Spreadsheet of state-by-state results so far; Why Hillary wants MI and FL to

[ProgressiveEconomist]

count--rather than carry out do-overs.

Prodded by a GDP discussion (at http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x4911694 ) that was missing these numbers, I went to http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2008/primaries/results/candidates/#1918 and http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2008/primaries/results/candidates/#val=1746 today and edited these results into a plain text file (see my first "reply" below--Why doesn't DU support HTML tables???)

Were the severely flawed FL results and the Soviet-style MI election results to count, Hillary would wipe out the 600,000-popular-vote margin Obama has racked up in legitimate elections and caucuses, as well as net 38 pledged delegates from FL alone.

What I want to know is: why were Clinton and Kucinich the only two candidates on the Michigan ballot? Did Hillary's advisers strategize in advance to take advantange of the DNC rules fight, to have the chance to grab illegitimate votes if necessary, to "win" at any cost?

What do you think?

[ProgressiveEconomist]

1. The spreadsheet promised in my lead-in above

                     Barack Obama                    | Hillary
Clinton
                 
-----------------------------------+----------------------------------
                                 ------Delegates-----|        
     ------Delegates-----
                     Votes       Pledged Super Total |  Votes 
     Pledged Super Total  Reporting
                 
-----------------------------------+----------------------------------
PRIMARIES+CAUCUSES  12,653,421 1314     169    1483  |
12,083,342 1183     206    1389
                 
-----------------------------------+----------------------------------
     Florida           569,041    0       0       0  |   
857,208    0       0      0     99%
     Michigan                                        |   
328,151    0       0      0    100%
                 
-----------------------------------+----------------------------------
PRIMARY TOTALS      12,269,851 1051     129    1180  |
11,899,337 1050     183    1233
                 
-----------------------------------+----------------------------------
027  RhodeIsland        75,115    8       2      10  |   
108,750   13       6      19   100%
026  Texas           1,356,330   61      10      71  | 
1,455,959   65      12      77    99%
025  Vermont            91,829    9       3      12  |    
59,854    6       1      7     99%
024  Ohio              979,025   59       4      63  | 
1,207,806   71       2      73   100%
023  Maryland          464,474   35       6      41  |   
285,440   22      11      33    97%
022  Illinois        1,301,954  104      23     127  |   
662,845   49       0      49    99%
021  Tennessee         250,730   28       4      32  |   
332,599   40       4      44   100%
020  Georgia           700,366   61       6      67  |   
328,129   26       2      28   100%
019  Alabama           302,814   27       1      28  |   
226,504   25       3      28   100%
018  Wisconsin         646,007   42       8      50  |   
452,795   32       2      34   100%
017  NewMexico          71,396   12       1      13  |    
73,105   14       5      19   100%
016  DistOfColumbia     85,534   11       8      19  |    
27,326    3       9      12    98%
015  Virginia          623,141   54       4      58  |   
347,252   29       6      35    99%
014  Louisiana         220,588   34       1      35  |   
136,959   22       3      25   100%
013  Arizona           191,681   25       3      28  |   
228,158   31       4      35    99%
012  California      1,890,026  161      12     173  | 
2,306,361  204      28     232   100%
011  Utah               70,373   14       1      15  |    
48,719    9       2      11    99%
010  Oklahoma          130,087   14       1      15  |   
228,425   24       1      25   100%
009  Missouri          405,284   36       4      40  |   
395,287   36       4      40   100%
008  Arkansas           80,774    8       0       8  |   
217,313   27      10      37   100%
007  NewYork           697,914   93       1      94  | 
1,003,623  139      42     181    99%
006  Massachusetts     511,887   38      10      48  |   
704,591   55       8      63   100%
005  Connecticut       179,349   26       7      33  |   
164,831   22       1      23   100%
004  NewJersey         492,186   48       4      52  |   
602,576   59      10      69    99%
003  Delaware           51,124    9       0       9  |    
40,751    6       3      9    100%
002  SouthCarolina     295,091   25       2      27  |   
141,128   12       2      14    99%
001  NewHampshire      104,772    9       3      12  |   
112,251    9       2      11   100%
                 
-----------------------------------+----------------------------------
CAUCUS TOTALS          383.570  263      40     303  |   
184,005  133      23     156
                 
-----------------------------------+----------------------------------
013  Texas              22,628    0       0       0  |    
17,883    0       0      0     39%
012  Washington         21,629   53       4      57  |     
9,992   25       5      30    96%
011  Hawaii             28,347   14       1      15  |     
8,835    6       2      8    100%
010  Nebraska           26,126   16       4      20  |    
12,445    8       0      8    100%
009  Minnesota         141,725   48       8      56  |    
68,607   24       3      27    99%
008  Alaska                302    9       1      10  |       
103    4       1      5     98%
007  Idaho              16,880   15       3      18  |     
3,655    3       0      3    100%
006  Kansas             27,172   23       3      26  |     
9,462    9       1      10   100%
005  NorthDakota        11,625    8       6      14  |     
6,948    5       0      5    100%
004  Colorado           79,344   33       4      37  |    
38,587   13       4      17    99%
003  Maine               2,079   15       2      17  |     
1,396    9       2      11    99%
002  Nevada              4,773   13       1      14  |     
5,355   12       2      14    98%
001  Iowa                  940   16       3      19  |       
737   15       3      18   100%
                 
-----------------------------------+----------------------------------

[papau]

2. I think ALL obeyed the no campaign rules - and the last day last hour name removal by Obama

in Michigan was a transparent attempt to make the best of a losing situation where he knew he would lose badly.

[ProgressiveEconomist]

9. That may be the single best "spin" attempt I've ever seen! But why did Edwards,

Dodd, and even Gravel's names not appear on the Michigan ballot also? If you can work out that little detail, you should get hold of Hillary's top brass pronto.

[lewis_in_fw]

10. WRONG! Gravel was on the ballot. Peace *NT*

[ProgressiveEconomist]

13. Do you have a link? I'm relying on my memory of what I heard on TV last month.

[lewis_in_fw]

18. wikipedia it *NT*

[ProgressiveEconomist]

25. Even better: The official State of MI sample ballot, at URL

http://www.michigan.gov/documents/sos/PriPresBal_final2_218616_7.pdf ,

lists Clinton, Dodd, Gravel, Kucinich, Uncommitted, and Write-In.

Thanks for prodding me to do some googling and websurfing, deep into the fine print on a confusing state website.

[burythehatchet]

20. pure. comedy. genius.

:rofl:

[enfield collector]

3. I think you nailed it with "win at any cost", HRC is prepared to

wage a scorched earth campaign and probably doesn't care if she destroys our party in the process.

[MonkeyFunk]

4. Florida wasn't severely flawed

1.7 million dems voted - more than twice as many as 2004.

It was a record turnout. All the candidates were on the ballot. Nobody had an advantage. It was a perfectly fine election.

[stillcool]

6. except it didn't count...

[ProgressiveEconomist]

7. At least you're not maintaining that nothing's wrong with counting Michigan

But don't you think Hillary had an unfair advantage from superior name recognition in a Florida election where Obama could not campaign?

[Captain Hilts]

15. Florida should stand and MI should get a do over. nt

[joshcryer]

5. She's happy for a do-over.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080305/ap_on_el_pr/primary_scramble

Obviously she'd want them seated, but if that's not happening, she'd want a do-over. :) :hi:

[ProgressiveEconomist]

8. I sure hope you are correct. Do you have a direct HRC quote, and a link?

[ProgressiveEconomist]

12. Thanks for the link. But it doesn't quote Hillary. It DOES quote the governors of both

MI (a Clinton supporter) and Florida (a Republican who presumable would prefer McCain face divisive candidate) as demanding their delegations be seated.

[Dinger]

11. I Heard Obama Chose To Leave His Name Off The Ballot In Michigan

On CNN I think. I don't have a link, but feel free to correct me if I am wrong.

[Captain Hilts]

14. MI needs a do-over, but FL had a real primary with nearly two million voters w/ full candidate slate

[ProgressiveEconomist]

16. Can an electon be fully legitimate if no campaigning is allowed?

Without campaigning, the candidate with the best name recognition would win, wouldn't she?

And what percentage of the Florida electorate do you surmise might have thought they were voting for BILL Clinton, not Hillary? With no campaigning, that percentage surely would be larger than it would had Hillary been a fixture on billboards and print and TV ads.

[Captain Hilts]

17. Twenty years ago I would have said, "no," today I say "yes." nt

[ProgressiveEconomist]

24. Would she net 38 delegates and 288,000 popular votes in a fair election?

[Altair]

19. She'll still win Florida, just by a lesser margin

[ProgressiveEconomist]

22. No doubt. But she's unlikely to net 38 pledged delegates or 288,000 popular

votes in a fair FL election, even with the nation's highest percentage in Hillary's Hallmark Channel demographic, and hundreds of thousands of minority "felons" who haven't had their voting rights restored.

[SoCalDem]

21. Why her name remained.

When the others removed theirs, her campaign said (very Machiavellian of them) .."well if the votes don't even count, leaving her name on, is no big deal anyway"...

They KNEW it would matter..down the line, and once she had votes "in her pocket", she would move heaven & earth to keep them.. even if it was a fake election..

The same with Florida.. she did not "campaign there", but they did hold "fundraisers"..and the Clinton brand was well-known..and in this day of TV EVERYWHERE 24-7, they didn't NEED to campaign there... the primary was early enough, that Obama was still an unknown at that point so she knew she would be the favored one..and would happily fight later..

Had she not gone on a loser-streak, and was the one in front, she might just say.."those votes don't count"..but since she NEEDS them desperately, she's like a broke person who found an ATM card on the ground at the bank.. she KNOWS there's money in there, and she'll keep trying pin numbers as long as the bank lets her.. she might get lucky and score some dough :)

[ProgressiveEconomist]

23. Love your metaphor: "like a broke person who found an ATM card"!

[ProgressiveEconomist]

26. HRC to USNWR: "I don't think there should be a do-over" in Florida. Keith Olberman

just had this on his Thursday show, about 7 minutes in.