In case any one has forgotten that Hillary is a liar, and not even a good one at that....

[mythyc]

DNC Chair Howard Dean's Letter to the Democratic Pres. Candidates:
"As the leader of the Democratic Party, I strongly urge you to adhere to the 2008 Delgate Selection Rules. ...

The 2008 Delegate Selection Rules adopted by the full DNC at its August 2006 meeting clearly provide that only 4 states -- Iowa, Nevada, New Hampshire and South Carolina -- may hold their respective contests prior to February 5, 2008. The finding of Non-Compliance included a 100% loss of pledged and unpledged delegates."
August 31, 2007

---------------

Clinton Campaign Official, Public Statement on the DNC's Michigan and Florida pledge:

"We believe Iowa, New Hampshire, Nevada and South Carolina play a unique and special role in the nominating process. And we believe the DNC's rules and its calender provide the necessary structure to respect and honor that role. Thus, we will be signing the pledge to adhere to the DNC approved nominating calendar."

Official Release of the The Hillary Clinton Campaign
September 1, 2007 (the next day! so prompt...)

-----------------

Hillary Clinton, interview with KO on MSNBC News: (stutters included for emphasis)
Q: "Does that effort, is it fair for critics who look at that effort, and say, this is Senator Clinton trying to change the aggreed-upon rules in Florida after the game has already begun and in fact has already been played?"

A: "No, Not at all. We agreed that we would not campaign in either Florida or Michigan and we -- uh I certainly did not. And uh I was pleased that, against an organized effort to vote "Uncommitted" in Michigan, I got a healthy majority there and I'm pleased that today I had another victory in Florida. Uh, there have been the four early contests - I'm very grateful for my victories in New Hamshire and Nevada, and, uh, in Michigan and Florida. And I think it's, uh, absolutely fair to say that any Democrat needs to win uh Michigan and Florida, if we're going to be sure to have a victory in November 2008. That's what I intend to do Keith. And I think uh there's no reason why anyone should uh doubt the importnace of Florida. We've seen that uh time and time again. So I am going to work to do everything I can to seat these delegates. I think they earned it. They played by the rules, we all played by the rules. But now we need to move on, and we need to start thinking about victory about victory for hte Democrats and that's what I'm going to do."

...

Q: "Question here that pertains to a statement that Senator Obama's campaign just put out and we'd appreciate your reaction to it. Let me read it in full: 'When Senator campaign was campaigning in Iowa and New Hampshire, she said that states like Michigan and Florida that won't award delegates -- quoting you -- "don't count for anything" -- unquote -- now that Senator Clinton has lost badly in South Carolina, she is trying to assign meaning to a contest that awards zero delgates and where no campaigning has occurred." Beyond the laughter, what's your reaction?

A: "Well, you know, that's typical campaign jargon. Uh, look, we have each won two of the early four states. I've also won in Michigan against a, a very concerted effort by my oppoinenets to try to get people to vote uncommitted. And I have just won a big victory in Florida. You know the election is about the future. And coming very close in uh time is whether or not the Democrats will be able to put together the electoral votes to win. And I think that all those voters who turned out for us already in the states that have participated didn't do it uh just to have their vote counted one time. They did it because they thought they were picking the next President of the United States. And the way we're going to get to have the next President be a Democrat is to make sure that every state believes that its votes count. And there isn't any state where that's more important than Florida because of recent history. ===>

So we all agreed not to campaign, but now that uh the election has been held, I am very proud that I have won, and I am very very muchlooking forward to having Florida in the winning column in November."

________________________________________________________________

IN CAPS AND UNDERLINED IN CASE SOME CLINTON PROSELYTIZER ATTEMPTS TO RANT OR POSTURE OTHERWISE:

WHY CHANGE HER WORD? AFTER SIGNING A PLEDGE NO LESS? NOT A PLEDGE SIMPLY NOT TO CAMPAIGN, AS SO MANY OF YOU SO OFTEN CIRCUMLOCUTE, BUT A PLEDGE TO HONOR THE DNC'S DECISION... THE DNC's NOMINATION CALENDER DECISION. :shrug:

We all enjoy the double-speak. Lay it on us. :popcorn:

Oh yes, before I forget: I anticipate some "TU QUOQUE" rebuttal about Obama. Feel free to post those here, but first explain why it's ok for Hillary to lie and then ignore said deceit.

[Taxmyth]

1. I see it as politics

as usual in the United States. But how does this convince me that I should vote for Senator Obama?

[Skittles]

4. exactly

I am shocked how many people seem to forget THEY ARE POLITICIANS

[John Q. Citizen]

6. I think you should vote for the liar if you want. I'm voting for less corruption, not more.

[Taxmyth]

11. And again,

how does this make me want to vote for Senator Obama? Hey, I'm easy.....it doesn't matter who the Dem candidate is, they have my vote. But not everybody is as easy as I am. You want Senator Obama to be President? Stop alienating potential voters and start showing the hows and whys he should be elected.

I think Senator Clinton brings more to the table in the way conducting foreign policy talks and negotiations. She's visited and dined with world leaders both as First Lady and as a Senator and this is a quality that both Senators McCain and Obama may not have the same breadth of experience.
There is going to be a lot of fences mended after the last 8 years and she has a good background to get THAT job done.

[John Q. Citizen]

14. Well you either voted in the New York primary already, or you didn't.

So I'm not too worried about alienating your vote, and as you don't care who the nominee is, even less so.

I'm voting for the progressive, grass roots insurgent on Jun 3rd.

I won't vote for the liar whose only reason to still be in it when she can't win it is to try to damage Obama. She's a liar and worse.

[Taxmyth]

15. Short term thinking

for a long term agenda. Is this what I can expect from a President Obama? If you want me to convince others why they should vote for Senator Obama in the general election, it will have to better than the meme "because he's NOT Senator McCain". That's just not going to fly especially in the areas outside NYC and a few other larger cities here in NY where the attitudes are more right of center than left. I can tell them now that a President Clinton would be beneficial to them because she's a Senator from New York and has already created legislation beneficial to them. Selling a President Clinton is hard enough, I just don't see how I can sell them on a President Obama.

Reneging on a campaign pledge is not a lie. It shows an ability to adapt to changing scenarios, something a President needs to be able to do. Senator Obama promises a timeframe to get troops out of Iraq. Should he be elected President and find that this pledge he made during the campaign cannot be accomplished, should I consider him a "liar" also or be comforted that he shows a leaders ability to adapt to circumstances?

[femmedem]

22. How about pointing to Obama's skill in running his campaign.

In a way, the POTUS is like the CEO of the country. His campaign has shown me that he can put together a great team, strategize fantastically, and prioritize spending--like a very effective CEO.

Foreign policy: during the height of the primary season, without much publicity, Obama was facilitating calls between Kenya's president and the opposition leader.

http://0-firstread.msnbc.msn.com.millennium.unicatt.it/archive/2008/01/08/558781.aspx

And I do like his willingness to meet with foreign heads of state without them having to meet a litmus test. I like his stance that when you disagree, you keep talking. I prefer this to Clinton's position that foreign leaders need to meet certain preconditions in order to have a meeting.

Flexibility: On the same day Susan Power resigned after making the Monster comment, she also had an interview with the BBC where she said that Obama would remain flexible based on the situation and military leaders' advice. I can send you a link if you missed this. (This was not great news for me but I understand you might see it differently.)

I hope that would help you persuade someone, or be motivated to persuade someone, to vote for Obama. Let me know. And welcome to DU. :hi:

[Taxmyth]

23. Thanks

And thanks for the useful information

[Carolina]

20. Fine, then vote for the thieving, rule changing

going back on her word, triangulating, IWR voting, Bush-lite, kitchen sinkin throwing, stop at nothing political MONSTER.

[Taxmyth]

25. Thank you

I will. Far more experienced in Federal and world affairs, a savvier politician able to give as good as she gets. Which will be important when the GOP slime machine gets ramped up against the Democratic Party candidate. And she's electable, I've heard many staunch GOP supporters say they would vote for her. Of course, they tell me this privately so their Husbands don't hear.

But how do I convince them to vote for Senator Obama? Enlighten and inform, don't denigrate. GOP lite tactics won't help his cause any.

[Carolina]

26. savvy my ass

she can't even manage a decent campaign much less the nation which is why she's losing now and will lose should she steal the nomination.

[Taxmyth]

27. very helpful

And once again GOP lite tactics that only seek to inflame rather than inform. I've seen several informative posts from people who disagree with my assessment of the general election and those I can use should Senator Obama become the nominee for the Democratic Party.

One of my biggest fears of a Senator Obama running for President is that he won't be able to withstand the right wing attacks that are their signature in an election. Senator Clinton has proven this ability and, indeed, it is a strong point for her.

The most effective way to fight these attacks is to have many, MANY supporters who can counter the negativity by providing potential voters with truthful information that is important to them and shows them why a particular candidate deserves their vote. All politics is local.

Good day

[Melinda]

2. Proof Hillary Clinton lied about her pledge and seating delagates:

when she signed the DNC pledge as shown:

THEREFORE, I, HILLARY DIANE RODHAM CLINTON, Democratic Candidate for President, pledge I shall not campaign or participate in any state which schedules a presidential election primary or caucus before Feb. 5, 2008, except for the states of Iowa, Nevada, New Hampshire and South Carolina, as "campaigning" is defined by rules and regulations of the DNC.

And why, when NPR asked in 10/07, why she was keeping her name on Michigans ballot, did HRC reply that Michigans election was not going to count for anything if she intended to seat the delegates?:

Well, you know, people in Michigan are flat on their backs. They have the highest unemployment rate in America. They are now grappling finally with what they are going to do with the auto industry. 1 in 10 jobs in America is tied to the auto industry which is -- the American auto industry, which as we know is centered in Michigan. You know, it's clear this election they're having isn't going to count for anything. - Hillary Clinton, New Hampshire Public Radio, 10/10/2007

http://www.nhpr.org/node/13858">listen here

This is the 4th time in one week I've posted this nugget, and I've yet to get a single response from a Clinton supporter explaining how her switch from her position before the primaries constitutes anything other than a lie now that she is behind Obama.

Crickets.

[rodeodance]

3. With the anger tone of your post I hope no one gives you a response either.

[Skittles]

5. ditto

n/t

[Melinda]

12. Damn, you responded to "ignored " which means you're either ignored too OR makes you a dittohead

Oh, the horror. :eyes:

How about you present a cogent rebuttal to what I actually posted?

[Skittles]

16. wtf are you talking about? Apparently the poster is ingored by YOU

NOT ME

[Melinda]

17. Correct; he is on my ignore. Your "ditto" of his ignored remarks means, from my perspective that....

You're technically (not literally) on ignore as well since you posted "ditto" and I can't see his ignored remarks.

Sorry if this confused you... was not my intent. :)

[Skittles]

18. I am not a "dittohead"

I am simply someone who actually sees the candidates from both sides and I am sick of the "bot" mentality around here - it is worse than idiot freepers

[Melinda]

19. That was a play on words as I am unable to only see your "ditto"

Again, it was not my intent to confuse you, and certainly not to upset you. I appreciate reasoned responses and dialogue as well as you do... perhaps we have more in common then you may think. Take care.

[John Q. Citizen]

8. I hope you don't find facts to be angry. That would be wierd.

[John Q. Citizen]

7. Yep, Hillary is a liar. You should send that as a lttr to newspapers in PA.

[Window]

9. Those "just words" are damning for the liar.

[Window]

10. K/R.

:kick:

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

13. Pledges don't mean shit to Hillary, except for the one she made to herself.

[Carolina]

21. with each passing day HRC reveals herself to be

the thieving, rule changing, going back on her word, triangulating, IWR voting, Bush-lite, kitchen sinkin throwing, stop at nothing political MONSTER Samantha Power said she was!

And I couldn't agree more.

[Auntie Bush]

24. Seems to me Obama has told a few lies himself. But that doesn't matter.

He's infallible to his minions. Reminds me of the three blind mice.