SDs should nominate Hillary

[hill_win_2008]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20080402/pl_nm/usa_politics_poll_dc;_ylt=AnZU6yKUQ.Mx4W5pVcn6Dv0DW7oF

She is beating McCain and Obama in the polls. This election will come down to Super Delegates, and it's their duty to pick the electable candidate. For the good of the party and the country!

[shadowknows69]

1. Yeah, good luck with that

[Buzz Clik]

2. plonk

[thevoiceofreason]

3. Only if 1/2 of the elected officials among them want to lose their seat in 2008 or 2010

[Changenow]

4. But wouldn't that disenfranchise the voters?

And everything Hillary is fighting for in Michigan and Florida?

[hill_win_2008]

7. How so?

The race is practically a tie right now, with polls showing that Hillary can beat either Obama or McCain. How would it be disenfranchise to vote for the good of the party and country?

[redqueen]

10. "The race is practically a tie right now"

By what measure is it practically a tie?

Is there some new kind of delegate they've come up with that we're only supposed to count those?

I can't keep up with the goalposts!

[hill_win_2008]

19. What's the current count?

170 delegates ahead at the 1500 mark is not a landslide in my book.

[redqueen]

24. You made the assertion. Please back it up.

How is it a tie?

[hill_win_2008]

28. "Practically"

By this I mean, it is certainly too close for anyone to call for the other candidate to drop out of the race.

Like I said, 170 delegates ahead does not a winner crown.

[redqueen]

31. It's possible, but FAR from likely.

It's only 'pratically' a tie if you think Obama is going to implode in the next few weeks. Clinton has damaged her campaign to the point that there really is virtually no chance at all.

[Mooney]

34. You're not arguing that it's too close a race to crown a winner.

You're arguing that Hillary should be crowned, despite her deficit in the delegates, on the basis of her deficit not being very large and the results of some polls.

You're making a reasonable argument if you're just saying she shouldn't drop out yet, or that it's still anyone's game, but that's not what you're saying. You're saying that Hillary should be crowned the winner, that Obama's delegate lead should be discounted entirely because it's not all that huge, and that there are polls that show Hillary doing well.

[hill_win_2008]

42. Correct

You are right. I get carried away with the whole "Hillary should quit now", which is a bunch of bull!

Ok, to me it's "practically" a tie. It's close right now. We will see what happens in PA, etc.

I'm making the case now that SDs should vote on who will be the electable candidate against McCain. It will come down to them I think.

I think that boths sides have their baggage, but Obama's is worse. In a general election, he will get hammered and SDs should consider this.

[Mooney]

51. Hillary Clinton is the most unelectable candidate we could possibly nominate.

Obama has his own baggage, but compared to Hillary Clinton he's Ronald Reagan when it comes to electability. There is no American political figure as universally loathed as Hillary Clinton. Every Republican on earth would give their firstborn for the privilege of voting against her. She has absolutely no appeal with independents, who arguably hate her even more than the Republicans do. And because of her scorched earth campaign style, she's alienated a significant portion of the Democratic electorate as well. You cannot win an election with that kind of "appeal." She would be lucky to get 35% of the vote in November.

It doesn't matter what happens in PA. She has to win by 20 points just to remain credible, and that's not going to happen. She also has to win every remaining state by that much to make any kind of significant dent in Obama's delegate lead. It may not be that big of a lead percentage-wise, but that doesn't change the fact that Hillary Clinton simply cannot win the remaining contests by the margin necessary to even cut it in half. It might as well be a deficit of a million delegates. She will never overtake this lead, ever, no matter what happens.

And you think Obama will get hammered in the GE? Just try to picture the ads they'll run with video of Hillary Clinton in Bosnia, accepting the poem from the little girl, with a voiceover of her recounting the bullshit version with the sniper fire. That's bad enough, but when you consider that her opponent in this case is a war hero who was actually shot at, it will make her fish story about a million times more galling. Also, is she planning to take her "35 Years Of Experience" motto into the general election against McCain? That would be hysterically fucking funny to see her actually try to pass that off against an opponent who can say he has that many years of experience and is actually telling the truth. EPIC FAIL.

Obama has baggage and he will get hammered for it. Any candidate would. But Hillary Clinton has a six-piece matching luggage set and she will get pulverized for it in the general election. That's a promise. That's a guarantee.

[Cha]

58. ..

[Changenow]

49. An over 10% divide is a tie in Hillaryworld? nt

[Mooney]

27. It doesn't have to be a landslide for Obama to have more delegates than Hillary.

There is no rule saying that the person with more delegates will only have their advantage recognized if it's a landslide. More delegates is more delegates. It would be the same if Obama was 3 delegates ahead or if he was a million delegates ahead.

More = More

More > Less

[hill_win_2008]

29. In the end, yes

I agree, it doesn't matter in the end. We aren't there yet.

[Mooney]

37. That's not what you're saying though.

You're saying that the superdelegates should nominate Hillary Clinton. If you've come to that conclusion, then you're suggesting that the race is over because the criteria you've chosen have been met. You're not arguing that the race should go on. You're arguing that the superdelegates should declare Hillary the winner. The title of your thread says this much.

[Mooney]

22. Polls also show that Obama beats Hillary and McCain.

And it's not "practically a tie." Hillary is losing.

I'm just going to keep using this analogy, and hopefully it will make sense.

If "Jimmy" has 2 apples and "Jane" has 1 apple, who has more apples? And is it a tie because "Jane" only has one less apple than "Jimmy?" And should "Jane" be declared the winner on the basis of some polls that show that "Jane" might hypothetically get more apples later?

2 > 1

[Changenow]

48. If the race is practically a tie

why bother with Florida and Michigan? Just split them.

She apparently believes the elections don't matter, unless she wins.

[EmilyAnne]

5. I think it would be silly for the SDs to make their decision based on polls rather than election

results. Obama is winning. Let's see what happens in PA. I understand that you are passionate about Hillary Clinton and I respect that.

[Vinca]

6. You can find a poll to support just about any general election

scenario at this point. Nothing will count until it's winnowed down to 1 Republican candidate and 1 Democratic candidate. IMHO, Hillary had a Dukakis tank moment with the Bosnia tale and is now unelectable.

[snooper2]

8. at least hide your profile like the rest of the trolls

:rofl:

[Zachstar]

9. Small post with a link that does not work.

So supers were bad until suddenly Clinton needs them to overturn the pledged delegates right?

[hill_win_2008]

13. Why is Obama trying to steal SDs away then?

[Zachstar]

Nobody "steals" SDs legally.

So Obama is not stealing any SD

As for stealing why am I hearing Crap like Clinton checking out the Supers past?

[cali]

30. "steal" them?

bwahahahaha. What silliness. Hillypoo is the one that's said ALL delegates are fair game.

[Mooney]

43. She even said that pledged delegates are game.

And I'm not even going to bother to get into the use of the word "steal" here.

[bridgit]

15. link works from here...

[Mooney]

11. And I should marry Salma Hayek.

I should also receive checks for one million dollars in my mailbox on a daily basis.

[4_Legs_Good]

17. Hey! She's MINE!

[Mooney]

39. Hands off my wife, motherfucker!

And wash my Rolls Royce while you're at it!

[Cheap_Trick]

50. you guys fight over Salma

I'll take Scarlett Johansson while you're not looking....

[book_worm]

12. Actually she runs better than Obama in some polls and runs worse than him in others

she doesn't run as well than he does in several western states, for instance, Colorado, Nevada, Oregon, Washington, New Mexico. Even in California a recent poll showed Obama doing much better than Hillary against McCain. She loses two blue states that we have won in every presidential election since '88--Oregon and Washington according to Survey USA and Rasmussen. He also runs better than Hillary in Wisconsin, Iowa, Minnesota, and Virginia. For instance, according to Rasmussen Obama is within the moe in Wisconsin while Hillary is running 11-points behind McCain.

[charlie and algernon]

14. Mark Penn, is that you?

[hill_win_2008]

36. Kool-aid man is that you?

[4_Legs_Good]

16. "Electability" worked GREAT for us in 2004!!

Those who don't study history, yadda yadda yadda...

David

[C_U_L8R]

18. Do you think Super Delegates can't do the math?

They aren't dumb and they know when they are being lied to.
You're not helping Hillary.

[hill_win_2008]

25. SDs can't think

And they can see. If, when it comes down to it, Hillary is more electable than Obama, do you think the SDs should vote that way?

[C_U_L8R]

40. She's lost half the primary contests

They won't see that as very electable.

[bridgit]

20. Oh no you di'int BREAKING: 'reputable polling firm' determines 63.2% of BO supporters...

just crapped their pants :wow:

[easy_b94]

21. Why even comment

[cali]

23. they're not. it's that simple. SDs are rolling in for Obama every

day. Polls change day to day. Some days Obama is on top. Some days he isn't, but the SDs have had NO interest in hilly since Super Tuesday. She has received only 9 SD endorsements in the past 2 months. Obama has received over 70- including today's endorsement by Gov. Freudenthal- who Bill Clinton named as a U.S.Attny in 1994. You guys should be very, very worried by the SD trend. It's overwhelmingly in Obama's favor now.

[Zachstar]

38. Which ends any chance of supers magically overturning the pledged count.

As if there was some magical chance that supers were going to bolt for Clinton at the convention.. Obama would not be picking up more and more.

And Obama is already thinning the Clinton leads in the few remaining states she is strong in. PA looks like it will be a disaster for her delegate wise if Obama keeps up his work there. She may gain less than 20 net.

[kwenu]

26. Your information is so two months ago.

[Life Long Dem]

32. Now the winner is the polls?

[Lucky 13]

33. Luckily we don't choose candidates based on polls

Nice try. What else you got.

[hill_win_2008]

35. SDs can

And should at least use polls to decide.

[Lucky 13]

52. They sure can. But won't.

You'll see.

[AnarchoFreeThinker]

41. back again? snipers didn't get you?

[hill_win_2008]

45. Still dodge them

Yes, still here. Just for you and others:

No, I'm not a troll.

Yes, I want Hillary to win.

No, I'm not leaving DU.

Anything I forget?

[LowerManhattanite]

60. “Anything I forget?”

Only your previous seven “handles”.

[zulchzulu]

44. "For the good of the party and the country!"

Are you out of your mind?

A candidate that has nearly a 50% disapproval rating who has lost the race from a mathematical standpoint and has less delegates, less popular votes and is a pathological LIAR is not "good of the party and the country!"

It's a GOP Wet Dream.

[kid a]

46. yes - so BIll doesn't EXPLODE

[anonymous171]

47. I wish Hillary had told us about her SD plan sooner.

The we wouldn't have to waste money on the primaries.

[damntexdem]

53. Hey, c'mon: this is April Second!

The day for April Fools jokes was yesterday.

[Alexander]

54. Yeah, okay, whatever, Shillbot.

:rofl:

[Window]

55. Okay.

[Kitty Herder]

56. Late April Fools joke? nt

[thoughtcrime1984]

57. She is leading in what polls exactly? Yes, KY, WV, and some PA polls, but

the GE polls favor Obama vs. McCain over Hil vs. McCain. Obama leads in every way, really. I do not understand why the Sd's should break to Hillary.

[scheming daemons]

59. Why don't you jump in a jlake?

....we know who you are....

[taught_me_patience]

61. Is this jlake?

time to go *poof*

[ieoeja]

62. It's their duty only when nobody wins a majority.

That is why the Super Delegates were added. I don't know where this notion came from that they were added to prevent the people from selecting the wrong candidate.

They were added to prevent a brokered convention. Had Obama, Edwards and Hillary continued splitting the vote three ways, then the Supers would have decided the nomination in Hillary's favor.

The Supers would have to be the stupidest politicians in the world to overturn the results when there is a clear winner.