I enjoyed the peace and prosperity of the Clinton years (1993-2000), but I still support Obama

[rox63]

The 90's were a good time for me. Jobs were plentiful, I made good a good salary, and we weren't pariahs in the eyes of the world. Reproductive rights weren't in serious danger of being repealed, poverty in the country was declining - Life was pretty good.

Unfortunately, that world died in Nov-Dec of 2000, when Bush stole the election. The * years have been HELL. We've turned into the proverbial "Evil Empire" right before my eyes. Restoring our democracy, rebuilding our reputation in the world, this is going to take more than simply a good manager. (which is how I would classify Hillary) It's going to take someone who can rally us all together as one nation: Black, white, red, yellow, Democrat, Republican, Independent, Green, etc. I can't see Hillary Clinton being that sort of leader. But I do see the opportunity for this kind of leadership in Barack Obama.

In his younger years, Bill Clinton might have been able to pull it off. But he has since become part of the political machine that got us into this mess. His closeness to the Bush clan disturbs me, as does his and Hillary's cut-throat thirst for power. Once upon a time, they cared about us common people. But I think those days are gone, and their focus now is just on regaining power.

[Captain Hilts]

1. Wow! It's Bill Clinton's fault! nt

[rox63]

3. No, I didn't say that

It's Bush's fault. But the Clintons have linked themselves too closely to the Bush clan.

[Alexander]

17. Apparenty you Shillbots have reading problems.

You don't know praise when you see it.

[DJ13]

2. K&R!

Excellent post.

[billbuckhead]

4. "Hillary's cut-throat thirst for power."

:eyes:

[rox63]

6. Yes, you heard me correctly

The tactics her campaign is pulling show this clearly. As does the fact that she started campaigning for President when she first ran for Senate in 2000.

[Independent-Voter]

13. in NY, where she wouldn't have qualified for in-state tuition because of residency no less.

[ORDem]

5. Given the path of HRC's primary campaign I think it's quite a stretch

to call her a good manager. If this campaign is any indication (and I think it very much is), we'd be in a real mess if she becomes President. If you want a Dem-version of politically motivated policy, smears, and triangulation, then by all means vote for Hillary. I was fond of having an intelligent person at the helm (Bill), but I'm not ready for a repeat by any means.

I really don't understand Hillary's experience meme at all. First, I think it's very misleading given the lack of her real accomplishments and the way the bungled univ. health care the first time around, and secondly, it's just a different world now. Every President who's been any good doesn't directly apply past experience, it's much more about setting direction and using good judgement. I honestly think Barack's got that in spades over Hillary.

:dem:

[Captain Hilts]

7. Kos has been generating a huge genre of 'Hillary is selfish' literature. Try this...

I wandered over to Kos this morning and found a highly recommended, many posted diary headlined "Hillary is Selfish." The following three hundred approving comments take for granted that all her motives are evil, and the evil-est portion of the whole thing is that her wishes run contrary to those of Obama and his supporters. Part of the fun, in these often two line posts, is to recapitulate things that "Hillary supporters" those poor, deluded, women, might say against these attacks. Female Obama supporters enter the lists to explain that something is never sexist if a woman says it--as though we hadn't just endured years of Ann Coulter and other femmes for hire offering cover for rampant misogyny.

Qua anthropologist I'd argue that we can't talk about the two candidates without sex and sexism intruding because we don't have a gender neutral language to begin with. Words have associations and meanings, histories and cultural backstops that give them a different valence depending on who is using them and who is being referenced. For example, while its trivially true that both men and women can be accused of being "selfish" -- they aren't accused of being selfish *for the same things.* And selfishness, too, is understood differently when applied to men and women. We have a long history in this society of seeing the singular male actor, acting selfishly for his own benefit, in fairly noble terms. We have *no* history or cultural appreciation for "elle, seule" the woman who makes her own way and does what she wants despite the needs and desires of those around her. Nevertheless, Kos and his commenters feel very comfortable continually demonizing HRC with sexist and sexed language while at the same time telling others that they are, essentially, crazy old biddies if they criticize it.

http://tehipitetom.blogspot.com/2008/02/but-in-morning-sir-i-will-be-sober.html

[Bluestar]

8. I would say you are hopelessly disillusioned and blinded by

the rock star factor and speechifyin'. There is NO evidence to suggest that Barack Obama can unite the country. All he has done so far is to stimulate some independents and Republicans to cross parties and influence the Democratic primaries to oppose Hillary. I don't like having them choose our nominee.

[high density]

12. The problem with this argument is...

These 2:1 wins from Obama show he has wide support from Democrats as well. Independents certainly are helping his cause but that's not a bad thing. I don't think many people are wasting time (especially in something as drawn out as a caucus) just so they can register opposition to Clinton.

[in_cog_ni_to]

9. Well, that's gratitude for ya! I just love the logic.

:eyes:

[Unbowed]

10. Excellent post.

I couldn't agree more.



A Nation Once Again - Thomas Osbourne Davis

So as I grew from boy to man
I bent me to that bidding
My spirit of each selfish plan
And cruel passion ridding
For thus I hoped some day to aid
Oh, can such hope be vain
When my dear country should be made
A Nation Once Again

[RFKHumphreyObama]

11. Ditto

What you said. Couldn't have said it better myself:thumbsup:

[cooolandrew]

14. Yes, the system removes innocence even Michelle Obama worries that it will eventually ..

...remove baracks's idealism. We have to get Barack now before the system gets him and turns into something else.

[cloudythescribbler]

15. I spent from the end of Jan 96 til AFTER Clinton Administration's end in a homeless shelter ...

and I have (not for that so much as for what's best to WIN the election and for the presidency of the possible nominees) supported Obama's campaign more or less since the beginning, including with modest donations.

So many people forget that other than balancing the budget while maintaining overall prosperity (no mean accomplishment), the Clinton Administration and the DLC have stabbed authentic progressives in the back at every possible opportunity, both directly, and, by pushing issues 'designed to fail', indirectly. He ushered in a Repuke Congress, spent enormous political capital pushing a NAFTA without anything remotely approaching adequate environmental and labor provisions, screwed progressives politically (while giving a number of key individuals coopting appointments), vitiated the welfare state, and promoted wedge issues instead of serious environmental protection, an area where, Gore or no Gore, the Administration was quite weak.

If I had to pick b/t Obama and another DLC Clintonite for the prez, that's a no brainer for me; but to choose between Obama and a more probably McCain Administration if HRC gets the nomination -- that is the basis for serious passion.

GOBAMA

[caledesi]

16. same here! NT