Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

Jeremy Wright and Philly

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion: Presidential (Through Nov 2009) Donate to DU
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 09:01 PM
Original message
Jeremy Wright and Philly


Leading black clergy group backing Obama

]By DAVE DAVIES
Philadelphia Daily News

U.S. SEN. Barack Obama is expected to get the endorsement of the leading organization of local African-American ministers tomorrow, when the United Black Clergy of Philadelphia and Vicinity meets to consider a presidential endorsement.

The organization's president, the Rev. Ellis Washington of the St. Matthew AME Church in West Philadelphia, declined to predict an outcome, but several members of the organization and other observers have said that Obama will prevail.

The excitement for Obama apparently trumps a history of affection and support among Philadelphia African-Americans for President Bill Clinton, whose wife, Hillary, is Obama's rival for the Democratic nomination.

<...>

White said that Rev. Jeremiah Wright, the pastor of Obama's church, is the son of a former pastor of the Grace Baptist Church in Germantown.


Q: Barack Obama calls you his spiritual mentor and role model.

Photo Of Wright A: He's kind in his use and choice of language. Someone just asked me … about mentoring Barack and I said, you know, Barrack came here like he is now. I can't take credit for that. Barack has always been someone committed to grassroots organization, committed to the poor, committed to all people, committed to trying to find common ground. In fact, when I met him I called him the dreamer, and I'm laughing because the night he was elected he asked me to deliver the opening prayer. And before I led his supporters in prayer I said I just want to say to you publicly -- your dream has come true. And I said that because when I met him he came into my office with all these wonderful ideas. He was a community organizer ... He was the organizer of all the churches in Chicago and got us all working together across the denominational lines. And I listened to him and I said, "Do you know what Joseph's brothers said to him when they saw him coming across the field?' He said, "No." I said, "They said behold the dreamer. You're dreamin'. This ain't going to happen." Well, the night he was elected I said your dream has come true, because he had pulled off bringing together disparate people, ethnicities, interests, from down-state -- I've been in Chicago since '69, and it's always been Chicago versus the rest of the state. He's been down-state and gotten miners, farmers, people in Cairo, Illinois, people who wouldn't even think about Chicago much less a black person voting for them, because he'd shone an interest in them, because six years in the state legislature have show he really cares about people, that he's not waving any banners or flags about my way or the doorway, you know, black power -- no, people power. That we can -- black, white, Hispanic, Asian -- we've got kids to raise, we've got neighborhoods to keep safe, we've got women and children to be concerned . We all have common interests. Well, that kind -- he was like that, he was like that. And, you know, I'd like to take credit and say yes, I made him who he is. No, I didn't. He was like that when I met him. He's been like that 23 years now. And right after he was elected I was at the Massachusetts Conference of the United Church of Christ. And they said what word of advice would you give to Senator Barack Obama now that he's United States senator? That you please stay the same now that you're in the United States Senate as you've been across the years, because that's very important.

link


Wright's sermon: "Audacity to Hope"

Today the ludicrous talking point calls for Obama to cut ties with his "radical' church:

Trinity United Church of Christ is a megachurch, the largest congregation of the United Church of Christ, with 10,000 members.<1> It is also one of the largest African-American churches in Chicago, Illinois. Barack Obama, the junior United States Senator from Illinois and candidate for the Democratic Party Presidential nomination, is the most notable congregant, and a member since 1988.<1><2><3><4> The pastor has most recently been the Rev. Jeremiah Wright.<5><6><7> Wright announced his retirement to Senior Pastor status in early 2008, and he is being replaced by the Rev. Otis Moss III.<8>


The United Church of Christ (UCC) is a mainline Protestant Christian denomination principally in the United States, generally considered within the Reformed tradition, and formed in 1957 by the union of two denominations, the Evangelical and Reformed Church and the Congregational Christian Churches.

According to the 2007 yearbook, the United Church of Christ has approximately 1.2 million members and is composed of approximately 5,518 local congregations.

Although similar in name, the UCC denomination is theologically and, for the most part, historically distinct from the Churches of Christ, a loose affiliation of conservative congregations<1> that arose primarily from the Stone-Campbell Restoration Movement in the 19th century.


Maybe the spinners can demand that the UCC cut its ties with Obama's church!

Here are comment by some attendees of Obama's "radical" church:

Rev. Susan Brooks Thistlethwaite

The Thing with Feathers

Emily Dickinson called hope “the thing with feathers that perches in the soul”. For those impatient of poetry and who demand pose as the condition of political discourse, I’ll spell it out for you. What Dickinson meant is that hope is the spirit moving among and through us, lifting us up.

Hope is the profoundly religious cord that Obama has struck in the minds and hearts of Americans. Religion is the search for ultimate meaning and purpose in life. So many of us had become so stricken with despair in the last years; Americans were cowering in fear and living down to their worst selves, instead of aspiring to be our best selves. Parts of the Christian faith were even co-opted and dragged down to be a “wedge” to drive us apart and to fear one another.

The support for Obama is support for this message; the thirst for meaning even in the seeming desert of politics. Obama seems to have captured that longing. I don't believe it is a "brand" or "talking point" for him. I think it is part of his religious heritage.

The spiritual roots of hope are what I have learned more than anything else from African American spirituality. Here are people who were kidnapped, brutalized, treated as sub-human and held against their will in the most degraded conditions, and yet it is they who produced the spirituals (and the blues), the greatest forms of lyricism from the American pulpit and some of the most profound biblical interpretation in the history of Christianity. The deep meaning of hope is found in the fact that hope and suffering are inextricably linked.

Of course Obama learned “The Audacity of Hope” in church. When I am empty and tired and fed up, I too go to Trinity United Church of Christ to be inspired and renewed by the kind of community that knows that life is not just handed to you. You have to hope beyond hope and lift one another up to make it at all. When Dr. Jeremiah Wright, Jr. recently retired as senior pastor at Trinity UCC, I emailed him that I considered him the best theologian, hands down, I had ever heard from the pulpit. And believe me, I’ve heard a lot of preaching in my life.

more


Susan Brooks Thistlethwaite
President, Chicago Theological Seminary

The Rev. Susan Brooks Thistlethwaite, is the 11th President of Chicago Theological Seminary. She has been a Professor of Theology at the seminary for 20 years and director of its graduate degree center for five years. Her area of expertise is contextual theologies of liberation, specializing in issues of violence and violation. An ordained minister of the United Church of Christ since 1974, the “On Faith” panelist is the author or editor of thirteen books and has been a translator for two translations of the Bible. Her works include Casting Stones: Prostitution and Liberation in Asia and the United States (1996) and The New Testament and Psalms: An Inclusive Translation (1995). Since the September 11, 2001 terrorist attacks, Thistlethwaite has been working diligently to promote peace, including a presentation at the U.S. Institute of Peace, which appears in one of their special reports. Most recently she edited and contributed to Adam, Eve and the Genome: Theology in Dialogue with the Human Genome Project (2003).


Jane Fisler Hoffman is a member of Barack's church:

Wright's comment:

"The government gives them the drugs, builds bigger prisons, passes a three-strike law and then wants us to sing 'God Bless America.' No, no, no, God damn America, that's in the Bible for killing innocent people," he said in a 2003 sermon. "God damn America for treating our citizens as less than human. God damn America for as long as she acts like she is God and she is supreme."

In addition to damning America, he told his congregation on the Sunday after Sept. 11, 2001 that the United States had brought on al Qaeda's attacks because of its own terrorism.

"We bombed Hiroshima, we bombed Nagasaki, and we nuked far more than the thousands in New York and the Pentagon, and we never batted an eye," Rev. Wright said in a sermon on Sept. 16, 2001.

"We have supported state terrorism against the Palestinians and black South Africans, and now we are indignant because the stuff we have done overseas is now brought right back to our own front yards. America's chickens are coming home to roost," he told his congregation.

link


Some people are conflating a comment about America with racism. It's as if they don't consider blacks Americans. Wright's comment was about the treatments blacks have endured in this country and American imperialism.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
OPERATIONMINDCRIME Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 09:04 PM
Response to Original message
1. I'm Gonna Give Ya Some Quick, Blunt, Political Fact:
Supporting this guy and trying to act like he's all hunky dory, is not quite the smartest thing to do as it relates to Obama and his campaign. This guy is bad news. He's the RW's wet dream. We should be running away from this as fast as we possibly can. Aligning ourselves with it is the LAST thing we should want to be doing. That's nothing but straight political fact. For fuck's sake, use your head sometimes.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 09:07 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. "I'm Gonna Give Ya Some Quick, Blunt, Political Fact:"
Fuck the RW and its "wet dream."

If you can't dispute the facts, take your fear and go home.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
OPERATIONMINDCRIME Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 09:14 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. I Gave You The Facts. You Are Ignorantly Choosing To Ignore Them.
The facts are that this is bad news. We, Obama, all of us, need to separate ourselves from this. That's a fact. Use your head.

There's a time to defend somebody and there is a time to run. This is the time to run. Use. Your. Head.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 09:18 PM
Response to Reply #3
6. The facts are in the OP. The facts that are not you chose to also ignore.
Wright is retired, still the OP stands! Dragging out old controversy is dubious and those doing it should be called on their BS!

Put things in context before going of the deep end trying to gin up a controversy!

Radical church, what a joke!



Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
OPERATIONMINDCRIME Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 09:22 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. At Some Point, You're Going To Have To Rise Above The Naivety.
Edited on Thu Mar-13-08 09:22 PM by OPERATIONMINDCRIME
That naivety is keeping you from acknowledging that in the world of politics and especially in the world of campaigning, it is not truth that ever matters; it is perception. The sooner you learn that, the sooner you'll be doing us all a service by not aligning yourself so strongly with something we should be running away from as fast as we can. Use. Your. Head.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 09:23 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. Are you naive? Answer this:
Edited on Thu Mar-13-08 09:43 PM by ProSense
How is the RW (that you fear) going to attack Obama for his ties to a Christian pastor and label him a Muslim?



edited typo
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Unsane Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 09:32 PM
Response to Reply #8
10. Will it matter? GOP'll gladly tie him to a pastor who says the govt made AIDS and whites deserve 911
All of it hurts him. You're overemphasizing consistency.

And I'm an Obama supporter, btw. He needs to get out in front of this thing. Trying to argue Wright is a "good guy" is pointless. That effort may play a role after the denouncing and rejecting occurs.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 09:41 PM
Response to Reply #10
12. They will tie him to Osama too. This OP is about Wright and distortions.
The wingnuts are not going to vote for Obama, but to quote a former Bush supporter:

Why does anyone give a shit what Obama’s minister thinks? Seriously? Why does anyone care what Hagee (McCain’s gay-bashing BFF) thinks? They are religious leaders. Who cares what they think- they are paid to peddle mythology to the masses, so who cares what sort of nonsense they spout? Is singing “god hates America” any crazier than telling people if they refuse to follow the wishes of an unknowable, invisible, unverifiable yet presumably omnipotent deity (as documented a couple thousand years ago by people who saw things in the desert after days without water) they will be damned to a fiery eternity in hell. That hell, of course, is conveniently located AFTER you die, so we can’t prove anything about that fiction, either.

So really. Who gives a shit what Obama’s minister thinks? He is just another bullshit artist.

And I know, I know, I am going to go to hell for writing this. Whatever.

link


Like I said, fear is not you friend.





Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Alter Ego Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 09:15 AM
Response to Reply #10
59. The people who think that Obama believes this crap
would never vote for him anyway.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Unsane Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 10:03 AM
Response to Reply #59
60. naivety much?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Alter Ego Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 01:39 PM
Response to Reply #60
66. No, realist much.
After we've seen the likes of Falwell and Robertson blame gays for 9/11 and every other horrible thing that has befallen this country in the last 50 years, no one can sit back and tell me with a straight face that anyone who believes this bilge would ever consider voting for Obama.

He has already distanced himself from Wright's comments. There is nothing more he can do.

If asked about this at a debate he can answer it in one sentence: "I do not agree with those statements made by Reverend Wright."
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
OPERATIONMINDCRIME Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 09:42 PM
Response to Reply #8
13. Wait: Who's The Christian Paster? And Does He Use The Nationally Preferred Elmers Or Something Else?
Edited on Thu Mar-13-08 09:53 PM by OPERATIONMINDCRIME
Cause if he doesn't use Elmers, then the RW'ers will have a fucking field day with whoever this guy is you're talking about...

:crazy:

Use. Your. Head.

(on edit: For context, the reply prior had said "christian paster" hehehe)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 09:44 PM
Response to Reply #13
14. A typo doesn't change the facts. Lose the fear and you'll be fine! n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
OPERATIONMINDCRIME Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 09:45 PM
Response to Reply #14
15. Use. Your. Head.
Think.

Just. Think.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 09:46 PM
Response to Reply #15
17. You know what I think: Your comments are a sign of desperation. n/t
Edited on Thu Mar-13-08 09:46 PM by ProSense
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Unsane Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 09:48 PM
Response to Reply #17
19. The issue is not US, or politicos like John Cole. Of course WE'RE not afraid.
It's ma and pa voter from suburban Philadelphia, St. Louis and Orlando.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
OPERATIONMINDCRIME Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 09:52 PM
Response to Reply #17
20. You're Right. They Absolutely Are. I'm Desperate To Win In November. DESPERATE. You Should Be Too.
Use. Your. Head.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 10:01 PM
Response to Reply #20
25. Here, use your head: review the OP again and you will see that
a block of voters in PA are moving toward Obama because of the latest incidents. Now, let's keep it going so that Hillary can lose more ground.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ElsewheresDaughter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 10:08 PM
Response to Reply #20
30. They can't
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
loveangelc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 09:47 PM
Response to Reply #13
18. I'm sorry, but some Obama supporters have lost it.
Edited on Thu Mar-13-08 09:47 PM by loveangelc
I don't understand this how you can try and act as if this will not be a problem. It will. Get it through your head now, Obama supporters, it will be a problem.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 09:59 PM
Response to Reply #18
24. You are trying to throw a hissy fit. This is a non-story, and a non-issue! n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
jlake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 12:12 AM
Response to Reply #18
53. Wow. I am glad that you see this issue for what it is.
Anyone who actually supports Obama knows this will damage him in the GE.
Kudos for standing up for principle! I know you want Obama to win - and he needs to take your advice if he is going to win.
There is no way to spin the pastor's rantings --- he sounds like a lunatic.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BlackVelvet04 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 09:53 PM
Response to Reply #6
21. Do you really think all of America is going to read your post?
Well, let me clue you in, what they are going to hear is Wright ranting and raving and saying GOD DAMN AMERICA. They aren't going to go looking for ProSense's post on D.U.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 10:02 PM
Response to Reply #21
27. Do you think America is seeing the panic of Hillary supporters on DU? n/t
Edited on Thu Mar-13-08 10:02 PM by ProSense
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BlackVelvet04 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 10:55 PM
Response to Reply #27
46. Nice try.....
Hillary supporters didn't break this story.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 10:57 PM
Response to Reply #46
47. "Hillary supporters didn't break this story." But they are the ones salivating over it! n/t


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BlackVelvet04 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 11:15 PM
Response to Reply #47
48. You don't get it .....
and I don't know if it's because you are unable to or unwilling to. Think what you like because it really doesn't make a rat's ass to me.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 11:26 PM
Response to Reply #48
49. No, you don't get it

ABC's Ross reported Wright's 9-11 remarks -- but not that Obama disavowed them



It's a bogus story!

IMO, as you can tell from the OP, Wright's comments were spot on!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BlackVelvet04 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 11:33 PM
Response to Reply #49
50. See how that works out for you.....
he has been Obama's mentor for 20 years. Obama can disavow all he wants and not many people are going to believe he supported the church and had Wright as his mentor for 20 years and doesn't at some level agree with him.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
John Q. Citizen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 09:27 PM
Response to Reply #2
9. Yep, fear is what it is. But you can't run from fear.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
JoFerret Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 09:34 PM
Response to Reply #2
11. Wish it could be so
Ain't gonna happen in a general election.

This is not about the facts, themerits or whatever. It's about votes in November.

This stuff is potentially incendiary. The GOP is drooling.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
angie_love Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 09:46 PM
Response to Reply #1
16. Hate to say it but I agree. No way do I think obama shares this kooks views
but this is fucking going to hurt him!! We need to stop the denial. Look what they did to Kerry, they LIED and we lost the election. This time wingnuts don't even have to lie, they have this crazy fucker they'll get excited about with videotape evidence no less. Why Obama refuses to throw this guy under the bus is beyond me, the pastor may have done some good things in his life but if Obama is serious about winning, this freak needs to go. Not only does Obama need to throw him under the bus, he needs to kick and push him under there too.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BlackVelvet04 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 09:55 PM
Response to Reply #16
22. And I'll bet money they will start replaying
Michelle Obama's comment about not being proud of America until now and juxtapose it with Wright's comments.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 09:58 PM
Response to Reply #16
23. How are comments from 2001 and 2003 that have been out there and reported on going
to hurt? Other than a temporary faux outrage that gets nowhere, how will this hurt, especially against McCain?

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
angie_love Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 10:01 PM
Response to Reply #23
26. 527's my friend...527's. Thats all.
We need a liberal 527 attack dog to counter but I haven't seen one that will be as nasty as repugs. Heres hoping a McCain sex scandal sees the light of day.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 10:06 PM
Response to Reply #26
28. Attacks have to be at least believable. No one is going to be convinced that
Wright's opinion is Obama's. People seem to forget that this controversy played out in January. How did it affect Obama? McCain has so many issues in this area (Hagee, Parsley), I can't understand how anyone could see this as an advantage for him.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ElsewheresDaughter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 10:10 PM
Response to Reply #28
31. omg stop it!!! of course they are going to believe just that hell 13% believe he is Muslim
Edited on Thu Mar-13-08 10:17 PM by ElsewheresDaughter
and they will tie this in with Obama friendship with the underground weathermen aka terrorist who hate America too


Obama was very friendly with Bill Ayers, one of the leaders of the Weathermen Underground. Ayers was not only friends with Obama but assisted him in his political career, and it has been reported that at one time Ayers donated money to Obama's campaign.

The Weathermen Underground started with a bombing of a New York City judge who was involved with a case over the Black Panthers.

the 527's will be all over this
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 10:12 PM
Response to Reply #31
32. Are you having fun? n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
angie_love Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 10:17 PM
Response to Reply #31
36. Ok i'm trying to have a rational conversation here and you are not helping.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
angie_love Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 10:12 PM
Response to Reply #28
33. Prosense, you underestimate Americans stupidity.
I made this mistake in 2004, i'm much more realistic now. I'm not saying Obama can't fight it, I hope he does with ferocity, but if he doesn't, this is not going to be pretty. I'm not saying you should panic, i'm just saying you need to be prepared for the ugliness.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 10:17 PM
Response to Reply #33
34. No, ignorance might cause them to believe Obama is Muslim. There is
no chance that anyone, including a wingnut (except to feign outrage) is going to believe Wright's (who btw is retired) opinion is Obama's. It's simply not going to work. You see the large congregation in the OP, you can't convince them. The people in his father's home town, not them either, and on and on.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
angie_love Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 10:21 PM
Response to Reply #34
38. Well I sincerely hope you're right but I doubt it.
I'm on your side but I've seen too many good liberals torn apart by wingnuts to believe it. But if you're right i'll buy you a beer. :beer:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 10:30 PM
Response to Reply #38
40. Here:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ElsewheresDaughter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 10:07 PM
Response to Reply #23
29. how did things Kerry did in the 70's hurt him >>>527's
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
WinkyDink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 02:20 AM
Response to Reply #23
56. I guess you've not heard the term "Swift-boating".
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
quakerboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 11:44 PM
Response to Reply #1
51. Ya know, your right
We should do our best to look like Repubs, thats obviously the only way to win.


Or we could try to win as democrats. Its a thought.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 10:15 AM
Response to Reply #1
64. Obama can easily use Hagee on McCain if he wants to play "Evil Pastor"
Hillary Clinton will not be the nominee, so it's a mute point suggesting that Obama's pastor is an "issue" to wedge into the simpleton vote that somehow thinks Wright will be preaching out of a White House window if Obama is president.

McCain and even any 527s that want to bring Wright into the mix will be SLAMMED BACK with Hagee's anti-Catholic, anti-Jewish and mostly KKK opinions.

If McCain wanted to walk into that trap, the bait is ready.


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 09:14 PM
Response to Original message
4. Very interesting..so many layers to
this..thanks, ProSense for giving some background the Reverends and Philly.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
redstate_democrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 09:14 PM
Response to Original message
5. Excellent post.
Edited on Thu Mar-13-08 09:16 PM by redstate_democrat
You know, a lot of people don't consider blacks to be "apart" of America. It goes back to the founding of this country. Blacks weren't considered "citizens" and could never be considered citizens according to not only the general population at the time, but by the COURTS. So, it isn't surprising that when people, mainstream media, talks about "America", they speak of it in terms of "their America" rather than "our America". This is what Obama is saying. We aren't a collection of red states and blue states, northern regions or southern regions, blacks or whites, we are America. America is not just some geographical marker on a map, it is more so a collection of ideals, differences, struggles, triumphs, beliefs, and people that make America what it is. Without each of these elements, it would NOT be what it is today.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Honeycombe8 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 10:17 PM
Response to Original message
35. Role model? That wacko, hysterical, hate mongering guy is Obama's role model?
I love Obama, but man oh man....this is terrible news.

I am reconsidering who I should vote for in the GE. No way I could vote for someone who actually LIKES that preacher. Toleration is one thing. But role model?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
angie_love Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 10:20 PM
Response to Reply #35
37. Obama doesn't share this guys views. That much is obvious. But he needs to disown him.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Frank Booth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 10:38 PM
Response to Reply #37
43. Barack Obama is too decent a person to toss someone he has known for years under the bus.
Unfortunately, in America, that quality could cost him the election. I don't think Hillary or McCain would hesitate a second to castigate someone who could be this big of a liability to their political future.

I'm still hopeful, however, that Obama will make it through this. This nonsense story couldn't have come out a better time for him since he's already pretty certain to get the nomination, and it's much better that it comes out now than in October. He needs to do a better job of distancing himself from the remarks, but I don't think he needs to buy into the pressure to throw this man to the wolves (at least not yet).
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tishaLA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 09:10 AM
Response to Reply #43
58. yes, on all counts.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
VotesForWomen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 02:40 PM
Response to Reply #37
67. even so, wouldn't it be too little, too late? nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 10:32 PM
Response to Reply #35
42. To the people in his father's home town, he is definitely admired. n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
saracat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 10:25 PM
Response to Original message
39. I am sorry but there is video of all his sermons. And it isn't good .
Nor was the descritption of the church itself on its website not was giving the "Jerimiah Wright Award " to Farakhan.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ElsewheresDaughter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 10:31 PM
Response to Reply #39
41. Rev Wright made all those videos of his sermons and sells them...there are hundreds of them
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
AX10 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 10:40 PM
Response to Original message
44. Sinking yourselves I see.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Oilwellian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-13-08 10:40 PM
Response to Original message
45. And look at all of these famous members of the UCC
This section lists notable people known to have been raised in or current members of the United Church of Christ or its predecessor denominations.

* Daniel Akaka — U.S. Senator from Hawaii (Democrat)
* Max Baucus — U.S. Senator from Montana (Democrat)
* Julian Bond — Chair NAACP (2004–present)
* Walter Brueggemann — contemporary theologian, poet, and UCC minister, retired professor at Columbia Theological Seminary
* William Sloane Coffin — Late Presbyterian/UCC minister and activist; 'pastor, prophet, poet'; former Chaplain at Yale University and Senior Pastor of Riverside Church, New York City
* Common — Rapper, recording artist, member of Trinity UCC in Chicago
* Jon Corzine — Governor of New Jersey (Democrat)
* Howard Dean — Former Governor of Vermont (Democrat)
* Mark Fernald — Former New Hampshire State senator pg 10
* Donald Hall — United States US Poet Laureate <42>
* Mills Godwin — Former Governor of Virginia
* Bob Graham — Former U.S. Senator from Florida (Democrat)
* Judd Gregg — U.S. Senator from New Hampshire (Republican)
* Jim Jeffords — Former U.S. Senator from Vermont (Independent)
* Dean Koontz — American writer and author. Raised UCC, now is Catholic. <43>
* John Williamson Nevin — notable 19th-century theologian <44>
* Barack Obama — U.S. Senator, 2008 presidential candidate
* Robert Orr — Assistant Secretary General of the United Nations <45>
* H. Richard Niebuhr — notable 20th-century theologian
* Reinhold Niebuhr — notable 20th-century theologian
* Sally Pederson — former Lieutenant Governor of Iowa (Democrat)
* Leonard Pitts — Nationally syndicated Pulitzer prize–winning (2004) columnist
* Marilynne Robinson — Pulitzer prize-winning (2005) author of the novel Gilead
* Philip Schaff — notable 19th-century theologian <46>
* George Smathers — Democratic Senator from Florida <47>
* Max L. Stackhouse — public theologian and professor at Princeton Theological Seminary
* William "Bill" McKinney — President of Pacific School of Religion, since 1996
* Paul Tillich — notable 20th-century theologian
* Andrew Young — Civil rights leader, ordained UCC pastor, and former member of Congress, UN ambassador, and mayor of Atlanta, Georgia

<48>

* Jeri Kehn Thompson - wife of Law & Order star and former U.S. Senator and presidential candidate Fred Thompson

UCC people notable within the denomination

This section lists theologians and other UCC clergy and laypeople that are notable within the denomination but that may have little name recognition outside the denomination.<54>

Presidents (year order)

* James E. Wagner & Fred Hoskins — UCC co-presidents (1957–1961)<55>
* Ben M. Herbster — UCC president (1961–1969)
* Robert Moss, Jr. — UCC president (1969–1976) and author of the Moss Adaptation of the UCC statement of Faith.<56>
* Joseph H. Evans — UCC president (1976–1977)
* Avery Post — UCC President (1977–1989)
* Paul Sherry — UCC President (1989–1999)
* John H. Thomas — UCC president (1999–present)

Others (alphabetical order)

* Ron Buford — coordinator of The Stillspeaking Initiative and former advertising manager for United Church News.<57>
* Gabriel Fackre — Theologian; president, Confessing Christ; Abbot Professor of Christian Theology Emeritus, Andover Newton Theological School
* J. Bennett Guess — Editor of United Church News, the denominational newspaper
* Edith Guffey — Associate General Minister
* Louis Gunnemann — UCC polity theologian and former dean of United Theological Seminary (Twin Cities)
* Douglas Horton — Ecumenist, Minister and General Secretary of the General Council of Congregational Christian Churches, translator of Karl Barth into English, and early force in the formation of the UCC.<58>
* Rev. William Hulteen — 25-year veteran of the former national "Office for Church Life and Leadership" (OCLL) and spokesman for issues of "ordained and lay leadership, theological reflection and education, clergy placement, worship and spirituality, and congregational life".<59>
* M. Linda Jaramillo — Executive Minister for Justice and Witness Ministries (JWM)
* José Malayang — Executive Minister for Local Church Ministries (LCM)
* Rev. Otis Moss III — Pastor of Trinity United Church of Christ in Chicago
* Elizabeth Nordbeck — Professor of Ecclesiastical History and 11-year dean at Andover Newton Theological School. co-editor of Prism, a UCC denominational journal.<60><61>
* Charles Shelby Rooks — influential UCC pastor and scholar who, as president of Chicago Theological Seminary from 1974 to 1984, was the first African American to lead a predominantly Euro-American theological school.<62>
* David Runnion-Bareford — Executive Director of Biblical Witness Fellowship since 1994; pastor, Congregational Church, Candia, New Hampshire
* Reuben Sheares, pastor and former executive director of the national Office for Church Life and Leadership for the UCC.<63>
* Nancy S. Taylor — frequent denominational commentator, former Massachusetts Conference minister, and presently pastor of the historic Old South Church in Boston<64><65>
* Susan Thistlethwaite — President and Professor of Theology, Chicago Theological Seminary<66>
* Rev. Bob Thompson, president of Faithful and Welcoming Churches;<67> pastor, Corinth Reformed Church, Hickory, North Carolina
* Frederick R. Trost — founding convenor of Confessing Christ; former Conference Minister, Wisconsin Conference<68>
* Cally Rogers-Witte — Executive Minister for Wider Church Ministries (WCM)
* Rev. Jeremiah Wright — Senior Pastor of the 10000-plus-member Trinity United Church of Christ, a predominantly African American Chicago congregation.
* Barbara Brown Zikmund — church historian (Hidden Histories) and President of Hartford Seminary; unsuccessful candidate for General Minister position in 1999.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Church_of_Christ
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Emit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 12:10 AM
Response to Reply #45
52. This deserves its own post n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 01:28 AM
Response to Reply #45
54. Jon Corzine is a member of the "radical" UCC? n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Scurrilous Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 01:33 AM
Response to Original message
55. K & R
:thumbsup:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 09:01 AM
Response to Original message
57. How many people have made
the American imperialism argument since 9/11? Who has questioned American policy?

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
fbuzz Donating Member (66 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 10:05 AM
Response to Reply #57
61. Yes, America and the White Devil Invented AIDS
n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 11:15 AM
Response to Reply #61
65. Non-issue:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 07:10 PM
Response to Reply #65
68. This is a media driven frenzy!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Iceburg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 10:10 AM
Response to Original message
62. So what you are saying is that he is a hero? Like Farrakhan. /nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 10:12 AM
Response to Reply #62
63. Remember when Bill Clinton hailed the Million Man March? No, here's what I'm saying
"The government gives them the drugs, builds bigger prisons, passes a three-strike law and then wants us to sing 'God Bless America.' No, no, no, God damn America, that's in the Bible for killing innocent people," he said in a 2003 sermon. "God damn America for treating our citizens as less than human. God damn America for as long as she acts like she is God and she is supreme."

In addition to damning America, he told his congregation on the Sunday after Sept. 11, 2001 that the United States had brought on al Qaeda's attacks because of its own terrorism.

"We bombed Hiroshima, we bombed Nagasaki, and we nuked far more than the thousands in New York and the Pentagon, and we never batted an eye," Rev. Wright said in a sermon on Sept. 16, 2001.

"We have supported state terrorism against the Palestinians and black South Africans, and now we are indignant because the stuff we have done overseas is now brought right back to our own front yards. America's chickens are coming home to roost," he told his congregation.

link


I agree!

What did America do in her moment of "indignation" over the attacks (horrible and tragic as they were)?

America invaded a country that had nothing to do with the attacks, destroyed it and facilitated the killing of more than a million people!

What do you say to that?

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Fri Apr 26th 2024, 06:05 AM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion: Presidential (Through Nov 2009) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC