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"Clinton Lies About Plagiarism Attack," and "plagiarizes" John Kerry

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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Feb-19-08 08:09 PM
Original message
"Clinton Lies About Plagiarism Attack," and "plagiarizes" John Kerry
Edited on Tue Feb-19-08 08:11 PM by ProSense
Opinion

Clinton Lies About Plagiarism Attack

1 hour, 36 minutes ago

The Nation -- Hillary Clinton flatly denied that her campaign was attacking Barack Obama for using the words of another politician, telling reporters on Tuesday that her campaign had not made the charge. The Chicago Tribune reported her remarks from an interview with KITV in Honolulu on Tuesday:

"Look, it's not us making this charge. It's the media. You know, the media is finally examining my opponent which I think is important because we're trying to pick a president, someone for the toughest job in the world <...> So, I think the media is going to be putting forth whatever facts and information it has for voters to assess on their own."

Obama Campaign spokseman Bill Burton shot back on Tuesday evening. "Senator Clinton knows full well that her campaign held a conference call with reporters to fan these flames and the fact that she suggested her campaign had nothing to do with it is exactly the kind of evasive tactic voters are rejecting," he said in a statement.

Clinton's claim is demonstrably false. Her campaign has aggressively and openly pushed the plagiarism attack, including a national conference call by senior campaign aides on Monday. Her aides also circulated a YouTube clip comparing footage of Obama and Gov. Deval Patrick.

Initially, Clinton operatives apparently did attempt to conceal their involvement. The first New York Times article about the clip reported:

The similarities from a passage of Mr. Obama's speech on Saturday and in remarks that Mr. Patrick delivered on Oct. 15, 2006, were highlighted by a rival campaign that did not want to be identified. Clips of both speeches are archived on the Web site YouTube.com.

Yet by Monday morning, Clinton Communications Director Howard Wolfson and Rep. Jim McGovern openly made the plagiarism attack on the conference call, while the campaign openly distributed the YouTube clip without requesting to only be identified as a "rival campaign." The story has now dominated campaign coverage for two days, so Hillary Clinton is obviously aware that her campaign is making the charge.

The Clinton Campaign's attack on Obama's use of the line "just words" was widely panned as a baseless and desperate ploy. Her cover-up might go over even worse.

more


October 15, 2007, 5:48 pm

Clinton Evokes Kerry, Quotes Roosevelt

By Patrick Healy

Purposely or not, Hillary Rodham Clinton evokes memories of the 2004 presidential nominee, John Kerry, from time to time.

A centerpiece of her health care plan was allowing Americans to buy into the federal insurance program that is available for members of Congress. Mr. Kerry proposed the same thing in 2004. “If it’s good enough for members of Congress, it’s good enough for all Americans,” Mr. Kerry liked to say; Mrs. Clinton has made the same point over and over the last few weeks.

Mrs. Clinton has talked at length about rebuilding global alliances; Mr. Kerry made the same pitch. They both talked about “rebuilding” a middle class economy, and they both used the phrase “war on science” to describe the Bush administration’s approach to scientific research.

And this afternoon, speaking at a luncheon to hundreds of women in midtown Manhattan, Mrs. Clinton even dusted off one of Mr. Kerry’s slogans. In May 2004, Mr. Kerry — who seemed to have a new catch phrase every month — settled on one that he repeated through the summer months, and one that drew more applause than many of his others.

“Let America be America again,” Mr. Kerry would say. It was the title and the first line of a 1938 poem by Langston Hughes, a leading figure in the Harlem Renaissance.

Toward the end of Mrs. Clinton’s remarks, she spoke about protecting children and giving the underprivileged a better life, and then looked ahead and said, “We have a lot of work to do.”

“We can let America be America once more, as Langston Hughes said,” Mrs. Clinton added.

Mrs. Clinton and Mr. Kerry are friendly and they respect each other, their aides said, and they have worked together during the campaign to pressure the Pentagon to supply more details about war planning in Iraq. That said, Clinton campaign advisers are sometimes brutally critical of the Kerry 2004 campaign, particularly its delayed and wobbly effort to fight back against the so-called Swift Boat attacks on Mr. Kerry’s war record.

Clinton advisers say they were not mining the Kerry playbook for tips or rhetoric; rather, they say, Mr. Kerry had some good, mainstream Democratic ideas (like on the congressional health plan) that fit into Mrs. Clinton’s agenda. And a good line from an adopted New Yorker like Mr. Hughes is free to all.

more


Video: http://www.oliverwillis.com/archives/2008/02/18/clintons-plagiarism-charge-fal">Clinton Caught Copying Obama (and Edwards) Too


Edited to put word "plagiarizes" in quotes.

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K Gardner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Feb-19-08 08:14 PM
Response to Original message
1. Tubbs: "If we hadn't BROUGHT this to you, it never would have been discussed." Wow. They're PROUD
Accidental flub-up/admission of Camp Clinton culpability in the plagiarism mess, per Stephanie Tubbs-Jones on MSNBC yesterday.
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Feb-19-08 08:36 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. Someone is off message! n/t
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TheDonkey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-20-08 11:02 PM
Response to Reply #1
18. she's off the meds
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karynnj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Feb-19-08 08:19 PM
Response to Original message
2. I guess Heally missed how Clinton in the last year has plagerized Kerry on Iraq
From saying that the Iraqis will not make the hard decisions if they think we are prepared to stay forever. There was one time where she spoke of respecting the warrior when you disagree on the war - something Kerry has said since the 1970s.
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Feb-19-08 08:52 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. Never mind that,
Edited on Tue Feb-19-08 08:52 PM by ProSense
the rules, as set by Hillary, don't apply to Hillary. Evidently being truthful doesn't either.
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Democrafty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Feb-19-08 09:25 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. Kick! n/t
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Feb-19-08 09:46 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. Thanks!
Anyone know if Hillary mentioned the "plagiarism" thing?

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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Feb-19-08 10:28 PM
Response to Original message
7. OMG, deja vu
Hillary:

"Tonight I want to talk to you about the choice you have in this election and why that choice matters. It is about picking a president who relies not just on words but on work, on hard work to get America back to work. That's our goal!"

more


Just words?

The 'Hard Work' Issue Isn't Taking a Holiday

By Dana Milbank
Washington Post Staff Writer
Tuesday, October 5, 2004; Page A05

HAMPTON, N.H., Oct. 4 -- The insinuation by the Democratic nominee is subtle but unmistakable: George W. Bush, the president of the United States, is lazy.

Outside Youngstown, Ohio, on Sunday, John F. Kerry mocked Bush for attesting in Thursday's presidential debate -- 22 times -- that his administration is engaged in "hard work." "I welcome hard work," Kerry said. "I like hard work. I think hard work is a good thing."

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And in Ohio!



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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-20-08 10:17 AM
Response to Original message
8. On national TV, Patrick calls plagiarism charge against Obama 'extravagant'

On national TV, Patrick calls plagiarism charge against Obama 'extravagant'

February 20, 2008

Governor Deval Patrick went on national TV yesterday to defend Barack Obama against charges that the Democratic presidential hopeful plagiarized Patrick. Patrick said on ABC's "Good Morning America" that the allegations were an unfair attempt to "belittle" Obama's "ability to motivate people."

The governor and Illinois senator have long shared similar principles and policies, Patrick has stumped for Obama, and Obama has borrowed rhetoric from his friend. The issue arose again over the weekend at a Democratic Party event in Wisconsin when Obama - taking the stage after Hillary Clinton said she offered solutions, not just speeches - used similar language about the power of words as Patrick did in a 2006 speech. They both quoted Martin Luther King Jr., the Declaration of Independence, and President Franklin D. Roosevelt to argue that words can influence history.

Clinton told reporters Monday that, "If your whole candidacy is about words, they should be your words." Representative James McGovern of Massachusetts, a Clinton backer, told reporters that the country deserved a president who was "not just someone who can copy someone's homework."

Obama has downplayed the issue, though acknowledging he should have credited Patrick.

Patrick also sought yesterday to lower the volume on the issue, calling the plagiarism allegation "an elaborate charge and an extravagant one."

more


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karynnj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-20-08 10:12 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. It is amazing that he repeated 2 words and many of the most common
American sayings - that's it. I bet that Rep McGovern has repeated things said by others. Not to mention, I think campaign rallies would be very different if NO ONE used speech writers. Then it would be the ones that can write - like Obama and Kerry - who would stand out even more.
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-20-08 10:39 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. Uh, Hillary "plagiarized" Carol Mosley Braun:
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karynnj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-20-08 10:45 PM
Response to Reply #10
14. But, but ... that was her campaign theme
and she plagiarized it - no one could independently think that.
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Major Hogwash Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-21-08 09:44 PM
Response to Reply #9
28. Yeah, but I also heard that the estate of Bob Hope is going to go after Obama for using his name.
Hopefully, they will negotiate some type of settlement for the improper use of Bob Hope's name in Obama's campaign!

It's a good thing the 2 words that Obama didn't borrow were from Dick Cheney when he talked to Pat Leahy on the Senate floor!

LoL

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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-20-08 10:41 PM
Response to Reply #8
11. On national TV Obama said he should have been more careful.
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jackson_dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-20-08 10:45 PM
Response to Reply #11
13. They still are in denial about what the real story was
It isn't the plagiarism, it's his candidacy is based on words. Words that we now know are just Axlerod campaign gimmicks.
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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-20-08 11:00 PM
Response to Reply #13
17. I know-----denial is so strange. They do not let anything in that contradicts their worldview
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-20-08 11:10 PM
Response to Reply #17
21. View: Hillary has fallen behind!
That pretty much seems in line with reality!


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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-20-08 11:14 PM
Response to Reply #21
23. i know that reality and accept it. That was not the issue and you know it.
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-20-08 11:15 PM
Response to Reply #23
24. What's the issue? n/t
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-20-08 11:09 PM
Response to Reply #13
20. "It isn't the plagiarism, it's his candidacy is based on words." So Hillary is player hating?
Just because her words, even the ones that she lifts from other people, aren't able to inspire at the same level as Obama's is no reason to throw a fit and cry plagiarism. That was her accusation.

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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-20-08 10:45 PM
Response to Reply #11
15. The video is in the OP. n/t
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SoxFan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-20-08 10:43 PM
Response to Original message
12. "A rival campaign"
Right.



Bastard.

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niceypoo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-20-08 10:53 PM
Response to Original message
16. Obama "issues" get shallower and shallower
And this one has to be the most shallow ever...
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-20-08 11:06 PM
Response to Reply #16
19. More shallow than Hillary's BS plagiarism charge? n/t
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Eric J in MN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-20-08 11:12 PM
Response to Original message
22. Each Democratic candidate should start from scratch and...
...not use any of the same arguments, like saying of a health care plan, “If it’s good enough for members of Congress, it’s good enough for all Americans"?
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karynnj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-21-08 09:33 PM
Response to Reply #22
26. Or she should say that Kerry said it first - millions of times
That's more words than Obama took from Patrick - all he took was "just words" - and said it a few times and gave examples that were well known American quotes.
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Major Hogwash Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-21-08 09:37 PM
Response to Reply #26
27. Yeah, but in reality, if you were going to steal words, wouldn't you steal from the best?
I mean, there would never have been any Milton Berle if he hadn't stolen jokes.

Everyone steals from everyone else's playbook, their ideas, their slogans, their words.

It just looks odd hearing Kerry's speeches coming from out of Hillary's mouth, is all.
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karynnj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-21-08 10:06 PM
Response to Reply #27
29. yep - and the media covered them so poorly, many don't recognize them
It doesn't bother me that Kerry has borrowed his words and even ideas - they are and were good.

What did bother me is that Kerry in 2004, his book tour and in Senate speeches has made a very good argument that investing for research for clean alternative fuels would lead to cleaner air, cleaner water and healthier lives, less dependence on an unstable middle east, and a better economy through selling these products and technology. He then pointed out that if we were wrong on global warming, those are the benefits. But, if they were were wrong and we did nothing on global warming - it would be catastrophe. When McCain got the endorsement from Arnold - he plagerized this whole thing. It bothered me as I was more drawn to how Kerry explained this than anyone else - even Gore. It was positive, drew on science and technology as good solutions and was up lifting. My fear is it will be seen as McCain's - and we don't want the Republicans to have that.
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Major Hogwash Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-21-08 11:45 PM
Response to Reply #29
30. Yabbut, McCain can't steal Kerry's ideas anymore than McCain can get laid in a whore house,
Kerry has always been ahead of the curve, in science, in dealing with the war, dealing with the troop shortages in Iraq, in dealing with national security, in dealing with the environment.

I don't even think McCain can ride a bike now. He's just too damn old and worn out.
While Kerry's riding in 100 mile bike marathons!

Who the hell can compete with that? Nobody.
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karynnj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-22-08 11:53 AM
Response to Reply #30
31. As one of the JK group, I agree with everything you say in the comparison
What I don't get is why the media disliked Kerry, who is not only smarter, but far nicer.

This country may never see what they lost in 2004 - Kerry really has been ahead of the curve on every major issue facing the country and on top of it has one of the cleanest records in government - unlike McCain.
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-24-08 11:36 PM
Response to Reply #31
32. The news organiztions are showing
signs of that same mentality, but their attempts to ambush will fail.
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MagickMuffin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-25-08 12:36 AM
Response to Reply #31
34. The media didn't like Kerry because he could talk in complete sentences
He's just not a sound byte kind of guy.

Complete sentences, which turn into complete paragraphs, which lead people to have to think about the message.

That's why I've always admired and respected Kerry. He makes you think.

The media can digest so much info. They would rather talk about having beers with a candidate, instead of issues that have a message.


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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-21-08 09:00 PM
Response to Original message
25. Hillary lies! n/t
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ErnestoG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-24-08 11:38 PM
Response to Original message
33. She is the Protean Candidate. She will do anything to get elected.
That includes lying.
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