Obama's church faced threats

[NYCGirl]

This is totally disgusting.

http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0408/Obamas_church_faced_threats.html

Obama's church has faced threats of violence since the Rev. Jeremiah Wright's comments on race and on America became national news, an official of a church council with which it's affiliated said.

"There have been phone threats and written threats to the congregation — and we want to stand and say absolutely no to that in all places of worship," said the general secretary of the National Council of Churches, the Rev. Michael Kinnamon.

He and the president of the United Church of Christ spoke at a press conference at the Trinity United Church of Christ in Chicago, where UCC President John Thomas called for a dialogue on race, and both defended the church and the denomination.

"I have seen the UCC portrayed as some kind of radical sect," said Kinnamon. "This is nonsense."

[leftofcool]

1. If this is true, they need to publically show them

I don't doubt it, but let's hear a taped phone call or see an email or see a letter.

[democrattotheend]

2. Why?

Is the church running for president? What to they need to prove?

[NYCGirl]

3. And make KKK martyrs of the creeps? Crappy idea. NT

[crankychatter]

8. wtf is wrong with your mind?

you need evidence for this?

I've never ignored a person on DU, but YOU?

you are consigned to the nether realm for sheer idiocy

[NDambi]

58. Unbelievable. Just unbelievable.

[mrreowwr_kittty]

63. OMG you're an asshole. nt

[Tinksrival]

68. Please vist this site:

The truth about Trinity

http://truthabouttrinity.blogspot.com/

It really is a thoughtful sight. They are trying to deal with this the right way.

Come on, You know what kind of hateful crap people put out there. I don't doubt it for a second.

[EFerrari]

71. You'd think today of all days people might remember that.

Thanks for the link, Tinksrival.

[Fredda Weinberg]

4. Wright accused Americans of nuking Japan w/o thinking twice.

Look, this country ain't heaven but that crossed a line ... like the accusation the government invented AIDS as a form of genocide. Them's fighting words.

[NYCGirl]

5. So that calls for threats? NT

[Fredda Weinberg]

55. To the contrary. Fighting laws exceptions exist to keep the peace

So while we condemn those who speak w/violence, we also require everyone to "tone it down". The law is clear.

[butterfly77]

6. Are you sure...

have you seen what your present president and the neocons have done and there is plenty that we don't know yet. So you are sayin it is alright to bomb black churches which has been going on for years now.

[Fredda Weinberg]

14. Are you drinking the Kool Aid? Nobody's bombed Rev Wright

but he asked for trouble ... if he never thought his words would be heard by those who do entertain thoughts of violence, he's learning that w/there are consequences to playing w/fire. Angry words are fine, but these are baseless accusations designed to incite.

[BumRushDaShow]

57. Wow. Justifying violence.

Off to ignore for you! Should have done this a long time ago. :eyes:

[Fredda Weinberg]

60. The law is the law. Sorry you have a problem w/it. It's not personal I assure you n/t

[madrchsod]

61. he asked for it?

playing with fire? bye bye

[Cali_Democrat]

7. America experimented on blacks with syphilis

You have to understand where many blacks in America are coming from then you won't think the accusation is so far-fetched. Believe it or not, many blacks don't want to kiss the feat of Uncle Sam.

[Fredda Weinberg]

15. And Germans experimented on my relatives ... so what? Should I hate

Germans today or make up stories about them? Face it, victimhood is a dead end and you're doing no one a favor by excusing it. If Wright had told the truth, fighting words doctrine would not apply.

[theboss]

19. Fighting words doctrine? Do you even know what that means?

Where is the immediacy of a threat here?

[Fredda Weinberg]

24. I think you're confusing self-defense w/fighting words

In Chaplinsky v. New Hampshire, the U.S. Supreme Court upholds the conviction of a Jehovah's Witness who had called a police officer a "damned fascist" The Court rules that there are certain words that "by their very utterance inflict injury" and are of “such slight social value” that they are not welcome in the marketplace of ideas. This category of speech, named “fighting words” by the Court, is not protected by the First Amendment. Consequently, the speaker may be prosecuted.

http://www.justicelearning.com/justice_timeline/Issues.aspx?IssueID=8&TimelineID=49&TimelineEventID=21

[NYCGirl]

25. Who did Wright threaten with his "fighting words"? Stupid white people who like

to bomb black churches?

[Fredda Weinberg]

31. The standard for fighting words ...

if uttering them in public is likely to start a fight, it's not protected speech and the person making the statement can be arrested.

Got that ... or do I have to dumb it down for you?

[NYCGirl]

35. No, you needn't bother.

Dumb is exactly the word that came to mind when I read your explanation. You have no idea what you're talking about.

[SemiCharmedQuark]

41. So if a gay man tells his partner that he loves him in a room full of homophobic bigots

can the gay man be arrested?

[Fredda Weinberg]

52. Good question. Yes, context matters. You can call a policeman fascist

in the privacy of your own room, but do it on the street and you risk the public safety.

If you want to incite a riot privately, that's your business until someone calls the authorities. If you're a masochist, sounds ideal. Enjoy.

[NYCGirl]

67. If one can be imprisoned for calling a policeman "fascist" we are certainly

on our way to being fascists.

[Fredda Weinberg]

69. Does everything have to be black & white? Here, try to wrap your

head around a complicated legal issue

http://www.firstamendmentcenter.org/speech/arts/topic.aspx?topic=fighting_words

No, we are not our way to being fascists ... we are limiting individual rights as we should

[Forkboy]

42. You dumb everything else down. Why stop now?

[cali]

49. actually, it's worse than merely dumbing

everything down.

[theboss]

46. Can be prosecuted if there is an immediate threat of violence

Trust me. I know more about this than you do.

Unless you can prove a risk that Wright's parishoners were going to go riot against white people, he can say what he wants.

[Fredda Weinberg]

54. You've got that half right ... we can prove that those who finally heard Wright

are threatening violence.

[DerekJ]

22. I should have known. Tell me, are you telling saying that the Jewish people, have forgotten what the

Nazi Germany germans have done, and have since moved on?

[Fredda Weinberg]

30. I wish. I see it as the heart of the I/P conflict, but that's another forum n/t

[DerekJ]

39. So, we agree. They have all the right in the world to still be angry.

[Fredda Weinberg]

47. Be angry? Yes. Spread lies in public that incite? No, that is the law n/t

[Cali_Democrat]

23. Many Israeli Jews didn't want Angela Merkel to speak to the Israeli Parliament in German

Obviously "victim hood" isn't dead among many Jews.

[Fredda Weinberg]

27. Tell me about it. I'm surrounded by trauma ... and have developed

strong coping skills. So I understand the hostility - but recognize that it's self-defeating.

My first car was a real fixer-upper, a delight to my engineering mind. But it was an Audi and repelled my father. In the end, he accepted that his reaction only deprived himself ... and enjoyed our time tinkering together.

Who could ask for more in this cruel world? Victimhood may not be dead ... my father lost every member of his family, including a sister who looked just like me ... but people can be healed.

[cali]

50. Shorter Fredda:

Me, me, me, me, me. MY suffering. MY family's suffering. Ceaseless narcissistic behavior.

[Fredda Weinberg]

53. No, dear. My family's very happy. No one beat me or abused me

I'm sorry for you, but my parents passed away under my care. The boy I married adores me and we're still talking about starting a next generation.

Honestly, cali, you have to stop stalking me. Send me a private message if you must ... I won't mind.

[cali]

56. stalking you? get over yourself, ducky.

If you think I'm stalking you, I suggest you alert. And your post is simply another example of your incessant me, me, me crap.

[Fredda Weinberg]

59. Alert sent. Enough is enough n/t

[mrreowwr_kittty]

66. Well I alerted on you and asked for you to be tombstoned.

It's time to shitcan you and your racist bullshit.

Get a clue, Fredda. Your family being victimized doesn't entitle you to go around acting like an insensitive jerk to everyone else.

You must be a lonely and bitter person. Now I'm putting you on ignore so I never have to see your venomous hatred again.

[quakerboy]

45. If the same people were still running germany today,

you might want to be a bit cautious of the place.

[Fredda Weinberg]

48. Ah, but Wright doesn't cred our changes either ... which is why you and

I should be allied, but one of us is enjoying Kool Aid.

Here we are, having a civil discussion of the most painful episode in my people's history ... and I have nothing bad to say against the German people or even the Nazis themselves. And if you'd ask, I'd tell you that my father gave me that insight: we are all capable of being driven to extremis.

So please don't advise me on caution. I have opened computer learning centers in community policing substations to cut crime. So I'll continue to post, anonymous critic, under my real name and with my real history.

Reverend Wright can retire in peace.

[Symarip]

9. Yeah. With that logic road rage should be legal

"Officer, I know I shot him but he cut me off?!"

"Oh, that's ok son, that's well within the law."

[SemiCharmedQuark]

11. "Yeah I killed him, but he made me super angry!"

[EffieBlack]

37. Wright should have known when he said these words in his church several years ago

that one day, one of his parishoners, who was then an obscure state senator, who wasn't even there when he said it, would run for president and some of his detractors would dig around through 30 years of sermons, find this snippet, put it on YouTube (which didn't yet exist), which would result in the mainstream media picking it up and playing it over and over and over and over and over again until some knuckle-dragging, racist criminals saw it enough times that they got so mad at seeing an angry black man criticize Amurka that they just had to avenge our nation's honor by threatening the life of a 60-something-year-old minister and his parishoners?

[mopinko]

75. just who sat through all those tapes is what i want to know

nobody seems to be asking that question.

[woolldog]

12. No. He said that we nuked Hiroshima and Nagasaki

and we never batted an eye.

Not true?

[SemiCharmedQuark]

Truman said he never lost sleep over it.

[DerekJ]

13. I know he really crossed the line.. What's next say that the Americans invaded Iraq without

thinking twice?!!

He is not the only one saying that by the way, many prominent historians, and figures are pretty much saying the same thing, many of them Americans.

WAKE THE FUCK UP from the delusional patriotism you are living in.

http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v16/v16n3p-4_Weber.html

"ritical Voices

Amid the general clamor of enthusiasm, there were some who had grave misgivings. "We are the inheritors to the mantle of Genghis Khan," wrote New York Times editorial writer Hanson Baldwin, "and of all those in history who have justified the use of utter ruthlessness in war." Norman Thomas called Nagasaki "the greatest single atrocity of a very cruel war." Joseph P. Kennedy, father of the President, was similarly appalled.

A leading voice of American Protestantism, Christian Century, strongly condemned the bombings. An editorial entitled "America's Atomic Atrocity" in the issue of August 29, 1945, told readers:

The atomic bomb was used at a time when Japan's navy was sunk, her air force virtually destroyed, her homeland surrounded, her supplies cut off, and our forces poised for the final stroke ... Our leaders seem not to have weighed the moral considerations involved. No sooner was the bomb ready than it was rushed to the front and dropped on two helpless cities ... The atomic bomb can fairly be said to have struck Christianity itself ... The churches of America must dissociate themselves and their faith from this inhuman and reckless act of the American Government.

A leading American Catholic voice, Commonweal, took a similar view. Hiroshima and Nagasaki, the magazine editorialized, "are names for American guilt and shame."

Pope Pius XII likewise condemned the bombings, expressing a view in keeping with the traditional Roman Catholic position that "every act of war directed to the indiscriminate destruction of whole cities or vast areas with their inhabitants is a crime against God and man." The Vatican newspaper Osservatore Romano commented in its August 7, 1945, issue: "This war provides a catastrophic conclusion. Incredibly this destructive weapon remains as a temptation for posterity, which, we know by bitter experience, learns so little from history.""

[Fredda Weinberg]

16. It's not my delusion ... it's the electorate's. Face it ... you've got a loser

and you can't defend him. All you can do is attack and I'm not vulnerable.

[DerekJ]

21. You are incoherent, and you ARE delusional. You weren't talking about the electorate.

“Look, this country ain't heaven but that crossed a line”, you are the one offended ( or trying to appear offended), not the electorate.

I proved you to be an idiot, so first you spun it as if it was the electorate who are concerned then you turned to the defensive response:
“HE IS A LOSER ..WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA”

Looks like you have been in a coma since WWII, last time I check, he is winning MORON.

[Fredda Weinberg]

34. You can't read either. Where did I say anyone crossed my line?

I'm describing reality ... you're the one who can't keep your fingers off the caps lock key.

[DerekJ]

40. It's called emphasis. You see when you capitalize one word it’s called emphasis, when you do it to a

full sentence, or paragraph, it's shouting. I assume you are new to message boards?!

He crossed YOUR line because you were angry about it. Your post leaves no doubt that it was you.

[ampad]

18. Yup and when innocent people are hurt what are you going to say

that those innocent people deserved to be hurt because of "words" Words that were taken out of context. Since when is it ok to threaten people based on fucking words? Rev. Wright didn't personally come up and bitch slap you or anyone else for that matter. Some of you are just sick. Violence or the threat of violence is never ok. I don't care if you are pissed off because you didn't like what someone said. What the hell is fighting words anyway? That has to be the most ignorant shit I've heard in a while. You have not right to threaten people with harm because of words, WTF.

[beachmom]

29. So you are for committing violence? Because Wright hasn't nor has he

ever called for it. He stated an opinion that most people disagree with. It's called free speech.

[Fredda Weinberg]

70. Accusing the US government of creating AIDs for genocide is not

an opinion. That's not free speech.

[my2sense]

78. What a piece of work you are - on ignore n/t

[mrreowwr_kittty]

64. You are one nasty piece of work, Fredda.

And to think they let you work in schools around young people.

[ampad]

72. Geesh are you serious?

It's time like this when I think home schooling is a good idea.

[izzybeans]

65. Yeah I know America in no way ever dropped nuclear bombs on japan.

We are a guilt free Utopia of freedom giving people aren't we?

:sarcasm:

[ZombieHorde]

74. The U.S. did nuke Japan twice.

Those nukes blew up many innocent civilians, including children and babies. The radiation afterwards was devastating as well.

I don't see which line was crossed by those words.






edit for photo link:
http://www.gensuikin.org/english/photo.html

[dbonds]

10. Shows that some people will endange many innocent lives for a political hitjob.

They should be more careful with their propaganda, there are some that can't distinguish games from reality.

[ampad]

20. I see that

Some on this board will condone such behavior because of "fighting words" Stupid shit, but if someone were to get hurt, children were to get hurt what are they going to say? Well it's their fault because of fighting words? There are some ignorant folks on this board.

[ellacott]

43. 4 little girls were killed in a Birmingham church

Because some thought it was fighting words when MLK lead a movement for equal rights. He reminded the country of a promissory note that came back as insufficient funds.

[ampad]

17. Why is ignore

Always the first one to post in these Wright threads? Anyways, I think it is sad that the church is going through this. I always said that if the church were bombed or if anyone were hurt the MSM would be to blame for their portrayal of this church. Maybe they should think of all the innocent people who could be hurt because they want ratings.

[Tribetime]

26. do you think this is something the church could sue fox news over

I'm sure their reputation has been damaged in the short term. It just doesn't seem right fox can continually distort the facts with no liability........we need the fairness doctrine

[ampad]

44. Yes they should

I think this is something the church should seriously look into especially now that they are being threatened. I was told by someone who attends the same church that it is against their "doctrine" to sue. I'm not sure if they meant a church creed or the bible. I really wish the church would look into some type of legal action against FOX and the others who are peddling this non-story. The next story we will hear is that someone bombed the church then what is the MSM going to say?

[NC_Nurse]

28. That is horrible.

Fox news sucks. :(

[KAZ]

32. Go tell it to Fredda.

[NC_Nurse]

33. Is she the "Ignored" further up the thread?

[Umbram]

36. Yep. (nt)

[NC_Nurse]

38. Figures...

:eyes:

[madrchsod]

62. nice day to bring this up is`t it

you think ignored is just a tad bit insensitive or just plain....

[Bullet1987]

51. Condoning death threats IS going too damn far...I don't give a fuck what Jeremiah Wright said

[MyNameGoesHere]

73. See. Fostering unity works.

Oh wait maybe it doesn't. Well you can always try to go to a Klan meeting and let em know they are All Americans, not Dems/Repubs and then invite them into the fold of decent human beings. Oh wait maybe that's not a good idea.

[mopinko]

76. i love threads like this- every other post ignored.

thank ja for ignore.

[RememberWellstone]

77. Arrest them, post their perp walks

Of course, the good Rev. says a lot of things that did'nt happen.:eyes: