many others. I can't put a quantitative value on each straw but they added up. And now HRC is unwilling to pledge that she will abide by the will of the voters and accept pledged delegates as the nominee. This is the final straw. In short, she's trying to pull a Scalia and is plotting and scheming to steal an election. Although I believe her attempt will be futile because she will lose every state from here on out (including Ohio and Texas) and although I believe her efforts will be futile because the superdelegates collectively will support the winner among the voters, I am still through with the Clintons. There is no way in hell I'm voting for her ever again.

So how does one move from persuadable to willing to comfortable to accepting to begrudgingly acquiescing to no way in just 3 months? The fault for that lies exclusively with Hillary Rodham Clinton.

...What these "straws" have shown me is that Hillary Rodham Clinton is in politics for the power and not for the people or her country. Hillary Clinton has shown me that she is a person of very low character and a person who has very little integrity. Hillary Clinton is a person who has shown me that she will do anything to win even if winning is done unethically or immorally. Hillary Clinton has shown me that she will choose expediency over ethics and is aghast that voters are pummelling her for it at the ballot box as if we "insignificant" little people have no right to question her perceived authority. Well I'm tired of the Clintons trying to micromanage and pigeonhole voters with ridiculous labels like wine v. beer, upper income v. blue collar, Latino v. black, male v. female. What Hillary Clinton does not get is that people are people, not statistics on a spreadsheet handed to you by Mark Penn. I drink beer, I drink wine. I connect with people of all economic classes. I love people regardless of their race and gender. So take these poll driven artificial divisions of yours Hillary Clinton and shove them up your you know what

....more at the link

[jlake]

1. Pathetic beyond belief.

[JackORoses]

5. Those are my exact thoughts on Hillary. You summed it up nicely.

[jlake]

6. y'all are drowning in koolaid. You will get what you deserve.

[Alexander]

9. It sounds like we'll get a pretty good president. I could live with that.

How are those grapes tasting? Sour?

[jlake]

12. Nope. Just baffled that so many are falling for this.....

[Laurab]

42. And I'm totally baffled that people don't see Hillary for what she is.

How can you look at that list, particularly the last part about "stealing the election", which is precisely what it seems she's going to try to do, and STILL support her?

:shrug:

[PoliticalOne65]

49. This is my first post!

I don't want to make anyone mad, but the comment about "stealing the election" made me want to point out that no one has stole an election. We have a long way to the convention. If no one is the clear winner by then? Well that is what conventions were designed for. In my life time all the conventions have been giant pep rallies for the given parties. Free ad time, and free campaign time. Before I was born, 'back in the day' conventions were where the platform was hammered out. The candidates were actually choosen on the floor. The rules of the democratic convention as I understand them are that the delegates are bound for one vote. After the first vote they are free to vote for whom ever they want. So look close at the delegate counts I believe Dodd has 3 delegates that are tied down for the first vote. I think Richardson has 1. If it is a brokered convention everyone of the delegates mean something. Also on June 7th Porta Rico has the last of the primaries if it keeps going like this we will see Hillary and Obama down there trying to get those delegates. No one is stealing an election though. This is politics, We all need to develope a thick skin this year because it is going to be a long tough one.

[sce56]

50. Let me be the first to say welcome to DU

And hope to see you use your time here wisely.
Got Fascism Yet?

Fascism Accomplished!

[calmblueocean]

68. Welcome to DU!

I agree, we all need to develop some thicker skins, especially on DU. :)

[bjobotts]

70. Sorry about the divorce especially after all the good years we had

[bjobotts]

71. They forget so soon and get so bitter over unrealistic expectations

[bjobotts]

72. Divorce is such a harsh word.Can't we try a seperation 1st?

[bjobotts]

74. Is there another man? That's it isn't it. Never satisfied. More of the same

[petgoat]

124. Like the expectation that she'd do her job and stand up for the Constitution. nt

[Bongo Prophet]

77. Not just ThicKer, but SHINIER!

Yes, I said shinier!

[ClayZ]

85. Welcome to DU, PoliticalOne65

:hi:

[ChazII]

99. Welcome to DU. n/t

[MrsBrady]

125. welcome to DU

[1monster]

105. And I'm baffled that most you don't see that neither of the nominee contenders are

the best, second best, or even the third or fourth best candidates we could have.

It's gonna be more of the same: Corporate owned candidates whose priorites are not those of the majority, or even a significant minority of this country.

The only good thing I can say about them is that they are head and shoulders above the Republican candidates.

But then, so is my husband's Shih Tzu...

[Laurab]

107. I'm not sure I said that in my post.

I was hoping for Al Gore, really. I also liked John Edwards. Of the two candidates left, IMO Obama is head and shoulders above Hillary, and I disagree that he will be anywhere near as corporate-owned as Hillary, and he will be able to get a few things done, because he can work with others, which will be absolutely necessary.

At the very least, he promises a transparent government, which Hillary won't commit to - the current pResident will have left a lot of power to abuse - I believe Obama will fix that, Hillary, on the other hand, I'm not so sure about. I just plain don't trust her.

[1monster]

112. No, you didn't say that in your post. I wasn't reinforcing your post, I was pointing out that,

once again, the best candidates were pushed out before even one tenth of the voters had their chance to choose.

And we were left with the corporations' choices.

And the ugly bitterness on GDP is ridiculous.

There is not much difference in substance in the two contenders still standing. The difference is in style.

Where do they stand on Iraq? On Afghanistan? On help for returning soldiers, physically, mentally, and emotionally wounded? On single-payer universal health care? On education and the obscene NCLB laws? On bringing governmental wrong doers to justice? On corporate raidings of our bank accounts, and our treasury? And what is the record on their votes on those issues? The list could go on and on and on and on. And I think you will find that if you pinch one, the other would say "ouch!"

edit: removed typo.

[crawfish]

114. Many of us see it...

But, the people have spoken and our best candidates are out. There is only one acceptable candidate left.

[crawfish]

113. Amen to that. Clinton folks have on big blinders.

She acts like a neocon. She votes like a neocon. She talks like a neocon. She's funded by the neocons. She's trying to steal the election just like a neocon.

Yet, they would have us believe she isn't a neocon. Sorry, but all this quacking and waddling tells me that Clinton isn't a swan.

[Trajan]

110. I have been one who has supported Hillary and Obama ....

jlake ? .... I am losing respect for Hillary .... It isnt Obama's fault; It is Hillary's fault ...

And comments like your's, disparaging the OP, make many of us realize how ugly a candidate supporter can be ....

Most everything on that list gives me pause ..... as it should give everyone a moment to reconsider their position on the candidates.

[USAcitizen]

118. Falling for what?

A man with common sense FINALLY a front runner for president. Hillary cares more about BECOMING president that she does about being a good president for the people.

[jlake]

134. Oh dear. Keep telling yourself that.

[disndat]

98. Terrific

I was going to reply the same words, but not as cleverly.

[grace0418]

10. Seriously, you need to calm down a smidge.

I'm not 100% behind either Dem candidate but you act like Obama is evil incarnate. Take it down a few notches.

[jlake]

17. Well, I don't think he is a good man. I'll leave it at that.

[CTLawGuy]

96. anyone who tries to deny the Restoration

of the House of Clinton, is a bad man!

[FedUp_Queer]

109. As an Edwards man

and, frankly, an outside observer of this feud, I don't get it, generally. But this comment, I just wonder about. What exactly makes Obama not a good man? Does that imply that Hillary is a good woman? I will say with JE dropping out, I'm leaning towards Obama. The reasons for me are very simple. As a gay person, I look to see who is for repealing DOMA and who isn't. I look to see who is for repealing DADT and who isn't. I look to see who is for the Uniting American Families Act (because my partner is from another country) and who isnt'. Obama is for complete repeal of DOMA, Hillary is not. In fact, she believes that the portion of DOMA allowing states to not recognize marriages done in another state should be kept. She is for the UAFA, and for repealing DADT. Close as they are, she is not as good as Obama on these issues. Now, back to this "good man" "good woman" stuff...what makes him not a "good man" and her, by extension, a "good woman?" I just don't get it.

[high density]

11. Koolaid

You make it sound like we're supporting McCain or Ron Paul.

Lighten up a bit.

[JackORoses]

16. We deserve President Barack Obama, and that is just what we will get

he serves Electric Koolaid, baby!

The Reality Expanding Kind

[hfojvt]

18. I think the coolaid metaphor has jumped the shark

Now that everybody uses it against everybody else.

[jlake]

19. Yeah, it has - so has "jumped the shark" though.

[Jackpine Radical]

53. Oh, indeed.

"Jumped the shark" has jumped the shark.

[Bongo Prophet]

79. It haz dun jumpd teh snark. inDEED.

Iz it hAmm3rTimE YeT?

[NMMatt]

32. We will

And what we deserve is a candidate who at least makes an attempt to be honest and ethical. What we deserve is to put the Clinton shennanigans behind us for good. And what we deserve more than anything is a Democratic Majority in the House, Senate and a Presidency with a significant victory and the mandate that comes with it. I just hope you'll join us soon enough and let go of the Clintonian past.

[jlake]

34. LOL. Will you be performing at the stand up club tonight?

Obama is the sleaziest politician out there.

[countmyvote4real]

86. Please explain your "sleaziest politician" opinion.

You can't be taken seriously until you back it up with at least 28 real reasons. Go for it.

[WilliamPitt]

92. So will you

and us all. Go back to bed.

[D23MIURG23]

103. I get it

Criticism of Hillary = kool aid

Isnt that a bit like

Criticism of Bush = Liberal bias

I don't mean to say that Bush and Hillary are equivalent, but the logic (or lack thereof) certainly is.

[bushisdirt]

23. Excellent post. I sure hope Obama wins the nomination. Voting for McCain

might make me delirious for weeks.

[hfojvt]

13. We can agree on that.

I find that to be a very uninspiring list. A bunch of he said/she said without a very substantial policy discussion in the bunch.

[UALRBSofL]

21. Very pathetic reasons

Using tears as a reason, OMG, that person needs some critical thinking and decision making skills. :)

[bjobotts]

66. These are all assumptions based on your view of her motivations.

[delt664]

84. "Pathetic beyond belief."...

I think you forgot "For the following reasons............."

I willing to listen to and respect any position as long as you can back it up. Insulting someone for having a dissenting opinion is truly pathetic.

[bunnies]

2. Lanny Davis makes me want to hit something.

I dont know what it is about that man. He makes my blood boil! :grr:

[VolcanoJen]

100. Lanny Davis is employing the "Insult 40 States Strategy."

Looking forward to seeing how that works out for Hillaryland. :-)

[AtomicKitten]

3. Amen.

[EmperorHasNoClothes]

4. Amazing! Those are the exact same 27 reasons why GD:P has jumped the shark!

[JimGinPA]

7. I have more than 27 reasons...

But I also have many, many reasons I WILL support Obama.

[WillYourVoteBCounted]

102. here another: Unofficial Tallies in City Understated Obama Vote

Unofficial Tallies in City Understated Obama Vote
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/16/nyregion/16vote.html?_r=1&hp&oref=slogin

[TwilightGardener]

8. Hillary looked pretty good to me up until last fall--she wasn't my first choice, but

I respected her and found her to be sometimes very likable, and above all, a terrific and professional candidate. I guess this was because Obama was a curious little blip in the polls, and Edwards barely registered too, and the race was totally hers--under sunny skies and big margins, she loomed pretty large and looked like a champ. Once the race started to tighten in December, the cracks and chinks started to show, the ugliness started against her rivals, the fumbling began. Now I'm to the point, after all the crap I've witnessed, that I don't even feel she necessarily deserves either the nom or the Presidency--although I will vote for her. Kinda sad. She's really a fair-weather candidate--great when things are going her way, lousy and obnoxious when there's a serious challenge.

[Cha]

54. Yay, Nebraska!

I've been against hilary since 2002 when as a constituent of her's she turned her back on us and went with the bushite's War On Iraq voting yea on the IWR.

I was hoping for a candidate I could get behind who I really liked but it was slow to come and then all of a sudden I found myself on the Obama Peace Train and it's just gotten better and better.

[MannyGoldstein]

91. Ha! I've Believed The Clintons To Be Bad News Since 1992!

In 1992 I worked on Paul Tsongas' presidential campaign. Tsongas was doing great, leading in the polls.

I remember the first candidate's debate. Bill Clinton did a brilliant, brilliant job of distorting Tsongas' positions. in short, Clinton had worked hard to find a way to distort every one of Tsongas' forthright positions into something that sounded awful, and do it in a self-righteous lip-biting way that made Clinton believable. It was immediately clear that, as Bob Kerrey later said, Clinton was "an unusually good liar. Unusually good." I had the distinct feeling that Clinton was a ravenous wolf in sheep's clothing, who would easily sodomize the average Joe and Jane in return for shekels from the Predator Class.

Tsongas would have lost the thing even without Clinton's help - his campaign was horribly organized, and his fundraiser later went to jail for stealing something like half the money that was being raised. As to whether Clinton (and his posse) fulfilled my expectation - I'll leave that as an exercise for the reader.

[Cha]

115. Thanks, Manny...I'd

recommend this if I could. I got into politics late at 2000 but always gave the clintons a break because the fascist wing were vicious on their case..so slowly slowly I'm learning more about them and it ain't pretty.

I'm thinking anyone like you who knew about bil's penchant for lying with ease in the early ninties must not have had much faith in his infamous declaration on tv concerning the intern.

bil clinton sounds like a real hero to bob kerrey.

[rug]

14. He's been against Clinton since November.

[bleowheels]

15. Bravo!!!

Thanks for taking the time to put into words the same thoughts that many of us are having.

[Kaylee]

20. I must admit, I am becoming increasingly disillusioned by

Senator Clinton. I thought she was better than this.

[Abacus]

26. I had hoped so too.

It wasn't that many years ago that I found the thought of a Hillary Clinton presidency exciting.

[Johnny__Motown]

22. Pathetic that you only listed 27, there are THOUSANDS of reasons to dump on the Clintons

[smalll]

25. Maybe where YOU come from, my friend -

maybe where you come from. :hi:

[Johnny__Motown]

30. good point.... umm... NOT

[donheld]

75. Isn't 27 enough

Hey a person can only type so much, and there's only so much space on DU. :D

[Name removed]

24. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[WillYourVoteBCounted]

27. Hillary attacks the messenger, not the message

Yep, I remember Bill telling people not to question the official story

[MethuenProgressive]

31. Obama never checks his sources.

Hence insane people like davefromqueens get 42 recs from the Obamabots.

[Bluebear]

28. "Dave from Queens", now there's an erudite source. nt

[Leopolds Ghost]

57. Why? Does Hillary look down on Queens?

[stickernation]

76. j dilla ?

not sure but "dave from queens" might be a j dilla reference.

"what do i think about radio hip-hop?" hahaha

[apocalypsehow]

29. K & R

:kick:

[BringBigDogBack]

33. Ouch.

I'll say it again: ouch.

[VotesForWomen]

35. so O hasn't done anything comparable? i think i could make a list too. nt

[Cha]

56. Then why don't you instead of

threatening it, votesforwomen-whatever.

[K Gardner]

36. Dave speaks for me, too ! Thanks DavefromQueens !

[Barack_America]

37. What was #27?

I'm dying to know. Man, I hope that Dave decides to volunteer for Obama somewhere. He's got passion!

:thumbsup:

[elixir]

38. Don't bother, they already divorced you.

[Barack_America]

39. Uh oh...more votes that Hillary "doesn't need"?

That's not very good strategy. This guy lives in NY, after all.

[LibertyorDeath]

40. Nails it

"Hillary Rodham Clinton is in politics for the power and not for the people"

[NJmaverick]

41. That pretty much covers it all

A good list of the things that turned me off, as well. Before this stuff, I was supportive of all the Democratic candidates. Now Hillary is looking WAY too much like a female George Bush.

[bagimin]

43. Picky..picky...picky..

:rofl:

[rAVES]

47. rec for this!

[Kitty Herder]

44. Congratulations! I divorced 'em years ago. nt

[Cha]

58. Me, too...2002..It didn't

take Einstein to figure that one out.

[nolabels]

81. I was pretty much sick of them by 95 but what's a few years anyway

:shrug:

[Cha]

116. Others knew much sooner than

I, like yourself, and look how right you were!

[David Zephyr]

45. Welcome to Clintons Anonymous. You've taken the first step to wellness today.

My name is David Zephyr. I am still in recovery for defending the indefensible for years

Welcome. Your 26 straws are all valid signposts for all those seeking rehabilitation.

[Major Hogwash]

46. People are people - exactly. Her clap, clap, point, point rallies will never work.

Maybe they didn't see it coming, but they know it now - we were looking for something different than hearing the same ol' political crap this time.

Obama came through for us.

[Cha]

59. I especially like

Dave's take on this..

"The irony of all this hoopla is that if Hillary Clinton had simply done the right things from the beginning and not been blinded by her own hubris and arrogance, she would have been the next President of the United States. A WABC poll from 2006 said 68% of Americans thought she was a strong leader and her positives to negatives were +12. Today she's considered a Shakesperean tragedy at best, a joke at worst. And it's pathetic."

But, the beginning would have been Oct 2002 and that would have ironically helped her, too, if she hadn't voted for the politically expedient yea on the IWR.

[psychopomp]

93. Shakespearean indeed

It is tragic, but politics can destroy the best among us--just look what happened to Tony Blair.

[Cha]

117. Yes, good ol' toady blur..

and yet there's others who managed not to be corrupted just like in real life.

[madwax]

138. fairly accurate....

Major Hogwash,

You're fairly accurate with calling them "clap, clap, point, point rallies".

This video on YouTube pretty much sums up the Clinton:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p_WIqjj0WVA

[think4yourself]

48. Thank you

She IS in it for HERSELF. Her Iraq WAR vote and the Kyl/Lieberman vote were supposed to cast her as tough on terrorism. A calculated vote that she greatly miscalculated-especially if you're Iraqi or Iranian or US Miltary or registered voters.

[nealmhughes]

131. Let us not forget Feinstein-Leahy Amendment vote on cluster bombs.

Three guesses on who joined the Republics on that little doozie. That was the straw that broke the camel's back for me, followed soon after by her holding up Ryan White reauthorization formulae to reflect the epiemic's epicenter moving southward.
If Mrs. Clinton cared so much about people with HIV, why didn't she simply not agree to the bill and then immediately have her staff start working on an equitable formula with input from the southern states? Why did she throw out "Medicare" for everyone as soon as diagnosed HIV+ during that time, yet never had another word touching on that? Did she lose interest? Was she too busy meeting with Penn prior to the official announcement of her candidacy? Does she even know that the new CDC and WHO guidelines call for HAART at a CD4 level of 350, and that under Ryan White, with its waiting lists and freezes in SC and other states, that this is not reflected, as the old cutoff of 200 is still in effect, which, is one of the definitions of AIDS.
Either she doesn't care, she is too busy, or just lost track of people she had on her bandwagon, "defending NYS's rightful chunk of charity medicine" for the People Living with AIDS, the rest of the nation be screwed!
She isn't holy, nor even deserving of any more respect than any other human being, and Senators only get the respect of a plumber or hotel chamber maid in my book.
Her presidency would be a disaster: if we think that the GOP are a bunch of whiny babies holding up everything in the Senate now, just wait until 2009 and she president! The only thing she could do is get some decent federal judicary members in, a viable cabinet (not an AEI/Heritage/AIPAC rubber stamp) and expect to cut a lot of ribbons. I hope she doesn't have to visit Walter Reed too often as her WOT continues.
Hopefully, she won't be president, and Obama will, since given the two corporatists-cum-Democrats, he is the lesser evil, and Franklin Roosevelt was considered a "light weight" but good orator, young and handsome when he became president, and look what turned out for him? Bobby Kennedy was once a big fan and friend of Joe McCarthy: he turned around 180 degrees, now didn't he? FDR and Bobby gave people hope and had a moral compass, two things lacking in the US today.

[usregimechange]

51. K/R

[Cha]

52. All too true..there's no denying one single reason..

Number 18 is particulary evident on DU.

18. The vicious attempts to play the misogyny card when 99% of Obama voters don't have a sexist bone in their bodies.

Dave from Queens sums it up nicely.. although, I only voted for hilary once and in 2006 voted for Jonathan Tisini(the anti-War On Iraq candidate).

[NoLockstep]

55. You nailed it... but... ADD these three to the list

She also voted for that horrendous bankruptcy bill that strapped more debt to poor people struggling to pay their medical bills.

She was in the immediate area in Washington and didn't show up to vote against the FISA BILL.

She also voted against the Levin amendment and lied about why she voted against it.

[Cha]

60. Thanks, NoLockstep..

and Welcome aboard the DU.

[Beausoir]

61. You ObamaRoids missed one..........

CLENIS!

How could you miss the Clenis?

[bjobotts]

69. 1st sign of Obama unity-get rid of all stupid Clinton supporters.

HOW=Help Obama Wish. Yes we can( get rid of republican obstructionism and fearmongering war profiteers, lobbyists, and anyone who won't unite with us...or is it we join with them in order to unite...better ask the WORM (What Obama Really Meant) because he only tells us what he wants to do but not how he will go about doing it. Obama said: "I didn't say I didn't believe in war...just not this one". Like Clinton he threatens Iran with regime change unless they change their behavior (against our UN treaty not to threaten other countries)...but hey...he won a grammy...god if only he could play guitar like Hendrix...that would straighten Iran out huh? Hope, change, and God on our side 'cause I'm a Christian because it's not ok to be Muslim in the land of the free...I'm Christian everybody, I'm not one of them...Muslims thank God...and no I don't pander. I love Obama the man, but I know identity worship and it shuts off the brain and leaves the ears on autopilot. Just get in the habit of saying "how" after every Obama sentence and you'll quickly see what i mean. We need to make Obama more progressive because right now he's s;lightly to the right of Clinton but until people quick acting like they are at a rock concert or a revival and start asking questions instead of chanting his name they will never see that there is no 'how'.

[Bongo Prophet]

80. Is "ObamaRoids" somehow more mature or intelligent than "Clenis"?

O Beausoir, you knows i luv ya.
U just being all caught up n it.

[johncoby2]

62. If you block walk as much as you write...

Yes you could.

[bjobotts]

63. What a sleeze. How about 27reasons why I support my candidate

[bjobotts]

64. Cutting down a fellow dem rather than building up another. It's your opinion

[ErnestoG]

78. Talk to yourself much?

[Cha]

128. Because it's all too true about hilary and

needs to be broadcast that she's the pathetic perpetrator these reasons have to be written.

[RememberWellstone]

65. Goodbye!

Hillary is not "attacking" Obama, she is pointng out the obvious.

Oh my..how stupid this is beginning to look for Obama's stepford kids.

[ruiner4u]

67. I love how DU as a whole would wax poetic remembering the Clinton Years...

Yet now they compare to the Bush years.. Hypocrisy knows no bounds on DU

[Cha]

73. Yeah, your red herring is

real poetic too.

[babylonsister]

82. Are you talking about that guy who effectively

ruined impeachment for the one who really deserves it?

[New Dawn]

83. K&R!

[graywarrior]

87. Either one of the dems who wins is a win in my book.

These threads are so dramatic.

[darclay]

89. reasons not to vote for Hill

Hillary lost my vote when she did not show up for the FISA vote. Even if her vote made no difference in the outcome, 1) she swore and oath to represent The People of New York. They were not represented. 2)she pledged to support FISA bill with no retro immunity. Have you seen her on the floor of The Senate lending her voice, showing her leadership skill? the answer is NO!
By not leading in the Senate and ignoring a vote as important as FISA tells me she has not got what it takes to lead the US.

[RBInMaine]

88. Half the country dislikes Hillary

Half the country disliikes Hillary, and we would be foolish to nominate someone with such high negatives. These numbers will not change much. Obama is CLEARLY the strongest general election candidate. This is no-brainer.

[Carolina]

90. exactly, and that number is growing daily

[JKaiser]

94. You listen too much to the republican media.. Sell out!

[Cha]

119. What the heck does your post

even mean? Are you sure you're on the right thread..everything in that list is true and your talking about the republicon media has no baring on the OP.

[JKaiser]

130. I am sure I have the right post! HILLARY is the better candidate!

It is just really nice to see another naive individual that just recites and believes media hype.. The list pretty much resembles the republican media hype throughout the whole primary season. The republicans want to make hillary look bad and Obama look good because he is the weaker candidate. They do this by only giving hillary negative attention and BO positive attention. People love him because he makes good speeches that speak of hope, speeches that only provide rhetoric! THIS IS NOT AMERICAN IDOL where people vote on whom has the better voice and provides the most entertainment. This is a vote for experience and who is better able can solve problems!

OBAMA PEOple make me sick! If he steals the election from hillary, I will not support him and I will laugh at you and Obama when the republican media turn on him and gives him hell for his lack of experience and everything else! WHEN HE LOSES I WILL LAUGH AT ALL THE FOOLS ON HERE! I can't wait to say I told you so!

[Cha]

132. Boy, do you have it wrong..you

poor poor thing..oh and lets all feel sorry for the weak candidate, hilary clinton, too.

[JKaiser]

133. noted and ignored..

[Maineman]

95. Specific versus intuitive.

I think many people have an intuitive feel for the Clintons that leads them to the same conclusion, that they do not feel comfortable with the Clinton's integrity, that the Clintons are kind of phony, that they are politically calculating, that they yearn for power, etc. But, once a list of example symbolic events is drawn up, it is obviously pretty irritating to those who like, or support Hillary, or Bill. I think the reason people experience Obama as a breath of fresh air is because he is, well, a breath of fresh air. I could simplify my voting decision down to selecting the one who is least like Bush. The result is no contest. I vote for Obama.

[disndat]

101. Exactly right.

I heard a report some time ago. I wish a DUer would confirm this, that HC twisted John Kerry's arm to support the Iraq war initiative in the Senate, telling him, he vote against the bill "at his peril." HC, the conniver, probably was afraid Kerry would enhance his chances of winning the upcoming presidential election, '04, if he voted against the Iraq bill.

[Cha]

120. Wow, I hadn't heard that...

I would like to know more about that myself!

[FATCATs]

97. If I know the Clintons you better get a good lawyer

:banghead:

[bluerum]

104. Perhaps you should call Kenneth Starr, Henry Hyde and Jim Sensenbrenner

to see how they can assist you in your efforts?

[Cha]

121. Perhaps you should look at the

facts instead of throwing out useless shyte.

[bluerum]

129. Ooooooo. The facts. I forgot about those,,,,

[Name removed]

106. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Cha]

122. Cute but no cigar.

[stillcool]

108. That Nevada Law suit...

was where I reached the point of no return. And then there was this:
"I'm sorry"

Clinton Surrogate Compares Obama Ad to Nazi March
http://news.yahoo.com/s/thenation/20080201/cm_thenation/45278988_1
Fri Feb 1, 2:23 PM ET

The Nation -- On a media conference call organized by the Hillary Clinton campaign today, Clinton surrogate Len Nichols compared an Obama health care ad to Nazis. The ad features a couple at a kitchen table, which some Clinton supporters said was reminiscent of "the famous insurance-industry-financed 'Harry and Louise' ads against the original Clinton plan," as The Politico reports, and Mr. Nichols said it "personally outraged" him.


Accusing political opponents of Nazism is an outrageous smear. Raising the specter of a Nazi march in response to a health care mailer that evokes the insurance industry is so absurd, it would be hard to take the attack seriously, were it not launched from a high profile national campaign conference call in this crucial stretch of the presidential race. And political observers know, of course, that the Clinton Campaign regularly arranges opportunities for surrogates to launch these kind of smears, which are later followed up with apologies. (See: Bob Johnson, Bill Shaheen, Bob Kerrey, and Francine Torge, to name the most recent offenders.) For his part, Nichols did not immediately return a call requesting further comment.
-------------------------
Len Nichols, Director of New America's Health Policy Program, stated, "For nearly 17 years I have worked tirelessly to reform our nation's struggling health system. Today my passion overwhelmed me. I chose an analogy that was wholly inappropriate. I am deeply sorry for any offense that my unfortunate comments may have caused. I made unfortunate comments that do not accurately reflect my bipartisan conviction, political philosophy, or most importantly, my opinions about Senator Obama and his historic campaign for the United States presidency."

Clinton adviser steps down after drug use comments
Earlier Thursday, Clinton personally apologized to rival Obama for Shaheen's remarks.
Obama accepted her apology, according to David Axelrod, the top political strategist for the Obama campaign.
http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/12/13/clinton.obama/index.html

January 6, 2008, 5:18 pm
Edwards: No Conscience in Clinton Campaign
http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/01/06/edwards-no-conscience-in-clinton-campaign/
By Julie Bosman
KEENE, N.H. – John Edwards angrily took on Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton at two news conferences in a row on Sunday, saying that her campaign “doesn’t seem to have a conscience.”

COMPTON, Calif. (AP) — Hillary Rodham Clinton and her campaign tried to mend ties to black voters Thursday when a key supporter apologized to her chief rival, Barack Obama, for comments that hinted at Obama's drug use as a teenager. The candidate herself, meanwhile, praised the Rev. Martin Luther King and promised to assist with the rebirth of this troubled, largely black city.

Bob Johnson, the founder of Black Entertainment Television, apologized for comments he made at a Clinton campaign rally in South Carolina on Sunday that hinted at Obama's use of drugs as a teenager.
http://www.usatoday.com/news/politics/election2008/2008-01-17-johnson-apology_N.htm?csp=34

December 10, 2007
Third Clinton Volunteer Knew Of Smear E-Mail

A third volunteer for Hillary Clinton's campaign was aware of a propaganda e-mail alleging that Barack Obama is a Muslim who plans on "destroying the U.S. from the inside out."

"Let us all remain alert concerning Obama's expected presidential Candidacy," the email reads. "Please forward to everyone you know. The Muslims have said they Plan on destroying the U.S. from the inside out, what better way to start than at The highest level."

Two Clinton volunteers, Linda Olson and Judy Rose, have already been asked to resign from the campaign for their roles in forwarding the e-mail. The AP reported yesterday that Olson, a volunteer coordinator in Iowa County, sent a version of the e-mail to 11 people, including Ben Young, a regional field director for Chris Dodd's campaign. Young passed it on to the AP.
http://tpmelectioncentral.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/02/hillary_adviser_harold_ickes_t.php

Hillary: Sorry for Any Offense Campaign (Bill) Has Caused
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FB65wJ6Rcfs

Bill Clinton Asks for a Second Chance
By Liz Halloran
Posted February 11, 2008

The morning after his wife, Hillary, was routed in three state contests by Sen. Barack Obama in their dead-heat battle for the Democratic nomination, former President Bill Clinton made his case for her before a packed Sunday service at one of the largest black churches in Washington, D.C.
But first he offered an apology of sorts for racially tinged comments he made about Obama and his candidacy that have triggered a backlash in the black community and among many other Democrats.

Clinton invoked his "worship of a God of second chances" in pronouncing himself glad to be at the Temple of Praise, which claims nearly 15,000 members. His invocation of second chances echoed comments he made early last week at black churches in California, where he campaigned for his wife before that state's Super Tuesday primary, which she won.
http://www.usnews.com/articles/news/campaign-2008/2008/02/11/bill-clinton-asks-for-a-second-chance.html

Bill Clinton To Apologize At LA Black Churches
Once again, Bill Clinton is ready to repent.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/02/02/bill-clinton-to-apologize_n_84573.html
On Sunday the former president is scheduled to visit black churches in South Central Los Angeles, where he's expected to offer a mea culpa to those who "dearly loved him" when he was their president, Rep. Diane Watson (D-Calif.) says.

Watson, a member of the Congressional Black Caucus who has endorsed Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton (D-N.Y.), tells us she'll usher the former president to more than half a dozen churches in her district where she says he needs to "renew his relationship" with congregants who were turned off by his racially tinged comments in the days leading up to and following the South Carolina primary. (Such as when Clinton compared Sen. Barack Obama's landslide victory to Jesse Jackson's wins in 1984 and 1988.)

Source: Hillary Adviser Harold Ickes Tells Surrogates To Refer To Super-Delegates As "Automatic Delegates"
By Greg Sargent - February 12, 2008, 11:43AM

In a sign that the spin war over the significance of super-delegates is underway in earnest, Harold Ickes told assorted Hillary supporters on a private conference call yesterday that the campaign wants them to start referring to super-delegates as "automatic delegates," according to someone on the call.

The person I spoke to paraphrases Ickes, who is spearheading Hillary's super-delegate hunt, this way: "We're no longer using the phrase super delegates. It creates a wrong impression. They're called automatic delegates. Because that's what they are."

The worry appears to be that the phrase "super-delegates" implies that "they have super-powers or super influence when they don't," the source says, describing Ickes' thinking. In other words, the phrase suggests that they have greater than average clout and that they have the power to overrule the democratic process, giving it the taint of back-room power politics
http://tpmelectioncentral.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/02/hillary_adviser_harold_ickes_t.php

[Cha]

123. Well, well, well...isn't this the truth?

"January 6, 2008, 5:18 pm
Edwards: No Conscience in Clinton Campaign
http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/01/06/edwards-n... /
By Julie Bosman
KEENE, N.H. – John Edwards angrily took on Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton at two news conferences in a row on Sunday, saying that her campaign “doesn’t seem to have a conscience.”

This is why John Edwards will not endorse hilary because gee..it's a fact and why would he endorse someone who doesn't have a conscience?

[krkaufman]

111. Here's one that influenced me away from HRC towards BO ...

... after my pref'd candidate didn't enter the race and my secondary fallback left. It may fall under your "Florida shenanigans" heading, but merits it's own bullet, in my opinion...

http://journals.democraticunderground.com/krkaufman/20

[Cha]

126. Indeed, why does hilary

feel the need to do any of her strategic, cold cut, pandering?

[krkaufman]

137. Dunno. Too entrenched in Carvillian politics...

... or lacking confidence in the merits of her record and goals?

[trthnd4jstc]

127. We need to make the Constitution even Stronger.

Hillary is not the worst person. Better than McLiar, but like Obama, still a politician. Our system brings out some negative aspects in politicians, making nearly everyone a bit slimy and weasly. Public payment for campaigns would help.

[Name removed]

135. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Barack_America]

136. Same exact post again!

Shibanu loves to spam!!