After Obama made that one small speech at one small rally - what did he do to stop the Iraq War?

[MethuenProgressive]

?

[maximusveritas]

1. He went to 2 anti-war rallies. What else could he do?

That's basically what I did as well.

I don't understand this criticism. Did you expect him to stop Bush single-handedly?

[rug]

11. He could convene committee hearings;

he could take the floor of the Senate and oppose it;

he could vote to defund the war;

he could do what he was sent to the Senate to do.

[maximusveritas]

20. Committee hearings would stop the war?

I assume you're talking about the NATO Afghanistan hearings. Doesn't really work in this case, but nice try.

As far as the others, he's done all those things.

[rug]

24. No, he voted to fund the war. Nice try. Post a link to his speech on the Senate floor.

[maximusveritas]

34. You're confusing the issue of whether to go to war with the issue of how to withdraw

This is an issue many Hillary supporter confuse, mostly on purpose, so as to cast doubt on Obama's opposition to the war.

Obama opposed the war from the start and attended anti-war rallies to stop it from happening.

Once it started, he (like most anti-war people) did not support an immediate withdrawal and supported funding the troops in order to help rebuild Iraq.

Once it was clear that we were making things worse with our presence there, however, he began opposing funding and put out legislation for withdrawal.

[rug]

46. You're confusing funding the troops with funding a genocidal war.

You cannot claim that bill did not allow Bush to continue his murderous wars. When did Obama ever vote against a funding bill for this war?

The OP asked what Obama has done besides give a speech in Chicago in a local election. The answer is nothing. Attending anti-war rallies without using the power of a Senator's office is bogus.

The truth in your post is minimal.

[OzarkDem]

64. Yes, he could have tried

He could have brought important facts, analysis and opinion to the public forum that would have seeded doubt in the public mind much earlier.

Did he have something better to do with his time?

[earthlover]

61. Right. Obama spoke out against the Iraq War....what did Hillary do? Voted for it!

I might also point out that Obama spoke out against it when it was unpopular to speak out against it. Hillary went along at a time when it was unpopular not to go along.

It may not have been 3AM when Hillary voted for this blunder that authorized the biggest strategic blunder in US military history, a blunder that not only cost us lives and money, but has put a damper on our economy in several ways.

But regardless of the time, Hillary did not do her homework, did not even read the intelligence briefings....she went along to go along. She signed a blank check and now complains that someone cashed it!

[MethuenProgressive]

72. So you're another one of those who don't know what the vote was about?

No wonder you support Obama. You're just the kind of person he's counting on.

[rodeodance]

75. OBAMA Funded it.

[roguevalley]

78. since he wasn't there to start it, he doesn't have the burden

of responsibility to stop it. since hillary was there to help start it, the question is hers.

RV

[Johnny__Motown]

2. He became President and ended the war..... oh wait, I am getting ahead of myself again

[bigtree]

5. got to Congress and realized the limitations of an individual Senator

He didn't act until 2005, by the way.

[DemBones DemBones]

44. so he voted to fund the war and extend the PATRIOT Act.

He was a civil rights lawyer and he supports the PATRIOT Act??? Does not compute.

[JimGinPA]

6. Beat Me To It

:rofl:

[MojoMojoMojo]

50. End the war ,but leave 100,000 Blackwater in Iraq?

And escalate Afghanistan by redeploying our troops there.

[BuyingThyme]

3. I saw him interviewed on a TV show and he explained why it was wrong.

Did I see you on a TV show explaining why it was wrong?

[rpannier]

4. He's flying to Iraq right now as we speak

to officially disarm everyone in the Middle East.

[MethuenProgressive]

33. That would be his first trip to Iraq ever, wouldn't it?

He's never been, has he?

[Madam Mossfern]

83. His going to Iraq would end the war?

Ah yes, you must be referring to that magic wand that Hillary mentioned. I see now, some are angry that he didn't use his magic wand soon enough.

:sarcasm:
I hate having to use that smiley, but I'm afraid that some here would take my post literally.

[kid a]

7. After CLinton made one HUGE vote at one HUGE moment, what did she do to sto the war in Iraq?

That shit don't fly with me brother.

[maximusveritas]

14. Great point. When it was clear Bush was going to go to war, did Hillary say anything?

Supposedly he was misusing the authority granted by the IWR, so Hillary should have been quite upset. Why didn't she hold a press conference, holding up the IWR and telling him he should be ashamed? Why didn't she say anything?

[bigtree]

16. But, Obama was SO concerned. 26 months into his term . . .

from the Boston Globe, March 20, 2007: http://www.boston.com/news/nation/washington/articles/2007/03/20/obamas_record_shows_caution_nuance_on_iraq/

Campaigning for the Illinois Senate seat in 2003 and 2004, Obama scolded Bush for invading Iraq and vowed he would "unequivocally" vote against an additional $87 billion to pay for it. Yet since taking office in January 2005, he has voted for four separate war appropriations, totaling more than $300 billion.

Last June, Obama voted no to Senator John F. Kerry's proposal to remove most combat troops from Iraq by July 2007, warning that an "arbitrary deadline" could "compound" the Bush administration's mistake. And last week, he voted for a Republican-sponsored resolution that stated the Senate would not cut off funding for troops in Iraq.

Though liberals want Congress to stop funding the war in order to end it, Obama has indicated that he will vote for the latest $95.5 billion Iraq appropriation when it comes before the Senate this spring.

Aides say the senator's opposition to the war has been strong and consistent. They said he opposed the initial $87 billion as a Senate candidate because the White House wanted to set aside $20 billion of it for reconstruction, and Democrats feared the money would be distributed in no-bid contracts.

Obama has voted for war appropriations because he wants the troops provided for fully, said Bill Burton, an Obama spokesman. Aides said that Obama has criticized the war several times early in his Senate career, but that he delayed rolling out specific plans and major Senate speeches while learning about his new office.

[MethuenProgressive]

That's right: He voted AGAINST pulling our troops out of Iraq by 2007.

"Against this war from the beginning"?

[DemBones DemBones]

42. I really hate it when Democrats tell bald-faced lies

the way Obama has. They should leave that to the GOP.

[MethuenProgressive]

47. It's no lie he voted against Kerry's bill pulling our troops out by 2007

He doesn't mention that in his soaring speeches, does he?

[Ravy]

21. She sent a letter to Powell urging him to give the weapons inspectors

more time in January, and gave an AP interview on 3/3/03 urging the administration to give the weapons inspections more time. This was at the time the French were being vilified for making the same suggestion, so it wasn't just going along with the crowd.

[MrSlayer]

8. What did anyone do? Nothing.

It couldn't be stopped. As soon as the neo-cons stole their way into the White House this war was going to happen no matter what.

[blogslut]

9. He also got on television and said it in 2002

But who cares, right?

link: http://youtube.com/watch?v=sXzmXy226po

[indimuse]

10. he's been too busy campaigning from day one.

..

[MethuenProgressive]

30. Pretty much. Positioning himself with great care.

Like the Judas Goat at the front of the flock.

[susankh4]

62. That's right

he barely gets going on one job... when he's off to campaigning for the next.

What will it be once he's in the White House? King of the world.... or the universe?

Why hasn't he held hearings on Afghanistan if he thinks that's so important? Why?

And why is he telling Canada to ignore what he's telling Ohio's unions?

He says one thing to our faces... and does another when he thinks we can't see.

[Carolina]

12. one small speech at one small rally

when it was dangerous to speak out, when few in public office (statewide or nationally) showed such political courage, when others like HRC cowered and went along to get ahead!

It was a big deal at the time but how quickly some have forgotten that milieu of fear and intimidation!

[still_one]

13. guess what all these DEMOCRATIC SENATORS HAVE IN COMMON?

akaka
bingaman
boxer
byrd
chafee
conrad
corzine
dayton
durbin
feingold
graham
inouye
jeffords
kennedy
leahy
levin
mikulski
murray
reed
sarbanes
stabenow
wellstone
wyden


They voted against the IWR

WHY, because they knew it over-rode the War Powers Act, and removed Congress from oversight

No justification for those who voted for the IWR

Those that voted for it thought they could avoid accountability, that is what this election IS ABOUT

[NJSecularist]

19. I can't believe Corzine voted against the war

That gets very many points from me. He's my Governor. That tells me alot about him.

[still_one]

22. here is the roll call:

http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=107&session=2&vote=00237#position

[stevenleser]

15. You mean as opposed to what Hillary did after voting FOR the war?

OMG, the title and premise of the OP is a joke

[MethuenProgressive]

17. So, you have no idea?

And you have an Obama logo in your post...

[TheDeathadder]

18. Well if he supposed to be like MLK

Why didn't march daily in the streets demanding to end the war? That's what MLK would have done. If Obama is like a MLK he should have taken the message to the streets and marched until something was done. Instead he ran for Senator and pretty much voted exactly the same way Clinton did once he was elected. It's called Playing Politics. He's a really good at Playing Politics

[MethuenProgressive]

28. I don't think anyone has compared BO to Dr. King.

So your post's title is a bit unfair to BO.

[TheDeathadder]

32. Please

For months we heard how Obama was both MLK and JFK put together from this board to MSNBC. His speeches always have a tone of "I'm like MLK and JFK"

It's not unfair at all. Lord knows I've had to hear far worse about Clinton and on this board alone I've seen people cross the line about both candidates so many times.

No I think the the comment I made was very fair.

I understand you disagree and I'm totally cool with that.

[MethuenProgressive]

36. I should've added a..

winking smiley face ;)

[TheDeathadder]

38. yeah that changes everything

you know how it is around here now at DU GDP. Shoot First Ask Questions Later. Nice to run into some good old fashion sarcasm and smiling faces.

[Drunken Irishman]

23. What did the millions of protesters around the world do to stop the war?

They rallied, some gave speeches and what happened?

We went to war.

Does that make what they did any less important?

[Perky]

25. OMG look at the substance of the speech He was completely right.

SHe showed keen, even prophetic insight

WHat had Hillary done to stop the war from either stopping or ending?

[apocalypsehow]

26. At least he didn't vote for it, like another Senator we all know....

n/t.

[bigtree]

27. He didn't have a vote.

[MethuenProgressive]

29. And he had no idea how he would've voted. Quote: "What would I have done? I don't know."

[Drunken Irishman]

53. Why not post the entire quote, aight?

Or are you too afraid to post the part where he says there was no case made?

[apocalypsehow]

31. Had he had one, he would've voted no. A certain Senator from New York who DID have one voted....

...ah, how again? Please refresh our memories....

[Mooney]

35. And she did...

...and she voted for it. Inexcusable.

[patrice]

37. I hate rationalizations, but it COULD have been a case of keeping one's powder dry.

It's hard not to see this as the same sort of calculation that Hillary made. But, the problem isn't the fact that they made these calculations, all of us do to one degree or another, it's the fact that the outcome of the calculation was WRONG in HC's and others' case.

Just as in a business setting, where something is proposed and pursued that you may or may not agree with, it would be necessary to ask one's self: Given that I strongly oppose ______________, what would be the best way to end __________________. Under the present circumstances, if I do much more than make my anti statements in a meeting or two, X can prevent me from getting into a position to do more than that.

Whether this was or was not what Obama thought is indeterminant, 50:50, i.e. meaningless, and the reason he's getting a pass on that is because we expect to be able to take responsibility for this issue and others ourselves if Obama gets elected and we are GAMBLING that we will have more say if he is pResident than if HC is.

[MethuenProgressive]

48. Seems to me that Obama's silence was Calculated as he Positioned himself for a POTUS run

jmo

[patrice]

68. You have no more basis to say that it was calculated than I do to say it was

a decision of conscience.

And as I said earlier, it isn't that calculating your behavior is bad. Everyone has to do that. It's that they got it wrong when we could afford it the least.

[GeorgeGist]

52. Hillary shot herself in the face ...

using her own powder. No rationalization required.

[Joey Liberal]

39. What else could one man do?

It was still a helluva lot more than Hillary ever did.

[MethuenProgressive]

40. That sounds like the first line of a Deval Patrick speech...

:hi:

[Drunken Irishman]

55. Hell, it's a line most anyone can use, since Clinton did squat.

Truth is the truth, eh Meth?

[DemBones DemBones]

41. Nada. Once in the Senate, he voted to fund the war every time

and to renew the PATRIOT Act.

Ya know, MP, I get the idea that a lot of the Obama people really are at their first rodeo and don't see what's going to happen if he gets the nomination.

[ElsewheresDaughter]

43. voted to continue the funding of it and ran for the presidency

[MethuenProgressive]

45. while hanging his hat on the one small speech at one small rally...

[ElsewheresDaughter]

54. in a nut shell

[Voice for Peace]

49. he ran for president. nt

[Emit]

51. He introduced the Iraq War De-Escalation Act of 2007

(S 433) on January 30, 2007 with co-sponsors Durbin, Leahy, and Sanders. While it didn't go anywhere but to the Committee on Foreign Relations, it's not like he hasn't attempted important legislation, or that Clinton has been more successful in her attempt. Their records, on average, are pretty similar, unless I'm missing something. :shrug:

S.433
Title: A bill to state United States policy for Iraq, and for other purposes.
Sponsor: Sen Obama, Barack (introduced 1/30/2007) Cosponsors (3)
Related Bills: H.R.787
Latest Major Action: 1/30/2007 Referred to Senate committee. Status: Read twice and referred to the Committee on Foreign Relations.SUMMARY AS OF:
1/30/2007--Introduced.

Iraq War De-Escalation Act of 2007 - States that: (1) U.S. Armed Forces levels in Iraq after the date of enactment of this Act shall not exceed January 10, 2007, levels without specific statutory authority enacted by Congress after the date of the enactment of this Act; and (2) except as otherwise provided, the phased redeployment of U.S. Armed Forces from Iraq shall begin by May 1, 2007.

Authorizes the President to temporarily suspend such redeployment upon certification to Congress that: (1) such action is in the U.S. national interest; and (2) the government of Iraq is taking specified actions. Resumes redeployment if Congress enacts a joint resolution disapproving such suspension or suspension renewal.

Authorizes, upon certification by the President to Congress, post-deployment retention of certain forces in Iraq to: (1) protect U.S. personnel and facilities; (2) conduct targeted counter-terrorism operations; (3) provide training for Iraqi security forces; and (4) conduct Office of Defense Attache functions. Terminates retention if Congress enacts a joint resolution disapproving such retention.

Reaffirms provisions prohibiting the establishment of bases or installations providing for the permanent stationing of U.S. forces in Iraq.

States that it shall be U.S. policy to: (1) implement a plan to intensify training of Iraqi security forces; and (2) undertake diplomatic initiatives to restore peace in Iraq and prevent a regional conflict.

Conditions continued economic assistance (with exceptions for humanitarian, employment, and security assistance) to the government of Iraq after May 1, 2007, upon the President certifying to Congress that the government of Iraq is taking specified actions with respect to economic improvements and reducing sectarian violence.

Clinton introduced S. 670 on 2/16/2007. It, too, sits at the Committee on Foreign Relations.

S. 670: Iraq Troop Protection and Reduction Act of 2007

Sponsor: Sen. Hillary Clinton (no cosponsors)
Introduced Feb 16, 2007

Last Action:
Feb 16, 2007: Read twice and referred to the Committee on Foreign Relations.
Show All Related Votes

A bill to set forth limitations on the United States military presence in Iraq and on United States aid to Iraq for security and reconstruction, and for other purposes.
Overview

The following summary is provided by the Congressional Research Service, which is a nonpartisan government entity that serves Congress and is run by the Library of Congress. The summary is taken from the official website THOMAS.

2/16/2007--Introduced.

Iraq Troop Protection and Reduction Act of 2007 - Prohibits, with a limited presidential national security waiver, U.S. military force levels in Iraq after the date of the enactment of this Act from exceeding such levels as of January 1, 2007.
Prohibits appropriations for security and reconstruction assistance to the government of Iraq 90 days after enactment of this Act unless the President provides Congress with a specified certification respecting Iraq's: (1) security forces; (2) oil revenue distribution; (3) civil rights and political accommodation concerning its ethnic and sectarian groups; and (4) policy towards the participation of former Baath party members in the Iraqi government.

Terminates authority for the use of U.S. military forces in Iraq 90 days after enactment of this Act unless the use of such forces is specifically authorized by Congress in a statute enacted after enactment of this Act or the President provides Congress with a specified certification respecting: (1) U.S. redeployment and mission transition; (2) Iraq's security forces; (3) oil revenue distribution; (4) civil rights and political accommodation concerning Iraq's ethnic and sectarian groups; (5) the participation of former Baath party members in the Iraqi government; and (6) the convening of an international conference on Iraq. States that the termination shall: (1) continue in effect if Congress enacts a joint resolution disapproving the President's certification; and (2) not be construed to prohibit the use of U.S. military forces in Iraq for force protection, force security, or similar purposes during the U.S. military withdrawal from Iraq.

Prohibits the obligation or expenditure of funds to deploy U.S. military forces to Iraq unless the Secretary of Defense certifies to Congress that such forces are adequately equipped and trained for their missions.

[MethuenProgressive]

57. His bill was sent to His committee where He sat on it. That's called a "Vanity Bill".

[Emit]

59. Is he the Chair of that committee?

:shrug:

[MethuenProgressive]

60. Why do you ask? Hasn't it held any hearings?

That's the tell that he's the Chair, right? No hearings?

[Emit]

63. Wha'?

He chairs the Senate Subcommittee on European Relations, I believe, no?

[Emit]

69. Obama is not the Chair of Senate Foreign Relations Committee

Biden is. No?

[Emit]

76. I'm still waiting for an explanation on this.

Can you explain what you wrote here, or what you meant by this?

I'm trying to follow your logic.

'His' committee? 'He' sat on it?

[Maribelle]

56. Obama bases the sum total of his 'judgment' on that speech.

and can't even explain how he came up with all those "I know" parts.

[MethuenProgressive]

58. "and can't even explain how he came up with all those 'I know' parts."

Bingo! :applause:

[jmg257]

65. He realized he can do much more if president, so he set himself to become the Dem nominee. Next?

[OzarkDem]

66. No, he thought only of his personal ambition

and put his country a distant second.

I anticipate we will see much more of the same if he is elected President. That's why I and many others don't support him.

[jmg257]

67. Nope - he can do ALOT more as Pres. IF you are worried about "self-interest", why support hillary?

Talk about eyeing THE PRIZE!!! She has geared her entire short political life on the Presidency just to get more power for power's sake alone. She THOUGHT she did everything right so it was a "gimmee"...Moved to a liberal state with a vacancy, black-mail dealed her way onto the Armed Services committee, etc. etc. etc. Most people know all this, which is why they don't support HER. Which of course is why she will lose, and why she is SO miserable now that it is slipping away.

She failed to count on a likable candidate that gives great speeches and offers REAL change. Oh, she'll keep throwing stuff to do as much damage as possible, even though nothing will stick; she will have some hope for 2012 if she can bring down Obama at all cost. Dispicable.

[berni_mccoy]

70. He had the Courage to Speak Out Against the War. Courage is something Clinton Lacks.

[MethuenProgressive]

71. One small speech, at one small rally. And then silence. That's "courage"?

That's a Fairy Tale.

[SaveOurDemocracy]

74. ooooooooohhh ... you said 'Fairy Tale' ...

ya racist!!! :evilgrin:

[MethuenProgressive]

77. I even rolled some dice the other day.

I am evil. Evil am I.

[MethuenProgressive]

73. Here's the YouTube answer:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4l4_jMyV3mY

[BigDDem]

79. Well, he voted to stop the funding!

Oh wait, never mind.

[nonconformist]

80. He also made a speech about war funding, and then rolled over for Bush (unlike other Dems)

I don't believe for a SECOND he would have voted against it had he been in the Senate.

Obama almost always says the right thing in speeches, but when it's really on the line, he folds.

[mmonk]

81. Has he got some power over the Federal government when he

wasn't in the Senate yet? Better question: What did Senator Clinton do to stop the Iraq war?

[anonymous171]

82. What did Hillary do to stop the Iraq War?

[hulka38]

84. Here's the deal Hillary supporters

You know that in 2002 you were for the invasion of Iraq, believed that Iraq was going to attack the U.S. with WMD and maybe even a nuke if they could get one ready in time, and with your keen perception of the people of the middle east, Hillary supporters understood that Saddam and his good terrorist buddy Osama were responsible for the attacks on 9/11. Hillary supporters, you bought all that shit. You know you did.