Krugman: Obama surrogate undermined Clinton's health care plan in 1993-4

[johan helge]

Krugman (http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/02/18/bad-health-care-omens/):

Bad health care omens

This is disturbing:

Mike Lux, a veteran of the Clinton health care wars, pointed out today that Obama is using as a surrogate on health care Bush Dog Democrat Jim Cooper. Cooper spent a good amount of time in 1993-1994 working to undermine Clinton’s health care plan by offering more insurance friendly proposals with former Senator and current lobbyist John Breaux.

This fits in with my sense, based on everything we’ve seen in this campaign, that Obama just isn’t all that committed to health care reform. If he does make it to the White House, I hope he proves me wrong. But as I’ve written before, from my perspective it looks as if a dream is dying.

[islandmkl]

1. Obama's dry cleaner left the stain on the blue dress!!

[Name removed]

22. Deleted message

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[Name removed]

43. Deleted message

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[thereismore]

2. I knew it! Obama did it! Poor Hillary. I am so voting for her. nt

[Skittles]

12. wtf is wrong with you?

are you incapable of any kind of rational discussion?

[jackson_dem]

19. Most of them aren't. They repeatedly show why so many see cultish tendencies in much of Obamanation

[libbygurl]

68. Obamination, more like it. nt

[BeyondGeography]

3. The Kruggenator strikes again

:boring:

[WillYourVoteBCounted]

40. why isn't he investigating: Clinton Used Giustra's Plane, Opened Doors for Mineral Deals

Krugman is supposed to be an economist.

Isn't he worried about what would happen if Hillary were elected?

Clinton Used Giustra's Plane, Opened Doors for Mineral Deals

Feb. 19 (Bloomberg) -- On June 21, 2005, Bill Clinton flew to Mexico City aboard a private jet that belonged to a Canadian investment banker he was meeting for the first time.

The introduction paid off for both men. Clinton was borrowing the jetliner to begin a four-day speaking tour of Latin America that would pay him $800,000. Frank Giustra of Vancouver was forming a friendship that would make him part of the former president's inner circle and gain him introductions to presidents of Kazakhstan and Colombia, where he bought mineral rights.

Giustra, 50, has since put his plane at Clinton's disposal at least a dozen times to raise money for charity, his wife's presidential campaign or himself, according to U.S. flight records and spokesmen for Clinton and Giustra. The Canadian businessman has become one of the largest donors to the Clinton Foundation, pledging half his future minerals earnings in a way that ties the foundation's success to his own.

``If former President Clinton is making decisions about where to put the charitable efforts of the Clinton Foundation based even partly on where he's likely to benefit personally, or see his friends benefit, then that clearly is a classic conflict of interest,'' says Aaron Dorfman, executive director of the National Committee for Responsive Philanthropy in Washington.

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=washingtonstory&sid=aKD3K5Dmu3sY

It looks to me that Clintons are busy throwing dirt at Obama to distract from their new scandals.

[BeyondGeography]

49. Good point...but that's out of his realm

What it should signal to him is that the Clintons have always let big money infect the process, and they have always been secretive. No reason not to assume the same thing wouldn't happen all over again with Hillary, insurance companies and Big Pharma.

Krigman is more comfortable with purely technical arguments, which is why he should avoid politics altogether and stick to economics.

[pnwmom]

84. Any economist knows we were immensely better off during Bill's presidency.

So why would he be terribly worried about Hillary's?

[sandnsea]

4. No HILLARY did it

By proposing a shitty plan and excluding the American people from the crafting of the plan. And she didn't learn a thing, she turned right around and did it again.

[mrreowwr_kittty]

5. Krugman, your dream of derailing Obama is dying. Give it a rest.

And frankly, this argument that Obama's advisor "derailed" Clinton's health plan is kind of specious. Why wasn't Clinton able to overcome whatever resistance he was putting up? Why did she continue to include him in the formation of her plan if he was such an underminer? Was she not aware of what he was doing? Why does her current proposal look like pretty much the same thing she was trying to do in '93, down to including insurance companies in the planning and wanting the planning to be done in secret?

[ShortnFiery]

10. All I can fathom is that The Clintons are filling Krugman's ears with "sweet whispers"

I've lost all respect for Krugman's integrity. What a TRANSPARENT Clintonian slobbering buffoon. :thumbsdown:

[peaches2003]

50. Sounds like Krugman's been promised a Cabinet position-

White House Economic Adviser?

[Eurobabe]

41. WTF is up Krugman's ass these days? I used to like him

:eyes:

[surfermaw]

61. Isn't he praising you candidate, is that why you don't like him

He mentioned my candidate(EDWARDS) today in his c, Charlotte Observer.

[QC]

66. He has rejected the Obamassiah and is thus evil.

He must be cast into outer darkness and never spoken of again.

Under no circumstances will he be allowed to board the spaceship behind the comet.

[Eurobabe]

67. Not sure what you mean?

You mean I don't like him because he isn't praising my candidate, Obama? Or what?

[pnwmom]

86. If it's not about Obama, then why are you criticizing him?

What has Krugman done to you lately? I think he's been in very good form, and today's column was especially good.

[Eurobabe]

87. Because I CAN.

C'ya!

[pnwmom]

85. What is he up to? How about this?

Not much to disagree with here . . .

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=2889910&mesg_id=2889910

[Hieronymus]

6. Breaux, the DINO, has endorsed Hillary.

[cyclezealot]

23. And Jim Cooper is no Dino. ?

People around here let their personal prejudices get in the way of good reasoning. Krugman has been speaking to Democratic issues and he calls issues as he sees them. Particularily Health Care. More than Krugman talks of Obama's economic cowardy. see below. The Nation calls to task another aspect of Obama's Wall Street connections.
I suggest you Hillary/ Obama ahhearants use your heads.
As for us, we approve of neither. But, Krugman suggests Hillary's universality plan is superior. And I also know, Blue Dog Jim Cooper, chair of the Obama campaign in Tennessee has been poison.


Subprime Obama
***
As the subprime mortgage debacle drives a recession that threatens financial markets around the world, the Democratic presidential candidates are pushing plans to address the crisis. John Edwards and Hillary Clinton are pledging substantial federal resources to stabilize the mortgage market and intervene on behalf of borrowers. Barack Obama's proposal is tepid by comparison, short on aggressive government involvement and infused with conservative rhetoric about fiscal responsibility. As he has done on domestic issues like healthcare, job creation and energy policy, Obama is staking out a position to the right of not only populist Edwards but Clinton as well. Obama's disappointing foreclosure plan stems from the centrist politics of his three chief economic advisers and his campaign's ties to Wall Street institutions opposed to increased financial regulation. David Cutler and Jeffrey Liebman are both Harvard economists who served in the Clinton Administration, and they work on market-oriented solutions to social welfare issues. Cutler advocates improving healthcare through financial incentives; Liebman, the partial privatization of Social Security.

Austan Goolsbee, an economist at the University of Chicago who calls himself a "centrist market economist," has been most directly involved with crafting Obama's subprime agenda. In a column last March in the New York Times, Goolsbee disputed whether "subprime lending was the leading cause of foreclosure problems," touted its benefits for credit-poor minority borrowers and warned that "regulators should be mindful of the potential downside in tightening too much." In October, no less a conservative luminary than George Will devoted a whole column in the Washington Post to saluting Goolsbee's "nuanced understanding" of traditional Democratic issues like globalization and income inequality and concluded that he "seems to be the sort of fellow--amiable, empirical, and reasonable--you would want at the elbow of a Democratic president, if such there must be."
Robert Pollin, an economist at the University of Massachussets, believes "these three advisers generally reflect Obama's very moderate economic program, similar to Clintonism." Wall Street apparently has come to a similar conclusion. Obama had received nearly $10 million in contributions from the finance, insurance and real estate sector through October, and he's second among presidential candidates of either party in money raised from commercial banks, trailing only Clinton. Goldman Sachs, which made $6 billion from devalued mortgage securities in the first nine months of 2007, is Obama's top contributor. When asked if Obama would hold these financial institutions accountable for losses incurred by homeowners and investors, his campaign refused to comment

http://www.thenation.com/doc/20080211/fraser

[BlackVelvet04]

7. interesting n/t

[UALRBSofL]

51. Blackvelvet interesting bedfellows Obama has

Kettle black should we say.

[DesEtoiles]

8. Krugman - pathetic! Give it up, loser.

[Skittles]

15. ???????????

so now KRUGMAN is a loser? Why? Because he's not all Saint Obama - All - THE - TIME ???

[cyclezealot]

33. strange how Democratic icons change

due to personal prejudices . Eight months ago when Krugman was taking on Bush he was a Democratic icon. Let's get a little balance. When krugman becomes our shining knight charging after President McCain's agenda, Krugman will again merit universal praise.

[chascarrillo]

37. Strange how Krugman starts eating his own

He's spent the last month or so writing pretty mean-spirited editorials slamming Obama. When he stops bullying progressive Democrats, I'm sure he'll start getting praise again.

[cyclezealot]

45. I am not sure either finalist are progressive

that is Krugman's problem. He might be right.

Only Obama has not called for a moratorium and interest-rate freeze. Though he has been a proponent of mortgage fraud legislation in the Senate, he has remained silent on further financial regulations. And much like his broader economic stimulus package, Obama's foreclosure plan mostly avoids direct government spending in favor of a tax credit for homeowners, which amounts to about $500 on average, beyond which only certain borrowers would be eligible for help from an additional fund.
Obama's disappointing foreclosure plan stems from the centrist politics of his three chief economic advisers and his campaign's ties to Wall Street institutions opposed to increased financial regulation. David Cutler and Jeffrey Liebman are both Harvard economists who served in the Clinton Administration, and they work on market-oriented solutions to social welfare issues. Cutler advocates improving healthcare through financial incentives; Liebman, the partial privatization of Social Security.

Austan Goolsbee, an economist at the University of Chicago who calls himself a "centrist market economist," has been most directly involved with crafting Obama's subprime agenda. In a column last March in the New York Times

http://www.thenation.com/doc/20080211/fraser

[QC]

52. Which progressive has Krugman bullied? n/t

[QC]

65. Yep. Suddenly Charles Krauthammer and Peggy Noonan are founts of progressive wisdom,

while Paul Krugman and Joe Wilson are bushevik hacks.

One of those things that make you go hmmmm.

[Cha]

9. Kerry isn't "concerned" why should

you be?

[johan helge]

13. I'm a Kerry fan, but also a Krugman fan! (nt)

[karynnj]

44. Same here - but of the two, my trust is far more to Kerry

In addition to Kerry, there was Kennedy. Also, if you go back and read anything on the 1993-1994 time period, HRC had many Congressional Democrats unhappy with the both how she ran a secretive closed process and produced a very cumbersome product. In the Clintons' autobiographies, it is clear that there were problems in the plan that led Bill Clinton not bringing it to the floor.

There was another plan, that the Clintons rejected, that was Bill Bradley's. Kerry was one of the people who supported Bradley's compromise plan. Ultimately the only increase in healthcare insurance was S-CHIP which was a Kennedy/Hatch plan that was bipartisan enough to pass a 55 Republican dominated Senate, that started as a stronger (but unpassable without the compromises made) Kerry/Kennedy bill.

I think the difference may be that where it would be hard to beat Krugman on economics - he is nowhere near Kerry or (even more so) Kennedy on politics. Both disciplines are needed.

[johan helge]

82. What Krugman says about health economics

makes sense to me. How a Democratic candidate in 2008 like Obama can resist universal health care (i.e. mandates) is beyond me. In 2008, universal health care is the Democrats' big chance to win.

[calmblueocean]

11. Read about what Hillary's health care plan then actually was.

http://www.counterpunch.org/navarro11122007.html

This is the best article you'll ever read about what Hillary's plan really was, and why it died.

[maximusveritas]

14. Undermined? Maybe if she'd listened to him, she'd have passed

a health care bill. Instead, she treated him and others in the middle like enemies and ended up passing nothing.

[karynnj]

46. In retrospect, I wonder if that was caused by the Clintons view of

everyone not with them unconditionally being against them. This was likely another unfortunate reaction to the unfair, intense RW attacks. But - it is interesting to think of what could have happened had she worked with him and Bradley, a stronger liberal than she ever was, in the Senate.

[TexasObserver]

16. Krugman spinning. Mike Lux is a good guy who came out of Lincoln, Nebraska in the early 80s.

He was very effective on the ground running Citizens Action Network in the midwest. As I recall, his dad was a professor at University of Nebraska, in Lincoln. Mike was a very talented young man in those days, and ended up in the Clinton White House the first term. He's got to be close to 50 years old now.

Last I heard he and Clinton's old Press Secretary, Joe Lockhart, were doing some things together. He's a good guy, and I have heard nothing but good things about him. I don't know that this tidbit by Krugman means anything, though.

Hillary is the INSURANCE LOBBY'S WATER GIRL this election, so the Krugman aspersions about Obama's advisers are vacuous, at best.

[NashVegas]

31. Mike Lux Wrote the Column Krugman Is Pointing Out

I had to travel 3 clicks to get to it, but here it is:

I was part of the Clinton White House team on the health care reform issue in 1993/94, and no Democrat did more to destroy our chances in that fight than Jim Cooper. We had laid down a marker very early that we thought universal coverage was the most essential element to getting a good package, saying we were to happy to negotiate over the details but that universality was our bottom line.

Cooper, a leader of conservative Dems on the health care issue, instead of working with us, came out early and said universality was unimportant, and came out with a bill that did almost nothing in terms of covering the uninsured. He quickly became the leading spokesman on the Dem side for the insurance industry position, and undercut us at every possible opportunity, basically ending any hopes we had for a unified Democratic Party position. I was never so delighted to see a Democrat lose as when he went down in the 1994 GOP tide.

It is such a huge mistake for Obama to use a guy like this to defend their position on health care. The signal it sends to reporters, organizations, and activists like myself who know something about the old health care battles is that Obama truly doesn't care about comprehensive health care reform or universal coverage, and that the health care package you would propose if President would be a conservative, pro-insurance industry bill. The campaign ought to be trying to reassure folks who care about this issue, and using a guy like Cooper does just the opposite.

http://openleft.com/showDiary.do?diaryId=4004

[TexasObserver]

53. Yes, I know what Mike Lux wrote. I've know him 26 years. You cherry picked the article he wrote.

Krugman is cherry picking because Krugman is a Hill Shill.

Typical of Krugman lately. His rug is almost as bad as Frank Luntz', and so is his recent slavish devotion to Hillary.

[The_Casual_Observer]

17. Krugman is old school, he's been replaced by Obama speech writers.

[BootinUp]

59. lol nt

[berni_mccoy]

18. that kind of stretch is gonna leave marks.

[davidinalameda]

21. you can get cream for those marks

:rofl:

[jackson_dem]

20. Thread recap: no Obamite argues the substance (because they know it is factually true).

[Satyagrahi]

24. Brad DeLong: I think Paul Krugman simply has this completely wrong.

"Commitment" to Health Care Reform

I think Paul Krugman simply has this completely wrong. Paul writes:

"Paul Krugman: Bad health care omens: This is disturbing:

Mike Lux, a veteran of the Clinton health care wars, pointed out today that Obama is using as a surrogate on health care Bush Dog Democrat Jim Cooper. Cooper spent a good amount of time in 1993-1994 working to undermine Clinton's health care plan by offering more insurance friendly proposals with former Senator and current lobbyist John Breaux.

This fits in with my sense, based on everything we've seen in this campaign, that Obama just isn't all that committed to health care reform. If he does make it to the White House, I hope he proves me wrong. But as I've written before, from my perspective it looks as if a dream is dying."

What Mike Lux, "veteran of the Clinton health care wars," knows--but is very careful not to tell you--is that in 1993-1994 health care reform needed 60 votes in the Senate in order to defeat a Dole-led filibuster, and that Sen. John Breaux (D-LA) was vote 55. "undermin(ing) Clinton's health care plan by... (working) with former Senator and current lobbyist John Breaux" translates as "working on bills that might actually pass the senate."

Mike Lux knows this. He just hopes that his readers don't.

http://delong.typepad.com/sdj/2008/02/commitment-to-h.html

[ProSense]

47. Exactly! Krugman and the Hillary shills distorting what really happened. n/t

[johan helge]

80. Krugman has an update (cites Ezra Klein):

Klein (http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/02/18/bad-health-care-omens/):

Cooper was, from the beginning, an enemy of reform, not a constructive participant seeking compromise. He did not survey the assembled bills and try and forge a deal. Rather, he did everything he could to undermine the Clinton plan, and played a key role in destroying its chances by shattering the Democratic legislative strategy … He was out for his campaign contributors and, as a read of The System makes clear, his own glory. He wanted to be the dealmaker of health care. He wanted it so bad that he killed the damn thing.

[Iceburg]

25. Like Bush, Obama surrounds himself with a counsel of men determined to line their

own pockets at the expense of middle America.

[JCMach1]

26. their are too many economists on his team with ties to Friedman and the Chicago School

:grr:

This sort of thing is par for the course.

[xchrom]

27. recommend

[Skwmom]

28. Krugman is such a Clinton hack.

[HeraldSquare212]

29. And, of course, he was the only Democrat who offered alternative proposals.

Hillary threatened to 'demonize' anyone who disagreed with her proposal...I guess she's following through now.

[Bread and Circus]

30. Bullshit. Bill Clinton's lack of moral courage and Hillary Clinton's lack of

executive skills is what doomed the plan in 1993.

This is well documented on thenation.com and counterpunch.

Krugman is a fucking idiot Clinton hack.

[sniffa]

32. Krugman: Obama sucks

He should just start printing that instead.

[Barack_America]

34. Krugman: I hate Obama!!1!!!11! Wah!

What a hack he has become. A shame.

[bigbrother05]

48. OT: where did the inclusion of 1 in a string of ! start?

[Barack_America]

54. Al Gore.

He invented the internet, dontcha know? ;)

Honestly, I have no idea where it started. But the idea is mocking those who are so overly emotional on the internet that they must include multiple exclamation marks to convey their point (and are a little loose on the 'shift' key).

ETA: I just noticed that I may have playgorized Sniffa there! (intentional sp)

Oops! Sorry Sniffa! :hi:

[bigbrother05]

55. Thanks, figured it was something like that

[Political Heretic]

81. It started as an internet forum fad - originating on gamer boards

I assume you understand the reason, right? People mocking those who are so intense about what they are typing that they are bashing the shift-1 so hard it looks like that.

The really funny one was the first time I saw someone go !!!!1!!!11!!!!ONE!!!1 - to add that little extra layer to the mockery. Cracked me up. :)

[rodeodance]

35. All obamakids Killing the Messenger--Rovian--NO one engaging in substance.

[chascarrillo]

39. No text in that post. So much for substance.

And give the "Rovian" label up. Doesn't show your best side.

[rodeodance]

42. there is substance you choose not see. And i will slap the Rove on when it fits.

[Cameron27]

36. K&R

[zulchzulu]

38. Yeah, one guy did her in...shows how bad she was if one guy could tear her down

What an insipid OP.

[Marie26]

56. And Krugman gets thrown under the bus.

But it's OK, he's used to it. Krugman is almost always right & almost always derided until the facts bear him out. See: Iraq War.

[QC]

57. It's getting very crowded under Obama's bus.

I guess this is what the new order of unity looks like--all who do not take their marching orders from the Obama politburo will be purged.

[Marie26]

63. Isn't it?

Krugman, Joe Wilson, Chelsea Clinton, Elizabeth Edwards... This is why I'm not a huge fan of the "unity" meme. I'm all for bipartisanship. But when you talk about "unity", it becomes very easy to characterize anyone who disagrees as an evil "divider."

[libbygurl]

70. O is dividing the Dems while uniting with the GOP, is what his 'unity' theme seems to be about. nt

[knowledgeispwr]

77. Not as crowded as under Clinton's bus

it's not just some of her supporters but her campaign that is throwing whole demographic groups and whole states under the hillaryland mobile.

[ProSense]

64. He deserves it for being

misleading, and disingenuous.

[libbygurl]

73. Totally. I doubt I'll ever not read his opinions about anything. He's always been...

...fair-minded and sober in his assessments, which is more than one can say for his colleagues at the NY Times.

[BootinUp]

58. color me surprised. Not. nt

[surfermaw]

60. Krugman, mentioned EDWARDS in his wrighting today , Charlotte Observer

[rinsd]

72. Poverty is Poison...its a good article

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=4661599&mesg_id=4661599

[Vinca]

I know nothing of this person and his position during Hillarycare,

but apparently you all are operating on the assumption people never change their positions, never learn from experience and always stay the same. That was nearly 15 years ago for heaven's sake. In retrospect, Hillarycare, while a noble attempt, was no better than what she's offering today. The American people want single payer, universal, health CARE, not insurance, and neither candidate is offering that.

[libbygurl]

69. Ah, 'Hillarycare' - another favourite right wing term from the 90s.

I don't think instituting universal single-payer health care at once is a practical option, which is why I prefer Clinton's idea. Even Krugman is of the opinion that universal health care is more achievable with her current plan. Leaving out the insurance companies completely, and immediately, was one mistake she made in the early 90s, methinks.


Edited to correct HTML code.

[hughee99]

62. Good for him...

Hillary's 93-94 plan was a TURD. While I may not be a fan of the one he proposed instead, I'm not sorry Hillary's went down. Besides, if Obama was serious about implementing health care reform, wouldn't it help to have someone who has actually WON congressional health care battles as opposed to someone who just learned one way NOT to do it?

[CyberPieHole]

71. K & R n/t

[CTLawGuy]

74. If Krugman doesn't draw a salary from the Clinton

oppo team, he should, for all the work he is doing for them.

[rinsd]

83. Judging by the reaction of Obamanation to any Krugman column

It appears he was dead on with this assessment.

Why, then, is there so much venom out there?

I won’t try for fake evenhandedness here: most of the venom I see is coming from supporters of Mr. Obama, who want their hero or nobody. I’m not the first to point out that the Obama campaign seems dangerously close to becoming a cult of personality. We’ve already had that from the Bush administration — remember Operation Flight Suit? We really don’t want to go there again.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/11/opinion/11krugman.html?ref=opinion

[Donnachaidh]

75. Yup -- the *Empty Suit* is going to let the industry do his work for them

That'll give him more time for GQ covers and doing the talkshow circuit. :eyes:

[SunnyDays]

76. His campaign is insidious...

I knew it early on and my conviction gets stronger and stronger that I will never trust this guy. Nor vote for him. It's write-in time in November...

[nonconformist]

78. K & R. nt

[joshcryer]

79. Krugman is the last bastion of truth i this pundant and cultist infested political season.

Great article.