Anybody but Dean: is YOUR vote transferable?

[Capn Sunshine]

Yeah, we hear a lot about the hard core Dean supporters , but I'm curious, if you're a member of that loud, albeit minority group, "Anyone But Dean"

And Dean wins the nomination (not much of a stretch at this point)
will you vote for the Democratic Party nominee?

[Cocoa]

1. yes, no question about it

I'm nearly out of energy, working to find nice things to say about Dean, he's been making it hard work lately.

But the idea of not voting for him if he gets the nomination, it hasn't even crossed my mind. It's so completely inconceivable it's hard to put it into words, it's hard to even talk about.

Dean on his worst day would be ten zillion times worse than Bush on his best day.

[OneBlueSky]

2. absolutely . . .

but then, I also voted for Dukakis and Mondale . . .

[TexasPatriot]

6. heh

When can their glory fade?
O the wild charge they made!
and all that...

yes, of course, for the 100th time... we're still democrats (whether we're compared to cockroaches or not)

[Capn Sunshine]

7. I voted for Mc Govern too

But for the record, Dukakis ran a lousy campaign.

[Clark4Prez]

16. Dukakis

You're right, he came out of the convention with a double digit lead and lost it faster than you can imagine.


My personal thoughts on MD are that he was talked into running but didn't really want it. He didn't fight back and GHWB kicked his butt with "America Can't Offord That." ads.

I am certian the Democratic nominee this time around won't be as forgiving as MD was. We won't make it easy for * to get round two in the White House.

For the record, I will support Dean if he is the nominee, even though I am a Clark supporter. In fact, I am already on Dean's mailing list and I am trying to stay up with his policy positions for that reason.

He will have my time and my money in the run for the WH. I think that any other answer makes you pro-Bush. Remember in 2000, Nader told us there wasn't a dime's worth of difference between Bush and Gore? Does anyone still think he was right????

[Bucky]

3. Hell yes. But I'm not really ABD. I'm actually OBL.

Others Before Lieberman. Hmmm, maybe being "OBL" doesn't sound too good.

[_NorCal_D_]

4. Of course. I'm not that stubborn.

I don't have to support Dean, but I can certainly vote for him! B-)

[Paulie]

5. It's not transferable

but it CAN be earned. And Dean hasn't earned it yet, and doesn't look like he's able to do so (policy wise).

Little difference between * and the Dem canidate means we LOSE!

[Capn Sunshine]

8. I think that's encouraging..

Since there is a huge gulf of difference between Dean and *

[Walt Starr]

23. Now you're getting an idea about how I feel

n/t

[mbali]

9. Yes

But Dean - or any nominee - needs more than our votes. They will need our commitment, our hearts and our extra efforts during the campaign. Unfortunately, Dean is alienating so many non-Dean supporters that he may find it difficult to generate that extra commitment he would need to beat Bush.

As a friend of mine - a strong Democrat who works his ass off at the grassroots level - told me the other day, "Dean is really starting to piss me off. The way I'm feeling about him right about now, if wins the nomination, about all he's getting out of me is my vote. I can't work for such a jerk."

This feeling is far too pervasive to simply write off as irrelevant. Dean and his supporters need to begin addressing this attitude - very prevalent among Democrats - before it's too late. And just calling these folks whiners, "Dean bashers" and clueless won't do it. That approach will only exacerbate his problem since that is the very reason so many people can't stand him.

[KaraokeKarlton]

10. How do you think all Dean's supporters feel about the others?

Do you think they aren't pissing us off with their behavior? Dean hasn't been anywhere near as negative as they have been toward him. And I don't recall any of the other candidates supporters being compared with cult members or elitists. :shrug:

[mbali]

11. That's exactly what I mean

Instead of addressing the very real feelings that these folks have, you respond by claiming that you've been subjected to even worse treatment. That's not the issue. And saying, "well what about us? You did it first!" won't do a thing to generate the support that Dean would need to beat Bush. He may be riding high right now, but having the support of 25% of the base of the Democratic Party that votes in the primaries won't mean squat when he goes up against Geoge W.

The Dean campaign needs to face the fact that, regardless of whether they think the views are valid, numerous people, from many campaigns across the Democratic Party are growing to dislike him intensely. It can't all be blamed on sour grapes or political opportunism. And it will have to be dealt with. He will need those people to win and he's got to start reaching out to them - and reaching out means more than a Bush-like demand that the train is leaving so you'd better hop on.

[KaraokeKarlton]

15. Why do they dislike him? Because he's beating their candidate.

Please cite all these supposed attacks Dean has made against his opponents that were not in direct response to attacks made against him. Oh, and I want more than "Bush Lite", which people were already thinking long before Dean even brought it up anyhow.

You produce all these supposed attacks Dean has made and then we'll talk.

Bottom line, the main reason I see people on here disliking Dean is nothing more than frustration that he's doing better than their choice is. :shrug:

[mbali]

19. You really don't get it, do you?

Dismissing other peoples' concerns about your candidate is one of the reasons that so many people dislike your candidate. Moreover, you're completely missing my point. Demanding that I "produce all these supposed attacks Dean has made" won't cut it.

If you guys want people to wholeheartedly support your candidate should he get the nomination (which isn't assured yet), you'll have to do much better than that.

Bottom line: regardless of the reasons or whether you think they are valid, many people dislike Howard Dean and resent his attitude. You can blow them off as "nothing more than frustation" but if the Dean campaign takes that approach toward the many, many Democrats who have problems with him, he'll add his name to the "Democrats who got their asses kicked by Republicans and became a footnote in history" list.

[KaraokeKarlton]

25. Oh, I "get it" alright...

This is what you wrote that I responded to:

Unfortunately, Dean is alienating so many non-Dean supporters that he may find it difficult to generate that extra commitment he would need to beat Bush.

What, exactly is Dean doing that supposedly "alienates" people who support someone else? He's not attacking anyone and only responds to attacks made on him by the other candidate. Either they just don't like him as a candidate (which isn't going to change if that's their problem with him) or they just don't like him because he is winning and their candidate isn't.

As a friend of mine - a strong Democrat who works his ass off at the grassroots level - told me the other day, "Dean is really starting to piss me off. The way I'm feeling about him right about now, if wins the nomination, about all he's getting out of me is my vote. I can't work for such a jerk."

Why does your friend think Dean is a "jerk"? Is it over Dean actually defending himself against the attacks other Democrats keep hurling at him? Frankly, it's not rational to call someone a jerk for defending themselves. That leaves your friend most likely thinking Dean is a jerk just because he's doing better.

This feeling is far too pervasive to simply write off as irrelevant. Dean and his supporters need to begin addressing this attitude - very prevalent among Democrats - before it's too late. And just calling these folks whiners, "Dean bashers" and clueless won't do it.

When did Dean call any voters "whiners, bashers or clueless"? That's basically only happening here in response to Dean supporters being called cult members, stupid, and even compared to Nazis. I haven't seen any kind of improvement in the way the supporters of other candidates treat Dean supporters on here, and there are still numerous flame bait threads started that clearly intend to do nothing more than be inciteful to Dean supporters.

It's not the fault of Dean supporters that the other candidates aren't doing as well as ours, and I still haven't seen a single rational reason for anyone to really dislike Dean to the extent many on here do. :shrug:

[mbali]

26. I guess I was wrong - Dean is just a misunderstood victim.

Everyone who dislikes Dean is merely irrational since he hasn't done anything to incur disagreement and the only reason anyone can have for not liking him is that he's ahead in the polls since, after all, Dr. Dean is infallible. And he's such a genius that he'll be able to transform 25% of support among a small core of Democratic voters into a state-by-state electoral victory over an incumbent president, without bothering to reach out to a substantial portion of Democratic voters or even consider the possibility that they might have good reason to feel he has alienated them. After all, if they don't get with his program, they only have themselves to blame.

Never mind.

[oasis]

21. Dean's style may not turn off potential workers but the smug attitude of

some of his supporters will be the deal killer. I have problems holding my temper with overly sassy people.

[Jerseycoa]

12. If Dean wins the nomination,

(maybe more of a stretch than you think), I will vote for him.

[lurk_no_more]

13. I refuse to answer

until a nominee is chosen, to do so now the way your question is worded would be to admit dean could win and at the present time I am unable to entertain that possibility.

Nice try though.


” JAFO”

[kayleybeth]

14. I will vote for Dean if he wins the nomination

but I'm not sure if I can expend any energy for him beyond pulling the lever in the voting booth. I will try to shake that attitude (because I know how important it will be to beat Smirk) but I am so alienated at this point, it is going to be extremely difficult to muster up any enthusiasm for Dean at all.

On the other hand, if the nomination does not go to Clark but to someone other than Dean or Lieberman, they will have my full support... vote, money, shoe leather, the whole nine.

So, yeah... my GE vote is transferrable but my enthusiasm may not be. That's probably how supporters of other candidates feel as well but I think when it comes down to it, most of us are going to show up at the polls and vote for the Dem, no matter who it is, and even if we have to hold our collective noses.

[mbali]

22. Beautifully said. n/t

[LWolf]

17. Absolutely.

I have, at moments, hovered on the edge of ABD. Not the "group," if there is one, but the attitude. Because I don't want to vote for the man, and I resent the hell out of a scenario that puts me in that position. In the end, I will vote for the dem even if it is Dean or Lieberman. The democrat will have my vote, if not my time and effort. And most will get my time and effort as well. I'm not too worried about Dean needing anything but a vote from me; many of his supporters seem willing to go it alone. If worse comes to worst, I'll put my time and effort into re-electing Boxer and into whoever has the balls to challenge Howard "Buck" McKeon. Worthy endeavors for democrats, and work that I can stomach.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

18. How many times do we have to answer this question?

Of course I'd vote for the Democratic nominee even if we nominated a dead squirrel.

[Zomby Woof]

20. at LEAST 4 or 5 times a week

It's out of hand.

[Padraig18]

24. Fully transferrable: ABB

:dem: