Why Didn't Hillary Read the NIE Report in 2002?

[Yavin4]

A war means that people, innocent people, die, so why not get ALL of the facts YOURSELF before you vote for people dying.

[BuyingThyme]

1. If she had, would there be a record of it?

Anybody know?

[Yavin4]

6. Yes, There's An Official Record of Who Read It

Quote: And there is a (classified) list of who did and who didn't because members had to visit a secure room -- called the SCIF -- at the Capitol to view it.

http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2007/05/25/204032.aspx

[BuyingThyme]

7. Thank you. I wonder why she didn't pick up the phone.

[dkf]

43. "available to any member who showed up in person, without staff"

If staff couldn't see the NIE and other intelligence docs, who briefed her? Was the only briefing she got from Condi?

[dkf]

2. Is this what Bill Clinton showed Hillary? Just get a briefing on NIEs

don't read it yourself?

I would think he was more thorough than this.

But what do I know?

[Schema Thing]

3. Because it's contents were not politically popular at the time

Why read an NIE when you're finger and the wind have already told you what you think you need to know? Besides, how bad could this invasion go; my friends have been pushing for it for ages, and it will all end up in Bush's lap anyway.

[MannyGoldstein]

4. Because The Military Reality Was Not Of Interest

Her blowing off the NIE clearly demonstrates that her concerns were for her own political future, and not the future of other people, and of other people's kids.

[Yavin4]

8. EXACTLY

She makes decisions based on her political fortunes, not what is or is not good policy.

[BuyingThyme]

22. Ouch.

[MannyGoldstein]

32. Does Any Other Answer Make Sense?

I don't see any that do.

[BuyingThyme]

33. Either that or she's just stupid.

[hedgehog]

5. She wanted to get to bed early in case the phone rang at 3AM? nt

[David Zephyr]

12. LOL!

:rofl:

[Johnny__Motown]

9. She voted for political gain. the truth didn't matter.

[ecstatic]

10. :( We deserve better. My heart breaks for those who have died nt

[bigtree]

11. How credible do you think those reports actually are? The White House has final say on it's contents

and, the agencies and individuals who generate those reports are solidly in the White House's pocket, especially with the heavy hand this administration has exerted on them.

Did Obama eventually read them? Is that all he would rely on to make his decision on that vote. It seems like a slim reed he's hanging on here. Sen. Clinton has said she read the summary of the report and consulted other military sources to form her decision.

[blogslut]

18. Reading the NIE convinced Dick Durbin to vote Nay

how's that?

[bigtree]

20. different Senators used different rationale on that vote

That was the attitude Kennedy took when he campaigned for Kerry in 2004.
That was the attitude Obama took toward Kerry in 2004.

[blogslut]

25. Wha?

What does that even mean?

I said Richard Durbin read the NIE. Richard Durbin voted against the IWR because he read the NIE. Ted Kennedy also voted against the IWR. I don't know if he read the NIE. John Kerry voted for the IWR but publicly renounced his decision almost immediately afterwards.

Hillary Clinton neither read the NIE nor has she renounced her vote for the IWR. She made a bad choice based on inefficiency and has never apologized or expressed remorse.

[bigtree]

37. So Durbin made his mind up by reading the administration-generated NIE

good for him. Other senators, Clinton included, got their info from a variety of sources. It's not so hard to understand that different legislators rely on different sources of info they trust to make their judgments. It's just not credible to point to one legislator and their fact-gathering habits as the beat all for knowledge and wisdom.

[blogslut]

40. okay

It's not fair. Hillary Clinton claims she thought long and hard about the IWR. She thoroughly researched the intelligence. Her words. She said she researched the intelligence thoroughly...

Have you ever watched this?

http://youtube.com/watch?v=2_KEWUU33Lg

[dansolo]

50. Bob Graham also read the NIE

If you don't want to trust Durbin, then what about Bob Graham, who was the Chair of the Senate Intelligence committee at the time?

You should take a look at this interview he gave to Frontline:

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/darkside/interviews/graham.html

[Carolina]

21. Not so fast, check this out

Why Hillary Clinton’s Iraq Vote Does Matter by Stephen Zunes
http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2008/02/23/7245/

...Despite her much-touted “experience,” Senator Clinton has demonstrated, through her support for the Bush administration’s invasion and occupation of Iraq, a profound ignorance of the reality of the Middle East and an arrogant assumption that peace, stability and democratic governance can be created through the application of U.S. military force.

In the months leading up to the Iraq war vote, Senator Clinton was briefed by a number of arms control specialists, former arms inspectors, strategic analysts, and others who informed her that the Bush administration’s WMD claims were not to be taken seriously and that Iraq had achieved at least qualitative disarmament... Despite this... Senator Clinton insisted that Iraq’s possession of chemical and biological weapons was “not in doubt” and was “undisputed.”

Similarly, even after the International Atomic Energy Agency issued a report prior to the war vote that Iraq no longer had a nuclear program and despite the 2001 National Intelligence Estimate (NIE) that confirmed there was no evidence that such work on Iraq’s nuclear program had resumed, Senator Clinton also defended her vote by claiming that, “If left unchecked, Saddam Hussein will . . . keep trying to develop nuclear weapons.”

Clinton’s supporters have defended her false pre-invasion allegations by citing the public summary of the 2002 NIE which appeared to confirm some of the Bush administration’s claims. However, there were a number of reasons to have been skeptical of this summary: this NIE was compiled in a much shorter time frame than is normally provided for such documents and the report expressed far more certainty regarding Iraq’s WMD capabilities than all the reports from the previous five years, despite the lack of additional data to justify such a shift. When the report was released, there was much stronger dissent within the intelligence community than about any other NIE in history and the longer classified version, which was available to every member of Congress, included these dissenting voices from within the intelligence community. It was also well-known through media reports at that time that the administration was applying enormous pressure on the intelligence agencies to put together a report emphasizing the alleged Iraqi threat.

Despite this, the NIE also challenged the notion of any operational ties between the Iraqi government and Al-Qaeda and questioned some of the more categorical claims by President Bush about Iraq’s WMDs. However, Senator Clinton didn’t even bother to read it. She now claims that it wasn’t necessary for her to have actually looked at the 92-page document herself because she was briefed on the contents of the report. However, since no one on her staff was authorized to read it, it’s unclear who could have actually briefed her.

[bigtree]

38. I'm not debating this article.

Forget it.

[Carolina]

47. yeah, forget pesky things like facts and truth

HRC voted aye on IWR and couldn't be bothered to read the NIE because she was coldly calculating her political moves toward this current POTUS bid. Many of us who saw her vote then for what it is will not, and have not, forgotten her willful poor judgment, lack of leadership and political cowardice.

[WolverineDG]

27. With all of her trumpeted WH experience

she would have seen it was all bullshit & the information cherry-picked. Hundreds of thousands of others around the world, including me & Barack Obama, didn't have access to these reports & WE somehow knew it was bullshit. And the only WH "experience" I have is a tour I took of it back in the 90s.

dg

[Voice for Peace]

39. Yes. Her experience claim is completely suspect to me. I have yet to hear a

good argument as to why her experience qualifies her to be president.

[From The Left]

13. Hill Said She Was "Briefed"

That's right. "Briefed."

The data used to form a decision to go to war and Hillary couldn't be bothered to take it to the Clinton's Chappaqua estate to read it before voting to give Bush the authority to start a war.

Some judgment.

[Carolina]

23. no she was lazy and calculating, check this out

Why Hillary Clinton’s Iraq Vote Does Matter by Stephen Zunes
http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2008/02/23/7245 /

... the NIE also challenged the notion of any operational ties between the Iraqi government and Al-Qaeda and questioned some of the more categorical claims by President Bush about Iraq’s WMDs. However, Senator Clinton didn’t even bother to read it. She now claims that it wasn’t necessary for her to have actually looked at the 92-page document herself because she was briefed on the contents of the report. However, since no one on her staff was authorized to read it, it’s unclear who could have actually briefed her.

[ChairmanAgnostic]

42. we know who briefed her. Mark Penn, Howard wolfson, and 3 poll results

Oh, I forgot. a focus group, too.

The idea that she is/was/will be ready on day one is so REED-iculous as to be laughable. She would run this country much like she ran her campaign. Into the ground. Think of Bush-Lite, and you have Hillary.

[Ravy]

14. What good would reading a "cooked" NIE do?

She was briefed on what it said. I am sure the briefing was accurate.

PS. People were dying either way. The best way to stop death was the IWR, had it been properly executed.

[Carolina]

26. BULLSHIT, here's why actually reading it mattered

Why Hillary Clinton’s Iraq Vote Does Matter by Stephen Zunes
http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2008/02/23/7245 /

Clinton’s supporters have defended her false pre-invasion allegations by citing the public summary of the 2002 NIE which appeared to confirm some of the Bush administration’s claims. However, there were a number of reasons to have been skeptical of this summary: this NIE was compiled in a much shorter time frame than is normally provided for such documents and the report expressed far more certainty regarding Iraq’s WMD capabilities than all the reports from the previous five years, despite the lack of additional data to justify such a shift. When the report was released, there was much stronger dissent within the intelligence community than about any other NIE in history and the longer classified version, which was available to every member of Congress, included these dissenting voices from within the intelligence community. It was also well-known through media reports at that time that the administration was applying enormous pressure on the intelligence agencies to put together a report emphasizing the alleged Iraqi threat.

Despite this, the NIE also challenged the notion of any operational ties between the Iraqi government and Al-Qaeda and questioned some of the more categorical claims by President Bush about Iraq’s WMDs. However, Senator Clinton didn’t even bother to read it. She now claims that it wasn’t necessary for her to have actually looked at the 92-page document herself because she was briefed on the contents of the report. However, since no one on her staff was authorized to read it, it’s unclear who could have actually briefed her.

[dansolo]

52. It was not "cooked"

There was information in the NIE that specifically contradicted her assertions.

[Ravy]

53. Read it. It is available. Don't take my or anyone else's opinion on it.

But to me, it clearly states that they think he has programs and WMDs.

Bush specifically released it because he thought it bolstered his case.

[Forkboy]

15. Reading is like hard and stuff.

[From The Left]

16. HAHAHAHAHA

[tabasco]

17. She didn't have time! Like with her tax return info!

Apparently she's not too good with the time management thingie but she's probably taking an audio course so she'll be ready on day one!

[FrenchieCat]

19. Too busy answering the phone?

:shrug:

[Evergreen Emerald]

24. I am not sure why I even respond, as I know you know this

and are just posting crap because you will look for anything to attack Clinton with.

The assistants for ALL the senators read the bills and summarize them in reports. The Senators are then briefed on the summaries and read the reports.

It is done ALL THE TIME BY ALL OF THEM.

But, please. Don't let facts stop you from burning the witch.

[FrenchieCat]

28. So do you have an answer to the question as to why Hillary didn't bother

to read the NIE report.

It appears that facts are required here.

I'm not sure about the "witch" comment, but this sounds sexist. Why do that? :shrug:

[Carolina]

29. Assistants didn't have the clearance

for the NIE... don't let facts get in YOUR way!

Why Hillary Clinton’s Iraq Vote Does Matter by Stephen Zunes
http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2008/02/23/7245 /

Senator Clinton didn’t even bother to read it. She now claims that it wasn’t necessary for her to have actually looked at the 92-page document herself because she was briefed on the contents of the report. However, since no one on her staff was authorized to read it, it’s unclear who could have actually briefed her.

[blogslut]

30. You are wrong on the NIE

Only the Senators and Congress people are allowed to read those kind of documents. They read them in private rooms with armed security guards. They don't sent their assistants.

[Yavin4]

36. Even If Her Assistants Could Read It

She's going to let a life and death decision hinge on her staff's "interpretation" of the report?

Wow, that says a lot about her management style.

[MojoMojoMojo]

31. Hillary voted for inspections, read her floor speech

Obama wants to reserve the option to reinvade Iraq ,bomb Iran,bomb Pakistan,escalate Afghanistan.
Do you suppose he will ever need authority from Congress?
If he asks for authority, should Congress all vote no?

[Cha]

34. Too busy preparing her disingenous speech

before the Senate.

[fenriswolf]

35. two words: plausible deniability nt

[RamboLiberal]

41. There were 3 Dem Senators who didn't want on the wrong

side of this issue - or that's how they figured it at the time. They had their eyes on the prize of the Presidency. And all 3 showed at least to me at the time they lacked political courage. 3 who could not even be bothered to read the full NIE! Clinton, Edwards and Kerry!

Here's list of Dems who say they read the full report.

Then voting Nay: Byrd, Dayton, Durbin, Graham, Inouye, Kennedy, Leahy, Levin, Mikulski, Wyden

Then voting Yea: Bayh, Biden, Feinstein, Rockefeller.

That was one huge disappoint I had at the time of many Dems in D.C. On the Patriot Bill and IWR they stuck their fingers in the political wind at the time, didn't read the full details of what they were voting on and then voted to enable Bush! There sure was a lack of Profiles in Courage there and there continues to be.

In the future I'd like to see some of these Dems face good primary challenges at home by Dems more commited to listening to their constituents.

http://thehill.com/leading-the-news/few-senators-read-iraq-nie-report-2007-06-19.html

[Tennessee Gal]

44. Here we go again.

The speech he made showed that Obama would have been opposed to a war in Iraq from what he knew at the time. That's not the same as being opposed to the Iraq War Resolution that gave the President the authority to go to war as a supposed last resort. Had Obama said something to the effect of being opposed to a war in Iraq "even as a last resort" or "under any circumstance", then that would be proof that he wouldn't of voted for the Resolution. But he said no such thing.

[Yavin4]

46. That's Not My Question

My question is why didn't Hillary read the NIE report?

[Carolina]

49. notice how Team Hillary willfully

avoids facts and, in this case, the question at hand?!

[superkia]

45. Maybe she has the same agenda that bushco has and thought...

if she said she didn't want war but also spewed propaganda for war in the same speech that the sheeple would still follow her? Thats my guess. Play the fence with your words but vote for the agenda you support and then say oh I was just stupid and bushie got one over on me...thats a leader we want right? America always votes for the lesser of the evils and Obama is the OBVIOUS choice at this point.

[L0oniX]

48. Why didn't she read the Patriot Act before voting for it? n/t

[FrenchieCat]

51. Because she had to answer the Red Phone,

while hiding under her desk.

Would have been awkward? :shrug: