Wishing Obama and his supporters the best of luck in the GE, if they get the nom ...

[sjdnb]

which they should given all the $$s, endorsements, and hype. This whole process has been one major disappointment -- I thought for sure a Progressive stood a chance, but with JE out and Gore not in -- I don't much care who wins.

So, I'll take a pass on this one. I just can't bend that much. And, anyway, according to all reports, you don't need us baby-boomer Dems anyway, you have the youth vote.

[libertee]

1. they talk, they don't vote...

[sjdnb]

6. Obviously, they do vote ... at least in these primaries

and, they've come out in record numbers state after state.

Hey, I may not agree with them, but their vote counts as much as mine does.

I just can't go with the flow, just so the flow wins.

[high density]

2. Love the baby boomers that feel the need to insult the youngins for getting involved

Thanks so much! :hi:

[WritingIsMyReligion]

4. *snort*

:rofl::rofl::rofl:

:thumbsup:

[gerrilea]

5. Reality shouldn't be insulting...you yougins don't vote consistently

only if the mood hits you...

[libertee]

7. exactly correct!!!

[high density]

15. Well then, what is it?

The OP says we've got enough pull to influence the elections, but then you tell me that we're not voting consistently.

[gerrilea]

26. Where were you with Kerry? In the GE...you'll forget to vote...had a date that night

[MagickMuffin]

35. Let's see if they are just now turning eighteen then that means they were fourteen in '04

So, they were too young to vote in '04.

D'oh....

[smalll]

46. Where have you been? Young people don't have "dates" these days --

they just "hook up" after a few too many vodka-and-Red-Bulls. Dates? That's so last century!

[RoadRage]

20. Or a candidate hits "us" that is actually worth a crap...

Finally, after a whole generation, we've found one we believe in. We're not in a hurry to apologize for not believing in yours... because the last few you've put up have had quite a few defects. So, now we'd like to take a shot at it to see if we can do any better.

[gerrilea]

25. Obama is a baby boomer...he's older than me...so this generational thing has to go

[Moochy]

36. GET THE FUCK OFF MAH LAWN

damn kids

[sjdnb]

11. I'm not insulting them ... just stating how it is, in these primaries

and, I admitted my vote was no more important than theirs. And, while I'd have loved to see JE stand a chance or Gore jump in, it is what it is.

I've worked my tail off for progressive causes since 1972, but I believe in democracy. And, that is why I readily admit no one's vote is more important than any other.

[high density]

17. If you're a progressive then I don't understand your beef with Obama (or Clinton)

Certainly either of them is much better than McLame? Even if you just take a single issue like the supreme court it's an easy choice IMO.

If you're fine with passively allowing the possibility of McLame becoming Prez, then go ahead and sit it out.

[readmoreoften]

If you don't understand what the beef is, then you don't know what progressive is.

Progressive is to the left. Both Obama and Clinton are centrists--and that's a kind analysis. Here's an analysis outside the US. A progressive would be at least at the center to the left. 25 years ago both Clinton and Obama would've be moderate Republicans.

http://politicalcompass.org/usprimaries2008

[sandnsea]

28. After whining about kids being missing

for the last 5 years. Fuck 'em. I don't know what their problem is. I guess they never outgrew that "me" generation thing.

[gateley]

3. You may not care what Dem wins, but you'd care if McCain won, right? nt

[gerrilea]

8. By all the hatred here against HRC...president McCain is inevitable

I won't vote for Obama...

[gateley]

27. Thank you for your support of our Democratic candidate, and for letting

a handful of rude bloggers in our own little DU world make up your mind for you.

Will you really be able to sleep at night?

[griffi94]

30. i won't vote for obama either

the slash and burn tactics used by obama supporters is no different than what the rw does....i don't want to turn into the thing i hate the most just to say we won.....besides obama doesn't seem to need my vote.....

[angie_love]

44. wow you can say that with a straight face?

:rofl:

I like alot of the hillary supporters, thank god they're not all petty and stupid like you are. Just b/c your candidate is losing you support the repug b/c you're just that angry. GROW UP.

[mcctatas]

9. Apparently among some on DU...

McCain is thier second choice, otherwise they wouldn't get thier freaking panties in such a twist when things don't go thier way!

[sjdnb]

13. McCain doesn't have a chance

nor does any other GOP candidate ... that's why this year was the year for a Progressive, but we've abandoned that possibility in favor of a 'party' person.

[high density]

23. These two candidates aren't exactly my first choices either

But that's how the cookie crumbled. The lines between Democrat and Repuke are very clear in this campaign even if the candidates may not be as far left as you hoped for.

[sjdnb]

32. I wasn't hoping for 'left', I was hoping for fairness and justice

Upholding the Constitution, etc. Something I've not seen done by party Dems, including Obama AND Clinton, lately.

[I Vote In Pittsburgh]

37. When did Obama go against the constitution?

Please don't be so bitter.

[MagickMuffin]

40. Well, if you care so much for the Constitution and then sit out the GE

seems to me you don't really care that much at all.

Yes, the Democratic Party has been lacking in their support for upholding the Constitution. This has been the case for a lot longer than Sen. Obama or Sen. Clinton has been in office.

I would hope you would not let the lackluster candidates sway you away from voting in the GE. Otherwise if McLameBrain pulls off the election then you will only have yourself to blame, and the others who claim they will not vote for the Democratic ticket.

I for one trust the Democrats to uphold the Constitution over the rethuglicons. The Supreme Court is enough to get me to vote for "OUR PARTY" and not sit it out. There could possibly be one or more Justices to retire, or who knows how healthy they are, some of them are really getting old.

Did I want either one of these two candidates to be my choice?

No, not by a long shot. I wanted Al Gore, or John Kerry to run.

Should I just call it quits?.?.?

Hell Fookin' NO............ I will be voting for the Democratic Candidate.

[HeraldSquare212]

10. Obama's about my third choice, but I'm still in it.

[Renew Deal]

12. Obama needs you

And the Democratic party needs you. It will take a little while to deal with the emotion. But Obama is the candidate that can deliver on his promises, and your help is desperately needed.

[jaxx]

14. I'm a boomer........1946

I'm female. And I'm for new ideas in the old oval office.

I'm for Obama.

[Adelante]

22. Me, too nt

[yellowcanine]

16. Speak for yourself. I am a boomer and I will vote Obama thank you very much. And I know

a lot of othe boomers who feel the same way. So please don't act like you speak for us. You don't.

[Hill_YesWeWill]

18. Hey, we need you as much as you need us, and you know that!

I hope you can bring yourself to change your mind, because we have to defeat McCain, he's a horrible warmonger!

[jillan]

19. He's going to need it. The repugs are going to have fun with the newbie.

And I hope I am wrong.

[grantcart]

21. thanks for your kind words please keep an open mind

[surfermaw]

24. I believe after hearing now that we can win in GE

[griffi94]

29. i just posted something similar in another thread

i just can't vote for obama

[mkultra]

31. perhaps you should open you mind

My father-in-law takes the same tact. Hes a long time dem just like me but he seems to think that his age gives him a corner on the truth market. He claims that Hillary is our only chance against McCant, despite a complete lack of supporter data and a huge load of contrary information.

You have a right to your opinion just like i do.

[sjdnb]

33. Well, some of us old timers prefer reaching into our knowledge base - over celebrity endorsements,

big time $$s, and M$M created momentum. Sorry if pragmatism is old-fashioned to you, but for us (who have paid your way through most of your lives) it has served us well.

[I Vote In Pittsburgh]

38. Excuse me, but it was MY money

and the money of 500,000 other americans - less than $2500 each - that funded Obama's campaign. I worked for that money, and as a college student, it could have easily gone to other places. It is ignorant of you to claim he won because of mega corporation funding. He was polling 20 points behind Hillary in most states before Iowa hit.

By not voting, you are supporting a 100 year Iraq war.

[mkultra]

42. your vieled implication of greater meantal prowess is border line insulting

That should be in your data bank as well. You've never paid my way and my parents are smart enough to know that raising a child they bore doesn't buy them any extra ownership of my intellect. Your pragmatism just looks like an opinion with an endorsement from yourself. everybody has an opinion. Take that from someone who is getting ready to pay your way.

I am a pragmatist. Pragmatism dictates that subjectivism(that would be you) denotes irrationality(not pragmatism.) put that in your oxygen tank for a while.

[mkultra]

43. oh, and btw

There is nothing wrong with big money when you haven't taken a dime from lobbyists. Something Clinton cant say.

[anigbrowl]

34. Thanks for the gracious support...

...and I hope you'll still vote for the Dem in GE if Obama is the nom. If not, I hope you find good congressional or local candidates worth supporting.

[Bongo Prophet]

39. Another old progressive here, and I welcome the young voters! Don't insult them.

Our party - any party - needs new voters, to stay vibrant, and to move the party toward culturally liberal positions. The only way we will get freedom for all races, for our GLBT+ fellows, envirinmental policies, net neutrality and more, is to bring in young and vibrant open minded people.

If you pause and think this through, i trust that you will see this.

[kurth]

41. Die Revolution ist wie Saturn, sie frißt ihre eignen Kinder

aka
The Revolution Devours Its Own Children

[Political Heretic]

45. Hey the I'm-pouting-and-staying-home wing of the party has spoken.

*sigh*

I'm voting for Hillary if she wins.
I'm voting for Obama if he wins.

Either one of them will make a REAL difference in REAL Americans lives. Either one will stop right-wing extremist judges from being put on the supreme court.

I don't have time for blind, petulant ideoogical purity. Ideally, I'm a radical. Not a "progressive." Not a "liberal." A radical. Practically however I'm smart enough to understand that national course correction doesn't happen in overnight, and I'm not stupid enough to have an all or nothing mindset.

The trouble with ideological purism is that it frequently gets in the way of ACTUAL CHANGE.

:rant:

[readmoreoften]

49. Ideological purity has nothing to do with it.

Our country is so far to the right people think that center, slightly right-leaning candidates like Clinton and Obama are to the left. We've been waffling between far right and center right for close to 30 years now. It's about not deluding ourselves. The only "actual change" happening if we win is respite (which could be brief) from a total slide into a new brand of technological fascism.

http://politicalcompass.org/usprimaries2008

[Political Heretic]

51. Don't lecture me about the american political spectrum.

I'm not some johnny come lately to politics. I do this for a living, and I understand what institutional problems we face. It's a no-shit-sherlock statement to say the political spectrum in the United States is narrow, encompassing only a tiny fraction of the full scope of ideas, mostly to the right and center. There is no true leftist movement with political power yet in the United States today.

None of that is my point.

My point, which you totally ignore to go right back to spouting the same old lines that sound like some 15 year old just read a "red" book for the first time, is that either an Obama presidency or a Clinton presidency helps real people - people I live with, people I work with, real living breathing persons - while sitting passively by and doing your part to allow McCain into office hurts those same real people. It's not an abstract idea. It doesn't matter if Democrats aren't "really left." Its still a fact that a democratic president will help real people. Maybe not as many people as we should, maybe not as much as we should - but its still help just the same.

And either Democratic president will not appoint two more right wing extremists judges to the bench. It doesn't matter if Democrats aren't "left" enough - getting them elected still does that, which also helps REAL PEOPLE - it not some abstracted idea.

And sitting home and doing nothing enables a president who will continue to murder our boys and girls in an illegal war with no end in sight and many other illegal wars on the horizon. And doing that my friend, makes you complicit in the murder. All of your blah blah blah about principle means very little.

I used to not be able to think of anything else by the purist idealist when I was in my young twenties. I still BELIEVE in the same principles, but I also believe that ACHEIVING THEM COMES FROM INCREMENTAL CHANGE, and that you can't just ignore the needs of REAL people in the HERE and NOW so that you can pat your self on the back for being a ideological absolutist.

You vote for a democrat this year because it helps real people and saves real lives. Period. It is just THAT simple.

[readmoreoften]

52. Hey where's your rant icon?

Talk about giving a lecture. I was responding to your original self-righteous lecture. Hey listen; it doesn't take much to vote. That's why I'll vote for the lesser of two clear evils. Knock yourself out moving the country back to the center one millimeter at a time. But while Obama and Hillary save real people-- in all their dramatic "boldface type" glory-- other real people who happen to live in other countries will continue to suffer under our neoliberal policies. Waiting for miracles doesn't save lives either. It's not about patting yourself on the back (maybe that's what you were about in your 'young twenties'...sounds like a personal problem) it's about being able to look at yourself in the mirror knowing that you've done all that you know how to fight an obvious death machine.

That's why I would never lecture people on the merits of incremental change. Because I'm not the one suffering the most serious consequences of incremental change (not to say that I do not suffer at all.) You have no more right to be angry for those "ideologues" for their strategy than they have to be angry at you for believing in a strategy which, frankly, has not panned out for close to three decades. That's the thing about a democracy: people can register their dissatisfaction in myriad ways and try to effect change as best they can. I understand why there is restlessness. There ought to be.

[cottonseed]

47. I'm 32, support Obama, and will not leave a Dem party corpse to conservatives.

I'm not a boomer, and I'm not young. I consider myself a progressive, and regardless of who gets the nomination this year, I will not be leaving a democratic party undefended against a McCain whose only real motivation is the defense of an America, against an "existential" threat that I'm not even convinced exists in the form that he believes it does. This leaves a McCain administration's soft belly open to the same Nixon/Reagan/Bush vultures waiting to feast upon what is left of our Treasury, Infrastructure, and national Services.

At a purely theoretical level, I'm not even sure why you wouldn't bend this year considering you're first 2 choices of Edwards and Gore. Even they're records have a number of things that would be considered suspect. I guess, I'm just asking that everyone reconsider boxing themselves in before we even go against the Republicans. Hell, in another decade, these youth voters might feel as disenfranchised as you're seemingly feeling right now.

[JVS]

48. Have fun watching Matlock while everyone else is voting.

[texas_indy]

50. No hay problema, jefe......plenty of Dem, Indy, and other baby boomers are stepping up for Obama now

Ya gotta do what you believe in....


Texas is Obama country.

[boppers]

53. I'm 36.

Close to half of the country is my age or younger.

We don't want groovy sit-ins or street puppets to protest Iraq, we want the fuck out.
We don't want to score political points in debates about women's rights, we want women treated equally.
We don't want "minorities" to be compensated, we want them to not be treated as minorities anymore.
We don't want signs and symbols telling us that we're saving the whales/environment/whatever, we want to sit down at a table and actually change things.
We don't want our politicians handing us Pyhrric victories, we want them to actually do something.

Hillary ran as a fighter, somebody to do daily battle... screw that.

We're about winning the war, and putting the final nail in the coffin of the 20th century, one of the worst social and political abominations mankind could have mustered.

If you don't want to be part of our D-Day, I understand. You fought against insane odds, and it was a long, hard, battle, to get to a point where we could finally crush our enemies. A lifetime of struggles. I applaud the progressive boomers for that.

I hope you do benefit from us trying to do something about health care and retirement, because there's a huge generation about to pass through, with very little available in needed funding, so we're gonna have to get creative.

[lligrd]

54. WTF? We've Been Begging The Youth To Get Involved For

decades and chastising them for not doing so. Now they do it and you insult them and opt out. Are you going through your second childhood while the younger generation grows up?