Hillary has pretty much handed Obama the nomination tonight.

[Political Heretic]

Save this post. Mark my words.

EDIT to add -- people here represent the fanatical-obsessive fringe of the voting public. Myself included. The only people who love things like the xerox disaster and her insane decision to bring up the "plagiarism" charge that she has been publicly laughed at all over the nation for making - is here, among the fanatics.

Only one candidate got drowned out by boos tonight. Ordinary people are sick of the shit. In Wisconsin, 53% of voters said they thought Hillary's attacks were unfair. Tonight, Hillary just changed that to a national percentage.

I would fire whoever DARED let her go out on stage and think it would be a good idea to take the tactic she did.

She could have come out and stole all of his thunder by going for the, "I admire Senator Obama, and I think he is a credit to our party -- heck, I think he's going to be President someday (make it a laugh line, but not as an insult, but a true but lighthearted statement) -- but I believe that right now we need to blend a true vision of hope and real change with the experience and wisdom to get things done - to turn that vision into a reality. I believe I am the best choice for president this year."

Basically its a variant of a message that says, Obama is the real deal, a good man, and inspiring visionary, and will make a great president SOMEDAY, but he's not ready this year, and I am the right person do the tough and dirty work to lay a solid FOUNDATION for building lasting change."

If she had done that, she would be winning.

[scheming daemons]

1. When you're getting booed by a pro-Democrat crowd, your campaign is over...

...

[Darth_Kitten]

2. LOL

Funny how loud the applause is for her, huh?

[plastichallway]

98. Sorry to disappoint but the Standing Ovation was for Hillary

She hit the ball out of the Stadium.

[plastichallway]

99. KO tried to marginalize this and

made the first crack. This was picked up by 'CNN Republican Flack, Bill Schneider, who was then parroted by NYT bimbo, Alessandra Stanley for her worthless, vapid column.

[RoadRage]

105. Which we're now finding out wasn't even her "ball"..

It was her husbands & John Edwards. Spoken 20 minutes after the hypocritical "Xerox" comment isn't exactly smart, IMO.

And, everyone stands at the end of a debate.. they were clapping for BOTH candidates. If it happend in the middle of the debate I would see your point.

[barb162]

34. How do you know they weren't booing him for plagiarizing?

[JeanGrey]

62. Because that is silly, and we watched it?

They were booing her. I am glad she dropped it fast.

[grantcart]

92. watch the polls from here to Mar 4 or you could get a you tube

and watch it on her face

[sandnsea]

3. Completely agree, she blew it

and is continuing to blow it. She just does not know when to shut up.

[Darth_Kitten]

4. it's a DEBATE, for cripes sake!

:eyes:

[Political Heretic]

14. Let me explain:

I added to my OP:

I would fire whoever DARED let her go out on stage and think it would be a good idea to take the tactic she did.

She could have come out and stole all of his thunder by going for the, "I admire Senator Obama, and I think he is a credit to our party -- heck, I think he's going to be President someday (make it a laugh line, but not as an insult, but a true but lighthearted statement) -- but I believe that right now we need to blend a true vision of hope and real change with the experience and wisdom to get things done - to turn that vision into a reality. I believe I am the best choice for president this year."

Basically its a variant of a message that says, Obama is the real deal, a good man, and inspiring visionary, and will make a great president SOMEDAY, but he's not ready this year, and I am the right person do the tough and dirty work to lay a solid FOUNDATION for building lasting change."

If she had done that, she would be winning.

Right now, every time she refuses to treat him or his candidacy as "real" she insults and belittles millions of voters - many of them new voters - a lot like much of DU does here. She basically calls them stupid, ignorant, naive, gullible, etc. Well guess what, you can stay pissed and angry that someone you think doesn't deserve to be winning is wining, and you can keep INSULTING AND DEMEANING MILLIONS OF VOTERS and think that somehow that's going to get you more votes.... or you can start excepting the fact that you're not the frontrunner, you're in danger of losing, and that Obama is REAL and start WOOING his voters rather than TRASHING THEM.

That's how she could have won.

[Usrename]

23. Wooing his supporters, instead of belittling them.

Exactly!

:thumbsup:

This isn't the way to turn the campaign around at all.

[JeanGrey]

63. Turn it around?

I don't think that is an option.

[Usrename]

74. Ok, then... not lose quite so badly. n/t

[JeanGrey]

106. That is only going to happen if she drops out soon

[dchill]

58. If she really wants to win...

she should fire all her "advisors" tomorrow morning. Tonight, rather.

[JeanGrey]

64. It's a little late for that.

[subsuelo]

5. She thinks going to attack mode will bring more votes

She's so wrong. It's interesting to watch the front runner go down like this

[MagsDem]

19. It will

[Political Heretic]

22. No it won't.

Not in this context.

[cali]

24. really? how do you know that?

Oh, that's right you don't have a crystal ball or a clue. We'll see what happens, but all he had to do tonight was not make a major gaffe. She needed to land a knock out blow and it sure looks like she didn't. It's all tied up in TX and he has the money and a YEAR headstart on his ground game there. Her campaign is in serious financial difficulty and in disarray. It's doubtful that she can pull it out in TX.

[Adams Wulff]

97. Wow

You really are an idiot.

"Change you can xerox"? You stand behind that crap? You stand up for the Karl Rove brand of politics?

Why be here?

[Johnny__Motown]

35. She needed to give people a reason to not vote for him, I don't think she has done that

[sandnsea]

48. She gave people reasons not to vote for her

Her snippy xerox comment, her beligerence towards Cuba, her picking a fight over health insurance. She had her laundry list, but that isn't what people vote for.

[sfam]

6. The nomination has already been decided...the only question is...

whether Obama does a serious gaff. So far, it hasn't happened.

[jackson_dem]

7. DU is so out of touch with the real world lol. Yes, Hill is satanic even though obama has the same..

...beliefs!

[Political Heretic]

13. Don't put words in my mouth.

[dchill]

60. It's not her beliefs, and you know it.

It's her tactics, and her attitude.

[kypp]

8. Totally agree.

[MagsDem]

9. I don't know about the nomination, but she is kicking his ass

[JeanGrey]

55. Sigh. Tonight I saw the truth on her face - she knows she is

not going to get it, and bringing up Bill's infidelities showed how hurt she still is. I think she showed she can have real class.

Tonight is the watershed moment though when everybody, well, knows.

[Tennessee Gal]

10. You must not be watching the same debate I am watching.

Hillary is sharp as a tack on the issues.

[Political Heretic]

11. So is he.

But she's the one that made herself look like a jackass, which is what the story will be and is what people will remember.

[Tennessee Gal]

15. Obama is the jackass.

More and more I simply cannot abide him.

[Political Heretic]

17. Well woop dee doo. I'm talking about political strategy, not the personal.

And I'm right.

[Cha]

52. The hilarys are the jackals...

And, your kinda support is sketchy at best.

[BigDaddy44]

37. Yes she is

But being sharp as a tack on issues isn't whats going to seal the deal. Case in point, Reagan got elected.... TWICE!! This isn't a race for the head policy-wonk. Its all about being telegenic, and charming, and affable, and knowledgeable, and leaderlike. And thats not a slam at anyone -- its just the way things are.

[krkaufman]

53. And inspirational.

Inspirational will be pedantic every time.

[barb162]

38. Yes, it seems to me they're cheering pretty loudly for her. n/t

[Enrique]

12. she didn't bring it up, Campbell Brown did

it disadvantages Hillary, and Hillary is trying to change the subject.

It was fair for Brown to bring it up since Hillary's campaign did make it an issue, but Hillary definitely doesn't want to talk about it in the debate.

[loveangelc]

16. yup.

[splat]

18. Obama seems like a vice president who'll sell her programs to the people

[tabasco]

20. She got booed when she continued the lame plagiarism smear.

That was a very bad moment for H. Clinton.

[The Backlash Cometh]

21. My hubby said he saw the debates and he thought the two really

got along well. I asked him if he was being sarcastic and he said no. He was serious. Was there a part in the debate where they were nice to each other? How long did it last?

[Major Hogwash]

25. I agree. If this debate was supposed to help her, it didn't. It ended her campaign.

She'll start crying anytime now.

[JeanGrey]

65. I really thought she was going to cry at the debate tonight.

I'm so glad she didn't.

Lord how I wish she would have kicked Bill to the curb years ago.................I've got a sister married to a jerk just like him and she stayed with him too for money. Aaaargh.

Hillary hung on to the one thing she didn't need in the long run.

[my2sense]

93. I feel for her as well

Yes, I was thinking the same thing. While I support Obama, I do have empathy for her and all she has endured.

[JeanGrey]

103. Ditto.

[Political Heretic]

26. Obama doesn't have to win, but Hillary has to NOT LOSE

...and she's taken a lot of strides toward being the loser tonight even if nobody "won."

[grantcart]

27. she made a bold move to capture . .

the silly demographic

[Recursion]

67. Idle: Tarquin Fin-tim-lin-bin-whin-bim-lim bus stop...

...F'tang F'tang Olé Biscuitbarrel...

Cleese: Silly

Idle: 12,441. (applause)

[Kaylee]

28. They should be paying you the 6 mil....

that was an excellent statement and would have gone a long way with both sides.

[Political Heretic]

33. See? I think so too!

Hehe... not really, but I wouldn't mind the money!!

[elixir]

29. SHE IS KICKIN' HIS ASS! Confident, on point, substantive - no uhmms

[Political Heretic]

31. Like I said, of course the fanatical fringe thinks that.

DU continues to be far out of step with the public in its polarized ways of thinking

[Cha]

91. Oh I don't know..I have a few friends at

work here in New York who are on the very same page as I am on this whole hilary thing. I'm amazed actually..cause I know so much but they pick up on it too. Just had a friend email from Cal that she voted for Obama cause she hasn't like hilary's demeanor lately.

[thevoiceofreason]

46. Yeah, right.

He crushed her.

Once again, she is the class valedictorian who tries to be class president. Has a plan with 150 detailed points. But few vote for her, because they like the smart cool kid who can deliver the word and package the message. Her handlers suck.. Especially the ones who suggested that she ever ever attack. Bad move. She should have acted offended.

[ErnestoG]

82. ...stealing her husbands speech lines from his '92 campaign....

[anamnua]

30. Wishful thinking

Saying that Obama won , or is winning , this debate is like saying Germany won WW2.

[Political Heretic]

32. I didn't say he won, or is winning.

I said she handed him the nomination.

She did it because she blew it... there may be no "winner" and she may even "win" in terms of certain answers to specific questions. But she screwed when she took this defeating, insulting track toward voters instead of wooing Obama supporters.

[thevoiceofreason]

36. He sealed it tonight.

Here's to crossing fingers for the Ohio debate. She'll come out swinging there because the polls will be kicking her by then.

[barb162]

42. He did? I don't think so. n/t

[easy_b94]

39. HILLARY JUST FAILED!!!

[Crunchy Frog]

40. I certainly hope so.

Her campaign really needs to be put out of its misery.

[backscatter712]

41. The plagiarism thing was silly - Looney Tunes silly!

[Cha]

90. Obama definetly has that whole

boomerang thang down..when hilary throws..right back it goes.

[no name no slogan]

43. NOBODY watches this shit

except for political junkies and the kid blogging in his mom's basement.

Besides, most of the people who DO care have already formed their opinions and/or already voted.

[Political Heretic]

50. This is TRUE. An important point.

[high density]

51. A voice of reason

There you go. Though that Xerox comment will get play far beyond the debate tonight.

[zulchzulu]

44. Her final statement almost appeared to be her swan song

She'll be fine...

[apocalypsehow]

45. That's pretty much the size of it, IMO. Hello President Obama! YES WE CAN - and will.

n/t

[NDambi]

47. It's over..obama beat her

[bigtree]

49. One more debate left. Watch what comes out of the debate from CNN

We don't know what will rise to the top out of what's covered. We'll see.

[JeanGrey]

54. Yes she did. This will be the moment that everyone looks

back on as the watershed that she conceded. And she did it a lot classier than I thought she would. Getting boo'ed must've been awful for her. But she knows it is over. I even felt badly for her when she started going on about Bill's infidelity. She put up with that for years and all for naught. I truly believe if she had kicked Bill to the curb after the WH, she'd be sailin' now.

[billbuckhead]

56. Obama will never live down the Xerox comment

Obama just bought into a franchise, he didn't build the store.

[JeanGrey]

61. The xerox comment was nothing - it just got Hillary boo'ed.

People aren't going to abide that stuff.

[Major Hogwash]

66. Because the 35-and-under crowd will all look to grandpa and say "What's a Xerox, Gramps?"

And then he'll chuckle and say, "well, back in the day, before we all had computers . . "

And then they'll roll their eyes, and say "oh, no, another one of those stories".

[JeanGrey]

75. LOL

[closeupready]

57. I felt that way, too, watching her underwhelm us.

n/t

[AZBlue]

59. She got BOOED in a room of DEMOCRATS!

She should drop out tonight.

[GarbagemanLB]

69. They don't count. They were black and latte-drinkers.

[DUyellow]

71. LOL

[bluedawg12]

70. She got a standing ovation from a room full of Democrats.

What's the rush? How about letting people vote?

[Political Heretic]

72. They both did. Only one got booed. You gotta screw up pretty bad to get booed.

[bluedawg12]

73. He was boo'ed the time before- stupid move on her part only because

it gave her opponents fuel.

It was a stupid line that fell flat that does not mean she should drop out.

[Political Heretic]

76. No he didn't

And I didn't say she should drop out. I said she pretty much handed him the nomination. For all the reasons I wrote about.

[bluedawg12]

80. Go back and look at the person I replied to orignally

that is who I referrenced that she should get out. It's a bit higher up.

[JeanGrey]

77. She is already defeated. She cannot win. She would need

to defeat Obama by 30% in three big states and that just isn't going to happen. She could try and steal Michigan and Florida and force it but that would earn her so much blistering hatred she'd lose even if she won.

She knows.

[Political Heretic]

78. She can't do it even with MI and FL.

[bluedawg12]

84. Is the Texas and Penn. primary over? n/t

[JeanGrey]

101. I know that.

[bluedawg12]

83. Actually, she could win. Saying she "cannot" win

then saying she can win if she gets 30% in three big states is a contradiction.

You are confusing your own opinion with probability and possibility.

Think: the audacity of possibility.

[Major Hogwash]

86. She can't win - she's a lying gas bag full of shit!

Just look at what she said tonight about the IWR.

Hillary is a liar - she can't win.

[JeanGrey]

102. No, she can't. She would need that big of a overage just to

tie at this point.

[TheZug]

68. It was the "plagiarized" finale that did it.

Such nice sentiment. Would have worked for her too, if she hadn't tried to create a scandal over plagiarism and then borrowed lines from her husband and John Edwards.

Ironic, and richly deserved.

[BenDavid]

79. okay, let me see if that is true. A pro democratic crowd and

obama says those same exact words to hrc because she borrowed words from some of bills speeches...okay I am an hrc supporter adn in the crowd and I boo obama along with all the other hrc supporters there. So, by your own assumption then obama will lose..

How silly...I think obama better come out with a dvd of his speeches so you obama folks can go and buy it cause you all sometimes act and write as though you are in need of a damn daily fix.....goodness

[ErnestoG]

81. I couldn't be happier.

[WinkyDink]

85. "Silly season", is right. The silly season of Rodney King's "Can't we all just get along?"

HRC's "Xerox" line was divisive? Good grief.

[LadyVT]

87. CNN brought up the plagiarism charge, but I agree w/ the end of your post

[Radical Activist]

88. The nomination was decided on the night of the Patomac primary.

Everything since then has just been Hillary dragging things out.

[writes3000]

89. Believe it or not, I Think Hillary's Standing O strangely benefits Obama...

Notice the two things, Hillary did in her final answer...

1) She paid respect to the wounded soldier. She talked about their great sacrifice. I think the audience was moved but I think this topic actually supports Obama's position on the war, more than it supports hers.

2) She talked about how honored she was to be on stage with Obama. Notice the diametrically opposite reaction that got compared to her "xerox" jab.

Hillary was gracious and she definitely can point to her close as a strong moment. But I think if you analyze it, even this moment shined a positive light on Barack.

[Blue_State_Elitist]

94. Is somebody a little bit sensitive?

Your candidate isn't perfect. Get over it.

[TheDonkey]

95. I just watched. Hillary flat out LOST this debate. Wow

I usually give Hillary the debates but this one she flat out lost. Not even close.

[ErnestoG]

96. She really looked like someone who had the wind knocked out of their sails

Seriously, she looks winded or beaten

[ChairmanAgnostic]

100. her last words were almost a blessing to the next president.

olive branch, handshake, whatever.

[Cameron27]

104. Opinions,

you have yours, and I have mine & the more I listen to Obama, the harder it becomes for me to vote for him if he's the nominee. I'll do it of course, but he just doesn't seem to have a handle on the issues, in fact he seems bored by it all.

I hope I'm wrong.