Obama is a Muslim! ?? Why haven't I EVER heard this reply?

[SoonerPride]

"Obama is a Muslim!"

"No, he isn't. He's a Christian!"

Thus goes the back and forth educating the unwitting and ignorant masses who hear a different sounding name or read an anonymous email and are swayed into prejudice and bigotry and fear.

However, to me, the reply is equally disturbing. Not in that it sets the record straight, but doesn't ever have the inclusion of

"SO WHAT IF HE WAS?"

I've yet to hear anyone ever say it should be a non-issue anyway. Though to be fair, I can't read and watch all the news all the time, so maybe it was said and I just missed it.

But really, has anyone heard people dismiss even the premise BEHIND the smear, which is that it shouldn't matter ANYWAY if he were a Muslim, a Jew, an atheist, or a God-fearing church going down home all American apple pie eating Christian?

[AnarchoFreeThinker]

1. you're right, but it'll never fly in the current climate.

[SoonerPride]

2. Well then that's just effing sad.

Someone somewhere ought to have the cajones to say

WHO FREAKING CARES?

[olkaz]

4. go ahead and do it

But you won't be accomplishing anything.

I would stick to just stating the truth, that he's not Muslim.

[SoonerPride]

9. Welcome to DU.

Hi there

[olkaz]

13. Not new. Just a lurker. eom

[ElsewheresDaughter]

12. spoke to my brother from Key west this morning ...he said that he would vote for.....

McCain before he would vote for "a Muslim"


I haven't talked with him in at least 7 months and what he said was shocking since he has ALWAYS voted Dem so this shocked the hell out of me and effing A I set him straight on it.

But that said....when he told me that most of the people in Key West truly believe that Obama is a Muslim....and if Clinton is not the nom they will either not vote (stay home) or vote for McCain.............that is frickin scary!


oh and my sister Kit who lives in upstate NY just yesterday told me the same damn thing about all her coworkers....they all believe that Obama is Muslim plant in our govt and will vote McCain

I am totally freaked out aND VERY WORRIED ABOUT 04.

[Deep13]

3. It wouldn't matter to me as long as he was a secular Muslim.

Frankly, Romney's Mormonism didn't matter to me.

Nevertheless, I think it is wishful thinking to suggest that it would matter to most voters.

[SoonerPride]

7. Sadly, I know it DOES matter to many voters

But I'd still like to hear SOMEONE say it should be a non-issue ANYWAY.

Like when people accuse someone of being gay, as if that makes them some kind of pariah.

I'm not a Muslim, I'm an atheist. So I have no particular dog in this fight, except.....

I am gay. And this kind of underlying "fear of the other" gets under my skin.

It is high time someone on the national stage said, ala the infamous Seinfield episode, "not that there's anything wrong with it if he is" a Muslim.

[Deep13]

23. Well, I'm saying it now.

As long as the theology is not going to be the basis of public policy and as long as the seperation of mosque and state is respected; a candidate's religion is irrelevent to public office. Huckabee would be much scarier than Obama if O. were a Muslim (and he's not, of course). Huckabee wants to change the Constitution to reflect "God's law" as he understands it.

[JerseygirlCT]

31. What do you mean by a "secular Muslim"?

Do you mean someone who doesn't really practice or believe in his faith?

Or do you mean someone who also honors the separation of church and state?

[Deep13]

33. I mean a someone who is a Muslim the way Bill Clinton was a Baptist...

...or JFK was a Catholic. Someone who considers himself part of secular, American society primarily and whose faith is secondary to that. Kennedy did not sit around wondering whether his policy decisions were consistent with Catholicism.

So the direct answer to your question is "both", someone who respects the distinction between church and state and someone who does not rely on theology for policy judgments. That necessarily means someone who does not take his/her religion especially seriously--more like a social identity than a way of life.

[JerseygirlCT]

34. Wow, well I wouldn't agree with that.

For someone who has a faith (one worth having) that faith is integral to who they are. That doesn't at all mean that it cannot be combined with a strong belief in the Establishment Clause, however.

And I would guess that both Clinton and JFK might bristle at a characterization of their faith as more social identity than something they took seriously.

How about Jimmy Carter? Was he terribly dangerous to our Constitution? I don't think anyone could claim that there is a man who doesn't take his faith seriously.

It's not a matter of making your faith secondary, any more than making your ethics secondary is important. It's a matter of understanding both the Constitution and your role w/in its boundaries.

[NoBushSpokenHere]

5. My first reply is...

No, he isn't that rumor was debunked, provide a brief explanation regarding the false rumor and then...

I follow with, "So what if he was anyhow?" I am amazed at the perplexed look on their faces as they really hadn't thought of the reason they weren't supposed to like that... It is fun to evaporate the kool aid at times :)

[Deep13]

26. Religious tests for office are unconstitutional.

It doesn't say who may not impose a religious test. It just says that such tests are right out. I have always read that mean in part that voters are not allowed to rely on religion when marking an "X." I know there is now way to enforce that requirement on voters, but I see it as a requirement nonetheless.

[InvisibleTouch]

6. Actually that's always been my response.

I know he's not, but so what if he was? My only problem with religious people (of all denominations) is if they try to force their belief onto others and make policy by it; otherwise, I don't care what others choose to believe. That's entirely a personal matter.

[SoonerPride]

8. But have you heard any pundit or news anchor

..........of other bloviating talking neck say that?

I sure haven't.

[InvisibleTouch]

28. No, but then I barely watch TV.

The "So what if he was" response should be part of the overall meme, though, I agree - if not among the "talking necks" then at least among the rest of us. Get enough people to spread the word and it will creep into the general consciousness.

[kentuck]

10. Yep. That's a real winner!

That'll bring out the voters.

[Freddie Stubbs]

11. You will probably not hear that response from Obama himself

[redqueen]

14. Because you'd have to have been living under a rock for the past 7 years

in order to not know why it matters.

There are many bigots in this country. Do you think the increase in hate crimes against Arabs / Persians after 9/11 was a coincidence?

[Yael]

15. It isn't about being muslim. The smear is about LYING about being muslim

The manchurian secret muslim.

[SoonerPride]

16. I understand that but why not break the lie at its kneecaps?

Why not attack the underlying premise that being a Muslim is something scary?

[frazzled]

21. Obama did just that on 60 Minutes--you weren't listening

(see my post below).

[frazzled]

17. First and foremost, because he's not

But clearly you did not hear his response on 60 Minutes the other night. After again restating that he was not and had never been a Muslim, he said it's not only a scurrilous attack on him because it's not true, but it's also an attack on Muslims, because it insults them. He went on at some length about the issue.

I'm sure you can find a You Tube video of it, not that I think you'll bother.

[SoonerPride]

22. Why wouldn't you think I'd bother? Weird reply....

Thank you for the reply anyway.

I had missed that interview.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BHe8N5hL0Wo

I'm glad someone has said it.

Now if only more pundits would repeat that meme.

[frazzled]

29. It was actually last Sunday's 60 Minutes ...

The pre-Ohio one that caused the dustup when Hillary made her famous "as far as I know" response. (This one is from early February, apparently).

I apologize for making that comment--but generally I find that if people haven't tried to find out the answer to their question before they post, they generally aren't interested in even reading or viewing the facts when provided, much less seek them out. But I was apparently wrong in your case ... and I apologize for the snark.

[bowens43]

18. That would disqualify him

in the minds of the vast majority of Americans.

[RoadRage]

19. I actually wrote this email reply a couple of months ago...

it includes the "it doesn't matter" portion pretty well. Feel free to use it!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=4032401&mesg_id=4032401

[SoonerPride]

24. GREAT!

Thank you very much.

[Deep13]

27. That's what I have been using. nt

[Sparkly]

20. I've wondered the same.

Yes, it has to be countered factually -- and the fact is, it's a lie.

BUT -- it bothers me that "Muslim" is said as though it were equivalent to "ax-murderer."

[dailykoff]

25. He isn't, but his Islamic credentials give him a huge advantage

over Hillary and McCain. Here's a post where I explain why:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=4867223&mesg_id=4867223

[JerseygirlCT]

30. I do, all the time

That's what's particularly nasty and insidious about the rumor: it's not only untrue, but it plays to the most bigoted and fear-mongering traits in the American psyche today - ones that have been carefully stoked by GWB and co.

If he were Muslim, it shouldn't matter a bit.

[Hepburn]

32. My friend got an email from a RW Nazi Bush lover...

...with this kind of "Moose-lim" crap being hurled. The response was the "so what if he was" answer. IMO, that is the best response.

[Redstone]

35. Damn if I know. Unless he or she was a Scientologist, I could NOT care less about

a candidate's religion.

Redstone