Should GOP voters decide Democratic Primary?

[Ian_walker]

Should people who are self described GOP voters even be allowed to vote in a Democratic Primary?

We all know the the GOP is gaming the Democratic Party primaries; they have admitted as much and that their purpose is to disunite the party and prevent real change.

Should the Democratic Party Super Delegates punish a candidate who relies on self confessed GOP voters for their vote?

[leftofcool]

1. Who was the numnut that decided it was okay for repukes to vote

in our primaries anyway?

[Hugabear]

3. It's called OPEN primaries

And it's up to each state to decide.

Several states have CLOSED primaries, in which only party members can vote in their primaries. That's the way it is here in Florida. Rethugs can't vote in the Democratic primary, and vice versa.

[leftofcool]

6. New Rule.......no rethugs in Dem primaries

[Ian_walker]

11. GOP voters should be banned. They are anti Democracy.

Gaming the vote is anti democratic.

[Hugabear]

2. Not this bullshit again

Rethugs are crossing over to vote for BOTH candidates. And while many people want to pretend that there is no difference in motives, that's absurd. Of course voters have a motive when they vote! In earlier primaries, when the GOP field was still wide open, many rethugs were disillusioned with their party and were crossing over to vote for Obama. Lately, there has been a push by Rush Limbaugh and other right-wing gasbags to have rethugs cross over and vote for Hillary because they feel she would be easier to beat. To pretend that there is no difference in motive is to deliberately ignore what they've been saying for the past few months.

Moreover, as I've said, it's important to note that BOTH candidates have been "benefiting" from GOP crossover votes. So how in the hell are you going to decide which candidate to "punish"?

[napi21]

4. No, but I can see us Dems doing that to them too!

I don't really believe there are enough of them doing that to make a REAL DIFFERENCE. I remember hearing Rush crying about Dems doing that back in 2000 when the story was "Dems don't want Shrub so they're crossing over and voting for McCain."

[Warren Stupidity]

5. Only 16 states have open primaries that allow registered

republicans to vote for democrats or vice versa. Given that ballots are secret how exactly would the party determine that a candidate 'relies on self confessed GOP voters for their vote'?

[Hugabear]

7. My point EXACTLY

Much has been made about exit polling, but that doesn't mean jack shit to me - exit polls have proven to be inaccurate in the past.

[Just-plain-Kathy]

8. It sickens me to know repugs helped Hillary win Texas. ...n/t

[Ian_walker]

9. Republicans gamed candidates to create disunity and your post is doing the same.

It is a plane fact an examination of the GOP voters voting show more gamed votes were for Obama. Where do you think Republicans for Obama came from?

The Rove Trolls on this forum do the same.

Their purpose is to promote disunity.

The solution is simple the Dream Ticket. Not bothered who is on the top I just want what the GOP hate. I want the dream ticket.

[Ian_walker]

10. Michigan has said it will not allow GOP voters to vote again

[mod mom]

13. In Ohio as well. 126,000+ PROVISIONALS BALLOTS STILL NOT COUNTED and

IT HAS BEEN NOTED IN OUR PRESS THAT CROSS-OVERS OCCURRED IN LARGE NUMBERS. If nothing else the delegate count has been tainted:



Ohio GOP roots for Hillary
BY HOWARD WILKINSON | [e-mail]
One of the worst-kept secrets of the Ohio presidential primary is that Republican party leaders have a candidate they are rooting for on the Democratic side.

Her name is Hillary Clinton, and they believe that if she wins the Ohio primary and goes on to become the Democratic nominee, she will be the one who unites their dispirited and divided party and give them their best chance of keeping the White House this fall.




It is a belief that the Clinton campaign says is wrong-headed and they will campaign across the state for the next three weeks making the argument that their battle-tested, experienced candidate is the only one who can go toe-to-toe with John McCain, the presumptive GOP nominee this fall.

-snip

http://news.enquirer.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080213/NEWS01/302130097






Turned away at poll? Click here
Some are told to wait - or come back later
BY JESSICA BROWN AND BARRETT J. BRUNSMAN | [e-mail] | [e-mail]

-snip
In that heavily Republican county, officials weren't prepared for the high number of Democratic ballots requested. Some voters waited for more than an hour for new ballots to be delivered; others were asked to come back later or asked to go to the county Board of Elections to vote.

The reason: a wave of "crossover" voting, in which normally Republican voters asked for Democratic ballots. In Clermont County, turnout surged to 43 percent Tuesday - compared with just 31 percent in the 2004 presidential primary.

-snip

Secretary of State Jennifer Brunner said there was also a "crossover problem" in Akron and elsewhere in Summit County where many Republicans and non-enrolled Ohioans voted Democratic.

-snip

Of Clermont County's 128,128 registered voters, 37,714 are registered Republicans and 14,496 are registered Democrats. With all precincts counted, 26,279 people had cast Democratic ballots and 28,032 had cast Republican ballots.

Warren County has 12,440 registered Democrats and 41,377 registered Republicans. With all precincts reporting, that county was reporting 27,855 Democratic ballots cast and 28,683 Republican.

-snip
http://news.enquirer.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080305/NEWS01/803050380&template=printpicart


GOP voters crossing over in large numbers
Posted by Tom Ott, Michael Scott, Joe Wagner & Maggi Martin March 04, 2008 14:51PM
Categories: At the polls

Poll watchers throughout Ohio are noting large numbers of Republican voters crossing over to vote in the Democratic Primary between Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton.

In the Republican roost of Chagrin Falls, veteran poll worker Liz McFadden was amazed at the number of people jumping the party's ship. Democrats accounted for 70 percent of the voters in her precinct, one of seven at the village's high school.

"That's a complete reversal of what it normally is, even more so," she said. "I've never seen a switch like this."

The defectors had motives both pure and sinister.

-snip
http://blog.cleveland.com/openers/2008/03/gop_voters_crossing_over_in_la.html

FROM OSU ELECTION LAW:

Cross-over voting under Ohio law

March 4, 2008

Edward B. Foley
Director, Election Law @ Moritz
Robert M. Duncan/Jones Day Designated Professor of Law
Moritz College of Law


Blogs at both the Plain Dealer and Dispatch are reporting Republican cross-over votes in the Democratic candidate for Senator Clinton on the ground that she would be an easier nominee for Senator McCain to beat. It is unclear how widespread this phenomenon is and whether, if calculable, could make a difference in either the statewide total popular vote or the awarding of delegates between Senators Clinton and Obama. There is also the question whether it is legal, and if not, whether it is remediable in any way.

Although it is widely reported that Ohio permits Republicans to vote in the Democratic primary (and vice versa), that is not technically true. Ohio law does permit voters to switch party affiliation on the day of the primary, but it has a rather awkward mechanism that attempts to ascertain that the switch is sincere—and to prevent insincere “party-raiding” of the kind that (as described above) is being reported today.

Section 3513.19 of the Ohio Revised Code states that it is the “duty” of poll workers in Ohio “to challenge the right of person to vote” in a particular party’s primary if a poll worker “doubts” the person’s eligibility based on the ground (among others) that the person is "not affiliated with or is not a member of the political party whose ballot the person desires to vote.” The same section further specifies that the poll worker is to determine the voter’s previous party affiliation by examining the voting records of the past two years. If those records show the voter to be a Republican, for example, then before giving the voter a Democratic ballot in the current primary, the statute then directs the poll worker to have the voter sign a “statement, made under penalty of election falsification, that the person desires to be affiliated with and supports the principles of the political party whose primary ballot the person desires to vote.”

This statement is supposed to be the test of the voter’s sincerity in switching party affiliation. Section 3513.20 of the Code make clear that a voter who refuses to sign the statement is to receive a provisional rather than regular ballot. Indeed, even if the voter is willing to sign the statement, but the majority of poll workers at the precinct believe the voter is not sincere in switching parties, then the poll workers are to give the voter a provisional rather than regular ballot.

-snip
http://moritzlaw.osu.edu/electionlaw/freefair/articles.php?ID=367

From the Warren County BOE (Warren is a Republican stronghold outside of Cincinnati where the faux "Level 10 Homeland Security shutdown of the BOE occurred in 2004) web page and found that the democrats voted at 223% of the total Dems in the county. Some turnout!

BALLOTS CAST - TOTAL 57,396
REGISTERED VOTERS - DEMOCRATIC 12,440
REGISTERED VOTERS - REPUBLICAN 41,377
BALLOTS CAST - REPUBLICAN 28,683
BALLOTS CAST - DEMOCRATIC 27,855
source: warren county BOE http://snipurl.com/212z3

http://blog.cleveland.com/openers/2008/03/ballot_1.html

Board of Elections Director Jane Platten said Democratic ballots ran out at the Grantwood Golf Course in Solon at 6:15 p.m. "A significant line of people waited 45 minutes to vote," she said. Nobody was turned away, Platten said.

There also was up to a 30-minute delay at the Lonnie Burten Recreation Center, on East 46th Street, in Cleveland, while more ballots were delivered, Platten said.

At least one precinct at Olmsted Falls High School ran out of Democratic ballots, according to Keith Smith, 27. He said he waited about a half-hour before leaving to tend to his family.


Tuesday, March 4

Don't Call Ohio Too Soon
That's my advice to the news media tonight, in the event of a close Democratic primary. As returns start to come in from Ohio this evening, we should keep in mind circumstances that will probably result in more outstanding ballots on Election Night than in other states, and maybe even more than is typical for Ohio. If that's true, a margin that appears insurmountable on paper -- even with all precincts nominally reported -- may actually be smaller than it appears.

Here are the big things that might cause there to be a large number of yet-to-be-counted ballots than usual on election night:

- Provisional Ballots. Ohio heavily relies on provisional ballots, which are used for people who've moved, who don't have required ID, and whose names don't appear on the registration list when they go to vote, among other things. Most of us probably remember the delay in calling the 2004 election, when Bush led Kerry by some 136,000 votes with approximately 158,000 provisional ballots left to be verified and counted. When these ballots were eventually counted, they cut Bush's margin by about 18,000 votes. In November 2006, an even higher percentage of Ohio voters cast provisional ballots, over 3%. In light of Ohio's new ID rules, still not completely familiar to many voters, and potential problems with its statewide registration list, we can expect lots of provisionals today as well. Voters have 10 days after the election to bring in their information, and it will be a while after that before we know how many of the provisionals will be counted and who they're cast for.

- Residual Votes. These are ballots that don't register a valid vote, at least when they're run through automatic tabulators. They include undervotes (a ballot that doesn't register a choice) and overvotes (a ballot that registers more than the allowed number of choices). Both can sometimes result from ambiguous marks with paper-based voting systems, but some of the undervotes may be recoverable through a manual recount. Under Ohio law, a ballot on which a voter circles the candidates name or makes a mark with an instrument that can't be recognized by tabulating equiment should eventually be counted. As I explained in Sunday's post, we can expect a significant number of residual votes in Ohio today, because a large number of voters will be voting with central-count optical scan equipment that doesn't allow voters to check for mistakes before casting their votes. Cuyahoga County will be especially hard hit, but other counties will also be affected given that voters in touchscreen counties are allowed to vote a paper ballot on request. If the race winds up being tight, it will be important to know how many residual votes there are -- especially in the Cleveland area.

-SNIP
http://moritzlaw.osu.edu/blogs/tokaji/2008/03/dont-call-ohio-too-soon.html

[UALRBSofL]

16. It sickens me that Obama got more of the rethugs vote then Clinton in Texas

They are shameless.

[Arkansas Granny]

12. The role of the superdelegates is to vote for the candidate that they believe

has the best chance of winning the Presidential election. Since these are party officials and elected office holders, they probably don't cast their votes to punish anyone, but for what they feel is best for the Democratic party.

[Ian_walker]

14. True Super Delegates should vote their conscience.

[gatorboy]

15. Oh sure. Because they've picked such winners in the past.

:sarcasm:

Honestly, these folks should have their voting rights revoked. To them, it’s not even a question as to whom is best qualified to lead our country. To them, it’s a ball game. And their team MUST win at all costs, regardless of the importance. Fucking. Assholes.