Clinton Clarifies HOW she criticized the Iraq war before Obama...

[RazBerryBeret]

and I knew it was gonna be good.

"...Sen. Hillary Clinton, D-NY, attempted to change the measure by which anyone might assess who criticized the Iraq war first, her or Sen. Barack Obama, by saying those keeping records should start in January 2005, when Obama joined the Senate. (A measure that conveniently avoids her October 2002 vote to authorize use of force against Iraq at a time that Obama was speaking out against the war.) She claimed that using that measure she criticized the war in Iraq before Obama did."

think about that..
So everyone who voted for the IRW could say .. "starting NOW, I've always been against this war".

full article
http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2008/04/in-oregon-clint.html

[Hepburn]

1. More unmitigated Hillary bullshit!

You know, every day she becomes more and more like a Saturday Night Live skit.

[IndianaGreen]

17. Hillary is the incarnation of bullshit!

This is how she will govern the nation were she allowed to take power with her corrupt husband.

[Hepburn]

36. LOL....so true! n/t

[polpilot]

92. Hillary: I voted FOR war because I was AGAINST it. Depends on what 'FOR' means.

[blm]

2. She had the chance to stand with Kerry and DENOUNCE Bush's decision to invade in early 2003 but she

refused, and she and Bill stood by Bush's decision and Bill defended Bush repeatedly throughout his summer 2004 book tour as the Dem nominee was aiming his criticisms pointedly at Bush's DECISION to invade when weapon inspections were proving force was not needed.


Even after Abu Ghraib, neither Clinton would support Kerry's call for Rumsfeld's removal from office.

[RazBerryBeret]

6. IMO...her platforms

and policies are ALWAYS politically motivated. what will serve her interests best in the future is what she will do.

[Whisp]

3. she's nucking futs

how anyone could want this unstable liar in charge of the red button is beyond me.

[SoFlaJet]

9. my exact sentiments Whisp

she IS fucking crazy

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

81. Ready to lie on day one.

[Kittycat]

4. HuffPo says it best in big bold letters on the Politics Page...

Clinton Falsely Claims She Criticized Iraq War Before Obama

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/politics/

[WillyT]

49. Ya Mean This ???

Clinton Falsely Claims She Criticized Iraq War Before Obama



:shrug:

[bigbrother05]

5. Well, now isn't that special.

[BlueIdaho]

7. It depends on what the meaning of is - is

Is this really the kind of tortured logic you want to see played out in the White House day after day after day? The Clintons will say anything and do anything to get back in the White House - they have no respect for the truth.

[RazBerryBeret]

8. It becomes the "truth"

once they say it, right?

[BlueIdaho]

29. Joseph Goebbels would be proud of them.

"If you repeat a lie often enough it begins to sound like the truth."

[RazBerryBeret]

47. Bush/Cheney/Rove

are all big proponents of this too, right?
this is embarrassing--to us all.

[Life Long Dem]

10. I thought she said before 2002 she spoke out agaisnt the war.? n/t

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

11. This is actually painful to watch.

Ugh. Please make it stop.

[tabasco]

20. It is embarrasing that she calls herself a Democrat.

She is embarrassing everyone that calls themselves a Democrat.

Her campaign can't die fast enough.

[LWolf]

12. The reality is that neither of these candidates were "against" the war at all.

Sure. Obama gave a speech in 2002 that he's been making campaign hay with. He didn't exactly stand by that declaration, either in word or deed, further down the road.

If you wanted a candidate who was clean on the Iraq War from the beginning until now, who would end it and bring our troops home without prevarication, you should have voted for DK.

With their records, trying to campaign on Iraq makes both of them dishonest, to say the least.

[RazBerryBeret]

19. but the Majority of us

didn't get the chance to vote for DK.

and DK was heavily contested to lose his congressional seat here in Ohio March 4th.
he won with 50%, and there were 4 opponents.

I think he's a great man, and would've voted for him...

but I am an Obama supporter, and I do feel his 2002 speech was honest and well thought out. if you go back and read it today everything he cautioned against has come to pass. Maybe he had the foresight because he wasn't in the US Senate with the beating of the drums? but I will vote for his judgement and foresight over the other two any day.

[LWolf]

54. It's true that most of us didn't get that chance.

I haven't voted YET; my primary is not until May 20th.

The fact remains that neither of these candidates can campaign honestly on being "against the war."

Of course I've read Obama's speech. I've also read the transcripts where, when asked during his senate campaign how he would have voted on the IWR, he said, "“I’m not privy to Senate intelligence reports. What would I have done? I don’t know.” And, in July of '04 he said, “There’s not much of a difference between my position on Iraq and George Bush’s position at this stage.”

That, and the fact that he voted repeatedly to fund the war once he got to the Senate diminishes the credibility of that 2002 speech.

Every voter whose had to vote since Edwards dropped out before super-tuesday has to choose between Clinton and Obama. Each person does so for various reasons.

I don't think that the Iraq War is a credible reason for choosing either, or a credible talking point for either. It's "off the table" as an authentic issue.

Voters scrambling to find some reason to support either of them need to dig further.

[RazBerryBeret]

56. connected issue...

Hillary voted for the IWR,
Hillary voted to label the Iran Military a terrorist organization
Hillary voted against a ban on cluster bombs in civilian areas.

from my perspective she is either
1) voting to further her presidential aspirations, and needs to appear "tough" on terrorism to attract the swing voters
or
2) she is much more of a hawk than I want in the WH

either way, she won't be my choice.
I will vote for her if she is the nominee, because I DO know what McCain will be like.

[LWolf]

62. You're right.

HRC is certainly no better than Obama on the IWR. That's why I won't give either of them any credit on that issue.

[Brianboru]

31. Spot on! DK has been the only honest

one in this race.

[TahitiNut]

38. "you should have voted for DK"

I did. But it didn't "count." How conveeeenient. :eyes:

I may just vote for him again in November. :shrug:

[LWolf]

55. I may, too.

I didn't get to vote in a primary yet. Mine's not until May 20th, for all the good a vote will do at that point.

[bigbrother05]

13. So, is she ready from day 1

2002, or 2005, I can't keep up.:rofl:

[DerekJ]

14. hmmm

[GarbagemanLB]

18. ONLY 5 pinnochios?

[DerekJ]

30. Pinocchios are about to go extinct because of Hillary. 5 only for the sake of the preservation of

the species.

[sellitman]

15. Stop picking on Hillary.

All she did was "Mis-Speak"


:sarcasm:





Again.

[RazBerryBeret]

26. she mis-spoke

AND she used her own personal time-continuum interruption....she can start her record any time she wants.
convenient!!

[AtomicKitten]

16. Riiight! And Bushies think Junior's term started 9/12/01.

[beachmom]

21. Weak. Hillary's criticism was only of the CONDUCT of the war, even in 2006:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/06/13/AR2006061301449.html

And liberal activists booed her for it. She will not win this type of argument, and frankly, it is a waste of time for her to start this. It will only remind people that she voted for the IWR.

[KaptBunnyPants]

23. Very weak.

First, a persons beliefs matter even when they are not a Senator. Second, as you say, she's still a hawk, she just wants to be a more effective hawk.

[slinkerwink]

22. uh, that's an incredibly stupid rationale. Not gonna fly with anyone but her base.

[RazBerryBeret]

32. which (hopefully) that base

is getting smaller with each passing day

[slinkerwink]

37. all we need to do is run ads with this

[Ichingcarpenter]

24. I am aghast on the use of tortured logic by the Hillary Campaign.

I've lived through the last 7 years of this shit and don't need to listen
to 4 more years of it.

[Jensen]

64. You hit the nail on the head!!!! That is what I don't understand about Hillary's supporters...

We have had 7+years of lies..Have "WE" become so accustom to this constant BS that it just doesn't matter???

[Schema Thing]

25. In 2005 AO, I criticized before BO?

[FightingIrish]

27. She learned under the master.

It all comes down to what the definition of "was" is.

[SoCalDem]

28. She crossed her fingers behind her back, as she voted?

[Ichingcarpenter]

34. And gave a speech before the Senate on support of the Going to War Bill

I did not have sex with that war..... type shit.

[RazBerryBeret]

35. Yes! she's a master

at the "didn't count"!
"DIDN'T COUNT!"
hehehe..

reminds me of my two kids--of course they're 8 and 11, so it's somewhat acceptable to try and get away with that shit.

[SoCalDem]

40. Remember "King's X"?

:)

[dkf]

33. Its the definition of "is" again.

Now she's trying to redefine what opposition to the war is.

See how manipulative she is? What an awful human being.

[SDuderstadt]

84. Jesus Fricking Christ

For the record, Bill Clinton did NOT try to redefine the word "is". During his deposition in the Paula Jones case, Clinton was presented with the question, "there is no sex of any kind going on, right?" (or something to that effect) with respect to Monica Lewinsky. Since the affair with Lewinsky had ended some time prior, Clinton truthfully answered that there was not. Later, Jones' attorneys tried to argue that Clinton had perjured himself for failing to admit to earlier misconduct with Lewinsky. But, that's not the question he was asked. In Bronston v U.S., a UNANIMOUS SCOTUS held that merely misleading or evasive testimony cannot be perjury.

In the instance at hand, Clinton (as well as any other deponee) had no duty to help Jones' case. That was the job of her attorneys. It's pretty simple. "Is" does not mean "was". Had Clinton been asked whether sex of any kind WAS going on (at some time in the past), then a "no" answer would have been perjurious (assuming the matter was actually material to Jones' case). But, since the affair with Lewinsky had ended well before the deposition, Clinton's answer was truthful and it was disengenuous (to say the least) for Jones' counsel to suggest otherwise. It's time to put this stupid myth to bed, "Is" does not mean "was" and Clinton, in no way, tried to redefine the word "is".

[Bad Thoughts]

39. The result of this tortured logic should be:

No one has a legitimate political stand until they reach high office.

Therefore, Clinton's own career is irrelevant until 2001.

[Kber]

57. That's a pretty good point

[WillyT]

41. She's Getting Downright Embarrassing Now...

:wtf:

:banghead:

[samsingh]

42. clarity is lacking in her stance

[samsingh]

43. clarity is lacking in her stance

[uponit7771]

44. I don't believe this story, I..I can't believe...I'd...have to see the words in a video or something

[MadBadger]

45. The article goes on to say that even using Clintons FUcked up Logic, Obama still criticized first.

[Pirate Smile]

46. Damn, that was a dumb comment to make. Not only is it untrue by even the

phony frame the Clinton camp tries to set up but it also brings back all of her comments (which are recited in that article) supporting the Iraq War AND it plays into the strong running theme of her dishonesty which the press is more then happy to run with right now.

She really sets herself up to get blasted by her opponents and the media with dangerous frequency now.

I don't know how people can think she would run a smart and strong general election campaign after what we've seen for the past six months or so. It would be a disaster.

edit to add - She is STILL lying based on the clarification by the campaign. How does that help?

[RazBerryBeret]

51. Exactly...

and how do we think this will play up again Mr. War Hero McCain?
She lied about sniper fire, now this? that's not gonna look good..
I can't watch anymore!

[Evergreen Emerald]

48. hello? Has anyone read her speech?

God you people are so unreasonable. Anything and everything to attack Clinton.

[DerekJ]

52. Enlighten us.

[Evergreen Emerald]

60. Seriously

How can you come on this board and attack her and then admit that you have no idea what she said in her speech? Enlighten you? What the hell?

[DerekJ]

63. Enlighten us on your point of view, we read her speech, I read the whole article. She lied.

Tell us how you view it differently.

[Evergreen Emerald]

65. If that is your conclusion

then you have a comprehension problem--or you just want to be part of the Hate HIllary Crowd. It is so much easier to go along with the crowd. You don't even have to actually think.

[DerekJ]

66. Not at all.

I stood against bookgate, hospital-gate and many other gates some Obama supporters here tried to hype up. But this one is a lie. If you see it differently let me know you view it. Correct me.

[RazBerryBeret]

53. EE,

did you forget to use your sarcasm button?

that WAS sarcasm, right?

[BattyDem]

50. WTF?

:wtf:

She has got to be kidding! How could she say that with a straight face?

While she voted FOR the IWR, Obama was speaking out against war with Iraq. Who gives a shit if he was a senator at that time? What difference does it make?

"... using that measure she criticized the war in Iraq before Obama did."

Using what measure? Ignoring history? Ignoring facts? Is Hillary the only person who can do it or does everyone get to play by those rules? Can Obama say, "I joined the senate in January 2005, so it's only fair that we ignore everything Hillary Clinton did prior to that date."

Oops ... there goes her 35 years of experience. :eyes:

[TexasObserver]

58. more lyin' from The Lyin' Queen.

[Lerkfish]

59. LOL! what bullshit

[Pisces]

61. She really believes in the motto, say something long enough and loud enough and people will believe

[TML]

67. I call bullshit

Check out this YouTube clip, especially after the :27 mark. Feel free to make it go viral while you're at it.

[Forkboy]

68. What a fucking joke. It's embarrassing.

[Blarch]

69. Fuck her.

Lets make sure she gets tossed out of the senate.

[PoliticalAmazon]

70. She just LOVES to change the rules to suit her needs. Reminds me of someone else...hmmm...

...who could it be?

I know! BUSH JR. He does the same damned thing. His moronic "signing statements" ring a bell?

[DarienComp]

71. And people wonder why she is the butt of so many jokes?

I mean, honestly.

[TheDonkey]

72. Please drop out Hillary. You are only hurting yourself this is getting sad

a once proud Democrat reduced to such pitifulness.

[Rubiconski2009]

73. You can't believe a single word out of B*I*L*L*A*R*Y

Isn't this what we've had to put up with since 20 Jan 2001?

It's a wonder most of the population hasn't committed suicide listening to Hillary's BS.

it makes you want to puke!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Sick of Hillary the Bimbo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Utopian Leftist]

74. More goalpost moving

The woman simply won't be truthful until it bites her in the ass.

[Willo]

75. Here's the C-Span video for January 18, 2005

It's the Q&A session from the Foreign Relations Committee Meeting

Here's the page: http://www.c-span.org/search/basic.asp?ResultStart=31&ResultCount=10&BasicQueryText=foreign+relations+committee&

Confirmation Hearing for Condoleezza Rice to be Secretary of State - Part 2 (starts about 00:41:08)

[karynnj]

76. Hillary's not on that committee - nor was she there

The stand out person in that hearing was Kerry - who really really grilled Rice especially on not letting the Iraqis be trained by Eqypt, Jordan, France and Germany (all of whom offered) and on the question of whether Pakistan was really adequately dealing with A.Q Khan and terrorism - he e asked pointedly at least 3 times "adequately?" (the point was not lost that he had had briefings as the nominee.

[Willo]

77. Exactly, Barack was on the committee and spoke out on Jan 18, 2005

[karynnj]

78. That's right!

That was a fantastic hearing - and you are absoluetly right

[karynnj]

79. That's right!

That was a fantastic hearing - and you are absoluetly right

[Ian_rd]

88. HAHA! Hillary should have said "Starting on January 25, 2005 ....

"I WAS THE FIRST to the criticize the Iraq War!" Hillary supporters are shaking their head in a collective cringe.

[AZBlue]

80. "Ok, I'm going to run a good campaign and tell the truth always.....starting NOW!"

WTF? She really thinks we're on recess from 3rd grade and this is just one big sandbox, doesn't she?

[Zachstar]

82. Clinton is never going to get over Obama when it comes to military.

She voted for group of words that merged into other words that led to boots on the ground that led to over 4000 graves.

So Clinton. You voted for the war, your choice was wrong and your faux attempts to downplay it and make yourself into something else are nothing but offensive!

[bvar22]

83. Make that 1 MILLION graves.....

and 4 MILLION homeless.

No stats on how many maimed for life.

[pokerfan]

85. Does she really expect this to fly?

"I meant I was first in 2005."

Each day brings a new embarrassment.

[Ian_rd]

86. Link

to an article about this (in case no one else has linked it)

http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2008/04/in-oregon-clint.html

[Independent-Voter]

87. God damn she is a trainwreck. I simply don't get how anyone can still support this woman.

[Political Heretic]

89. Clinton campaign has truly jumped the shark.

[workinclasszero]

90. If her lips are moving....

Hillary is telling another whopper!

Hillary's campaign is a parody, a joke, a major embarrassment.

If she had any sense she would drop out now and try to repair the massive damage she has done to Team Clinton's reputation.

But I fully expect her to go on telling many more fairy tales along the way to her certain and total defeat.

After President Obama is elected in the GE, Bill and Hill's importance and sway in the democratic party will be nil, and that is a very good thing!

I seriously wonder if Hillary will be able to hold on to her Senate seat after her pathetic and divisive campaign this year.

[NashVegas]

91. More MSM Lies Show Anti-Clinton Bias

Candidate A:

"I am concerned about this notion that was pursued by Senator Biden and others that we've made significant progress in training troops. Because it seems to me that in your response to Senator Alexander that we will not be able to get our troops out absent the Iraqi forces being able to secure their own country, or at least this administration would not be willing to define success in the absence of such security. I never got quite a clear answer to Senator Biden's question as to how many troops -- Iraqi troops -- don't just have a uniform and aren't just drawing a paycheck, but are effective enough and committed enough that we would willingly have our own troops fighting side-by- side with them. The number of 120,000 you gave, I suspect, does not meet those fairly stringent criteria that Senator Biden was alluding to. I just want to make sure, on the record, that you give me some sense of where we're at now."

"If our measure is bring our troops home and success is measured by whether Iraqis can secure their own circumstances, and if our best troops in the world are having trouble controlling the situation with 150,000 or so, it sounds like we've got a long way to go. And I think part of what the American people are going to need is some certainty, not an absolute timetable, but a little more certainty than is being provided, because right now, it appears to be an entirely open-ended commitment."

Candidate B:

"The Administration and Defense Department's Iraq policy has been, by any reasonable measure, riddled with errors, misstatements and misjudgments. From the beginning of the Iraqi war, we were inadequately prepared for the aftermath of the invasion with too few troops and an inadequate plan to stabilize Iraq."

[karynnj]

93. Didn't she see the polite raised eyebrows and startled looks

when Bill Clinton announced that he had always been against the war. She must have missed that even he no longer had the magic to lie straight faced to the country and have about half of us believe it. And that was Bill, she never had the same ability to be believed.

What is ridiculous was that even if you ignore where she was in 2002, she didn't speak out in early - or late 2003. In 2006, the Clintons positioned her against Kerry, Feingold, Harkin, Kennedy, Boxer and others who defined a Democratic exit strategy. Not only that, there are Bill Clinton comments that politically it was unwise to propose a solution. Contrast that to people saying things like he could not be a Senator in good standing and not speak out when people are dying for a plan that was not working. Those people moved America to where it was in November 2006 - not the Clintons, who vilified them. Yes, I know that Obama voted against Kerry/Feingold - and I wish he didn't - but he was not the leader among the Democrats fighting it.

Odd how in early 2007, HRC was suddenly always for what was essentially Kerry/Feingold.

[LTR]

94. She was so against the war that she voted for it.

Spare me.

:eyes:

[burythehatchet]

95. Truth be told, she voted for the war but in her tender heart she hoped it wouldn't pass.

She was so screwn by the other people who voted to invade and occupy another country. It was obviously because she's a girl.