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Hillary Couldn't Pass Universal Healthcare with a Democratic Congress and cost Dems the Congres

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berni_mccoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 08:11 PM
Original message
Hillary Couldn't Pass Universal Healthcare with a Democratic Congress and cost Dems the Congres
Edited on Sun Feb-17-08 08:12 PM by berni_mccoy
Hillary's Record:

From Wiki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hillary_Clinton#Health_care_and_other_policy_initiatives

The plan did not receive enough support for a floor vote in either the House or the Senate, although both chambers were controlled by Democrats, and proposal was abandoned in September of 1994.<133> Clinton later acknowledged in her book, Living History, that her political inexperience partly contributed to the defeat, but mentioned that many other factors were also responsible. The First Lady's approval ratings, which had generally been in the high-50s percent range during her first year, fell to 44 percent in April 1994 and 35 percent by September 1994.<135> Republicans made the Clinton health care plan a major campaign issue of the 1994 midterm elections,<136> which saw a net Republican gain of fifty-three seats in the House election and seven in the Senate election, winning control of both; many analysts and pollsters found the plan to be a major factor in the Democrats' defeat, especially among independent voters.<137> Opponents of universal health care would continue to use "Hillarycare" as a pejorative label for similar plans by others.<138>


Not only did she support the Iraq War, she voted against putting Limits on Bush proposed by Levin (from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Senate_career_of_Hillary_Rodham_Clinton) :

(However, Clinton voted against the Levin Amendment to the Resolution, which would have required the President to conduct vigorous diplomacy at the U.N., and would have also required a separate Congressional authorization to unilaterally invade Iraq.<1> She did vote for the Byrd Amendment to the Resolution, which would have limited the Congressional authorization to one year increments, but the only mechanism necessary for the President to renew his mandate without any Congressional oversight was to claim that the Iraq War was vital to national security each year the authorization required renewal.)


Ah, but if she had only read the NIE that said the intelligence for the Iraq War was baked. But wait, she was briefed on it (same link above).

In 2005, she agreed with Cheney when he said the insurgency was in it's last throes: http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/iraq/2005-02-19-iraq-senators_x.htm

In that same year, she shut down filibuster attempts by Democratic Senators that would have stopped Bush's judicial nominees ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Senate_career_of_Hillary_Rodham_Clinton ).

But, hey, she did propose Flag Protection Act of 2005 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_Protection_Act_of_2005) and is a member of the Senate Prayer Breakfast ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Senate_Prayer_Breakfast ) so we should cut her a break for being a GREAT AMERICAN.

In her second term, things got a little better, but not by much. At least she didn't vote to go to War with another nation. Oh, wait, she did, by voting to label Iran as a terrorist organization, giving Bush military authority under previous Congressional Acts she voted for. But she's all about restoring civil liberties, so long as the telecom companies are granted immunity.

So, she *does* have a substantial track record, one I'm sure that many Democrats are hopeful for. Well, at least the 30-39 % that are still supporting her.




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Maddy McCall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 08:13 PM
Response to Original message
1. Berni can't post positive things about his candidate. He has to tear down the opposition.
Just another example that being pro-Obama means hating Clinton.
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thunder rising Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 08:20 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. That's just reflection...not hate. Sorry, that Hillary has such baggage.
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Tellurian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 08:32 PM
Response to Reply #2
10. Hillary is one of the most innovative Senators in Congress.. Health Care IS ALL Hillarys..
and she will get it done. If Democrats refuse to pass it through Congress, they can answer to their constituency and see if they're reelected to a second Term.
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berni_mccoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 08:23 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. Can't handle the reality of your chosen candidate?
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Maddy McCall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 08:26 PM
Response to Reply #3
6. I'm very proud of the candidate I support.
And your attacks on her won't change my mind.
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berni_mccoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 08:26 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. They aren't attacks. That is HER RECORD.
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Hieronymus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 08:38 PM
Response to Reply #7
18. Exactly, it makes her supporters feel better to call truths, attacks.
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Tellurian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 08:36 PM
Response to Reply #1
17. Berni has too much time on his hands and is new to the political game of gotcha!
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Ravy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 08:24 PM
Response to Original message
4. The NIE said the intelligence was baked??? Link please.
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berni_mccoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 08:25 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. It's in the wiki article, but here's the referenced link
Edited on Sun Feb-17-08 08:27 PM by berni_mccoy
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Ravy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 08:36 PM
Response to Reply #5
16. I read parts of the declassified version. It, itself, looks "baked", I didn't
see anywhere that it said that other intelligence was.

Of course, in the declassified version, there is a lot blacked out.

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berni_mccoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 08:40 PM
Response to Reply #16
21. You actually believe what you just said?! LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL!
Wow, and you guys say Obama supporters drink the coolaide. MANOMAN have you got the Hillary-bug bad.
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Ravy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 08:52 PM
Response to Reply #21
24. Of course I believe it.
And I am not crazy about Hillary.

I just find it interesting that you are claiming that the NIE said the intelligence was baked.

From what I see, the NIE is just more baked intelligence. Probably no one should have read it.



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mondo joe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 08:28 PM
Response to Original message
8. Cost Dems the Congress? Remember that when DUers want the elected to act on principle rather
than what will get them re-elected.
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berni_mccoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 08:30 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. Perhaps if she worked in a non-divisive way, been a better politician, she would have succeeded
She even admits it was HER FAILURE. She did not know how to work with the other side. She still doesn't.
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mondo joe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 08:33 PM
Response to Reply #9
11. LOL. First she's demonized for working with the other side, then for not.
Sorry Berni.

It's hard to know why you post shit like this and what you think it's going to accomplish.
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berni_mccoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 08:33 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. Who has demonized her for working with Republicans?
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LordJFT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 08:57 PM
Response to Reply #8
28. if she'd gotten healthcare passed and the dems lost congress
no one would be complaining
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mondo joe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 08:59 PM
Response to Reply #28
31. I'm old enough to remember the absolute machine the Clintons were against.
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Az_lefty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 08:34 PM
Response to Original message
13. let's get this straight...hillary didn't do shit as a Senator...
all the things she claims to care about did not once result in her sponsoring legislation to promote the cause. She co-sponsored important legislation no doubt, but never once sponsored legislation promoting issues she supposedly cares about. It's not good enough to become a high powered Senator to simply prepare yourself to run for higher office, which is all she has done. In fact, she did more to promote to issue of health care as a First Lady than she ever did as a U.S. Senator. Get it? Hillary is all about herself and nothing more.

PS...this isn't directed at the poster of this thread, but to all those who blindly follow the hillary clinton.
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berni_mccoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 08:35 PM
Response to Reply #13
15. Well said.
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Tellurian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 08:39 PM
Response to Reply #13
20. Hmmm...said the no nothing, Lord of the Flies...
don't give up your day job friend.. You'll starve floating political spin.
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berni_mccoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-18-08 12:55 AM
Response to Reply #20
43. I think you mean know-nothing... perhaps you should go back to your day-job
Because blogging certainly isn't yours.
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LordJFT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 08:34 PM
Response to Original message
14. How do you know she wanted to give telecomm companies immunity?
She didn't even show up to vote, which was a little hypocritical considering how much she's been ragging on Obama for that.
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berni_mccoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 08:39 PM
Response to Reply #14
19. She didn't even show up for the vote (she was escaping to Texas). Obama did and voted against it.
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Tellurian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 08:42 PM
Response to Reply #19
22. Berni, the more we hear from you... the more you just amplify how little you know
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berni_mccoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 08:43 PM
Response to Reply #22
23. You have nothing else than to attack the messenger. So be it.
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Tellurian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 08:55 PM
Response to Reply #23
26. I call it being honest... you can call it whatever pleases you..
the fact remains your rehash adds not a modicum of information we are not aware of.. however we disagree.
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LordJFT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 08:56 PM
Response to Reply #22
27. you're mad at him for telling the truth?
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mondo joe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 08:54 PM
Response to Original message
25. I'm glad I'm old enought to REMEMBER the Clinton administration, and to know what
a load of bs this revisionist crap is.
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berni_mccoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 08:58 PM
Response to Reply #25
29. Thanks for the kick.
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Tellurian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 08:59 PM
Response to Reply #25
30. No doubt this poster is trying to qualify for the Propaganda Arm of the Obama Campaign..
He couldn't fool his own Grandma.. never mind a political junkie board.
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berni_mccoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-18-08 12:50 AM
Response to Reply #30
42. And you must be Hillary's campaign manager... Only good for personal attacks.
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Oskie Donating Member (66 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 09:00 PM
Response to Original message
32. Read Woodward's THE AGENDA published '94 about what happened
with the health are issue and the incredible backbiting struggle with the House and Senate (Dems and GOP). That's some of the experience HRC's referring to. The book doesn't flatter WJC or HRC. She's tough. Smart and doggedly determined. The GOP threw it all at her while they Harry&Louised the MSM. They won that time. But she opened the American consciousness about healthcare... My gut tells me Obama's smart and I catch his snide remarks but I don't know if he can outflank them. I doubt I'd like either one of them on a personal level. But I don't care about having "a beer" with my prez.......or my surgeon. Just get results!
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Auntie Bush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 09:06 PM
Response to Original message
33. Hillary admitted she made a mistake due to her inexperience.
Can we afford to have Obama make mistakes due to his inexperience? I don't think so. This is a much more dangerous world. We need experience! Obama is a neophyte when it comes to trying to be an executive or CiC. We don't need no beginner learning on the job!
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berni_mccoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 09:15 PM
Response to Reply #33
34. It was her OPINION it was experience. The mistake was due to a character flaw. One Obama
Edited on Sun Feb-17-08 09:17 PM by berni_mccoy
doesn't have. And Obama does have 12 years of experience as an elected politician. I don't think he would be dumb enough to make the same mistake as a Clinton did since she HAD NO POLITICAL experience when she made it.
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Auntie Bush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 09:26 PM
Response to Reply #34
37. Now what character flaw was that? Empathy and sympathy for poor people
and those that couldn't afford insurance. Or was it a character flaw to
try save some lives by helping them get some sort of health insurance. This is just another example of unfair bias Hill hate?
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berni_mccoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 09:54 PM
Response to Reply #37
38. A lack of Leadership.
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Auntie Bush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 11:41 PM
Response to Reply #38
40. I only have two things to say about that!
B S.
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berni_mccoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-18-08 12:30 AM
Response to Reply #40
41. Then why couldn't she get even the DEMS to give her plan a floor vote? There is only one answer.
And it isn't B.S.
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Auntie Bush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-18-08 01:19 AM
Response to Reply #41
44. Look up the details and you'll see what I mean. You have
no idea if what was going on or understanding of the situation if you say it was lack of leadership. Do you remember Gingrich...the hateful Rethugs in the senate...Harry and Louise etc. etc. etc.?
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Telly Savalas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 09:19 PM
Response to Reply #33
35. Sen. Clinton has experience as an executive or Commander in Chief?
I was aware of her being First Lady of Arkansas and First Lady of the U.S., a U.S. Senator, a partner in a legal firm, a board member for Walmart, and an active participant in children's advocacy groups - an impressive resume like Obama's - but I didn't realize she was ever the Commander in Chief of a superpower or had any executive experience.
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berni_mccoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 11:29 PM
Response to Reply #35
39. Better yet, she's a lesser experienced Politician. The Wonderful Myth of Hillary's Experience.
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AnOhioan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-17-08 09:20 PM
Response to Original message
36. Let's get one thing straight....
What The Clinton's attempted during Bill's Presidency was NOT universal healthcare. Nor is Hillary's current plan. Call her plans what they are, band-aids for a gaping wound.

Universal Healthcare is covering EVERYONE....not just those who can pay.
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TexasObserver Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-18-08 01:20 AM
Response to Reply #36
45. "Universal Healthcare is covering EVERYONE....not just those who can pay."
correct
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berni_mccoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-18-08 08:34 AM
Response to Reply #36
46. Exactly. Clinton plans to force people to pay for health insurance. Just like in Massachusetts.
Health Insurance Premiums certainly haven't gone down there.
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