I think we should update "Let it Sink" to "Alert and Ignore"...

[stevenleser]

If you see obvious flamebait from HRC supporters, hit the Alert button and then hit the Ignore button to Ignore the OP. You then dont have to see garbage from that person again and you give the Mods the opportunity to do their jobs. At the same time you are not kicking the thread and you are letting it sink.

[hell-bent]

1. What should we do with the flamebait from the Obama supporters?

[stevenleser]

7. If you feel that there is, you should do the same thing...

... although I have to say that I have seen a number of threads started by HRC claiming all sorts of nastyness by Obama supporters and when they were asked to provide links, they couldnt do so, but by all means, if you think you have found something like that, do it.

[MonkeyFunk]

10. You're delusional

if you think that.

[proud2BlibKansan]

22. And you're in denial

[stevenleser]

24. Which is why that person is on my ignore list...

I have no idea what they said but I am sure it yet again validated why I have them ignored.

[DemVet]

28. Ignore just shows...

...you have no real debating skills.

[stevenleser]

32. LOL, right. That ridiculous statement just earned you membership. Bye!

[Maddy McCall]

35. Ignore me, too

Please! If you can't talk to people without being a jerk, just go ahead and add me too!

[DemVet]

58. Yet you follow me around like a little puppy...thread to thread.

[niceypoo]

77. I support neither candidate, but you can ignore me too...

...because I dont like intolerant bigots

[Buzz Clik]

43. Beg to differ, Demvet.

My ignore list was near zero for years. No longer.

Those I put on the ignore list are newbs who never tend their threads -- "hit and run" posters, purveyors of raw hate, and those who are so obsessed with a topic and/or against a candidate that they are incapable of rational discourse.

Although my Ignore list has grown to just under 20, very few are the grizzled oldtimers.

[proud2BlibKansan]

50. Actually I choose to ignore the ones who choose not to debate

and just whine and complain.

[LanternWaste]

63. Rather, it may illustrate that many posters

Rather, it may illustrate that many posters simply aren't worth the consideration or the time...

[proud2BlibKansan]

49. It's one more person I probably should add

to my ignore list.

No substantive arguments, just name calling and snarky replies.

[Buzz Clik]

34. All I'm seeing from the post above you is "Ignored"

[Maddy McCall]

37. Putting people on ignore so that you can go into threads and say 'I can't see you!"

Really stupid, no?

[stevenleser]

41. Nope, not stupid. When people exceed what is obvious to most as good and reasoned discourse...

they should be reminded that they are on ignore for that reason.

[Buzz Clik]

44. I can see you just fine, Maddy. You and I have crossed paths many times.

Clearly you are not the insidious idiot that the Ignored poster has become. (My Ignore list is short enough that I could figure out who it is in an instant, but why bother?)

[stevenleser]

48. Same here. I wont ignore you Maddy because you never cross the line...

which makes my point all the more strongly.

[stevenleser]

39. Yup. (n/t)

[proud2BlibKansan]

52. ANd that's all I see from the one replying to you

:rofl:

[greguganus]

60. me too. n/t

[2rth2pwr]

75. If I'm not already, put me on ignore please.

I wouldn't want you hurt by one of my postings.

Thanks.

[readmoreoften]

98. I have so many nasty Obama supporters on ignore that it's hard to link for you.

And I can't stand Clinton.

[ekwhite]

102. Same thing N/T

[Maddy McCall]

2. Wow! Following DU's rules. That's a novel idea!

Glad the idea finally struck you. Everyone else's been doin' it for months.

[stevenleser]

9. Oh, believe me, so have I. Once the worst 35 or so HRC flamethrowers are on ignore, GD-P is a great

place.

[DemVet]

59. Then GD:P becomes...

...the Obama circle-jerk. Everyone gets a turn!

[apocalypsehow]

107. There's definite disadvantages to using *ignore* - see my #106 below. However, so many of the HRC

boosters are so nasty, vicious, and full of bile that I can well understand why a poster who didn't want the aggravation would make extensive use of the *ignore* button.

[glowing]

3. Why in the world is discourse on a progressive liberal blogging board

being shunned. Some of the Let it Sink threads that I have happened to wander into, and there aren't many, are not always snarky 6th grade stuff... Some of it is valid and well written. Please don't tell me that with Obama we are going to have 4 to 8 yrs of "if you don't like it leave" and Obama can do no wrong, just trust him. We did that with Bush.. I really don't care what label sits behind the politician or a person.. the Constitution and democracy mean 10x more than the silly little letter. Country before party.

[Maddy McCall]

4. Excellent post.

:thumbsup:

[stevenleser]

14. No, it isnt, anyone can pontificate (nt)

[Maddy McCall]

17. It's better than the OP.

Much better. Actually working on making sane discussions happen at DU instead of dividing DU, like you advocate.

[stevenleser]

18. I thought you said I was advocating the rules? I'm confused. Which is it?

First you sarcastically congratulated me for advocating the rules, (see http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=5305470&mesg_id=5305498 ) now you are saying that I am being divisive. Which is it? And if you believe the rules are divisive, then I am not the one to whom you should be complaining, right?

[UALRBSofL]

6. WOW, someone with logic

great post.

[stevenleser]

15. Pontificating isnt logic (nt)

[stevenleser]

13. Totally missing the point...

Anyone can pontificate about high ideals like open sharing of information, progressive ideas, etc. But there are rules here about bigotry and other offensive posts. I assume you agree that none of us here should be subjected to hatespeak, right?

The Let it Sink and now my Alert and Ignore are not about people trying to share ideas or convince people. I have a LARGE ignore list, and no one who is on it got that way by actually trying to share ideas. They are on it because they are simply trying to smear Obama without adding anything to the discourse at all. I never had an ignore list before HRC started losing. Once she started losing, one by one, her supporters started losing their ability to govern themselves and keep their discourse intelligent and reasoned. This isnt a phenomenon that is limited to HRC supporters or even politics. People tend to become bitter when they start losing. I just dont feel the need to read the results of someone elses bitterness.

Does that adequately explain it for you?

[glowing]

62. No. Like I said, some of the things I have read with "let it sink" are not subjects

that should be ignored. Now if something is offensive, then yes, it has no business being on this board at all, and I don't care if its Skinner himself posting. And instead of trying to label my post.. perhaps you should read and analyze it. Perhaps you should wonder why a person like myself, a heartfelt activist.. The person who has worked very hard every election (even the one's we have in between the Presidential election) is feeling like its a shouting match and that I am happy letting those with the mouths do the real work that it will take to take on The Repug machine, media, and every other brainwashed American who'd rather watch American Idol than vote.

Instead of labeling me, perhaps you could address a very serious question that a lot of my fellow acivist type people's are feeling now.

[stevenleser]

71. I ignored the parts of your post that arent for me to answer...

I cannot respond to or be responsible for every single instance where people have opted to put people on ignore to let the post sink, or to alert. First of all, there is virtually no way that either of us could know each instance where that has been done. Nor could I know every reason why someone might find a post offensive.

I do know that many people here have ignore lists for the very first time, and that includes me. I resisted having one for a very long time, I think I ignored my first person 3-4 weeks after super Tuesday, now I am approaching triple digits.

At first, I just put people on ignore who were obviously not interested in discourse or any semblance of engaging.

Lately, anyone who attacks Obama in any way has mostly made my list. I described why in another OP I wrote. As far as I am concerned, Obama is the nominee. We all know that he is whether or not certain individuals are willing to admit it. Since I regard him as the nominee and since I dont want McCain and think a McCain Presidency would be a disaster, it is unacceptable to read posts attacking Obama.

Before people attack me on that as they have in other places, realize that my opinion on that is the same as Skinners, except for at which point we agree whether someone is the nominee.

[glowing]

82. I don't think some of the subjects that have been written are necessarily

attacks. And I don't think that information regarding any of our candidates/ politicians should be ignored just because of their letter. Its not exactly like Pelosi hasn't been over-scrutinized, and rightly so, for her "off the table" crap. I do not want another 4 years or 8 years where people cannot object.. where they have to watch what they say because in the wrong croud it could cause you serious bodily injury.

As to Obama and Clinton.. I don't know. She's winning really important states that we need and that pull through in the GE. The states Obama is winning the delegates in are states that have never carried for a Democrat in the GE. Its not cut and dry.. Here's the numbers. People like myself cannot stand for another McSame. AND Clinton does have a passion and understanding of education and healthcare (and if we have informed, smart, healthy Americans--they might actually elect people who work for them). I don't like either one's policy on Iraq, Economy, or "Wallstreet"/ lobbied interests.

Thank you for taking the time to actually respond with something other than "let it sink" or whatever else. Its refreshing to have good, thoughtful discussions.... This whole "blinded love" of candidate (both sides), is something we have bellittled the morans and faux news for over the last 8 yrs.

[doyourealize1]

90. you're polarizing people

HRC voters are not inherently different than Obama voters. Granted, Obama is a "good politician". His ethics record is great.

Just because he is an angelic politician doesn't mean that that reflects on his supporters. There are many Obama posters who are rude. "let it sink" is nothing more than a disguised popularity contest designed to stamp out unpopular voices. That is not "progressive"

On the flipside, that many Obama voters think HRC is a wicked politician doesn't mean that HRC have the same characteristics.

The politician does not equal the voter. There are angels on either side, as there are assholes.

[dogday]

100. Excellent Post

Welcome to DU :hi: Some of us are just sitting on the fence letting the dogs eat the dogs...

[Benhurst]

20. Democracy is so messy and fractious. Obviously there are those

who think it interferes with our being on message as we goose-step into the glorious future.

[stevenleser]

23. Oh brother. Spare me the self-righteous imagery...

Wanting to make sure we all see a gazillion Obama pastor posts doesnt make you a free speech champion. Sorry.

[dogday]

33. Someone needed to say this...

Thanks for being a rational voice... :thumbsup:

[stevenleser]

42. No they didnt. Everyone here knows all about free speech and can pontificate just as well as that...

it adds nothing.

[dogday]

67. All I know is you have responded negatively to everyone

who posts and you don't agree with them... It is a good statement and I stand by it.. You have been up and down this thread pontificating, if you know the definition, you will see that you are actually guilty of doing what you accuse the poster of doing... Pot calling the kettle situation....

[stevenleser]

70. There is an obvious line between pontificating and advocating a real course of action

Responding to "I think we should alert and ignore on flamebait" with "I am for free speech" is about as textbook an example of pontificating as you can get.

Whereas, making the suggestion to "alert and ignore" in the first place is not preaching or coming across high and mighty at all. It is a simple call to do something, a call that many are heeding. Do you really not understand the difference?

[dogday]

79. When you realize that you yourself are probably guilty of

the most pontification on this entire thread (and I won't count your entries) your course of action is showing, and the funny thing is, I have no candidate, I have chosen nobody's side, but I say that poster said an amazing mouthful of truth, and if you don't like it, then just keep on posting buddy....

[glowing]

83. thanks dogday.. I didn't think it was pontification.. Its how I felt.. AND

really I don't click on very many GD:P posts anyway.

[stevenleser]

85. Neither of you obviously, really know what pontification/pontificate means

That's ok. Most of the rest of the folks understand what I mean.

[dogday]

93. I understand that you are the biggest offender of it on

this thread and that is all I can see... You go up and down this thread picking on anyone who doesn't have your view... So sad that a Democrat can be this way toward his fellow Democrats... I really feel sorry for you... Your attitude does nothing to help your candidate or your cause...

[stevenleser]

97. I'm satisfied I have made my point and stand on earlier statements. (n/t)

[dogday]

99. And I will let your many posts speak for themselves

and speak and speak and speak.....

[dogday]

92. It was a great statement and I stand my post, it was

not pontification.. The other poster somehow sees this as a negative toward his candidate and I don't think you meant it either way.. I see that you understand what I see is happening and for that reason I have not made a choice one... Both of these candidates are not worthy in my book, but when the dust clears, and the choice is made, I will be there to vote.. Getting my close-pin ready from 2004 when I was a Deaniac supporter.....

[anamandujano]

5. You all might just try thinking for yourselves instead of mob mentality.

Having said that, I've had you on ignore for weeks. Why does that function fail so often.

[quantass]

8. Will do ... and in effect

[stevenleser]

25. Merci

:toast:

[Warren Stupidity]

11. It seems that is very hurtful.

We are required, out of politeness to our DU comrades, to kick egregious flamebait smears pasted from rightwing sources, and to never put the posters of this crap on ignore. Anything less is just rude.

[stevenleser]

16. LOL, great post.

:rofl:

[AllentownJake]

12. I have no problem

Fighting with them. Its just an internet message board. They want to come here and fight..I'll fight.

[stevenleser]

19. And that is totally up to you. But for those of us who dont want to have to deal with that crap...

... I still think Let it Sink/Alert & Ignore is the way to go.

[proud2BlibKansan]

21. They are now posting their whiney complaints in GD

I am so over these people. This is a great idea.

Alert and Ignore. :applause:

[stevenleser]

26. That is all they do, whine and smear...

I am so over them too...

[DemVet]

27. Yeah, afterall

...this is an Obama message board.

HRC supporters aren't allowed in here anymore.

[Benhurst]

31. Nor, it seems, any other dissenting voices.

[DarienComp]

29. do we really wanna make the moderators' lives a living hell?

and I'm an obama supporter.

[dailykoff]

30. Clinton supporters already have.

They hit the alert button like it was the letter e.

[DarienComp]

40. really?

how does one know?

[dailykoff]

45. Watch what's locked and deleted.

Anything remotely off-color or flamy about Clinton get locked or vanishes within minutes; openly racist anti-Obama threads hang around for hours if not days, picking up hundreds of attaboy posts and recs.

[niceypoo]

78. Like this one?

If I recall, this hung around for a half day or so, the hatred and intolerance toward other DUers is just breath taking.

The OP is bragging about stalking Hillary supporters and being cheered on by most of the loudest Obama supporters for doing so.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=5301901&mesg_id=5301901

Hope, my ass!

[stevenleser]

38. Think about what you just asked.If someone posts flamebait, is it the fault of the people who alert?

Those people who were/are engaging in troll-like behavior will either stop or they will be tombstoned. Either way, issue resolved.

[DarienComp]

46. i'd agree with that...

obvious flamebait is obvious flamebait, of course... but there are times when it's not so obvious, and I worry that some people might get... alert-happy, shall we say?

[stevietheman]

36. I support Obama, but 'ignore' is for cowards. n/t

n/t

[stevenleser]

47. Nope, you come at it from a faulty premise from the getgo...

You assume all sorts of things that are not in evidence, implied by your use of the word 'coward'.

The question is WHY are people ignoring? If a person of color or a member of the GLBT community or a woman decides to put someone on ignore who is being bigoted toward them, is that being a coward? Should that person have to deal with the bigotry to satisfy your perception of what is courageous?

It is a short walk from there to ignoring someone who posts nothing but smears against your candidate 24x7 and refuses to listen to any arguments you have about why you like your candidate or dont like theirs. It has nothing to do with cowardlyness. I can refuse to acknowledge anyones posts and just keep posting my opinion. Does that mean I am a better debater than them because they cant reach me and I keep posting my spiel?

Finally, I think it interesting that someone who uses a handle on an internet forum is talking cowardlyness to someone who insists on using their real name to stand behind their posts. Dont you?

[stevietheman]

51. My name is Steve Magruder from Louisville, Kentucky

And my profile links to my website where my name is clearly shown.

Using 'ignore', even when used on people who make bigoted statements, or any statements you don't agree with, is COWARDLY.

Just deal with it, or eye-ignore it. Using technology to blot out a few people's bullcrap is inane. We need to *deal* with each other, not shut each other out!

[stevenleser]

54. You keep saying that. WHY do you think that?

Why do you think people making a choice not to read bigoted posts are being cowardly? Go ahead, spell it out for us. How is it more cowardly than as you said eye-ignoring it? If I decided not to read posts by a poster, how is that different from having them on ignore?

This line of reasoning makes no sense.

[stevenleser]

55. As one responder said above, they choose to ignore those who REFUSE TO DEBATE AND ENGAGE...

that is the bigger point I am trying to make. Unlike our back and forth, many people here refuse to acknowledge any point in any way. I am sorry if you think that it is cowardly, but those people earn a place on my ignore list.

[bilgewaterbill]

53. How 'bout we just stick our heads in the sand and hope they go away?

[Life Long Dem]

56. Good idea.. But the quuicker she quits the better. Screw these Hillary spamming trolls today.

Blame it on those Hillary supporters for the pressure to get out. Nice going Hillary supporters.

[The Night Owl]

57. Yes! We should compound the stupidity of LIS. {EOM}

[DemocratSinceBirth]

61. I Don't Have Anybody On Ignore

~

[IDemo]

64. Kick the good posts (even from pages 2-10), let the others sink n/t

[AZ Criminal JD]

65. Alert and Ignore

[emilyg]

66. Why are you here?

[stevenleser]

69. Why are YOU here?

[depakid]

68. What's fair for the goose should be fair for the gander, don't you think?

[stevenleser]

72. Absolutely, see my post #7

[Forkboy]

73. It cracks me up how many people this upsets.

Methinks some people hate not getting attention.

[blues90]

74. why don't you start your own website ?

Instead of promoting your agenda of ignorance ? ie , if you can't handle the heat get the hell out . As if your ignore lists make any difference to anyone other than yourselves . The people who are put on your ignore lists may have things you may agree with on the other forums and now you would never know .

[OzarkDem]

76. Agree, this is a forum to discuss both Dem candidates

its not devoted exclusively to Obama.

[Moochy]

101. So how about you reply to the countless abandoned subthreads...

you know the ones you actively ignore because you have been shown to be substantially in error or just plain wrong.

[stevenleser]

84. Why dont YOU start your own website?

[blues90]

89. I'm not the one who spouts out to tell people what to do !

[stevenleser]

96. In effect, you are. You are telling me I shouldnt suggest to people to Alert and Ignore...

and that if I want to do that, I should leave and start my own website. Problem is, skinner has provided us an alert button and an ignore button for a reason. So if you dont like that, maybe it is you who dont belong here.

[blues90]

108. Oh for crips sake , do what ever the hell you want

Nothing I say of anyone else expresses will make a difference if this is how you choose to use as a solution . Push all the little buttons until your fingers fall off , ignore and alert , what does alert do , put everyone on standby locked and loaded ?

[doyourealize1]

91. What do you mean by this?

This is not an Obama forum by any means, though it seems more like one every day. There is a reason why there are so few HRC supporters. Some poll a few days ago suggested that the supporters here were 95%-5% for Obama.

[stevenleser]

95. The person asked me why dont I start my own website, so I asked them why they dont?

It is a silly question to begin with so I was hoping they would see that by me asking it in reverse.

[William769]

80. What about obvious flamebait from a Obama supporter?

Or is that tolerated?

ON EDIT: I better watch my P's & Q's or I may be alerted on. And people say this is George Bush's fascist America. Yea right. :eyes:

[stevenleser]

81. See my reply #7

[Blue_In_AK]

86. Oh, the irony.

Do you not see that your own post is flamebait?

[Catherine Vincent]

87. People, please get a life.

You're making DU look stupid!

[The Night Owl]

88. IN ADDITION TO ALERTING AND IGNORING, WE SHOULD RUN AROUND IN CIRCLES WHILE SCREAMING!

[smalll]

94. LOL - that plan will never work.

"then hit the Ignore button to Ignore the OP ... At the same time you are not kicking the thread and you are letting it sink."

It's pretty clear that just about no-one here can put anybody on Ignore without responding to the thread to TELL the miscreant that he or she is being placed on Ignore.

I get the impression that if ignorers weren't allowed to communicate Ignore-ance to their ignorees, the feature would be little-used. :shrug:

[Skip Intro]

103. YAY! Let's create an echo chamber where only what we want to see and here is all there is.

My question would be, why not just stand in front of a mirror?

[knight_of_the_star]

104. Epic Fail

Censorship is not conducive to political dialog.

[Maven]

Oh, gimme a fucking break. Stop pretending.

[SoCalDem]

105. or how about "hide thread"

wouldn;t that be easier?..or ignore for the posters.. then you never even have to see them :)

[apocalypsehow]

106. I am very ambiguous about the use of the *ignore* button, and here's why:

The problem comes when that poster, knowing you have them on ignore, posts blatant falsehoods about you. This happened recently.

I belong to another board, a strictly pro-Obama board, and several members there, who have my "real world" e-mail address, lurk at DU because they enjoy the latest breaking news, the pro-Obama posts, etc. One of them e-mails me the other night and tells me claims - untrue claims - are being made about me by my *ignored* poster in a thread I was participating in.

This person e-mailed me the gist of these claims. Had that person not known both my "real world" e-mail address and DU identity, and had she not just *happened* to be lurking at DU, specifically GD: P, that claim would have stood un-refuted, and hundreds of DU'ers and outside lurkers would right now believe a patent falsehood about me (several falsehoods, in fact).*

Still, your OP has great merit, and deserves consideration. :thumbsup:

(*edited repost)