Wow... I can't believe this has happened

[MonkeyFunk]

But there's finally a controversy here so dumb, so overblown, so idiotic, so meaningless, that even *I* can't bring myself to get involved.

Elton John? "To hell with 'em"? Really?!? That's what we're reduced to discussing now?

I'm gonna go watch something smarter on TV - like Hee-Haw.

[anonymous171]

1. So you agree? To hell with America?

[rodeodance]

he was using a common expression used here on DU daily--and NOT america-as

some idiots make it out to be.

[leftynyc]

60. I missed that

can you link me to where he said to hell with America? Thanks.

[pompano]

62. Seriesly!!!

It would be prudent for Hillary to come out immediately and completly distance herself from a man that would make such hurtful and outlandish remarks. Then square up with the American people and explain why she continued to listen to his music for decades knowing his mindset. We, as a nation need to have time to heal. This needs to get air time at the top of every hour non-stop for 18 days.

The hurt is overwhelming. She needs to do the right thing and get out in front of this issue. A public painful outcry should be enough to have her step up to the plate and denounce Elton's remarks and the public should painstakingly go through and parce everyone of his song lyrics over the past 25 years to find anything questionable he may have sang or implied.

Human decency would demand nothing less.

:eyes:

:sarcasm:

[BigDDem]

66. You would prefer "God Damn America?"

[Warren DeMontague]

74. I'll tell you, when Elton John is running against Obama's Preacher, then surely that will be a

pressing question for debate.

[roguevalley]

80. if surrogates need flogging for damning the country, then so should

he. either both do or we need to move on.

[BigDDem]

84. That wasn't directed at you

but thanks for the two cents!

[MyNameGoesHere]

67. Sure seems as good as "Goddamn America" n/t

[grantcart]

2. Christ agreeing with MonkeyFunk

whiskey time

[samdogmom]

61. I'm with you! Up is down...right is left...is the world is spinning off it's axis?

I can't believe it, but this is actually a post by MonkeyFunk that I can agree with! WOW!

Here's my take on the controversy: Elton :thumbsup: Hillary :thumbsdown:

[MadBadger]

3. I thought it was all going to be a joke. Just in case it was a stupid controversy, I stayed out

[redqueen]

77. Oh, it's a joke all right.

Doesn't mean that some won't go right on ahead and treat it as a VERY SERIOUS ISSUE! anyway.

:crazy:

[Maddy McCall]

4. K/R. I agree 100%

Except for watching Hee Haw.

I'm gonna watch SpongeBob.

[DearAbby]

5. Sort of like

taking Pastor Wright's "GOD DAMN AMERICA" out of context and play it over and over and over again...to harm a perfectly good Candidate's chances to win in the GE.

But continue to avoid the obvious.

[TahitiNut]

6. Well, Elton looks good in a Mountie outfit - Dudley Doright coming to Nell's rescue.

:rofl:

[me b zola]

7. Kind of like the entire stupid controversy over Rev Wright

---just stupid. YMMV.

[Maddy McCall]

9. Wright was Obama's pastor for 20+ years.

Elton John performed a benefit concert for Hillary. Once.

Wright said "God damn america." John told American misogynists to go to hell.

You truly don't see how disingenuous it is to compare the two?

[anonymous171]

10. How about McClurkin? How about Farrakan?

Hillary attended a fundraiser held by a racist sheriff in 2007.

[Maddy McCall]

12. One admonishes bigots. The others are bigots.

There's just no comparison.

[merh]

17. Who are you calling the bigot?

I'm just trying to understand your statement.

[UALRBSofL]

50. Ugh, don't get me started with McClurkin, he is mixed up

I don't know what his problem is. As If he will cure me of being gay. Anyway, I never think about him until someone brings his name up on DU.

[mrreowwr_kittty]

16. You're not worthy to shine Rev. Wright's shoes. nt

[Maddy McCall]

19. Why would I want to?

The Bush economy has been tough, but I'm doing ok.

Besides, he's got Obamabots to do that sort of thing for him. I wouldn't want to push them out of a job.

[rodeodance]

20. ho ho--good one

[mrreowwr_kittty]

21. Yes, you can continue to hold Hillary's purse.

How are those donations working out for you? I hear she's deep in hock. Can't even pay her health care providers. Tsk tsk....

[Maddy McCall]

22. At least she can account for what she's spending money on.

Your guy? He's not doing so good at that.

[mrreowwr_kittty]

23. Yeah but he's raised enough money to make good on it, whatever it is.

Your candidate? Not so much.

:rofl:

[Maddy McCall]

24. Too bad that he can't account for $150,000 of his donations.

:shrug:

[mrreowwr_kittty]

25. Whatever. He can return them and still have $millions left over.

Your candidate is still in arrears to all kinds of creditors, including HER FREAKING HEALTH INSURANCE PROVIDER!!

Embarrassing.

[anonymous171]

27. Under her HC plan, wouldn't she be fined?

[mrreowwr_kittty]

34. You'd think they would but I doubt it.

I get the sense that the fines would only be levied against poor working saps who can't scrounge up the change to pay their premiums. Big companies (or campaigns) who can't pay their bills will be forgiven. Kinda like Bear Stearns.

[Maddy McCall]

29. Yeah, but at least she's accounting for the money she spends and owes.

Your candidate? Nope. $150,000 unaccounted for.

So there's no way to know who he owes and what he's paid. He can't even keep up with what he spends his money on.

[mrreowwr_kittty]

35. At least he doesn't owe his HEALTH CARE PROVIDER over 300 grand.

Keep spinning, Maddy. You know you don't have a leg to stand on. I admire you for trying, though. :rofl:

[rodeodance]

87. abc news has reported that has been paid . update yourself

[SwampG8r]

59. 150 thousand out of what...... a hundred million total?

not even a statistical anomaly
you hillary folks just dont understand what a lot of money is
since you seem to believe none is plenty

[roguevalley]

82. he released that. 680K in debts and millions in the bank. Bitch at their

bookkeepers. Both sides.

[PBS Poll-435]

76. Bags of one dollar bills

being thrown over the fence from the Rezko lot seems to be working out very well for Obama!

[roguevalley]

81. this I don't get but I know he hasn't got collection agencies on his ass.

[rodeodance]

88. abc news has reported bills paid including hospital ins. update yourself

[SwampG8r]

58. a much easier job

hillarys empty purse vrs wrights size 12 shoes
go with the empty purse
as we have come to know since the primaries started
heavy lifting aint for a clintonista

[MercutioATC]

33. Maddy, do you seriously have an objecton to Wright's statements

or are you just arguing that they could be politically harmful to Obama in the general?

What did Wright say that isn't true?

That aside, have you watched of his sermons other than the parts that were cherry-picked by the media? I'll provide a link to a few:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvMbeVQj6Lw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QOdlnzkeoyQ

I know they're not the convenient short clips that the media's provided, but if you want to honestly debate this issue, it's worth the 20 or so minutes it'll take.

[Maddy McCall]

36. I've said it a thousand times.

No personal objection. But, hell, I attend black churches here, go to black funerals, (used to drink at black bars, when I drank) so none of that is alien to me.

I do think it could do Obama political harm. I have no personal objection, however. I live in the deep south, where I'm in close quarters with my black neighbors and friends, where blacks make up over 66% of the population, which is headed by a black mayor. I don't view this topic from afar...I'm right here in the middle of it.

And I agree with 80% of what I hear black preachers here saying. And I don't have any personal objection to what Wright said--when it's placed in context of the entire sermon.

McClurkin is another topic...I do have personal objections to what he says.

(And I appreciate the civility in my and your exchange. I wish more people were willing to speak openly like this at DU. We might learn a little from each other. :) )

[MercutioATC]

40. I agree with you. It has the potential to cause strategic harm.

I still support Obama. I think the campaign can deal with the negatives.

I appreciate your candor. I've disagreed with many of your posts, but there are many here (on both sides) who hold the campaign line and won't budge an inch, regardless of the dictates of integrity. I'm sure we'll still disagree on many things, but I won't question your honesty.

[Maddy McCall]

42. I don't begrudge you for who you support.

And he's proved to be politically masterful in handling this kind of stuff this primary season. I'm hoping, should he get the nomination, he continues handling stuff that arises quickly and decisively.

I don't dislike Obama. I'll be happy if he gets the nomination. I'll be a little disappointed if it's not Hillary, but we'll all be OK.

Thanks for a civil exchange. :pals:

[merh]

44. Some you have on ignore are wililng to speak openly and

discuss subjects, you just don't seem to be able to handle the discussion. You are the one that goes for the cheap shots, you allege personal attacks which never occur and you use those juvenile names to label the people who dare to differ with you.

It's sad, it truly is.

[Maddy McCall]

46. I don't have anybody on ignore.

:shrug:

[merh]

48. You just ignore their posts.

Manual or automatic ignore, same thing.

[mrreowwr_kittty]

38. That's what I don't understand.

Do they disagree with Wright's sermons? Or are they "concerned" about the ramifications of them in the General Election?

It's hard to tell what their point is, because they go back and forth so much.

[Irishonly]

89. I Don't Trust The Right Wing Spin Machine

I have no problem with any of Rev Wright's statements and I knew what was being played 24/7 was a tiny snippet of a sermon. I don't think there is a person in the world that couldn't be made to look like someone they are not jut by selecting comments out of context.

What I do have a problem with is the right wing spin machine and I would be just as worried if Hillary got the nomination. I don't think she will but my concern covers all democratic candidates whether local, state or federal.

Bush made the comment that if you repeat something long enough and often enough people will believe it and we have seen it happen too many times. Truth matters little to those people. Even those charges that have been debunked time and time again still make the internet rounds. Democrats must fight ridiculous charges against all democratic candidates.

[Tim4319]

47. Out of a 30 year pastor career,

people take about 3 or 4 sermons, that spoke the truth about America, and characterize his entire career by those 3 or 4 sermons!

What was so hateful? What did Rev Wright say that was not truthful? I believe what Rev Wright said had more truth in it then fabrication!

[me b zola]

52. Stupid is stupid

But again, YMMV.

[samdogmom]

64. Um mm. Are you serious?

Olive branches are being extended here and you're slapping them off like they're mosquitoes?

[Barack_America]

69. Hillary was present when Elton John said "To hell with (Americans)"...

It has been proven that Obama was not present when Wright said "god damn America".

Hillary also did not get up and leave. She has not returned the money she received from the event.

Both controversies are complete BS, but I do think that it's only fair to note this.

[Warren DeMontague]

75. Yes, it's totally disingenuous to compare one wholly bogus non-issue about what someone said

with a totally different wholly bogus non-issue about what someone else said.

Here's an idea: The Candidates are responsible for their OWN words. Not anyone else's.

I could give a shit what Elton said.

[MadBadger]

13. Seriously?

[leftstreet]

8. Wow... I can't believe you don't know it's just a joke

But then, you probably do

[dkf]

11. Hillary people have no sense of humor.

What can you do? :shrug:

[leftstreet]

15. Au contraire! Hillary's a great comedian!

"It is so great to be here, I was so worried I wasn't going to make it. I was pinned down by sniper fire,"

[Eric Condon]

39. Yep, hilarious!

Right up there with "those WMDs must be around here somewhere."

[Maddy McCall]

14. It's not a joke.

It's desperate Obama supporters trying to find something, ANYTHING, to latch on to one-up Obama's tendency to cling to bigots.

[dkf]

28. oh boy.

Yeah you're a bag of laughs too.

[Maddy McCall]

32. Thanks, shugah.

[rodeodance]

18. hey MF--its been a week almost on the bookbag smear--they needed another stupid thing grab

[sudopod]

26. There is no controversy

We all know that.

THAT'S WHY IT'S TEH FUNNEH!

LOL

[kdpeters]

30. Ummm, I think you're taking something a little too seriously

I read it as playful and light hearted. It was funny. Read it again and lighten up. You might actually like the thread.

[Maddy McCall]

31. Would be nice if that were true.

But some Brobots are taking it seriously. At least you're a good one, if you think it's ridiculous to harp on it.

[kdpeters]

90. Heck, I'd donate to Hillary to see Elton John.

I've seen him twice in concert. He puts on a helluva show.

As far as being one of the good ones, that's not really true. I'm human. Some days I try harder than others and sometimes I give up and give in to the toxic state of gd-p. You might have noticed what happens then. I hope not because I was a little crass to you. If so, I hope you'll accept my apology. I hadn't seen this kind message from you. If I'd seen this opportunity to reach across the divide I'd have jumped on it.

[Zachstar]

37. So do you think that this is all pointless, MonkeyFunk? Hell with America I will just watch TV?

Sorry if I am Offended with someone like Elton John says such crap. Its the whole loving your country thing.

[Bake]

71. You should only be offended if you're a misogynist.

Because THAT'S who Elton said "to hell with." Sorry to bother you with the FACTS.

Rev. Wright, on the other hand, said "God damn AMERICA," which means "all of it."

Bake

[Mimosa]

41. Did Elton and Hillary violate campaign finance law?

Sir Elton is a foreign national contributing valuable services to a Presidential campaign. Isn't this skirting the campaign finance laws?

[Marrah_G]

55. No- they did not.

[PBS Poll-435]

78. Nice Try!

Haven't been around long enough to see that one debunked over and over again?

No more than Rezco's cash-filled easter egg hunt on the Obama lawn.

[blogslut]

43. Where, oh where, are you tonight?

Why did you leave me
here all alone?
I searched the world over
and thought I found true love.
You met another and blttt
you were gone...

:)

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

45. You must have missed Bookbag-gate.

That vies with the smearing of Sinbad for dumbest made-up scandal I've ever seen on DU.

[endarkenment]

49. Yes it is as stupid as the Wright non-issue.

I am glad you agree with that. The smears posted here by both sides are shameless.

[not_too_L8]

51. Agreed, from an Obama supporter ...K&R

[terrya]

53. Oh...I see what you mean

I'm surprised I'm not seeing "fuck that Limey faggot" in that thread.

Sir Elton condemned misogyny. Am I seeing something wrong with that?

[izzybeans]

54. Ummm I don't think anyone is serious about it. If you find one then wow.

[Marrah_G]

56. Scary enough there are a half dozen or so people freaking out about EJ

The bright side is I am pretty sure they are all trolly types.

[izzybeans]

57. No one can be that dense, I'm having the audacity to hope that anyway.

:)

[Texasgal]

63. I agree MF..

Hard to hold a convo while hearing "bennie and the jets" in the background!

[mckeown1128]

65. I side with you on this. nt

[Barack_America]

68. Welcome to the other side of the Reverend Wright "scandal"...

It ain't pretty, is it?

And, FWIW, the "outrage" that I have professed about this incident is entirely fake. Much like the faux-rage that many Hillary supporters professed regarding Wright.

[samsingh]

70. ironically that's what we're doing right now

and now
and now

[DarienComp]

72. You honestly think we're being serious about that?

[kid a]

73. Thanks for partaking in nothing. nt

[Jamastiene]

79. It's actually a step UP from Book Bag Gate.

:rofl:

[durrrty libby]

83. The Cardboard Messiah's Followers have serious brain necrosis

[Bucky]

85. This country has been going downhill ever since corporate America killed Hee-Haw

Hee-Haw was the greatest show on TV ever, the last valient gasp of vaudeville on the broadcasted wasteland. I can't believe you'd imply it wasn't smart TV. You, sir, are formally disinvited to my next "I'm apickin versus I'm agrinnin" hoedown showdown.

Saaaaluute!

[BeyondGeography]

86. Everyone gets their goddamned American turn in this game