The Clinton rules apply, still, again, and forever

[Caro]

"Attacks on Hillary have seemed over-the-top recently"
"NewsHour" media reporter Terence Smith … says Hillary Clinton and her supporters have reason to complain about the tone of their press coverage, if not the substance. "A barely-suppressed glee often creeps into the commentary when Hillary loses another primary or caucus," he writes. Meanwhile, "Barack Obama is characterized as the second-coming of JFK, etc. etc."

And the Obamabots on the internet have that same feeling of glee, not suppressed at all. They want to knock Hillary Clinton down, stomp on her, and grind her face into the dirt. Bush hatred has been replaced by Clinton hatred. Isn’t it amazing how that happened? Is it a coincidence that Obama’s chief political strategist is a student of Karl Rove’s tactics?

H. Brandt Ayers: Let's play race card
Bill Clinton mentioned that Jesse Jackson, like Barack Obama, had carried South Carolina, which gave New York Times columnist Maureen Dowd a hissy fit… Her hair-trigger sensitivity about the race issue evidently is rooted in the fact that she was a schoolgirl during the civil rights movement and graduated college after the movement was over. With respect due to her entertaining style and Pulitzer Prize (which I haven't won), I can say, "Child, you haven't seen the race card played until you've been a liberal journalist in George Wallace's Alabama." I know something about the race card… As I said, Maureen, I know the race card and the Clintons are no racists. One of your colleagues, Times columnist Paul Krugman, agrees with media scholars that the national media tend to inflate even mild comments by the Clintons into the explosive potential of hand grenades.

INSIDE THE SEWER: (by Bob Somerby at the Daily Howler)
Let’s be frank: The Times op-ed page is an intellectual sewer. Yesterday, Dowd was at it again. After some brain-dead Hopi humor, she lodged this hiss-spitting claim against her favorite target: “Hillary says Obama is ‘all hat and no cattle.’” But The Dim One was playing her readers a tad. Here’s what Clinton actually said, last Tuesday night, in Texas. We’ll cite Beth Fouhy’s AP report, since the Times didn’t even report the comment: “FOUHY (2/13/08): She slipped into a ‘you all’ and criticized Bush, the former Texas governor. ‘There's a great saying in Texas,’ she said, ‘all hat and no cattle. Well after seven years of George W. Bush, we need a lot less hat and a lot more cattle.’” Huh! She had criticized Bush—but Obama worked better. So the Times let their crazy girl type it.

Now and forever, however, it will be accepted as common “wisdom” that Clinton used that phrase against Obama, not against George Bush. Truth be damned. It's just not as much fun as believing the lie.

Carolyn Kay
MakeThemAccountable.com

[scheming daemons]

1. It's the world they created....

...now they have to live in it.

[Caro]

10. What on earth ...

... are you talking about?

It's been well documented that the Clintons were dogged by right-wing fanatics from the moment they came on the national stage. Rich right-wing hatemongers spent hundreds of millions of dollars to discredit them, and make them seem like terrible people.

You fell for it.

When they start on your guy, you won't dismiss the demonization so easily.

Carolyn Kay
MakeThemAccountable.com

[Clinton Crusader]

13. They spent more 'investigating' the Clintons than investigating 9/11

should tell you everything
:eyes:

[Caro]

14. By a huge margin.

Carolyn Kay
MakeThemAccountable.com

[EvolveOrConvolve]

2. Your point gets lost in the 'Obamabots' comment

The slur simply relegates your post to the flame bait pile. When trying to make a substantive point, keep it civilized and you'll have a better chance of winning over those whom you hope to convince. Instead, you turn it into an attack piece that takes the discussion nowhere.

[Tatiana]

4. Absolutely.

The level of discourse, especially from formerly rational, thoughtful people, has really gone downhill.

Shame.

[Caro]

15. If the shoe doesn't fit ...

... don't wear it. But I see a close resemblance between a lot of people who call themselves Obama supporters and the Bushbots of the message boards of 2000.

Interesting that you thought it applied to you.

Carolyn Kay
MakeThemAccountable.com

[cali]

21. wrong.

all you do is harden people against any point you're trying to make. And it's too bad, because I agree that the MSM is gleeful about piling on when it comes to the Clintons, but instead you took a wrong turn. You're only speaking to the choir, and you've turned off everyone else. Too bad you can't see that you're only damaging your own argument.

[Raine]

24. No, it's just plain rude

and if you are trying to sway someone WHY do you want to use an insult against them. :-(

[EvolveOrConvolve]

25. You answer a slur with another slur

Do you not understand how insults redirect the discussion away from valid issues (such as the one you pointed out) to insubstantial arguments?

What's interesting is that you have the ill conceived notion that I thought your insult applied to myself. There's a lot of hidden anger and some serious projecting going on. Is that what this political race has turned into?

[ShortnFiery]

3. Just like The Bush Family, when the Royal Clintons don't like the rules, they ignore or change them.

It's time to OUST The Clintons. Hell, I hope she loses her Senate seat. :( :thumbsdown:

[Metric System]

7. "Hell, I hope she loses her Senate seat." And that's the kind of talk that just may convince me to

stay home on election day in November if Obama is the nominee. Obama supporters are no longer solely content with Hillary losing the nomination, they now want to oust her from the Senate as well. I want no part of ObamaNation.

[Caro]

16. And I'm accused of being mean ...

... by calling some people Obamabots?

Carolyn Kay
MakeThemAccountable.com

[Mojorabbit]

5. This is why I am leaning

Obama though I am not fond of either. It may not be her fault but it is a fact. She and Bill are not well liked and I hate the thought of another 8 years of the press and the other side doing everything they can to obstruct any kind of progress and trashing every endeveour she tries to make. It sucks but the press does not like her. Nothing she does will be portrayed positively by them. We have too many huge problems including climate change and the economy to have to fight an uphill battle with the press on the other side.

[Caro]

17. Obama won't be much liked ...

... after the right-wing crazies get through with him, either.

Don't you see? We can't make our decisions based on their trashing of our people. They did it to the Clintons. They did it to Al Gore. They did it to John Kerry.

You know what they say about doing the same thing over and over, expecting different results.

Obama's and Clinton's voting records are similar, so I based my decision on their platforms. Of the two, Clinton's is more progressive. That's why I voted for her. It was a rational decision.

The mainstream media and the fanatical Obama supporters are quickly radicalizing me, though.

Carolyn Kay
MakeThemAccountable.com

[Mojorabbit]

23. I just don't agree

The press has it in for Hillary and Bill. They have for years. If she wins we will be starting ten steps back with a rerun of everything that happened when he was prez and negative press on any initiative she tries to put forward. An uphill battle before even getting to a starting point. At least with Obama, they will have to start fresh with the trashing..
At the end of the day though, I don't care which one of them wins as long as a Dem is the winner.

[CreekDog]

6. When you say "Obamabots" I stop reading

you might consider that when you post, that is if you are trying to get through to anybody that disagrees.

[Caro]

18. If it doesn't describe you ...

... then don't own it.

Interesting that you thought it did apply to you, though.

Carolyn Kay
MakeThemAccountable.com

[CreekDog]

20. I didn't think it applied to me

I stopped reading because when I saw that term, I thought it falsely asserted something that put enough of a cloud over the rest of the post that I wouldn't know what to believe about it without checking every statement twice. There is enough good information out there that one doesn't have to doubt immediately that I spend my time with that when push comes to shove.

So I moved on from your post.

And second, just because I don't think I'm an Obamabot doesn't mean you wouldn't think I am and apply the term to me (which would be false).

Just think about that before you use terms like that.

[Caro]

26. So you thought you think that you might know ...

... and missed some important information.

Now that he's the frontrunner, they'll start applying the Clinton rules to Obama. Come back and tell me how that feels.

Carolyn Kay
MakeThemAccountable.com

[John Q. Citizen]

8. Actually, it's Terry McAuliffe face i'd like to grind into the dirt. Just for the record...

[MethuenProgressive]

9. "Obama’s chief political strategist is a student of Karl Rove’s tactics"

You'd better explain this, before the DUbamas send out their "alert/flame this thread" mass email.

[sniffa]

11. I know this is going to be a waste come Level 2 tonight but

bye

[Cha]

12. More hilary whining..are you sure

you don't need an Waaaaambulance?

[Caro]

19. This kind of comment ...

... could have been made in 2000--by a Bushbot.

Carolyn Kay
MakeThemAccountable.com

[Indenturedebtor]

22. Human nature

Pretty much everyone here has one of those people that everyone hates at the office. Almost without deviating that person:

1) Thinks they know it all. You can tell that they never really listen to you because they answer before a question is finished, they have the same expression no matter what you say, and no matter what you say they disagree with you or sneer in a "I already knew that, but good for you" sort of way.

2) They assume that everyone knows they are "the best"

3) They never hesitate to do whatever it takes to get the glory, because ultimately they are the best qualified at the office and the only people that can't see that are simply evidencing their inferiority. Clawing their way to the top will pay off for everyone in the end, even if a few eggs have to be broken along the way.

4) They are fake and keep conversations light and meaningless. They don't really want to talk to you anyways. What could they possibly learn or gain from an interaction with a plebe? Better simply to avoid conflict or tangling their fortunes up with yours through friendship. Again the expression/mood never changes. It's always carefully crafted for the situation.

And on and on and on.

In short whenever a person like this shows the slightest weakness everyone takes an opportunity to kick them in the teeth. This above all else is why I believe HRC has such high negatives. She reminds so many of us of "that guy" at the office. Smarmy, know it all, fake, arrogant, triangulating, and so on.

-------

Take policy out of the discussion for a moment (wow I see smoke coming from that comment already), she's just very very hard to like.