Is sexism the last form of bigotry that's acceptable? At DU??

[Maddy McCall]

The escalating sexism in DU tonight is undeniable.

Some of you think that it's a joke when women point out misogyny and sexism at DU. You attempt to disarm your sexist crap with "I know I'll probably be called a misogynist..." and then you post disturbing sexist garbage. You don't even try to hide it.

This is a PROGRESSIVE forum. Racism is not accepted. Nor should overt sexism be.

To you Obama supporters who are admonishing the jerks posting this stuff, I salute you.

To the people who think that it's funny to post such shit, I hope your daughters are proud.

[madaboutharry]

1. I think sexism and bigotry

against overweight people. Earlier there was a post with awful comments about Mark Penn, who happens to be rather overweight. The comments were cruel. I have a friend who is overweight and I am often shocked by how she is treated by people.

[goodgd_yall]

25. That and ageism.

I'd say those (ageism and bigotry based on looks---and size being the most common)are two kinds of bigotry that aren't even recognized as bigotry when they are expressed.

[totodeinhere]

72. Ageism is a just as bigoted as any other "ism."

So we have got to be sure to attack McCain on the issues, and God knows we have enough issues to get him on, rather than attacking him over his age.

[lapfog_1]

2. links please... you can't just paint everyone with such a broad brush

and not support it with hard evidence.

[Maddy McCall]

4. The people who do it know they do it.

It's not that hard to identify.

The most recent was just deleted. It stated that Hillary has PMS and needs Midol.

[Whisp]

22. I just saw that one and it was disgusting.

I was going to post such, but thought better of it. Obviously trolls like that are Looking for a heated response, and I wasn't willing to give him/her any soapbox time for the stupidity of the post.

[DURHAM D]

30. I missed that - was it deleted or locked? n/t

[Maddy McCall]

47. Well, I responded "fuck you" and...

when I went to my du and clicked on my post, it showed "missing topic", so I suppose it was deleted.

And for that, I have to say THANKS MODS!

[lapfog_1]

96. Things that are over the top USUALLY get taken care of

Obama supporters... Do NOT use sexist language (and try not use any offensive language of any type) when referring to Ms. Clinton. It doesn't make your candidate look good. It doesn't make YOU look good.

By the same token, can we now ask AGAIN that Clinton supporters NOT call Obama supporters Obamites, Obamanations, children, kool-aid drinkers, cultists, etc? Halfrican-American is also not acceptable. Neither are any other references to his race or the race of his supporters.

I promise to only refer to Ms. Clinton as Hillary, Hillary Clinton, or Ms. Clinton (or occasionally when the context calls for it, Clinton, though usually that is not sufficient because of possible ambiguity). In addition I will strive to call folks here that support Hillary Clinton as Hillary supporters or Clinton supporters (not Clintonistas - which, yes, I have been guilty of in the past and now apologize for).

The mods here are doing a wonderful job and my hat is off to them.

This is NOT by any stretch, an olive branch or a concession of any of our debate points. If I think you are not being truthful, I will still say that, and I assume that you will do the same to me... but we don't have to name call or get into the muck of sexism or racism or any other ism.

Truthfully, with so many threads in GDP, it's hard (for me) to check them all out.

The one thread mentioned here was clearly inappropriate and I condemn it.

[blonndee]

98. Yeah, then the guy posted it AGAIN and it's still there and so is he.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x4732490#4733306

[lapfog_1]

107. Ok, I see it again

and I alerted the mods about it.

It's inappropriate.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

15. I'll Find More Examples

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x4732490


You don't give a shit because it's not your oxe being gored...If it was you would squeel like a pig...

[lapfog_1]

80. Yes I would

and "hysterical wifey" is very wrong.

Un Presidential was about as far as I would go. Especially after the glowing remarks she had for Obama at the end of the Austin debate.

If she had just been handed those fliers by someone in the crowd and hadn't seen them before... she should have stuck to her prepared speech and spent some time the proper response to Senator Obama, realizing that both of them are democrats and going to have to work together.

But yeah, "hysterical wifey" is not something that Obama supporters or Hillary supporters should tolerate.

[Straight Shooter]

16. She is not allowed to provide specific links. That would be "calling out" DU'ers.

The evidence is there, plain and simple, right in the Primaries forum.

edit to add: not allowed to provide links to posts; links to threads is acceptable. :blush:

[lapfog_1]

84. Threads is all that I was asking about.

and I know the rules.

The one thread had some language that is unacceptable.

[Hoof Hearted]

35. I have a link for you

http://www.democraticunderground.com

Look.

[lapfog_1]

87. Look at what? - n/t

[Hoof Hearted]

168. Sorry, I'm all out of crayons and drawing paper to draw you a picture with.

And I'm not your mommy, you'll have to look yourself.

[lapfog_1]

175. Like I said in the other posts...

we don't need this kind of crap here.

if you hate me so much... please take your hatred and find another outlet for it.

Unlike you, I am not a child. and I don't indulge in childish taunts.

I came into this thread willing to look at the evidence. And willing to alert the mods or PM the offenders (which I have) if things were as Maddy said they were. I don't care who you support, racism or sexism or homophobia doesn't have a place here.

We can disagree without resorting to name calling. Well, I was hoping that we could.

[Bombtrack]

3. I see much more acceptance of bigotry against Oasis

and uncircumcised males.

but to be serious, while any rational person would agree that females continue to be the more oppressed gender worldwide and in America (although not America in particular), there is anti-male sexism that's rampant on DU and particularly by alot of Hillary supporters since she and Obama have become the clear frontrunners and then only 2 candidates left in the race.

[Maddy McCall]

6. Oasis deserves bigotry.

I'm staying out of the circumcision debate. :)

[okasha]

5. No. Homophobia is also alive and well.

n/t

[Maddy McCall]

8. God, yes. It sure is.

[Beausoir]

7. One problem....people who post that kind of shit don't have daughters. They are stuck in mom's

basement, whacking off to fantasies about Clenis.

[Maddy McCall]

11. You always crack me up.

I think you're right. :rofl:

[knowledgeispwr]

9. Actually, I've seen sexist AND racist threads in GDP in the last 5 minutes

so I wouldn't say it's the "last form of bigotry acceptable".

But in any case, it's disgusting and I agree it shouldn't be accepted.

I'm an Obama supporter.

[Maddy McCall]

14. Please post a link to any racist thread.

I always denounce such posts, and I'll do it now.

[knowledgeispwr]

21. Here ya go...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=4733201&mesg_id=4733201

and here:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=4733087&mesg_id=4733087

I may have missed a few.

ETA: I've been alerting the sexist threads I've been seeing, as well as the racist ones.

[Umbram]

33. Wow.

That second one was pretty rediculous.

[Maddy McCall]

39. I responded.

The first poster has quite a record of posting inflammatory bullshit.

The second poster, I have no idea what's in his head. Responded to that one, too.

[knowledgeispwr]

48. Has something happened in the last hour?

It seems like there has been a sudden rash of particularly sexist and racist threads (more than usual).

[Maddy McCall]

55. I don't know.

That sudden cluster of sexist threads provoked my thread. I think what happens is that sometimes someone will post a mildly sexist thread, then another tries to out do that one with a pretty overt sexist thread, then another says, "Fuck it, if they can get away with that, I'll go for the motherlode of sexist shit," and posts.

I think one emboldens the other, then the other, then the other.

[emilyg]

74. It's Saturday night

and they have nothing to do.

[lapfog_1]

119. Thank you...

and I alerted the mods on the one over the top thread that was disgustingly sexist.

(it's the only one listed in response to my request)

I'll look for more over the next 30 minutes or so.

No matter who we are for, or even who we are against, we need to maintain our own dignity as humans.

[pnwmom]

186. To me, the second poster was clearly saying that we should NOT

judge people on the basis of their race, and that all people in the same race are not the same.

So I'm not sure why that post is racist. Wouldn't it be similar to saying that women shouldn't vote for Hillary merely because she's a woman? I think the person's main mistake was that he or she should have used a sarcasm smilie instead of a shrug.

[Forkboy]

67. Lots of ugliness as the race draws to a close.

I've seen a few real bad posts today on both sides. I mean over the top bad, not just "I find it annoying you don't agree with me" type of bad.

[Clovis Sangrail]

10. I thought it was homophobia

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=221x65762
:shrug:

[WillYourVoteBCounted]

12. "..I'm your girl..."

Clinton to Ohioans: "I'm Your Girl" Feb23 2008
http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2008/02/23/politics/fromtheroad/entry3868245.shtml

[Kaylee]

13. I'm an Obama supporter who's been alerting left and right. nt.

[Maddy McCall]

18. Thank you, Kaylee

Thanks...I do it, too, when I see obnoxious dreck against Barack.

[Debi]

17. It is inappropriate, Maddy

I'm sure that after the primaries they will end.

[goodgd_yall]

19. Yes.

You can be pretty openly sexist here and it's tolerated to a greater degree than any other type of bigotry is my perception

[NastyRiffraff]

20. Do these people have mothers? Daughters? Sisters? Wives?

If so, they must hate them. It's one thing to criticize a candidate on the issues; we can all disagree with honor on some things. But ad hominum attacks based on sex is vile and unacceptable.

[Darth_Kitten]

24. Yes, some real issues there.

n/t

[Umbram]

26. You give the posters of overt sexism too much credit.

They just want attention. I doubt they mean half of what they post (certainly not an excuse) but do it just to get a "rise" out of people.

[NMMNG]

36. They'd likely sacrifice them if it would advance St. Obama

Anything is acceptable if it helps St. Obama. Screw LGBTs, women, the "uneducated", older people, white people and anybody else you need to if it helps Obama win the election. Pick up the pieces and make apologies afterwards. All is fair, it seems, in love, war and elections.


I've never felt so ill as I have these past few months.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

45. Here

Do not think that I came to bring peace on the earth; I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. For I came to set a man against his father, and a daughter against her mother, and a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law; and a man’s enemies will be the members of his household. He who loves father or mother more than Me is not worthy of Me; and he who loves son or daughter more than Me is not worthy of Me. And he who does not take his cross and follow after Me is not worthy of Me. He who has found his life will lose it, and he who has lost his life for My sake will find it."

Matthew 10:34-39

[NMMNG]

54. That sounds very much what the "unity" campaign has come to

:shrug:

[Umbram]

46. You may need to take a long walk and a deep breath. (nt)

[NMMNG]

50. Piss off

The last thing I need is some sanctimonious Obama supporter telling me what I need to do. Take your advice and stick it.

[Umbram]

69. Obama supporter?

I'm not an Obama supporter - with D.K. out, I could honestly care less.
That makes 2 accusations I'm a H.C. supporter and 2 that I'm an Obama supporter.

:shrug:

As my avatar suggests - I'm voting for whomever wins.

I hope the primary season gets over soon. There's way too many people that seem genuinely upset here.

:hide:

[ErnestoG]

170. A retort common to the Hillarist.

[Umbram]

23. I'm disturbed by the amount of sexism I see lately, but also...

disturbed by the amount of false claims of sexism.

For example - the person running around claiming that ANYONE who points out that H.C. has high negatives is complicit in spreading sexism. That's just BS.

I also disagree that every time someone posts something sexist people should speak out against it. That is EXACTLY the kind of attention the children that post that sort of stuff WANT. Alert, get it removed, and move on. There are a lot of people here that THRIVE on attention. Don't give it to them.

[goodgd_yall]

27. Yes, there is that element

Those who just want a reaction---like troubled children.

[NMMNG]

28. Not the last one, but one of the more acceptable

Particularly since HRC is the last remaining candidate standing in the way of St. Obama.

What I've seen here lately is deplorable. To consider this a progressive forum, lately, is laughable.

[robbedvoter]

29. Not sure if it's the last, but boy, it sure florishing here..."wifey" PMS" unhinged"

the place looks like Wife beaters anonymous.
I especially loved this post:
she reminds every man of the wife he just divorced"

[Flabbergasted]

31. I agree.

[terrya]

32. Apparently, it is.

Not only did I see "hysterical wifey" I also saw "Hillary must really have PMS today" in the same fucking piece of shit thread.

I'm really sorry, Maddy. I'm sorry this shit is posted here. I do believe, however, that most of the Obama supporters here are just as disgusted with this sexist shit as well.

[ErnestoG]

34. Many of you are imagining sexism where it doesn't appear.

And thats the scariest thing of all.

[Skittles]

79. know what scares us more than that?

men telling us when to see sexism

[ErnestoG]

114. know what's even scarier?

When some women assume they know what all "men" think. That's called prejudice, by the way.

[Straight Shooter]

122. There is no assumption when it's obvious. n/t

[ErnestoG]

Obvious is in the eye of the beholder. Er, SORRY, I mean, behold-him.

[Straight Shooter]

171. Cute, Ernesto. Sometimes you almost redeem yourself. n/t

[Skittles]

191. emphasis on the word ALMOST

yup

[yardwork]

37. Don't forget gay folks. We get kicked around regularly here on DU.

Actually, seems like business as usual over the past thousand years or so. Women, queers, people of color - yeah, that's about right.

[Maddy McCall]

42. And I do my best to alert and post in those disgusting threads.

I appreciate y'all doing the right thing on this front.

:hug:

[yardwork]

Yeppers. The mods probably hate me. I alert all the time now.

Obama threads, Hillary threads, my little alert finger is just going going going.

Truly, it is amazing.

[Maddy McCall]

57. Same here.

[Skittles]

83. you are correct

when I see those "we need to drop 'gay causes' to appeal more to the 'center'" memes it makes me just f***ing CRINGE

[QC]

38. Homophobia is also fine 'n dandy,

particularly among the Hope 'n Unity Brigade.

[yardwork]

40. LOL! Hope and unity whether we like it or not.

[QC]

44. Well, it's really not so bad,

except for the hours and hours of forced chanting.

[yardwork]

49. And the constant requests that we "resist our sinful urges."

And being prayed over. It gets tedious.

[QC]

58. Yeah. And it made me really uncomfortable when Donnie McClurkin got in my sleeping bag.

He said he was praying my sins away, but something about it just didn't seem right.

[yardwork]

76. Gosh he never gets in my sleeping bag! Maybe that's because I'm a girl.

[QC]

140. Oh, well, you don't need to worry about him.

He doesn't seem to like girls much.

[NMMNG]

81. Don't forget how we should just "pass"

You know, so all our problems will go away. :eyes:

[Maddy McCall]

43. Not to me, it isn't.

I'm in there with you when I see it.

:hug:

[splat]

41. Like Lennon said, 'Woman is the nigger of the world.' Still.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

77. Not Much Has Changed In Nearly Forty Years

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6P91_H690z4

[goodgd_yall]

89. Thanks for that link

You don't hear that song very often. Too truthful.

[goodgd_yall]

88. Great song

I was going to post something along those lines one time, but then I thought---sheesh---but I didn't have the courage. I was imagining posters outraged that I dared compare sexism to racism.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

91. Hmmm

I have said several times that bigotry isn't like a buffet where you can choose which bigotry is ok and which bigotry isn't...

If Senator Obama's actions were attributed to his race a scintilla as much as Hillary's actions are attributed to her gender this site would be labeled a hate site...

[Rowdyboy]

51. I'm 100% undecided....my primary is March 11th....Sexism offends me as does racism....

Why are these people so stupid as to think they help their candidate by sliming the other? It doesn't work for me or much of anyone but still they do it.

[Maddy McCall]

59. I don't think they do it to influence voters.

I think they do it to get their tiny little goobies off.

(Oh, and hi, friend. :hug: )

[NJmaverick]

52. I have seen far more sexism from Hillary's people

They have urged women to vote for Hillary because of her gender. They also have suggested anyone that held her to the same standards as a man, are guilty of sexism. It's been a disgusting and cynical use of the gender card by the Hillary supporters.

[Maddy McCall]

61. You need to learn the definition of sexism.

[NJmaverick]

64. See if you are both honest and intelligent

You know that the definition does not discriminate

Sexism is commonly considered to be discrimination and/or hatred towards people based on their sex rather than their individual merits

So men and women can both be guilty.

[Two Americas]

184. incorrect

This is a common mistake.

A master beating a slave is not the moral equivalent of the slave retaliating or defending himself or herself.

People may not like me, but if they can't hurt me, I am not affected. It is people from one group's ability to hurt people from another group that is the issue, not who likes whom. It makes no sense whatsoever to talk about racism, sexism nor abuse of GLBT people and leave power out of the equation, which is what you are doing with your "reverse sexism" argument.

Again, I don't care if you like me, so long as you don't have the power to harm me.

The unequal sharing of power means that some people are subject to harm at the whim of others because of race, gender, class, or sexual orientation. If that were not true, no one would be talking about sexism, racism or violence against GLBT people.

[Two Americas]

192. damned hit and run bs

If you are going to toss inflammatory opinions around, have the guts to stay and defend your point of view when someone goes to the time and trouble to respond to you.

[From The Left]

53. Andrea Dworkin Is Dead

Bump

[DemocratSinceBirth]

85. Did Sexism Die With Her?

I guess racism died with George Wallace...

[KoKo]

56. You make a good point, Maddy...and many Female DU'ers have Left because there was so much

Bigotry against Females. Some got upset when "Bitch Slap" was common usage here on DU but when they complained they were told it was a word the GLBT Community used and so it was like when many of us were offended by David Shuster (who was in general a great reporter and asset to the Muck on MSNBC) got in trouble because he said Chelsea was "Pimping" for her Parents.

Many of us were supposed to believe that since Shuster defended the Wilson's that we should IGNORE his trashing of Chelsea Clinton...(implying that she was a "whore baby" because her Parents were Pimping her!) Shocking that there were so many here who said: "Get OVER IT!" Pimping is in "common usage" and WHO would ever THINK of being OFFENDED...by a Daughter of a President being said to be "Pimping for her Parents." As a Parent ...I gotta tell you that me and many other DU'ers were offended by that statement...because we have Daughters and Sons...and we don't want them growing up with that CRAP...just so David Shuster has a BIG PROMOTION or DEMOTION on MSNBC/GE!

Then there's that Fiasco of Faux News, MSNBC and CNBC where Females are presented as "chirpy cutesies who differ to the Male Pudit/Anchors. They are very careful to use "Politically Correct Mix of Immigrants vs. Corporate Insiders" in their females who all look like Barbi Dolls...no matter WHAT their background is. "They all graduated from Yale or Harvard though!... These are Gals who have good credentials from top notch colleges" but...they "play some sexist game?"

Anyway...the manipulation of African Americans...Females and other's in our society GOES ON. If you can be a "Colin Powell or Condi Rice or in the forefrunt for any American who didn't come here in the first two Centuries.....and if you are "Repug Leaning" you will FIND A GREAT JOB...If you are WELL CONNECTED...no matter WHO ARE WHAT YOUR ARE...and if "you can be USED" by one political party or the other...you will ALWAYS BECOME PART OF EITHER a BUSH/CLINTON/CARTER/FORD/NIXON/REAGAN White House Cabinet.

Until WE ALL GET TOGETHER ...they WILL USE US/SPLIT US APART...using RACE/GENDER/SEX...or whatever else they can do to DISTRACT US!

But...what I see from our Democrats on this Board who exhault in trashing Females...is offensive...and I'm not anywhere as sensitive as many DU Females who have left this Board because they saw "ahead of me" how bad it was going.... I decided it was worth it to stay here and deal with some of it they couldn't stand...hoping it would get better. BUT...it got WORSE...and then I've spoken up...about it...We need to keep at it...I hope those of us still here will do this...

[NC_Nurse]

60. No, it's not. I am not happy with the sexist crap on here.

I don't like Hillary's tactics lately, but I don't see any reason to use sexist language or stereotypes to
refute them. There's a lot of bullshit posted on this forum, from BOTH sides and I don't like it.
As a result, my ignore list keeps growing and I have many hidden threads. I can't wait for this primary to be over.

[Maddy McCall]

62. Thank you.

[Forkboy]

65. It is sad on all fronts. Both sides have thrown each other under the bus.

And don't even try being gay this time around.

Sometimes I'm real glad to be a straight white male...

[Forkboy]

63. Well, fat jokes still seem ok.

But to the point of your OP, it's been sad on all fronts here. I've seen two blatantly sexist posts and two blatantly racist threads today. And some wonder why I don't like being part of any group....

[SheWhoMustBeObeyed]

101. We fatties will welcome you into our group if you bring pie

Just bring enough for everyone.

http://www.savin-hill.co.uk.nyud.net:8090/images/Pies.jpg

Note to self: do not search for pie images with Safe Search off. :scared:

[Forkboy]

104. LMAO...safe search is your friend.

My friend makes music under the name Massive Inch...imagine THAT Google search! :)

[SheWhoMustBeObeyed]

121. LOL! I just tried it

Wheeeee!

To be honest, there is virtually no term I have searched for that doesn't turn up some, um, surprise.

:hi:

[Forkboy]

137. Damn intertubes...can't take it anywhere.

:D

[Maddy McCall]

141. LOL! I made that mistake once.

:rofl:

[SheWhoMustBeObeyed]

158. Hey you!

:hi:

:hug:

I wanted to kick your thread and Forkboy gave me an opening. I always look at his posts when I skim subject lines, he always has some smartass thing to say. :D

I came into GDP this afternoon, read through the thread titles and cleared right back out again. Even here so many of the responses are so knee-jerk and predictable.

I am not ashamed to be a straight-ticket Dem voter. I firmly believe winning back the WH is what matters most, and I am not bothered one bit by tongue-tskers who think one or the other candidate betrays progressive principles.

That's why I will vote for Obama if he is the candidate. That's why I avoid reading what his supporters say, because a lot of it is fucking appalling. I don't say comparable things about their candidate, and I suggest they do likewise and avoid those Clinton supporters who do.

I do what I can to protect my vote, because once we're in the G.E. and all those GOP voters who infiltrated our primaries to vote against Clinton turn their backs on our candidate, he or she is going to need the support of every real small or big D democrat to pull off a victory.

I would never have thought even six months ago that Dems would be in a tough race, but I see now it will be killer every step of the way.

[Maddy McCall]

160. Beautifully said.

I'll be right there voting D with you. :D

[Neshanic]

66. Yes apparently.

[Shine]

68. I'm just popping in to this forum for the first time today, so I guess I've missed out on the drama

but interestingly, my 14 yr old son said the other day that he thinks this country is less racist than it is sexist. Needlesstosay, I was a bit surprised by his accurate assessment.

Hmm....

[Maddy McCall]

70. You have a wise son.

My son is the same age. We've raised them well. :hug:

[ErnestoG]

71. Mostly manufactured. Alot of Hillary's supporters are seeing phantoms.

There have been threads here that EXPLICITLY renounce sexism and make a point of not making such implications or using that terminology, yet the Hillary group insists on seeing it there anyway.

With some folks, you just cannot win.

[Name removed]

73. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Skittles]

75. it's very widespread

very disconcerting to see it on DU but not really surprising

[LadyVT]

78. Thank you for this post.

[BooScout]

82. Sadly it seems it is....

I have been asked here if I have taken my midol, if I am PMSing, etc. The sexism isn't just directed at Hillary, it's being directed at female posters and with increasing frequency. Quite frankly, I have had about all I am going to put up with.

[Maddy McCall]

86. You are soooo right...and I appreciate your thread on the topic.

Had I seen yours first, I wouldn't have posted this one.

:yourock: :hug:

[BooScout]

90. The more it's publicised the better.

I think the more threads calling people out on it the better. It's time to stop the hate.

[Bongo Prophet]

92. There is too much BS to swat tonight, Maddy. Lord of the flies.

Besides the "Parlocking" and Freeps, there are swarms of who the hell knows what?
College kids? Parody kids in basements? I honestly don't know.
Sexist, racist, just plain crude anti-human behavior. Pathological.

I have never met a supporter of ANY candidate in 30+ years of this that compares, and I don't attach either of our candidates to them. Indeed, I can't attribute even basic human decency to much of them.

no solutions from me, I can only say that sometimes we primates are less than noble.
Alerting and swatting till my wrists are sore, then outa here for a spell.

when it gets this bad, i just have let it go, dodge the blows, and resort to verse.
just when we are on the verge of the end of Bush demiurge, somehow it all gets worse.

:hug:

[Maddy McCall]

94. Hey, you! "Parlocking!" HAHAHAHA!

What a night we had. That was some fun. :hug:

I agree with your whole post. The element that's entered the political field this time is nothing like I've ever seen before.

[Bongo Prophet]

157. You might have missed my long reply to another of your posts a few days back.

I know it is hard to see replies when there are so many, but i did do a lot of searching of themes and phrases, matching the links to FR, H=44 and others. This just to try to figure out where the hell some of this crazy shit is coming from. It is my firm opinion that, to a very large degree, we are being played, with "supporters" pretending to be on both sides (like poppa parlock, the son who ripped the sign, the daughter who cries) - all this in order to break us down and split us by race, gender, etc. It sounds paranoid to some, but you and i know it happens for real.

This is why i so often stress the importance of not using the broad brush against "evil hillbots and obamabots" - that just plays right into their hands.

I thought of making a parable of goldilocks and the three parlocks, but was too sleepy. ;)

Anyway, buck up, friend. I think that we can prevail this time.
We have to, with Barack or Hillary - and then do as much as we can after that to reclaim our human rights.
Just getting back what we lost in the coup of 2000 and since will take longer than either of us will live, so it is a long road back.
i am glad to be on your side in this fight.

[Buzz Clik]

93. Oh, shit! Another fucking pity party. How many victims can one board have?

[Maddy McCall]

97. Probably sixty percent of DU's population.

Thanks for giving sexist threads like "Hillary is PMSing and needs Midol" your stamp of approval.

See ya!

[Buzz Clik]

100. I didn't read it. Try hitting "alert" instead of taking your pissing and moaning on the road.

You know that transferring your fight into a new thread is explicitly against DU rules.

Thanks in advance for following the regulations of the board!

See ya.

[Maddy McCall]

106. I've broken no rules, but thank you so much for your concern.

[Buzz Clik]

113. I frankly don't give a shit about DU rules, any more than I care about your shrill hypersensitivity.

But don't bother responding -- it's hard to type with your thumb in your mouth.

[Maddy McCall]

118. Well, that made a lot of sense.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

108. I Don't See Any Pissing And Moaning...

I am sorry you lack the empathy to discern pissing and moaning from legitimate grievances...


Racism has been eradicated...Sexism has been eradicated...Homophobia has been eradicated...Move along...Nothing to see here...

[Buzz Clik]

111. She claims that 65% of the members of DU are victims of sexism, and that's not pissing and moaning?

Sorry, but I've had a bellyful of the pretend victims and faux outrage on this board.

Sometimes, you just have to act like an adult.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

124. Being A Member Of A Minority The Figure Seems Low To Me

~

[Buzz Clik]

129. Let's call it 99.999%. I'm the only non-victim here.

Happy now?

Let the sobbing begin -- in unison.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

133. If You Were The Victim Of Bigotry You Wouldn't Think It Was Funny

I wasn't particularly amused when I was called Jew Boy, Jew Bastard, or told that "Mary said to Moses that the Jews should have their noses"...

[Buzz Clik]

144. You have absolutely no clue who you're talking to. None.

If you wish to proclaim yourself a lifelong victim who, for some unknown reason, has decided to side with this ridiculous rant on this thread, go for it. However, no one is attacking you in any way, any more than the author of this silly thread was attacked prior to her decision to start this shit fest.

I have no issues with you other than your questionable choice to cast your lot with her.

[Maddy McCall]

147. So you don't like me. Don't post in my thread. Your hatred of me is toxic.

Better to place me on ignore if I have that kind of effect on you.

[Buzz Clik]

159. Hate you? I don't even know you. I doubt I've ever read a post of yours before.

What I hate is your self pity. Get over it.

I save ignore for very special people. You have potential, but you'll have to try a lot harder.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

151. I'm Not Casting My Lot With Anybody

I'm just standing by the simple proposition that if you attribute a person's good or bad deeds to their race, gender, religion, sexual orientation, et cetera you have robbed that person of their individuality or their humanity...

[terrya]

174. Maddy McCall asked a legitimate question.

She rightfully questioned whether sexism has any place here...particularly in relation to discussing Hillary Clinton.

Just tonight...just tonight alone...that question needs to be asked.

I'm sorry. I have this problem about using sexist language...or racist language or homophobic language. See, I think it's wrong. And I sure wouldn't label it as "pissing and moaning". I wouldn't lessen anyone's outrage by being so insulting and childish as you are right now.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

102. I'll Bet You Thought Slavery, Jim Crowe, The Trail Of Tears, And The Holocaust Was A Pisser

~

[Buzz Clik]

112. Way to kick it up a notch. I just love hyperbole.

So, I think that her comment is overreacting, and suddenly I'm also a racist and favor slavery.

That is so special.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

116. Bigotry Isn't Like The Buffet At Golden Corral

You don't get to choose which form of bigotry you think is o k and which isn't...

Bigotry should be called out whenever it raises its ugly head...

If Senator Obama's actions were revealed in racial terms here a fraction as much as Hillary Clinton's actions are revealed in sexist terms the Southern Poverty Law Center would deem Democratic Underground a hate site...

[Buzz Clik]

131. One size fits all -- hate one, hate everybody. (I'm talking about you, not me)

You've got serious issues, pal. Get help.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

136. I'm Disarmed By Your Clever Repartee

I must have issues...Because I'm arguing on the internet with a idiot...


And I'm not your fucking pal...

[Buzz Clik]

138. You're disarmed by your lack of "arms".

I'm assuming that's your so-called minority group.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

143. You Should Stay Away From Engaging People In A Battle Of Wits Because You Suck At It

You should find a hobby you excel at like finger painting...

[Buzz Clik]

146. You call me a "fucking idiot" and then proclaim superior debating skills?

I suppose you'll be engraving the trophy yourself.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

150. If The Shoe Fits Wear It

This little mana a mano began when you casually dismissed bigotry... You were called on it...Now you're backtracking, your obscurantist tactics notwithstanding...

[NMMNG]

177. You do if you're Senator Obama

:shrug:

[QC]

145. Oh, shit! Another name for the twitfilter. n/t

[Maddy McCall]

155. Might want to add this one, too.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=4733417&mesg_id=4735091

[QC]

173. Looks like it got removed. n/t

[Hieronymus]

95. It seems to me that if one doesn't want Hillary, one is automatically ......

labeled sexist. Does that make you a racist if you vote for Hillary over Obama?

[Maddy McCall]

99. I've constantly retorted against racist shit against Obama.

If you'd look around before you put in your 2 cents, you'd see that.

[yourguide]

103. oh and republican,

you forgot to mention if you are against HRC you are also a republican. Seen that 3 times today alone.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

110. Don't Light A Match Next To Your Straw Man...You Will Immolate The Both Of Ya

~

[Beacool]

105. Let's put it this way, if attacks at DU on Obama were based on his race,

most people on the board would be rightfully outraged. DU is no different from society at large, sexism, along with ageism and fat phobia, are the last remaining acceptable forms of discrimination in this country.

I have come to the conclusion that Sharon Stone was correct when she warned that Hillary would have an uphill battle because she was still seen as a sexual being. I guess that if she were older and looked like Helen Thomas (with all due respect to Ms. Thomas), she would have fared better.

When has anything been said about Obama by the media that were the equivalent of the sexist comments made about Hillary? The endless babble about her voice (shrill), laughter (cackle), cleavage, age, weight, clothes, etc. etc. etc.

Oh, let us also not forget about Carlson saying that he worried about his manhood whenever she appears on his screen while admitting to Elle magazine that she was his "guilty fantasy", Shuster's "pimping" comment, Tweety's asinine remarks about how she got to the senate and plenty others.

Until we as a society fully decry sexism and proclaim that NO woman should be debased on the basis of her gender, we will remain a backward society. Leader of the Free World or not!!!!!!!!!!!

[Maddy McCall]

109. Best post in this thread...better than my OP.

Thank you so much for taking the time to write this. :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

[Beacool]

123. Wow, that was a quick response. LOL!!!!!!!

No need to thank me! One of the things that has gotten me outraged, disgusted and sick at heart in this election season is the way that Hillary has been treated across the board by all sides of the political spectrum and the media.

I'm not referring to policy differences, which would be entirely fair. I'm talking about the incessant drumming of sexist comments that, if they had been racist, would have rightfully been decried and not tolerated. I guess that too many people forget that they have mothers, wives, sisters and daughters. I would hope that they wouldn't want them to be treated in the same crass manner as they have treated Hillary.

What's even more disappointing is to see that some of these remarks come from women. Don't these women realize that by degrading another woman in sexist terms they ultimately degrade themselves???????

[ErnestoG]

115. They HAVEN'T been? LOL

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=4733087&mesg_id=4733087

Reading. It's not just for breakfast anymore.

[Beacool]

128. No need for the sarcasm, very few posts have been about Obama

in a racist manner. While there have been dozens that had nothing to do with Hillary's position on the issues and plenty to do with sexism. Besides, one wrong does not justify another.

[ErnestoG]

169. So you admit there have been racist threads. That's a start.

[557188]

148. Wonderful post

agree 100%

[loveangelc]

117. I'm sick of everyone screaming SEXISM everytime something is said about Hillary.

Is Hillary unable to move beyond the old and absolutely tired "scorned woman" stereotype?

[Maddy McCall]

120. That's just because you aren't paying attention.

You've got your head buried so deep in your Obama worship that you don't have an objective eye.

Many objective Obama supporters see it. They don't like it. The respond to it. Those are the ones I admire.

[loveangelc]

126. Whatever. Maybe you're too deep in your Hillary devotion that you see any little attack

on Hillary as MISOGYNIST and SEXIST, which is not always the case. Maybe some describe as shrill because SHE IS SHRILL. maybe some call her a bitch because she seems to act catty and bitchy at times.

[Maddy McCall]

130. Nice try to make it partisan. It's not. It's about decency and progressivism.

I've stood against misogyny and sexism for decades.

You've got a lot to learn, grasshopper.

[loveangelc]

142. I commend you for standing up against misogyny and sexism for decades.

Obviously the work that you've done has made things better for me and my generation. But I think a lot of the time, the people who have worked hard to end sexism are the ones that sometimes perpetuate the problem by making a bigger deal than need be by making virtually EVERYTHING an issue of gender. I could care less about Hillary's gender. Honestly, I'm disturbed by the older women who have honorably worked for years for women to be equal who are now supporting Hillary based solely on the fact that she's a woman and would be the first woman president.

[Buzz Clik]

132. NO SHIT!!!

:toast:

[Maddy McCall]

135. I'm sure she's glad to have you on her side.

:rofl:

[DemocratSinceBirth]

154. That's A Red Herring

Nobody is saying all criticism of HRC is gender based but there has been much criticism of her on this board that is laden with sexist overtones...

[Name removed]

125. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

127. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Thepricebreaker]

162. self delete

[RuleOfNah]

134. No.

Skimming the replies, I'd say hatred of the left is the most tolerated form of non-Republican bigotry on DU (it wasn't mentioned at all, that I could see, while complaints about sexism were, while both exist). It comes up all the time (often accompanied by FUCK YOUs), especially the Nader haters. Then there are the hippie haters. And the principled people haters. You know, the hated people that are the wellspring for progressive ideas and ideals. The DU line seems to be drawn at unionists, unions get respect on DU.

As for myself, I ridicule the Republicans with their homophobia (McSweaterVest, Craig, Gannon, the Congressmen, the religious figures, the RNC, etc). I'm highlighting their hypocrisy, not making a value judgment on their gender preferences, though I understand that others might see it differently. No one has complained to me (that I can recall), so anyone that was offended probably hit ignore.

I ridicule Republican border policy. Not because of race, because the Republican border policy is 1. insane 2. bad relations 3. bad economics 4. insane. A wall with a hole big enough to drive a truck through, a lot of trucks. Republicans are trying to pander to corporations that profit from labor exploitation and trying to pander to racists, while screwing both (and at least two countries). Why not wedgie Republicans with it?

I don't read most of the Clinton/Obama threads. It takes specific references in the title, like PNAC, to get a click from me (freepers are rarely so dangerously pertinent). So I am not as raw from the sexism/racism as others. I don't doubt it exists but I'm not going to start reading those threads just to try and correct behaviors. I will outsource it!

If anyone comes across misogyny, sexism, racism, homophobia, ageism, religiousism (including anti-Semitism), etc and it is so outrageous that you must respond: please give 'em a FUCK YOU for me too. Thanks.

[Medusa]

139. My not liking Hillary has nothing to do with her being female

And if I call her on her triangulation, her flat-out lies and her distortions, they are not sexist remarks nor do they make me a sexist but nice try even if the logic is utterly flawed, just like HRC's.

[ErnestoG]

156. That's an amazingly difficult concept for many here to grasp.

[BooScout]

161. have you even read some of the posts here today?

You can dislike Hillary for all the reasons you listed fair enough. But don't pretend the offensive words are not out here being used and used often.

[Thepricebreaker]

149. IF YOU DONT SUPPORT HILLARY YOU ARE SEXIST!

.... in a nut shell ....

.... btw GOBAMA 2008 ....

[Bluebear]

164. Yeah, Gobama, whatever.

DU used to be more than a graffiti board, which you would not know about, only having recently arrived.

[MethuenProgressive]

152. Absolutely. You can't even get a sexist DU post deleted around here.

I hate what the DUbamas have done to DU.

[Maddy McCall]

153. Look at this...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=4733417&mesg_id=4735091


This little troll is running all over DU spraying his shit. Alerts must be slow going through tonight.

[Thepricebreaker]

163. Thats my post.. and im try to say that criticism of a woman is not sexist.....

Nor should it be looked at that way, simply because the person happens to have a pair of breasts.

[Maddy McCall]

165. Go away, child.

No matter what timezone you're in, it's probably your bedtime.

[BooScout]

166. It's past it's bedtime.

:eyes:

[Thepricebreaker]

167. Wow you really inspire me... Obama really needs to win.. n/t

[Name removed]

172. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[MethuenProgressive]

185. "125. Deleted message Message removed by moderator" - Yay!

Looks like the troll's bridge fell on him.

[BooScout]

190. Oh.......I can say I told him so now

:evilgrin:

[Behind the Aegis]

176. not just sexism.

Seems, to me, there are many here with a variety of bigotry issues to overcome. Being Jewish and gay, those tend to be the two I see more bigotry directed toward; though, I have seen an alarming amount of anti-female, racist, and lookist posts. And, believe it or not, Christianity gets slammed around pretty hard, surpassing criticism. What I have seen has been more blatant than in the past. It used to be much more nuanced and that made it really difficult because some people are such dualists, that if it isn't "blatant" then it isn't bigoted.

Just remember who made comments and who defended the comments, as well as those who spoke out against the bigotry. I have also found some of the biggest bigots in one area, generally have issues in others as well!

[Fox Mulder]

178. I agree.

I hate this sexist shit that's posted and not deleted. I don't know why many people get away with it.

Edited to add that I'm an Obama supporter and I'd never use sexist words to describe Hillary.

[Maddy McCall]

179. So I guess the answer is "Yes."

[Manifestor_of_Light]

180. There are several acceptable forms of bigotry.

Sexism is major; racism is major. There are others that are not acknowledged: Prejudice against fat people; prejudice against short people; prejudice against intelligent people (especially when not white and male); prejudice against people who wear glasses; prejudice against non-Christians and non-believers in any religion.

[better tomorrow]

181. No, I think obesity is the last great bigotry.....

[krabigirl]

182. sexism, homophobia, and hatred towards non-religious people, yes.

[leftofthedial]

183. especially when it's directed against males

and most especially white males

and if they're straight? fuggeddaboutit

*that* kind of bigotry is not only accepted here, it's encouraged.

anyone who legitimately engages in sexism is a pig. I've seen some pretty outrageous things today. But by and large over the past months, I've seen non-sexist criticisms repeatedly labeled falsely as sexism.

[RandomKoolzip]

188. Here:

The Male Privilege Checklist

My odds of being hired for a job, when competing against female applicants, are probably skewed in my favor. The more prestigious the job, the larger the odds are skewed.
I can be confident that my co-workers won't think I got my job because of my sex - even though that might be true.
If I am never promoted, it's not because of my sex.
If I fail in my job or career, I can feel sure this won't be seen as a black mark against my entire sex's capabilities.
The odds of my encountering sexual harassment on the job are so low as to be negligible.
If I do the same task as a woman, and if the measurement is at all subjective, chances are people will think I did a better job.
If I'm a teen or adult, and if I can stay out of prison, my odds of being raped are so low as to be negligible.
I am not taught to fear walking alone after dark in average public spaces.
If I choose not to have children, my masculinity will not be called into question.
If I have children but do not provide primary care for them, my masculinity will not be called into question.
If I have children and provide primary care for them, I'll be praised for extraordinary parenting if I'm even marginally competent.
If I have children and pursue a career, no one will think I'm selfish for not staying at home.
If I seek political office, my relationship with my children, or who I hire to take care of them, will probably not be scrutinized by the press.
Chances are my elected representatives are mostly people of my own sex. The more prestigious and powerful the elected position, the more likely this is to be true.
I can be somewhat sure that if I ask to see "the person in charge," I will face a person of my own sex. The higher-up in the organization the person is, the surer I can be.
As a child, chances are I was encouraged to be more active and outgoing than my sisters.
As a child, I could choose from an almost infinite variety of children's media featuring positive, active, non-stereotyped heroes of my own sex. I never had to look for it; male heroes were the default.
As a child, chances are I got more teacher attention than girls who raised their hands just as often.
If my day, week or year is going badly, I need not ask of each negative episode or situation whether or not it has sexist overtones.
I can turn on the television or glance at the front page of the newspaper and see people of my own sex widely represented, every day, without exception.
If I'm careless with my financial affairs it won't be attributed to my sex.
If I'm careless with my driving it won't be attributed to my sex.
I can speak in public to a large group without putting my sex on trial.
If I have sex with a lot of people, it won't make me an object of contempt or derision.
There are value-neutral clothing choices available to me; it is possible for me to choose clothing that doesn't send any particular message to the world.
My wardrobe and grooming are relatively cheap and consume little time.
If I buy a new car, chances are I'll be offered a better price than a woman buying the same car.
If I'm not conventionally attractive, the disadvantages are relatively small and easy to ignore.
I can be loud with no fear of being called a shrew. I can be aggressive with no fear of being called a bitch.
I can ask for legal protection from violence that happens mostly to men without being seen as a selfish special interest, since that kind of violence is called "crime" and is a general social concern. (Violence that happens mostly to women is usually called "domestic violence" or "acquaintance rape," and is seen as a special interest issue.)
I can be confident that the ordinary language of day-to-day existence will always include my sex. "All men are created equal…," mailman, chairman, freshman, he.
My ability to make important decisions and my capability in general will never be questioned depending on what time of the month it is.
I will never be expected to change my name upon marriage or questioned if i don't change my name.
The decision to hire me will never be based on assumptions about whether or not I might choose to have a family sometime soon.
Every major religion in the world is led primarily by people of my own sex. Even God, in most major religions, is usually pictured as being male.
Most major religions argue that I should be the head of my household, while my wife and children should be subservient to me.
If I have a wife or girlfriend, chances are we'll divide up household chores so that she does most of the labor, and in particular the most repetitive and unrewarding tasks.
If I have children with a wife or girlfriend, chances are she'll do most of the childrearing, and in particular the most dirty, repetitive and unrewarding parts of childrearing.
If I have children with a wife or girlfriend, and it turns out that one of us needs to make career sacrifices to raise the kids, chances are we'll both assume the career sacrificed should be hers.
Magazines, billboards, television, movies, pornography, and virtually all of media is filled with images of scantily-clad women intended to appeal to me sexually. Such images of men exist, but are much rarer.
I am not expected to spend my entire life 20-40 pounds underweight.
If I am heterosexual, it's incredibly unlikely that I'll ever be beaten up by a spouse or lover.
I have the privilege of being unaware of my male privilege.


Against all that, women calling men out about their sexism does not compare in terms of offense or damage. Even if they happen to go "over the line" and insult a man, the insult carries virtually no power, unlike the cumulative damage (thousands, millions, of little slights, mostly unconscious) done to women in the name of male privilege since day one. ALL people, men and women, need to be aware of the ways their language and their actions affect others.

It wouldn't hurt the males on DU to start LISTENING to the females when the females have an opinion - even if that opinion may be couched in overtly offensive language.

[leftofthedial]

194. the OP was about DU, not the "real" world.

plus, that list is pure bigotry.

[cd3dem]

187. On Dan Abrams, they examined Obama's sexist language

* the two men said it was not sexist statements

* the two women said it was "blatant" sexist statements (even the woman who always defends Obama)

men just do not get it!!! or they do not care!!!

[Binka]

189. Oh They Care & They Get It....That Is Why They Ignore It

It is a natural affront to their hold on power. They must ignore it at all costs because acknowledging it would demand action. They aren't gonna give up the gravy train without a fight. Good thread Maddy!

[LadyVT]

193. Sexism is the new racism, but it's been around as long.