Joe the Revelator
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Tue Mar-11-08 09:33 PM
Original message |
PA is not a "must win" for Obama |
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Everybody should remember that. PA is nowhere near as important as Hillary and the media want it to be.
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OzarkDem
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Tue Mar-11-08 09:33 PM
Response to Original message |
1. But its a must win for Dems in the GE |
tekisui
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Tue Mar-11-08 09:35 PM
Response to Reply #1 |
6. And that win is not dependent on Hillary. |
OzarkDem
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Tue Mar-11-08 09:38 PM
Response to Reply #6 |
15. So Obama can lose PA in the primary |
tekisui
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Tue Mar-11-08 09:41 PM
Response to Reply #15 |
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Just as he can lose CA in the Primary and win it in the GE. And NY, and NJ.
And just as Hillary could win Texas in the Primary and no Dem will carry it in the GE.
The Primary and the General have a completely different calculus behind them. Don't let Hillary fool you on that one.
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BzaDem
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Tue Mar-11-08 09:46 PM
Response to Reply #23 |
27. Then why do Obama supporters keep saying he can win red states (that in reality we can't win)? |
tekisui
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Tue Mar-11-08 09:48 PM
Response to Reply #27 |
29. He can't win "red" states. |
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But, he can in fact turn many states blue. Ones that HIllary has no chance in hell of turning. CO, MO, VA, NV, GA, ID.
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BzaDem
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Tue Mar-11-08 09:54 PM
Response to Reply #29 |
32. We lost GA by 17 points and ID by 38 points in 2004. |
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Edited on Tue Mar-11-08 09:54 PM by zlt234
And you are saying Obama can win these?
I agree that primaries and caucuses most of the time give little insight into GE performance. I certainly apply this to states we lost by 17-38 points in 2004.
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tekisui
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Tue Mar-11-08 09:58 PM
Response to Reply #32 |
33. Yes, ID and GA would be in play with an Obama Nominee. |
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They will be close, and could very well swing.
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goclark
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Tue Mar-11-08 10:10 PM
Response to Reply #23 |
38. John King said on CNN that with MI and FL and Ohio |
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Hillary will be in good shape ~ they are spinning like wild fire now.
Meanwhile the DNC sits back and says nothing.
Now they are saying that their CNN poll says that Obama people would not have a problem having Clinton as the VP on his ticket but Clinton's voters don't want Obama on her ticket etc. etc. etc.
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tekisui
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Tue Mar-11-08 10:12 PM
Response to Reply #38 |
39. Let 'em spin till they're dizzy. |
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I'm not worried about a re-vote in MI &FL at this point.
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Spider Jerusalem
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Tue Mar-11-08 09:39 PM
Response to Reply #1 |
17. And it hasn't gone for a Republican since 1988. |
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you're a moron if you think that blue states are going to flip in the general election if Hillary isn't the nominee. There is no actual LOGIC to support that idea.
Thought experiment: New York is a safe Democratic state in Presidential elections. Candidate X is a Democrat. Candidate Y is a Democrat. Candidate X wins New York in the primary. Candidate Y wins the nomination. Who wins New York in November?
Logic is not hard, if you stop to think for a moment.
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walldude
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Tue Mar-11-08 09:40 PM
Response to Reply #1 |
20. And? Are you saying that you won't vote for Obama if he wins? |
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I know I'll be voting for whatever dem is on the ticket. Too bad there are so many who are so wrapped up in their candidate that they lose site of what this is all about.
Oh and don't bother with the "Obama can't win the GE" bullshit, you don't know that, the media doesn't know that, the bullshit pollsters don't know it, Hillary doesn't know it, McCain doesn't know it, it's all crystal ball bullshit.
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tabatha
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Tue Mar-11-08 09:33 PM
Response to Original message |
2. But he should try and win, so that any further arguments will be futile. |
quantass
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Tue Mar-11-08 09:34 PM
Response to Reply #2 |
4. Agreed, but very least he ideally should keep it close! |
dana_b
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Tue Mar-11-08 09:36 PM
Response to Reply #2 |
9. of course- and I'm sure he will- he is. he's a fighter too. n/t |
quantass
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Tue Mar-11-08 09:34 PM
Response to Original message |
3. For Hillary it's a desperate win! (Edited Title) |
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Edited on Tue Mar-11-08 09:39 PM by quantass
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Joe the Revelator
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Tue Mar-11-08 09:36 PM
Response to Reply #3 |
8. Mathmatically, she's finished with or without it |
quantass
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Tue Mar-11-08 09:38 PM
Response to Reply #8 |
16. My mistake -- you are ABSOLUTELY correct -- She's already Finished! |
Johnny__Motown
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Tue Mar-11-08 09:37 PM
Response to Reply #3 |
10. Again.. first NH, then TX & OH now PA.. sooner or later she will lose a must win |
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Besides, she can't catch up in pledged delegates anyways. This race is all but over.
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donheld
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Tue Mar-11-08 09:35 PM
Response to Original message |
5. Everybody does remember that except |
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for the few who won't accept truth.
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quantass
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Tue Mar-11-08 09:36 PM
Response to Original message |
7. Reading Report about PA being openly Racist -- but Obama has 6-weeks to open their minds |
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Edited on Tue Mar-11-08 09:37 PM by quantass
virtually always breaks Clintons lead when he starts campaigning in the state and so i hope this state's racial beliefs will lower enough. THank goodness for open minded young voters living there at least.
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OzarkDem
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Tue Mar-11-08 09:39 PM
Response to Reply #7 |
19. PA voters will focus on the economy and jobs |
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and those issues are not Obama's strength. His globalist past won't sell well in PA.
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tekisui
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Tue Mar-11-08 09:37 PM
Response to Original message |
11. As Carville said tonight, "No political gain from winning an expected state" |
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If she wins in PA, no biggie.
It will just be more money spent on a losing campaign.
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usregimechange
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Tue Mar-11-08 09:37 PM
Response to Original message |
12. Your right, she needs about 4 PAs |
stop the bleeding
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Tue Mar-11-08 09:37 PM
Response to Original message |
13. It is a must win for HRC period. Obama just has to keep it close, an |
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upset would be awesome but VERY unlikely.
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DJ13
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Tue Mar-11-08 09:38 PM
Response to Original message |
14. The MSM wants a race no matter if its Secratariat vs. a glue factory candidate |
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Its the race thats everything to them to sell ad time.
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Teaser
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Tue Mar-11-08 09:39 PM
Response to Original message |
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Wish he would, but the Pennsyltucky portion of my state won't let it happen.
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quantass
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Tue Mar-11-08 09:40 PM
Response to Reply #18 |
21. ..and Thank goodness it won't matter. |
goldcanyonaz
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Tue Mar-11-08 09:43 PM
Response to Reply #18 |
24. Right, anyone who doesn't vote for Obama is a racist. |
Teaser
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Tue Mar-11-08 09:46 PM
Response to Reply #24 |
28. Learn to read, clown. |
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I didn't say that. I said that there are enough racists in the center of my state that it can't happen.
You from PA? If not, then shut your hole. I know this state tight.
If you are, then you know it too. But that is beside the point. You will either address the points that I actually make or keep quiet. You will not put words I didn't say in my mouth.
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dchill
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Tue Mar-11-08 09:40 PM
Response to Original message |
22. I agree with the logic of all the posts in this thread... |
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Edited on Tue Mar-11-08 09:41 PM by dchill
so far. But the Clintons are NOT using anything like logic - or fair play - in these primaries. I hope he can out-do her somehow in the next few days, and end this morbid charade.
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jgraz
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Tue Mar-11-08 09:43 PM
Response to Original message |
25. Jesus, PA isn't even a "must show up" for Obama. |
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This nomination fight is OVER. Hillary's just too stupid to realize it.
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quantass
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Tue Mar-11-08 10:13 PM
Response to Reply #25 |
rocktivity
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Tue Mar-11-08 09:44 PM
Response to Original message |
26. She won't win if she doesn't get at least 62% of the vote--not only in PA |
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Edited on Tue Mar-11-08 10:28 PM by rocknation
but in EVERY SINGLE ONE of the remaining contests. That's why she's channeling Orwell to manufacture viability ("My defeats are victories! My losing gives me momentum!"), and a corporate media that wants to cash in on keeping the story going are only too happy to aid and abet her.
:headbang: rocknation
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DesertFlower
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Tue Mar-11-08 09:50 PM
Response to Original message |
30. once the people get to meet him |
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and hear him speak, i think he's got a good chance.
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Cha
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Tue Mar-11-08 09:52 PM
Response to Original message |
31. Isn't there a part of Pennsylvania |
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that is Heinz Territory..as in Teresa Heinz Kerry?
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peace13
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Tue Mar-11-08 10:03 PM
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34. Maybe not but Dems here can help him win!! |
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If you live near PA contact the campaign and find out where you can fit in. If you are too far away to travel use the internet call system to call for Obama in the great state of PA. I live in Ohio and we had an Obama staff member stay with us for the primary week. It was very nice. We all worked together but the young Obama staff really puts in the hours. Get involved and make it happen. Peace, Kim
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Shine
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Tue Mar-11-08 10:06 PM
Response to Original message |
35. Some guy from Obama's camp even said they don't expect to win it. |
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they'd LIKE to, of course, but they've pretty much been able to successfully call all the states ahead of time that they've won and lost.
From what I understand, Obama can lose PA and STILL be ahead of Clinton with delegates.
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Joe the Revelator
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Tue Mar-11-08 10:08 PM
Response to Reply #35 |
36. He can lose the rest of the states coming up and still be ahead of Clinton |
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She has to beat him by 60% in all remaining races. She probably won't pull those kind of numbers anywhere.
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Shine
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Tue Mar-11-08 10:12 PM
Response to Reply #36 |
40. So it's all gonna come down to those pesky super delegates, huh? |
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it seems fairly evident she's planning to take it all the way to the convention, "party unity" be damned!
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LulaMay
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Tue Mar-11-08 10:09 PM
Response to Original message |
37. Yes, it is. Even Dem leadership knows that it is not good if he can't win PA, OH or FL, & she can. |
quantass
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Tue Mar-11-08 10:15 PM
Response to Reply #37 |
43. He won TX, and do over for MI tend to favor Obama. |
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Edited on Tue Mar-11-08 10:16 PM by quantass
..and who's to say Florida wouldn't be close too (if not a possible iwn for Obama too)
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Skip Intro
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Tue Mar-11-08 10:13 PM
Response to Original message |
41. No, it's not a must win, it's a can't win. |
quantass
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Tue Mar-11-08 10:16 PM
Response to Reply #41 |
45. For Hillary that is true -- She can't win delegate total -- It's already over. |
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Edited on Tue Mar-11-08 10:17 PM by quantass
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cooolandrew
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Tue Mar-11-08 10:16 PM
Response to Original message |
44. Yes, it is HRC peception spin if she win s epxect her to milk it into creamcheese. |
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Edited on Tue Mar-11-08 10:16 PM by cooolandrew
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