If Hillary wins OH/TX/PA, when does this END???

[angie_love]

Seriously, when the fuck does this end? I'm really tired of this and this party is in deep need of unity. So when does it end? Does it end at the convention? If it ends there then we'll have a President McCain. The party will be too divided. Hillary will still not have enough delegates to overcome Obama w/ wins in OH/TX/PA so it would be up to the superdelegates and they have implied that they will follow the will of the voters. I just can't see anything but very serious damage to our party the longer this continues. This is a fucking giant mess!! I don't even fucking care anymore, just give me a damn nominee whoever it is!! The longer this chaos goes on the better the repugs have us where they want us.

[Tarc]

1. When the empty suit drops out?

[DJ13]

2. When the empty pantsuit drops out

[Window]

57. LMAO!

:thumbsup:

[Name removed]

3. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[hulklogan]

7. A beautiful example of the politics of "hope"

Thank you.

[angie_love]

17. sorry, some of these ppl are getting on my last nerve. I've never said that before.

I'm going to edit my post.

[bellasgrams]

35. She is not destroying the party. BO has already divided it

beyond repair for 08.

[Hoof Hearted]

43. Banshee? Shame on that SEXIST shit. My God.

If I had said some racist shit about Obama like "When that shuffling so-and-so drops out" I would get called on it in a HEARTBEAT and RIGHTLY SO.

Since when the fuck is it a BAD thing to allow people to vote in elections? Sorry you're impatient and feeling a little inconvenienced. A few million people would still like to cast their own votes and make their own voices heard. It might bum you out, but it's Democracy.

[angie_love]

50. OH please! That wasn't meant to be sexist, I'm a female. Shame on that poster for callign

Obama an empty suit. If you guys start spitting out names then I'll spit them out too. Its unfair that I have held my tongue and all I get in response are nasty comments about Obama. So forget it, everytime an idiot says something nasty about Obama, I'll say something nasty about Hillary. Fair is fair. I've been holding my tongue about Hillary for a long time, but forget it now.

[Double T]

4. Here's a clothes hanger.

[Yael]

5. Memo to Tarc

Um, the "empty suit" is winning.

[Tarc]

16. Pretty easy to win when you bank on undemocratic caucuses

open primaries where republicans can and have stated that they will meddle, etc...

[Honeycombe8]

6. I support Obama, too, but it's unnecessary to call Hillary an empty suit. nt

[anamandujano]

39. Love your sig!

[scheming daemons]

8. It matters by how much.... if she wins 51-49.... NOTHING changes....

...about the trajectory of the race.


She has to cut into his delegate lead this Tuesday by a significant amount. If she doesn't... the math just isn't there for her to catch Obama.

[Exilednight]

9. PA doesn't hold their primary for another 7 weeks. She has to win Tx and Oh by at least 15% margins

I don't see it happening.

[JorgeTheGood]

11. if BO doesn't end it in TX/OH

then he loses ... just that simple ... 7 more weeks of nothing but negative press for BO will be too much to overcome.

[scheming daemons]

15. Um.... no. All the "negative press" this week has had no effect....

..because he responds immediately.


AND.... after Tuesday... if Tuesday is a "draw"... the superdelegates will start to flood to him in large numbers.

...and even if Hillary "soldiers on"... she'll just be a bad parody of Huckabee.

[JorgeTheGood]

29. apparently you haven't seen today's polls ... n/t

[Exilednight]

34. The Polls I keep seeing makes it a dead heat in both states. Every poll shows both candidates...

within the margin of error, except faux news who had her up 8 points.

[JorgeTheGood]

40. I won't argue the numbers but just a day or so ago ...

Baracaucus was gonna blow it wide open ... what happened?

[Exilednight]

42. I never saw anything from his campaign that said he was going to blow it wide open. It's the ....

Clinton camp who says he has to have a major win in all four states. Reality says otherwise, he just needs to keep Hillary from getting double digit wins. As long as Obama keeps within 5 points or less it will be impossible for Hillary to spin it as a win after blowing a 20+ point lead.

[Exilednight]

21. Then it goes to a brokered convention. The math is such that neither will reach 2025 unless....

she wins Tx, Oh, and Pa with a 65% to 35% victory. If she splits the delegates again, she can win every delegate in every state and still not have enough to catch Obama.

Personally I think her lower staff will start to quit and she will have a hard time organizing ground support.

[ruggerson]

10. It ends with a combo ticket

I hate to say it, because I know the most rabid don't like it.

But, if that occurs, this ends with the party elders, including Dean, sitting Barack and Hillary down and informing them they have to join forces on a unity ticket.

Of course, that's only if she wins the states you mentioned.

[backscatter712]

12. I don't want an Obama/Clinton ticket.

And the reason is because if Obama gets Clinton as a running mate, he doesn't get just her, he gets her staff. Mark Penn, Wolfson, etc.

It'd be like hiring Grima Wormtongue as campaign adviser.

Obama would be running in the general election like he had an anchor chained to him.

[casus belli]

24. Agreed. n/t

[musicblind]

55. I second that agreement

[Blondiegrrl]

37. He also gets the 50 percent of America who hate her.

Not exactly a winning strategy going into the GE.

[Hoof Hearted]

44. I love how you think it's about you.

That's cute.

[backscatter712]

45. You want a Democrat in the White House or not?

To make that happen, we need the candidate with most effective campaign team.

And I hate to break it to you, but Obama's campaign has been blowing the doors off of Clinton. Better infrastructure, more boots on the ground, great fast response to attacks, and broad appeal, giving him a vast volunteer army and enormous fund-raising capabilities.

I'm not going to be for taking Obama's and Axelrod's proven campaign machine and hamstringing it by throwing Mark Penn in there - he seems to have done little but rake in the consulting bucks and throw vast amounts of money away.

[JorgeTheGood]

13. won't happen ...

Hillary is smart enough to not throw in with someone that could, at a minute's notice, be a prime figure in a high profile government trial.

Nope ... BO is on his own.

[scheming daemons]

22. LOL... you know nothing about the Rezko thing......

....The chief prosecutor (Fitzgerald) has already said Obama is not under investigation and that there is no evidence of any wrong-doing by Obama.

It's a non-starter.


I realize it *IS* all you guys have.... but it really is nothing.

[JorgeTheGood]

38. Uh... like dude(ette) ... it's ... like ... a trial ...

ya know, one of those constitutional things where they have witnesses and stuff like that and try to figure things out ....

Completely discounting Barcaucus involvement is foolish.

Bookmarking for my return visit.

[unc70]

47. Care to place your bets on that?

Fitzgerald is very careful when he discusses cases. Do you have a link to back up Fitzgerald saying what you claim?

The NY Times has joined the Chicago and UK papers and has started to follow the money. Check the LBN entry with the title:

"As Developer Heads to Trial, Questions Linger Over a Deal With Obama"

If this topic starts being discussed on the Sunday interview shows it becomes a problem. If it makes the late-night comedy monologues, then it will have become a huge problem. Hugh?

I supported Edwards and have not chosen between Clinton and Obama. If there is a problem with Obama's house or anything else, we need to know now rather than after Labor Day. Otherwise, this could blow up in our faces. No surprises, please.

[scheming daemons]

18. Combo ticket just WILL NOT happen...

...neither wants anything to do with the Vice Presidency...


Howard Dean doesn't want to lose TWO senate seats.



It just will NOT happen.

[musicblind]

54. I just want to say that your sig line ROCKS!

hahahahaha :rofl:

[JimGinPA]

14. She May Win Ohio By A Slight Margin,

But she won't gain any delegates. The M$M has kind of looked past the two primaries she'll lose between Mar. 4th & Apr. 22nd in PA., where the polls are tightening also. Even if she decides to stay in it's only going to get worse for her after PA, when she'll lose at least 4 of the next 6 contests in May. By that time nearly all Super Delegates will have moved to Obama.

[JorgeTheGood]

41. and you know this how ??? n/t

[BenDavid]

19. HRC will have the MO and that is all we heard all last week

and wek before that obama had the mo.....so let HRC have a great Tuesday and stop obama and she then will have the mo and people will take another look at HRC and begin having buyers remorse with Obama and then HRC goes into the convention with the mo and there she will become the nominee....and obama will either take the vp position or go off and become the new mkj jr.....this was what the cartoon on snl represented....not so much as he being president but the new leader of the black community and Al and Jesse sent out to pasture......along with that silly ass son of Jesse's, Jesse Jackson, I will claim you played the race card Jr.

[Exilednight]

23. A few states does not = momentum. Obama was given the mantle after trouncing Hillary several times

[scheming daemons]

28. "MO" means nothing if she doesn't pick up any delegates.

Obama can outspend her for the 7 weeks leading up to PA....


Unless Hillary significantly cuts into his delegate lead, then it doesn't matter what the vote totals are in the states.

If the delegates are split, or Obama picks up a handful... then the trajectory of the race doesn't change.



I know how much you WISH it to be so, BenDavid.... but she needs to make significant delegate gains.... because other than PA, there are no states left after Tuesday where she is likely to make any significant gains.


Anything short of 10+% wins for her on Tuesday in Ohio and Texas, and she's toast.

[earthlover]

56. If Hillary wins TX and OH by a point or two, that is hardly "MO"....

But that is how the Hill Herd will try to spin it.

[LadyVT]

20. At the convention, or in mid-summer when it USUALLY does

[Lucinda]

25. After all the states have voted?

[ShadowLiberal]

26. Worst yet, this is getting VERY negative fast, it's weakening both C & O in a GE

The worst part of all this is that the longer we fight each other in the primary the harder it's going to be for either candidate to defeat McCain.

My republican dad is laughing in glee at Hillary's latest attacks on Obama on national security. The fact of the matter is McCain is going to win that argument against EITHER democrat, not just one but not the other. I don't see Obama's judgment attack working in a general election, and I don't see Hillary's 'experience' standing up to McCain's, the republicans will bury her in charges of "Bill Clinton weakened our national security" and "years as first lady don't give you national security experience, McCain has been in the senate over a decade longer then Hillary and knows national security more then Hillary".

I'm an Obama supporter by the way, and I will admit Hillary's negative attacks are REALLY pissing me off, as I think we should never go negative against each other in a primary, especially on an issue that the neocons are largely seen as stronger on. Attacks like these, and our primary continuing into April and onward are a gift from god to the neocons.

[Johnny__Motown]

27. I doubt very much she has any shot at all at PA, Obama has 7 weeks to campaign there

And we all know how well he does when he has time to campaign in a state. Her lead has already been cut to 6%.

[Yael]

48. ...and hes not even here yet

[cooolandrew]

30. I think Brack has a master plan that is why he addresses McCain over Hillary.

[cooolandrew]

31. He's done this fight he's on to mccain remember the end of the debate.

[cooolandrew]

33. He avoded the Hillary question and made it about McCain barack is all on it.

[New Dawn]

32. If she only wins 51% in those big states and...

Obama continues to win 60%+ in the small states, then Obama still wins the nomination easily.

[Raine]

36. With MacCain as President and

the Democratic Party left in shreds. :-(

[WinkyDink]

46. It ends when it ends. Democracy doesn't need to rush for some people's comfort.

We rushed enough in late 2000.

But then, I'm in PA, and don't like the thought of my major "must-have" GE state's being irrelevant to the nomination.

[WorseBeforeBetter]

51. That was my response: "It end when it ends."

As someone from PA, I want PA relevant to the nomination! My primary isn't until May 6th and yeah, I'd like for NC to be heard.

Contrary to what Limpballs and breathless news bunnies say, the Democratic Party will survive this. Jaysuz.

[davidpdx]

49. I agree Angie, but it all comes down to Tuesday

Obama needs to only win Texas and Vermont to knock Hillary out of the race. The press releases coming out of the Clinton campaign saying Obama needs to win all four races are a little overzealous (to put it in a kind way). RI is likely going to go for Clinton by a good margin and Vermont will likely go for Obama by a good margin, which leaves Ohio and Texas. Ohio will be close, but I think she'll win it by 5%. If she won by that amount, the amount of delegates she'd pick up would be minimal.

Then again, if you don't believe me try adding it up:

http://www.forbes.com/2008/02/27/obama-clinton-election-oped-cx_jb_0227delegates.html

[Skip Intro]

52. I say it strengthens our party and our candidates. Let the process run it's course. Have faith

in our system.

[Johnny__Motown]

53. If it were not for the slime being thrown around and fed to the Repugs to use I would agree with you

[boston bean]

59. This is nothing compared to what repugs will do. They don't need dems giving them ammo.

They stock pile the shit for just the right moment. So stop blaming dems.

[Perky]

58. At the Baloon Drop and not a second earlier.

[RBInMaine]

60. If if if if if if...RELAX and let the process play out.