Is the Hillary team manipulating women?

[CaptJasHook]

Notice a pattern? A big primary day coming up and suddenly the charges of sexism by the Hillary camp start punctuating the GDP.

Included in the threads are testimonials by so-called feminists who threaten to:

A) Switch their vote from Obama to Hillary just because of the so-called sexism of a few #$%holes. (That would be the join my bandwagon ploy)
B) Sit out the election and just let McCain win. (The passive-aggressive attempt to make you scared)
C) You know nothing about me and can't understand my pain because you are too young or from Kansas or have never suffered like I have suffered or my sister/cousin/best friend/mother suffered and... most importantly... you are male. (arguments that cannot be actually addressed because to do so would indicate that you are a boor or a Republican in disguise or a misogynist, etc, etc...)


I wonder if the belief is that somehow these illogical arguments will somehow sway a few more women or men to become so outraged at the supposedly widespread sexism that they will somehow magically ignore Senator Clinton's faults as a candidate. Somehow, their emotional appeal will result in a vote for Hillary out of pity/solidarity/empathy.

And, again, why does this discussion come up when the Senator is in trouble? When there is a vote coming up? Do feminists really believe that this is the way to get us to take a candidate seriously?

[Metric System]

1. Yes, the Hillary posters here are paid shills, even though we are far outnumbered by Obama

supporters.

[CaptJasHook]

5. I didn't accuse you of being a shill

I don't think some of these people need to be paid. I think they enjoy it.

Thanks for addressing my points.

[UALRBSofL]

33. OP I don't think Hillary is manipulating women any more

then Obama is manipulating blacks. I think the statements Obama has made over the election cycle that has come across as sexist has caused some women not to vote for him. As I think some blacks vote for Obama based on the fact they see Hillary and Bill as racists. That said, I don't think the Clinton's are racists or Obama is sexist.

[NMMNG]

2. .

[JeffR]

3. No, I don't think so.

But thanks for raising this amazingly pertinent question.

[jackson_dem]

4. There isn't a primary coming for another 10 days

If this was the case why would the effort begin so far in advance of March 4? Second, what does GD P have to do with the Hillary campaign's strategy--unless, as it seems you are implying--a bunch of Hillary staffers post here?

The answer to your larger question is yes, Hillary has played the gender card but Obama has played the race card. The one major candidate who didn't play the race or gender card got booted out before Super Tuesday with a tie among folks of his race and gender while his rivals had big margins among their gender and race respectively. There is a sad political lesson there. :(

[CaptJasHook]

8. She is campaigning in TX and OH

But I noticed this same thing happened after Iowa on DU. Hillary had a personable moment and the next thing all hell broke loose around here.

I also supported that major candidate of whom you speak. I have spent most of my time watching the back and forth, looking for patterns.

[melody]

6. It doesn't matter if they are -- it won't work

I think impassioned statements are fine ... we all have the right to speak from the heart. I do it all the time. One can
speak from the heart about one's own experience and still respect the right of another to disagree.

There are things you only know about being female if you're female (or male if you're male) but they aren't the important
things or the things most people consider important. I'm a feminist and I'm still voting for and supporting Obama. I part
company with many feminists in a lot of areas -- that's to be expected. As much as I'd love to see
a female President in my lifetime, I won't vote for any female President. I won't vote for someone based on their gender.
The female President I vote for will have to be the one I feel is best to run the country. I'm a human being first.

[CaptJasHook]

10. I'm unsure what a feminist is anymore

I thought it was doing what you could to overcome the disparities between men and women. But I don't see that in these conversations. I only see people trying to get others to listen to their story, to feel their pain. There doesn't seem to be much room for discussion of issues and what will move things forward.

Just a lot of whining as I see it.

[melody]

15. lol - you're caught in the old wanting to discuss versus wanting to fix conundrum

Men tend to want to fix things through immediate actions ... one of the ways women tend to process situations in order to fix them is to express ideas and discuss concerns. It's a neurological difference. I don't see that discussion as "whining" at all -- it isn't from my perspective, it's processing ideas and feelings.

[CaptJasHook]

19. Ah f#$% you're right.

I falling for that one again.

Now if I can only use my "fix-it" hammer to go bash my skull in.

Okay, say that you are right (which you are, but I'm playing coy). How the hell are we going to get over this?

[melody]

30. By mutual understanding. It's all we really have.

You can understand that processing things through discussion is how we "fix" things, and you can continue
to point out (as other people do, male and female) that talking is fine, but we need action, too. Beyond that,
we're all caught up in the same pit of ideation and conception. We only find our way out one step at a time.

[flyarm]

7. wow you have a very shallow idea of women and our self fulfilling abilities, to think for our

selves..and to make decisions all by ourselves..wow that is a novel accomplishment for we of the female genre ..in your world..

clue bubba..i think for myself..i do what is right for myself..i do not need a man or anyone to help me make my own decisions..or what pleases me or not..i know how to make myself happy and i can think independently..

i have traveled the world on my own...and rather enjoy it...on my own...but have shared it with friends and spouse and children as well...i have raised children..and educated them..to be independent, and self sufficient..and to have a high self worth...and to value integrity.

maybe it is you that is easily manipulated and you are projecting.

fly

[CaptJasHook]

13. Could be.

That is a human trait. I find it interesting that you accuse me of trying to tell you what to think. You are specifically one of the people that I am refering to in the above point.

You accuse young women today of not understanding the suffering you went through aboard your aircraft. Yet instead of feeling a sense of accomplishment of what the feminist movement has accomplished... Instead of feeling pride that young women today take some things for granted, you demean them and hope that they will have to suffer what you suffered.

That isn't cool.

[flyarm]

26. quite the contrary ..i am upset that they don't enjoy what they have and

appreciate what they have today..and are so willing to give it all way..without a moments thought..or care.

Perhaps because it has come so easy to them , or they have no idea what it would be like without all that has been fought for, to give them the freedoms they enjoy today.

The accomplishments they can achieve will know no bounds..but only if they work hard enough to keep the gift they have been blessed with.

I do not say this easily..i have worked in a tube in the air with many Young'uns ..and it is not often a pleasant experience, for many reasons..but mostly lack of respect, in more ways than i choose to go into.

I love young people ..i raised one and always had a house full of them..and took so many into my home that were young flight crew, with no where to go....but found a home in my home at all times.

but the arrogance and disrespect i see from the young here supporting Obama and the ones i saw on the ground in Iowa and South Carolina..defies any thing i have seen before.

oh and i housed the Kerry Field rep a young man for three counties in my state for 7 months in 2004..and several of the staff Kerry sent to my area ..also found a bed in my home and i spent over $200.00 a day feeding the young staff in 2004 for over a month.. when we ran the largest campaign headquarters on my side of a very large state.

I worked daily with those kids..and they were like my own kids..and they still call me ..ma..

fly

[CaptJasHook]

28. Then don't give up on them

I know you won't, anyway. Maybe you are just frustrated.

This is a good generation. They are flip and a little too entitled for my taste. But, hey, it was people like you who fought so hard to get them here. Maybe it is going to be two steps forward, one step back. But at least we are going forward. This generation takes for granted that they have a voice in things (even if it sounds immature sometimes), they take for granted the freedom to defy convention, they take for granted many of the rights that were hard fought.

I often think that, in a real crappy way, Bushco. has done wonders to this country. He has finally shown how fragile our freedoms are and how we need to stop taking things for granted.

This is the hole where we need the progressive leaders of the 50s and 60s to step in and bring their skills.

[Hoof Hearted]

9. we have tiny little brains like jellyfish and need men and their followers to tell us what to do.

[CaptJasHook]

11. Typical knee jerk response

Read again. I understand that you may feel insulted. But it isn't me who is insulting you, it is Hillary.

And for the record, I don't tell grown ups what to do or what to think.

[Hoof Hearted]

14. No. It's just you.

So far.

[CaptJasHook]

23. What is that supposed to mean?

[Hoof Hearted]

24. It should be self-explanatory

to grown-ups.

[CaptJasHook]

25. Eww, I love it when you call me a child

Why don't you assume I am a Neandrathalic male (which you already do) and explain it reeeeeeaaaal sloooooow. Maybe you can make drawings in the dirt.

[emilyg]

12. I love being manipulated

a little lower on the right, please.

[CaptJasHook]

16. You mean the left I hope

[emilyg]

18. Hey - it's my body

[CaptJasHook]

22. Quiet, my wife is sleeping in the other room

[cali]

17. Yikes. You don't understand anything about feminism

and no, the Hillary campaign is trying to manipulate potential VOTERS. And so is the Obama campaign. It's just that her campaign in doing it ineffectively.

[CaptJasHook]

21. Not true Cali

Though I don't know enough about feminism (it seems there is one opinion about it for person who cares to talk about it). I have studied feminist theory back in the day and have tried to be sensitive, adjust my life accordingly, and take time before every vote to try and put that lens on.

But you are right, I would never teach a college level course on it, and I would certainly hit the books again before I taught in a high school.

[loveangelc]

20. Mostly only older feminists feel that way imo.

[Obamaman2008]

27. That word is so sexist!

You used the word manipulating. That words comes from the ancient Niampei men of the eight tribe of Zubribua. And it means to make someone less than a man. It is very uncalled for. I am so insulted. :sarcasm:

[Robert Oak]

29. You making misogyny aok?

I'll tell ya, the misogyny being blasted at Hillary on here is positively disgusting.

You boys need to go back to your mamas and ask for forgiveness.

this post is absurd they are blasting sexism because it is sexist and have been when she was the frontrunner.

[From The Left]

31. The Sisterhood is Powerful Meme is Sooooo Tired

You'd think we had come further.

[JTFrog]

32. No. Her campaign tried and failed at everything except making her appear to be batshit crazy. n/t

[DemocratSinceBirth]

34. Sometimes A Cigar Is Just A Cigar

~